Knicks · Hezonja a Knick (page 6)

NardDogNation wrote:

Welpee wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

Welpee wrote:

nixluva wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

nixluva wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:Well, this might be the first move of Mills-Perry that I liked. With some floor-spacing around him, I think Hezonja might pleasantly surprise many. I just hope they don't waste this opportunity and understand that Hezonja is a 4 and not a 2.

Personally I think Perry has been EXCELLENT since coming on board. He's totally upgraded the teams youth and athleticism. This is a completely different vibe since this new regime has taken over. Smarter moves and more Front Office synergy. I like it all. The drafts and acquisitions that Perry has made are all moving in the right direction. He's not even done yet.

You think everything the Knicks do is "EXCELLENT", ever since I joined this board. I don't mean to be rude but it's clear you're biased to the point where you can't be objective. As a fan, I always find myself hoping you'd be right but I doubt it will happen with this front office.

I will say that I find myself liking the image/reasoning of the Fizdale hire. He's really the only thing about Perry-Mills that I have a more positive opinion of. But there is too little a track record to even be sure if Fizdale's hype is justified.

I don’t understand you’re take here. It’s not about my views of past GM moves. I was specifically commenting on PERRY’S moves since coming on board. You don’t have to bring up anything else in order to assess the job he’s done. Have his moves been mostly good, neutral or bad for the team?

Just looking at the moves starting with the Melo Trade I think Perry has made some pretty solid moves! Took flyers on some young players that fit the criteria of the stated goals. Hired a good Coach. Drafted players with high potential. The team is younger, longer and more athletic than it was when he took over. We of course will have to wait to see how these players develop but judging the INITIAL choices it’s hard to find fault.

Time will tell but I agree, I like what Perry has done so far. Knicks fans are always after the homerun. You need to few singles and walks first to set up the grand slam.

What "singles" has Perry gotten us? Jarrett Jack? Michael Beasley?

Those players were career journeymen in their prime, let alone now. They played well for us last year but Knick fans being attached to them is reflective of just how talent-starved this franchise has been the past 18 years. I guess even a dogshit-sandwich would seem appealing if starving.

How many times are you going to use that line? Perry has been on board for what, almost one year. We'll see how Mudiay, Knox, Robinson and Hezonja work out. He brought Kanter here. He got Trey Burke here. He pulled the trigger getting rid of Hornacek and signed Fizdale. None of these moves are homeruns (as far as we know at this point) but they're moves in the right direction. We'll see how things pan out. Unloading Melo for worthwhile assets and not screwing up our cap (i.e. getting Ryan Anderson), was a significant victory. If nothing else, he's transforming our roster towards improved youth and athleticism. Sorry if you want to continue with quick fixes and no patience.

I wasn't aware of the fact that I used the line before (pretty sure I haven't). I'm also not sure why you felt the need to rehash the moves this franchise made last year but I'm well aware of what was done. None of it has impressed me as anything beyond piecemeal or serves as any kind of demonstration that this franchise is competent. I've lived in multiple market places and have had the opportunity to familiarize myself with how other franchises operate (e.g. Hinkie's Sixers, the Celtics, Eddie Jordan's Wizards, Budenholzer's Hawks and Thibodeou's Bulls), so it's hard for me to sit around and be giddy about re-threads like Trey Burke and his ilk because those teams have had far better to work with. But the simple fact that you are crediting a "significant victory" to this front office for "not screwing up our cap" is a telltale sign of how low the bar is for you and how mediocre an operation this is.

Also, I don't think you're familiar with my general stance about the Knicks. I've never advocated for "quick fixes" and have continually lobbied for the team to build through the draft, while maintaining as much cap flexibility as possible, in perpetuity, until a true superstar becomes available. One of the major reasons why I'm skeptical of this front office, is due to the subtle hints they've given that suggest they think this "rebuild" can be something accelerated and completed by the start of the 2019-2020 season. For one, Steve Mills signed Tim Hardaway Jr to that ridiculous contract that no other team was offering. Second, them trying to preserve/create "max" cap space for 2019 suggests they believe that the signing of one player can fix this mess. Newsflash: they can't because no 2019 free agent has that kind of talent. Kyrie Irving (the rumored target) is nothing but gilded-gold and if we sign him, it'll set this franchise back for another 3-5 seasons with his empty calorie and piss-poor health. So spare me your condescension.

My apologies. I just assumed that line was so unique multiple posters wouldn't be using it.

Failed Homeruns: Starphuchs.
Moving forward, this kid came here because in part by Fizz. He does well we'll pay him. If not someone else will.
Fans will scream how stupid we are.....Think for a moment why we won't pay him? Someone else we want? Knox develops? Others rise too?
its ok be known as a place players want to come too!!!!!!
There will be others.

Nalod wrote:Failed Homeruns: Starphuchs.
Moving forward, this kid came here because in part by Fizz. He does well we'll pay him. If not someone else will.
Fans will scream how stupid we are.....Think for a moment why we won't pay him? Someone else we want? Knox develops? Others rise too?
its ok be known as a place players want to come too!!!!!!
There will be others.

+1

this is a nice hedge if he plays well and we whiff on Irving in the offseason. We would do one of two things... either bring in Kyrie or if the Knicks are decent or certain guys break out like Mario then you bring him back if you cant get Kyrie and just draft another guy and keep working on getting better.

So does Hezonja still have all-star upside as scouts thought before the draft or have we seen enough of him (and his close but not-quite elite quickness/athleticism/shooting) to determine his upside?

Some say he just turned the corner. His stats as a starter last year were very promising.
I'm thinking about the possibility he follows the arc of Gordon Hayward.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/pla...

When you look at Hayward's first 3 years, you didn't anticipate him becoming a 19ppg/4apg/5rpg sort of player over the next 4 years.

He might also go the route of an Ilyasova... settling into a 25mpg/12ppg/6rpg rotation/sometimes starter sort of player.

And maybe he won't figure it out and end up like Doug McBuckets... a player who sticks in the NBA, but can't quite carve out a consistent role.

In any case, we're giving him 1 year to get an idea of where he's headed.

technomaster wrote:So does Hezonja still have all-star upside as scouts thought before the draft or have we seen enough of him (and his close but not-quite elite quickness/athleticism/shooting) to determine his upside?

Some say he just turned the corner. His stats as a starter last year were very promising.
I'm thinking about the possibility he follows the arc of Gordon Hayward.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/pla...

When you look at Hayward's first 3 years, you didn't anticipate him becoming a 19ppg/4apg/5rpg sort of player over the next 4 years.

He might also go the route of an Ilyasova... settling into a 25mpg/12ppg/6rpg rotation/sometimes starter sort of player.

And maybe he won't figure it out and end up like Doug McBuckets... a player who sticks in the NBA, but can't quite carve out a consistent role.

In any case, we're giving him 1 year to get an idea of where he's headed.

The highlight reel definitely points to All-Star.

Mario is Anthony Randolph up until now.
I'll be super happy if he is the "Most Improved player"!!!

Mike1989 wrote:I did this breakdown for another place, but thought I'd post it here to show how Hezonja played per position last season:

Starting PF
- 13 starts, 30 mpg, 82/165 FG, .496 FG%, 28/71 3P, .394 3P%, 5.5 TRB, 1.7 APG, 14.9 PPG
Bench PF
- 20 games, 20.4 mpg, 71/164 FG, .432 FG%, 21/62 3P, .338 3P%, 3.2 TRB, 1.05 APG, 9.1 PPG

Starting SF
- 14 starts, 28.3 mpg, 59/142 FG, .415 FG%, 22/61 3P, .360 3P%, 5.8 TRB, 2.2 APG, 11.71 PPG
Bench SF
- 21 games, 10.2 mpg, 33/75 FG, .444 FG%, 19/52 3P, .365 3P%, 1.6 TRB, 0.8 APG, 3.73 PPG

Starting SG
- 3 starts, 28.3 mpg, 15/32 FG, .468 FG%, 6/11 3P, .545 3P%, 5.6 TRB, 3.6 APG, 14 PPG
Bench SG
- 4 games, 28 mpg, 13/39 FG, .333 FG%, 4/22 3P, .181 3P%., 3.25 TRB, 0.25 APG, 10.25 PPG

Interestingly his shooting percentages are not substantially different whether he started or came off the bench at SF or PF, but they are substantially different when he played shooting guard especially when you factor in his 3 point shooting.

As it stands I think starting him as an undersized stretch four with Knox playing small forward could be an option for us next season.

Looking at these stats, he should be our starting SG, playing 30 mins a game, and lighting them up from 3 point range. Right now, THJ is projected to be the starting SG, but don't mess up Timmy. They're on your tail.

We'll see. It's a reasonable gamble, but if I had to guess, he'll be a decent backup and nothing more. To this point, his offense has been meh and his defense worse.

he's a stopgap that hopefully proves to be more, essentially what Beasley was

THJr might actually fit best with the ultra-aggressive Trey Burke as part of an elite attacking second unit. I thought Hardaway (when healthy) did a fine job putting in career numbers this past season and has become a borderline all-star. I wouldn't downplay his potential impact with the team. It'll be interesting to see where he falls into the mix of minutes and touches this season.

I think the biggest losers of last year's bunch will likely be Courtney Lee, (though the Knicks may need to continue to give minutes to showcase him for potential trades) and Lance Thomas. Beasley, perhaps is the biggest loser, as he doesn't look likely to be offered an opportunity for an encore performance with the Knicks.

The Knicks will have a number of players who "should" be able to shoot from deep at a high clip. THJR shot under 32% from 3, Frank shot worse, and while Knox's form (and confidence) looks pure, he hasn't been hitting at a high clip during summer league nor did he light it up in college. Hezonja came billed as having unlimited range pre-draft, but in 3 seasons has averaged 33%...

Former NBA coach who watched Mario every day......
Link to Berman story:
http://www.ultimateknicks.com/outerlink....

A lot of what he said also applies to Frank. While Mudiay did not come out of Europe his status as a project still applies because of his age.
Dirk and Kobe did not hit stride until 21. Hindsight is always cleaner than an unknown future.
Some fans need to see it before believing. Some fans like the intrigue of upside and know not everything works to plan.

technomaster wrote:THJr might actually fit best with the ultra-aggressive Trey Burke as part of an elite attacking second unit. I thought Hardaway (when healthy) did a fine job putting in career numbers this past season and has become a borderline all-star. I wouldn't downplay his potential impact with the team. It'll be interesting to see where he falls into the mix of minutes and touches this season.

I think the biggest losers of last year's bunch will likely be Courtney Lee, (though the Knicks may need to continue to give minutes to showcase him for potential trades) and Lance Thomas. Beasley, perhaps is the biggest loser, as he doesn't look likely to be offered an opportunity for an encore performance with the Knicks.

The Knicks will have a number of players who "should" be able to shoot from deep at a high clip. THJR shot under 32% from 3, Frank shot worse, and while Knox's form (and confidence) looks pure, he hasn't been hitting at a high clip during summer league nor did he light it up in college. Hezonja came billed as having unlimited range pre-draft, but in 3 seasons has averaged 33%...

They need to play Hardaway and hope he improves. He killed any chance at 2 max deals so we are stuck with him for better or worse

Jmpasq wrote:

technomaster wrote:THJr might actually fit best with the ultra-aggressive Trey Burke as part of an elite attacking second unit. I thought Hardaway (when healthy) did a fine job putting in career numbers this past season and has become a borderline all-star. I wouldn't downplay his potential impact with the team. It'll be interesting to see where he falls into the mix of minutes and touches this season.

I think the biggest losers of last year's bunch will likely be Courtney Lee, (though the Knicks may need to continue to give minutes to showcase him for potential trades) and Lance Thomas. Beasley, perhaps is the biggest loser, as he doesn't look likely to be offered an opportunity for an encore performance with the Knicks.

The Knicks will have a number of players who "should" be able to shoot from deep at a high clip. THJR shot under 32% from 3, Frank shot worse, and while Knox's form (and confidence) looks pure, he hasn't been hitting at a high clip during summer league nor did he light it up in college. Hezonja came billed as having unlimited range pre-draft, but in 3 seasons has averaged 33%...

They need to play Hardaway and hope he improves. He killed any chance at 2 max deals so we are stuck with him for better or worse

He is paid 17mm. So is Kanter and Noah. “He” did not kill it. It’s not like a vendetta or a personal things is it? Kid can ball. If he can going forward he can always be traded. If he does not improve he is still an avg SG paid an avg salary.
I would not worry about 2 max free agents for some time. There is no lock Kyrie or Durant are coming even if we had the room.

Ira wrote:We'll see. It's a reasonable gamble, but if I had to guess, he'll be a decent backup and nothing more. To this point, his offense has been meh and his defense worse.

You really have to take into consideration, the talent around him, the environment, the lack of leadership on the team, multiple coaches, being a euro player, inconsistent minutes, the pg he played with, they multiple systems, how he was used.

I really never watch him play much, but i do know he started turning it on just like burke around january

knicks1248 wrote:

Ira wrote:We'll see. It's a reasonable gamble, but if I had to guess, he'll be a decent backup and nothing more. To this point, his offense has been meh and his defense worse.

You really have to take into consideration, the talent around him, the environment, the lack of leadership on the team, multiple coaches, being a euro player, inconsistent minutes, the pg he played with, they multiple systems, how he was used.

I really never watch him play much, but i do know he started turning it on just like burke around january

HE also has a bad injury. He needs to learn pace of his body, his game, and the flow of the game.
You over pay to grab these players.

Nalod wrote:Failed Homeruns: Starphuchs.
Moving forward, this kid came here because in part by Fizz. He does well we'll pay him. If not someone else will.
Fans will scream how stupid we are.....Think for a moment why we won't pay him? Someone else we want? Knox develops? Others rise too?
its ok be known as a place players want to come too!!!!!!
There will be others.

I have no real issues with these deals as long as its only 1 year, Actually I prefer a 2nd year team option. As long as we don't leave Steve Mills stupid ass in a room alone with FA's anymore we should be fine