nixluva wrote:MEH! Golden State Warriors were losers until they weren't! This Knicks team isn't doomed because of Dolan. Dolan hasn't stopped KP, Willy or Kuz from performing well during Eurobasket. Dolan won't stop THJ, Nitty or Dotson from performing either. Either these players perform or they don't. Mills, Perry and Jeff all have to do their jobs. It's not gonna be about Dolan at that point. Just the GM, Coaches and Players. The Knicks have some good talent to work with despite all the naysayers.
signing below average journey pg's, who were never good enough to secure long term contracts, is not the sign of a FO making power moves, or remotely focus on winning. I would have preferred marbury
knicks1248 wrote:Knickoftime wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Knickoftime wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Knickoftime wrote:knicks1248 wrote:beasly
jack
sessionsThe youth movement is in full effect, we got some journey players , some G league players, some 2nd rounders.
Mills is headed for exec of the yr
No, they don't give out the executive of the year to someone overseeing a rebuilding year, like Mills is.
What were the last 3 years?
Attempts to compete that were not successful, hence the need to rebuild.
when you win 17 games, then add 12 new players and a top 5 draft pick the following season, what do you call that..Tryouts..smh
we signed baker to the same $$ dwill got 2 ys ago, and sign THJ to twice the $$ AA got..
Was never a true rebuild so long as it was around melo.
There never will be true build until the people who hired melo are gone.
You see, the owner of the company doesn't just get rid of the slack workers, he start with the person/s who keeps hiring in effective people.
Upset over jack? what were you looking for? Somebody gets hurt, somebody does not play well, someone will be a good mentor for yoots.
You equate chnage with improvement. MIlls was never in charge, He got undercut when Phil came to town. But really, the movement forward is still in place.
If we added DWade for Melo pairing then you should be concerned.
The front office is evolving. Dolan is a figure head which is ok. A deep pocket owner who has sworn to stay out.
The buzz of a new owner is not always lasting. SAC has had a few years to reboot into an intelligent oranization. Nola has been slow to respond. They will, but thats because its the personal decisons and that takes time.
Dolan starphuching with Melo/Amare was awful. Dolan enabling the Isiah era was awful. Dolan picked JVG over Earnie and short term was ok, but it threw the franchise back years after its 1999 run. Jeff don't play uptempo and we had an uptempo team. stupid. I like JVG but in hindsight Earnie knew where he was going. Dolan didn't.
Knicks1248 your only happy if your somehow able to be unhappy. Knicks just rebuild its front office and its not "THE MILLS SHOW" like it was "THE PHIL SHOW". Mills is the president but he has a basketball GM and a culture of basketball guys to draw from.
We can talk phil all day long but perhaps his worst crime was thinking he can rebuild and still be good at the same time. Its also should be noted that becoming a pathetic mess of a team is not desirable either so the effort is not without merit.
We wake up today with what it is. You either root for yourself to be the "Guy that said that thing" or just plain root for your team to succeed. I think you'd rather root for yourself to be "THAT GUY".
knicks1248 wrote:nixluva wrote:MEH! Golden State Warriors were losers until they weren't! This Knicks team isn't doomed because of Dolan. Dolan hasn't stopped KP, Willy or Kuz from performing well during Eurobasket. Dolan won't stop THJ, Nitty or Dotson from performing either. Either these players perform or they don't. Mills, Perry and Jeff all have to do their jobs. It's not gonna be about Dolan at that point. Just the GM, Coaches and Players. The Knicks have some good talent to work with despite all the naysayers.
signing below average journey pg's, who were never good enough to secure long term contracts, is not the sign of a FO making power moves, or remotely focus on winning. I would have preferred marbury
And there in lies the true sign of your intelligence.
You are also clueless to why you sign these short term guys.
Hint: The young guys are the important ones now.
knicks1248 wrote:nixluva wrote:MEH! Golden State Warriors were losers until they weren't! This Knicks team isn't doomed because of Dolan. Dolan hasn't stopped KP, Willy or Kuz from performing well during Eurobasket. Dolan won't stop THJ, Nitty or Dotson from performing either. Either these players perform or they don't. Mills, Perry and Jeff all have to do their jobs. It's not gonna be about Dolan at that point. Just the GM, Coaches and Players. The Knicks have some good talent to work with despite all the naysayers.
signing below average journey pg's, who were never good enough to secure long term contracts, is not the sign of a FO making power moves, or remotely focus on winning. I would have preferred marbury
Thank you for this. Yea.. lets rip the FO for inviting Jack to camp when you want Marbury. Good call.
I know most around here expect Frank to turn water into wine but I personally feel that limiting his minutes will be a good thing. KP played 28 mpg. I expect Frank to play less. His career averages, depending on which league, are: 12.7 and 13.9 mpg, last year was his career high at 18.3mpg in 32 games this year. I know, I know "tougher competition" etc. But I don't think it's a bad thing if Frank gets the traditional rookie treatment this upcoming season. Frank got drafted first and last for his potential - not his production - but potential. Expecting legitimate production from him next season seems beyond silly to me.
That's a long way of saying that I like this signing
I would've preferred Burke myself, but maybe Burke's holding out for more than the minimum. To me, Jack on top of Sessions feels redundant; taking a shot on a still-young Trey Burke to see if he could've been developed into a Kyle Lowry-type eventually, however -- that I found much more appealing (again, if Burke could've been had for the minimum). Oh well.
Mills was supposedly in favor of bringing in Darren Collison at one point not too long ago -- I wonder if he was one of the guys in the Knicks' front office that was said to be in favor of signing Burke. And the buck stops with him now. Curious.. Despite not doing much so far in his career, I still think in the right setting (change of scenery) and with more usage, Trey Burke could still blossom. Forget Kyle Lowry, how 'bout Jeremy Lin? No one thought too much of him until he was given a real chance and what happened? He bloomed...I think in our current situation, you take a chance on something like that. If we wanted Jack from the beginning, why not just sign him instead of Sessions? Is it because they think Jack might not have much left? Maybe he was just brought in to help Frank out early through training camp/pre-season as others have mentioned. Sessions is a Chris Duhon/Howard Eisley-type that signals they want to try to win games and remain respectable this season. How respectable will we really be with Sessions getting major time or splitting time with Nitty? And is that worth passing up an opportunity to further develop a young PG who was taken in the lottery just a few years ago? Not imho. What if Nitty shows he's not a true NBA PG and better off the ball or better at the 2 spot? I can't wait to see Nitty play ball live against NBA competition. Euro player, no summer league -- I just don't know anything about the kid at all.
fishmike wrote:knicks1248 wrote:nixluva wrote:MEH! Golden State Warriors were losers until they weren't! This Knicks team isn't doomed because of Dolan. Dolan hasn't stopped KP, Willy or Kuz from performing well during Eurobasket. Dolan won't stop THJ, Nitty or Dotson from performing either. Either these players perform or they don't. Mills, Perry and Jeff all have to do their jobs. It's not gonna be about Dolan at that point. Just the GM, Coaches and Players. The Knicks have some good talent to work with despite all the naysayers.
signing below average journey pg's, who were never good enough to secure long term contracts, is not the sign of a FO making power moves, or remotely focus on winning. I would have preferred marbury
Thank you for this. Yea.. lets rip the FO for inviting Jack to camp when you want Marbury. Good call.
well I'm not going to praise them for bringing to camp a past his prime pg coming off a season ending injury less than a yr ago.
The thing that pisses me off, is that everyone knew our PG situation was weak as hell, and should have been the focus this off season, especially if they knew Frankie wasn't a sure lock to start. We had a few options, and completely ignored them.
knicks1248 wrote:fishmike wrote:knicks1248 wrote:nixluva wrote:MEH! Golden State Warriors were losers until they weren't! This Knicks team isn't doomed because of Dolan. Dolan hasn't stopped KP, Willy or Kuz from performing well during Eurobasket. Dolan won't stop THJ, Nitty or Dotson from performing either. Either these players perform or they don't. Mills, Perry and Jeff all have to do their jobs. It's not gonna be about Dolan at that point. Just the GM, Coaches and Players. The Knicks have some good talent to work with despite all the naysayers.
signing below average journey pg's, who were never good enough to secure long term contracts, is not the sign of a FO making power moves, or remotely focus on winning. I would have preferred marbury
Thank you for this. Yea.. lets rip the FO for inviting Jack to camp when you want Marbury. Good call.
well I'm not going to praise them for bringing to camp a past his prime pg coming off a season ending injury less than a yr ago.
The thing that pisses me off, is that everyone knew our PG situation was weak as hell, and should have been the focus this off season, especially if they knew Frankie wasn't a sure lock to start. We had a few options, and completely ignored them.
Again the relevant question is why?
You don't think they're any good anyway.
Knickoftime wrote:knicks1248 wrote:fishmike wrote:knicks1248 wrote:nixluva wrote:MEH! Golden State Warriors were losers until they weren't! This Knicks team isn't doomed because of Dolan. Dolan hasn't stopped KP, Willy or Kuz from performing well during Eurobasket. Dolan won't stop THJ, Nitty or Dotson from performing either. Either these players perform or they don't. Mills, Perry and Jeff all have to do their jobs. It's not gonna be about Dolan at that point. Just the GM, Coaches and Players. The Knicks have some good talent to work with despite all the naysayers.
signing below average journey pg's, who were never good enough to secure long term contracts, is not the sign of a FO making power moves, or remotely focus on winning. I would have preferred marbury
Thank you for this. Yea.. lets rip the FO for inviting Jack to camp when you want Marbury. Good call.
well I'm not going to praise them for bringing to camp a past his prime pg coming off a season ending injury less than a yr ago.
The thing that pisses me off, is that everyone knew our PG situation was weak as hell, and should have been the focus this off season, especially if they knew Frankie wasn't a sure lock to start. We had a few options, and completely ignored them.
Again the relevant question is why?
You don't think they're any good anyway.
Idk what Frankie is capable of, but any success with this team starts and ends with the success of a pg
Nalod wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Knickoftime wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Knickoftime wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Knickoftime wrote:knicks1248 wrote:beasly
jack
sessionsThe youth movement is in full effect, we got some journey players , some G league players, some 2nd rounders.
Mills is headed for exec of the yr
No, they don't give out the executive of the year to someone overseeing a rebuilding year, like Mills is.
What were the last 3 years?
Attempts to compete that were not successful, hence the need to rebuild.
when you win 17 games, then add 12 new players and a top 5 draft pick the following season, what do you call that..Tryouts..smh
we signed baker to the same $$ dwill got 2 ys ago, and sign THJ to twice the $$ AA got..
Was never a true rebuild so long as it was around melo.
There never will be true build until the people who hired melo are gone.
You see, the owner of the company doesn't just get rid of the slack workers, he start with the person/s who keeps hiring in effective people.
Upset over jack? what were you looking for? Somebody gets hurt, somebody does not play well, someone will be a good mentor for yoots.
You equate chnage with improvement. MIlls was never in charge, He got undercut when Phil came to town. But really, the movement forward is still in place.
If we added DWade for Melo pairing then you should be concerned.
The front office is evolving. Dolan is a figure head which is ok. A deep pocket owner who has sworn to stay out.
The buzz of a new owner is not always lasting. SAC has had a few years to reboot into an intelligent oranization. Nola has been slow to respond. They will, but thats because its the personal decisons and that takes time.
Dolan starphuching with Melo/Amare was awful. Dolan enabling the Isiah era was awful. Dolan picked JVG over Earnie and short term was ok, but it threw the franchise back years after its 1999 run. Jeff don't play uptempo and we had an uptempo team. stupid. I like JVG but in hindsight Earnie knew where he was going. Dolan didn't.
Knicks1248 your only happy if your somehow able to be unhappy. Knicks just rebuild its front office and its not "THE MILLS SHOW" like it was "THE PHIL SHOW". Mills is the president but he has a basketball GM and a culture of basketball guys to draw from.
We can talk phil all day long but perhaps his worst crime was thinking he can rebuild and still be good at the same time. Its also should be noted that becoming a pathetic mess of a team is not desirable either so the effort is not without merit.
We wake up today with what it is. You either root for yourself to be the "Guy that said that thing" or just plain root for your team to succeed. I think you'd rather root for yourself to be "THAT GUY".
Nalod with another gem. Great post!!!
SupremeCommander wrote:I know most around here expect Frank to turn water into wine but I personally feel that limiting his minutes will be a good thing. KP played 28 mpg. I expect Frank to play less. His career averages, depending on which league, are: 12.7 and 13.9 mpg, last year was his career high at 18.3mpg in 32 games this year. I know, I know "tougher competition" etc. But I don't think it's a bad thing if Frank gets the traditional rookie treatment this upcoming season. Frank got drafted first and last for his potential - not his production - but potential. Expecting legitimate production from him next season seems beyond silly to me.That's a long way of saying that I like this signing
How about just expecting to pick up where he left off?
I don't understand the anger over the Jack (or Sessions for that matter)signing. This is actually a good signing and shows that Perry seems to know what he is doing.
The Knicks already have their PG of the future in Frank. Therefore, no need to break the bank or make any "power moves". Jack (and Sessions) were brought in for one purpose: strictly as stop gaps to provide veteran PG play while Frank acclimates himself to the NBA.
This allows the Knicks to monitor Frank's minutes. If he develops quickly he gets more minutes if his development takes a little longer they hold him back while still having veteran PGs to fill the breach.
Once Frank is ready to assume the reigns Jack and Sessions will be gone or at best relegated to the end of the bench. Jack and Sessions are simply insignificant to the team's future. No need to get bent out of shape about them.
fishmike wrote:SupremeCommander wrote:I know most around here expect Frank to turn water into wine but I personally feel that limiting his minutes will be a good thing. KP played 28 mpg. I expect Frank to play less. His career averages, depending on which league, are: 12.7 and 13.9 mpg, last year was his career high at 18.3mpg in 32 games this year. I know, I know "tougher competition" etc. But I don't think it's a bad thing if Frank gets the traditional rookie treatment this upcoming season. Frank got drafted first and last for his potential - not his production - but potential. Expecting legitimate production from him next season seems beyond silly to me.That's a long way of saying that I like this signing
How about just expecting to pick up where he left off?
Nitty did actually play in a Pro League with a 24 second shot clock. That was good experience for him as he is already used to it. Still being only 19 with a LOT to learn it's understandable that the Knicks would look to add a vet like Jack. If Jack can show he still has enough left he brings a lot to the table. Jack understands how to close out games more so than anyone on the Knicks. We've seen first hand how he can get it done in the clutch. Our young guards could learn a lot from him.
knicks1248 wrote:Knickoftime wrote:knicks1248 wrote:fishmike wrote:knicks1248 wrote:nixluva wrote:MEH! Golden State Warriors were losers until they weren't! This Knicks team isn't doomed because of Dolan. Dolan hasn't stopped KP, Willy or Kuz from performing well during Eurobasket. Dolan won't stop THJ, Nitty or Dotson from performing either. Either these players perform or they don't. Mills, Perry and Jeff all have to do their jobs. It's not gonna be about Dolan at that point. Just the GM, Coaches and Players. The Knicks have some good talent to work with despite all the naysayers.
signing below average journey pg's, who were never good enough to secure long term contracts, is not the sign of a FO making power moves, or remotely focus on winning. I would have preferred marbury
Thank you for this. Yea.. lets rip the FO for inviting Jack to camp when you want Marbury. Good call.
well I'm not going to praise them for bringing to camp a past his prime pg coming off a season ending injury less than a yr ago.
The thing that pisses me off, is that everyone knew our PG situation was weak as hell, and should have been the focus this off season, especially if they knew Frankie wasn't a sure lock to start. We had a few options, and completely ignored them.
Again the relevant question is why?
You don't think they're any good anyway.
Idk what Frankie is capable of, but any success with this team starts and ends with the success of a pg
Because its a need do they pay for one at any cost? You have to name the options available and if the price made sense to fill the need. For the short and long term. For example Jrue Holiday got 5 yrs 125mil from the Pelicans or 25mil per yr.
He would have filled our need at PG. But at 5 yrs 25 mil don't think we could have afford that and even if we could would that have been a good move based on his injury history and long term contract at that price.
How about putting your name on some options the Knicks should have pursued given their situation instead.
If Jack is recovered and makes the team he would be a good addition. Reports were Jack and Burke both worked out for the Knicks and they chose Jack.
CrushAlot wrote:If Jack is recovered and makes the team he would be a good addition. Reports were Jack and Burke both worked out for the Knicks and they chose Jack.
You have to figure that was a deciding factor. If Jack can play he's a better option to help fill a role and mentor as well. I always respected Jack's ability to close out games. Calm decision maker in the clutch.
newyorknewyork wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Knickoftime wrote:knicks1248 wrote:fishmike wrote:knicks1248 wrote:nixluva wrote:MEH! Golden State Warriors were losers until they weren't! This Knicks team isn't doomed because of Dolan. Dolan hasn't stopped KP, Willy or Kuz from performing well during Eurobasket. Dolan won't stop THJ, Nitty or Dotson from performing either. Either these players perform or they don't. Mills, Perry and Jeff all have to do their jobs. It's not gonna be about Dolan at that point. Just the GM, Coaches and Players. The Knicks have some good talent to work with despite all the naysayers.
signing below average journey pg's, who were never good enough to secure long term contracts, is not the sign of a FO making power moves, or remotely focus on winning. I would have preferred marbury
Thank you for this. Yea.. lets rip the FO for inviting Jack to camp when you want Marbury. Good call.
well I'm not going to praise them for bringing to camp a past his prime pg coming off a season ending injury less than a yr ago.
The thing that pisses me off, is that everyone knew our PG situation was weak as hell, and should have been the focus this off season, especially if they knew Frankie wasn't a sure lock to start. We had a few options, and completely ignored them.
Again the relevant question is why?
You don't think they're any good anyway.
Idk what Frankie is capable of, but any success with this team starts and ends with the success of a pg
Because its a need do they pay for one at any cost? You have to name the options available and if the price made sense to fill the need. For the short and long term. For example Jrue Holiday got 5 yrs 125mil from the Pelicans or 25mil per yr.
He would have filled our need at PG. But at 5 yrs 25 mil don't think we could have afford that and even if we could would that have been a good move based on his injury history and long term contract at that price.
How about putting your name on some options the Knicks should have pursued given their situation instead.
I really don't know, rondo would have probably been my focus, but through out FA, they never made a solid attempt at any real back up.
Most thought one was destine to come via a melo trade,
