Knicks · GameThread: Knicks and Spurs (page 7)

FINAL
NYK 130 SAS 118

SupremeCommander wrote:did hell freeze over

Nah, the Spurs aren't good either. Not horrible, like we are, but still bad.

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Uptown wrote:Gotta Luv Samuel Mutha****** L Jackson!

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yeah that was good

I have not been a DSJ guy at all and didn't care when he put up the 31 point night or whatever it was because I felt like it was a fluke. If he's going to succeed as a winning player in this league, his game has to be what we saw tonight. He is not a good enough scorer or shooter to warrant the role he wanted in Dallas or what he played like he wanted here in these first few games. Tonight was the first time I saw him actually play the role he'd need to for it to even have a chance to work. I still don't think it's the role he's going to want but I'm an objective guy and will be the first to say I'm wrong if he does. Even then I'm not sure he's a good enough pure PG but he'll at least have a chance if he embraces that mentality.

All of that being said...no hesitation if any of these guys had to go in a deal for AD. Mitchell I'd try to keep out of it but that's not a deal-breaker in the end. And Dotson and DSJ are replaceable parts. Getting AD and one big FA would put this team in an incredible position to build a title contender.

Only thing stopping it from being perfect is that Smith dunk attempt on Bertans not going down.

homeskillitprigioni wrote:Dotson, Mitchell...and yeah DSJ were really good tonight.

I have not been a DSJ guy at all and didn't care when he put up the 31 point night or whatever it was because I felt like it was a fluke. If he's going to succeed as a winning player in this league, his game has to be what we saw tonight. He is not a good enough scorer or shooter to warrant the role he wanted in Dallas or what he played like he wanted here in these first few games. Tonight was the first time I saw him actually play the role he'd need to for it to even have a chance to work. I still don't think it's the role he's going to want but I'm an objective guy and will be the first to say I'm wrong if he does. Even then I'm not sure he's a good enough pure PG but he'll at least have a chance if he embraces that mentality.

All of that being said...no hesitation if any of these guys had to go in a deal for AD. Mitchell I'd try to keep out of it but that's not a deal-breaker in the end. And Dotson and DSJ are replaceable parts. Getting AD and one big FA would put this team in an incredible position to build a title contender.

I know Melo and AD are not on the same level. But your strategy feels like the same thing we did with Melo rhat set us back. We have an opportunity to draft a franchise player and add 2 superstars. Do we really want to gut the team for a player thats from LA and stated he rather play for his home state. KD and Kyre are from the east coast and stated they rather play with the knicks....in so many words. Stay the course and dont get caught up in fools gold.

homeskillitprigioni wrote:Dotson, Mitchell...and yeah DSJ were really good tonight.

I have not been a DSJ guy at all and didn't care when he put up the 31 point night or whatever it was because I felt like it was a fluke. If he's going to succeed as a winning player in this league, his game has to be what we saw tonight. He is not a good enough scorer or shooter to warrant the role he wanted in Dallas or what he played like he wanted here in these first few games. Tonight was the first time I saw him actually play the role he'd need to for it to even have a chance to work. I still don't think it's the role he's going to want but I'm an objective guy and will be the first to say I'm wrong if he does. Even then I'm not sure he's a good enough pure PG but he'll at least have a chance if he embraces that mentality.

All of that being said...no hesitation if any of these guys had to go in a deal for AD. Mitchell I'd try to keep out of it but that's not a deal-breaker in the end. And Dotson and DSJ are replaceable parts. Getting AD and one big FA would put this team in an incredible position to build a title contender.

Your post is very objective....Smith has had games like this before, tonight guys were knocking down shots, it's that simple. He's the best
all around pg on this team, hands down....He is a better defender than he is given credit for...The energy of the offense and the ball movement Spike's up (shout out to Spike Lee!!!)when he is on the floor. Hopefully he continues to play with same level of confidence he displayed last night.

Uptown wrote:Gotta Luv Samuel Mutha****** L Jackson!

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And you could see Spike respond re: something about messing up the "tank"...Spike's a real NYK fan.

Uptown wrote:

homeskillitprigioni wrote:Dotson, Mitchell...and yeah DSJ were really good tonight.

I have not been a DSJ guy at all and didn't care when he put up the 31 point night or whatever it was because I felt like it was a fluke. If he's going to succeed as a winning player in this league, his game has to be what we saw tonight. He is not a good enough scorer or shooter to warrant the role he wanted in Dallas or what he played like he wanted here in these first few games. Tonight was the first time I saw him actually play the role he'd need to for it to even have a chance to work. I still don't think it's the role he's going to want but I'm an objective guy and will be the first to say I'm wrong if he does. Even then I'm not sure he's a good enough pure PG but he'll at least have a chance if he embraces that mentality.

All of that being said...no hesitation if any of these guys had to go in a deal for AD. Mitchell I'd try to keep out of it but that's not a deal-breaker in the end. And Dotson and DSJ are replaceable parts. Getting AD and one big FA would put this team in an incredible position to build a title contender.

Your post is very objective....Smith has had games like this before, tonight guys were knocking down shots, it's that simple. He's the best
all around pg on this team, hands down....He is a better defender than he is given credit for...The energy of the offense and the ball movement Spike's up (shout out to Spike Lee!!!)when he is on the floor. Hopefully he continues to play with same level of confidence he displayed last night.

I'm worried that we're going to win ourselves out of bottom 3... and end up picking at our seemingly typical 8 or 9.

I watched the highlights. Some quick thoughts:
* I don't know about anyone else here, but DSJ looks like he has the makings of a good player. Of course, doesn't any PG when their wings are hitting 25ft 3pt shots like Dotson? What sets him apart from a lot of PGs is his fast-twitchiness. Other teams seem to respect the fact that even though he isn't a dead eye jump shooter, he can still blow by them even though they know it's coming.

* Dotson looked like a real player, certainly looked the part of Klay Thompson. Fiz says he's a good shooter who could become a great shooter. He seemed steady out there.

* Mitchell Robinson - wow. He sure seems to have improved since coach Jordan joined the team. Interesting choices for the Knicks. They could do Jordan a favor and let him join playoff roster on March 1st (4 more days of Jedi big man training)... or keep him in NY.

* The Spurs have no answers at PG. Mudiay also has his way with them from a scoring standpoint.

* Kevin Knox started out cold (missed his 1st 4 shots), but finished with a really nice game. He's averaging 9rpg over his past 3 games. One thing I was more conscious about is that the Knicks let Knox dribble the ball up the court and drive a lot for a 6'9" rookie with a supposedly shaky handle. I'm pretty sure the coaches are pushing him to do this to get real-game reps and develop his game (albeit to the sometimes detriment of the team). They could easily play him in the same role as Dotson if winning/fg%/efficiency were the name of the game.

fishmike wrote:

Uptown wrote:

homeskillitprigioni wrote:Dotson, Mitchell...and yeah DSJ were really good tonight.

I have not been a DSJ guy at all and didn't care when he put up the 31 point night or whatever it was because I felt like it was a fluke. If he's going to succeed as a winning player in this league, his game has to be what we saw tonight. He is not a good enough scorer or shooter to warrant the role he wanted in Dallas or what he played like he wanted here in these first few games. Tonight was the first time I saw him actually play the role he'd need to for it to even have a chance to work. I still don't think it's the role he's going to want but I'm an objective guy and will be the first to say I'm wrong if he does. Even then I'm not sure he's a good enough pure PG but he'll at least have a chance if he embraces that mentality.

All of that being said...no hesitation if any of these guys had to go in a deal for AD. Mitchell I'd try to keep out of it but that's not a deal-breaker in the end. And Dotson and DSJ are replaceable parts. Getting AD and one big FA would put this team in an incredible position to build a title contender.

Your post is very objective....Smith has had games like this before, tonight guys were knocking down shots, it's that simple. He's the best
all around pg on this team, hands down....He is a better defender than he is given credit for...The energy of the offense and the ball movement Spike's up (shout out to Spike Lee!!!)when he is on the floor. Hopefully he continues to play with same level of confidence he displayed last night.

disagree... Smith is great at being fast and getting a shot off. The league is full of those guys. He's never created for the team like he did tonight from start to finish. This was absolutely his best game as a Knick and hopefully one to grow on. He looked fantastic and so did the guys around him. Mitch, Dotson, Knox....

Smith jr has been getting the most minutes of his career, and its starting to pay dividends. Disagree that players with Smith jr's ability to get to the rim, kick out for a 3, are a dime a dozen.

Its not just being able to run fast, those players are a dime a dozen. Smith jr can use that speed in more ways than a player who mostly is fast at going north/south. Can put that speed to use in different ways, like slicing through the D for a lob to Mitch. Or those kick outs to Dotson. Not all fast players can do that, and with Smith jr's burst.

If anything, DSJ at times looks like he is trying to figure out how to make the best use of his speed. Gets ahead of the offense, turns the ball over. Didnt see that last night.

Fizdale is giving Smith jr the PT to work tbrough his mistakes, in a way he couldnt in Dallas.
We saw last night why its worth not trading Smith jr until we've had another season to see where his game is going.

technomaster wrote:The Knicks even held out DeAndre Jordan to try to lose this one, but fact is that San Antonio hasn't been playing well (what is it, now 1-6 in their last 7 games?).

I dont get why you would throw this out there. Dude can't be hurt and held out?

The Knicks were DESPERATE for a win.

GustavBahler wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Uptown wrote:

homeskillitprigioni wrote:Dotson, Mitchell...and yeah DSJ were really good tonight.

I have not been a DSJ guy at all and didn't care when he put up the 31 point night or whatever it was because I felt like it was a fluke. If he's going to succeed as a winning player in this league, his game has to be what we saw tonight. He is not a good enough scorer or shooter to warrant the role he wanted in Dallas or what he played like he wanted here in these first few games. Tonight was the first time I saw him actually play the role he'd need to for it to even have a chance to work. I still don't think it's the role he's going to want but I'm an objective guy and will be the first to say I'm wrong if he does. Even then I'm not sure he's a good enough pure PG but he'll at least have a chance if he embraces that mentality.

All of that being said...no hesitation if any of these guys had to go in a deal for AD. Mitchell I'd try to keep out of it but that's not a deal-breaker in the end. And Dotson and DSJ are replaceable parts. Getting AD and one big FA would put this team in an incredible position to build a title contender.

Your post is very objective....Smith has had games like this before, tonight guys were knocking down shots, it's that simple. He's the best
all around pg on this team, hands down....He is a better defender than he is given credit for...The energy of the offense and the ball movement Spike's up (shout out to Spike Lee!!!)when he is on the floor. Hopefully he continues to play with same level of confidence he displayed last night.

disagree... Smith is great at being fast and getting a shot off. The league is full of those guys. He's never created for the team like he did tonight from start to finish. This was absolutely his best game as a Knick and hopefully one to grow on. He looked fantastic and so did the guys around him. Mitch, Dotson, Knox....

Smith jr has been getting the most minutes of his career, and its starting to pay dividends. Disagree that players with Smith jr's ability to get to the rim, kick out for a 3, are a dime a dozen.

Its not just being able to run fast, those players are a dime a dozen. Smith jr can use that speed in more ways than a player who mostly is fast at going north/south. Can put that speed to use in different ways, like slicing through the D for a lob to Mitch. Or those kick outs to Dotson. Not all fast players can do that, and with Smith jr's burst.

If anything, DSJ at times looks like he is trying to figure out how to make the best use of his speed. Gets ahead of the offense, turns the ball over. Didnt see that last night.

Fizdale is giving Smith jr the PT to work tbrough his mistakes, in a way he couldnt in Dallas.
We saw last night why its worth not trading Smith jr until we've had another season to see where his game is going.

fishmike wrote:Smith is great at being fast and getting a shot off. The league is full of those guys.

GustavBahler wrote:Disagree that players with Smith jr's ability to get to the rim, kick out for a 3, are a dime a dozen.

GustavBahler wrote:Its not just being able to run fast, those players are a dime a dozen

fishmike wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Uptown wrote:

homeskillitprigioni wrote:Dotson, Mitchell...and yeah DSJ were really good tonight.

I have not been a DSJ guy at all and didn't care when he put up the 31 point night or whatever it was because I felt like it was a fluke. If he's going to succeed as a winning player in this league, his game has to be what we saw tonight. He is not a good enough scorer or shooter to warrant the role he wanted in Dallas or what he played like he wanted here in these first few games. Tonight was the first time I saw him actually play the role he'd need to for it to even have a chance to work. I still don't think it's the role he's going to want but I'm an objective guy and will be the first to say I'm wrong if he does. Even then I'm not sure he's a good enough pure PG but he'll at least have a chance if he embraces that mentality.

All of that being said...no hesitation if any of these guys had to go in a deal for AD. Mitchell I'd try to keep out of it but that's not a deal-breaker in the end. And Dotson and DSJ are replaceable parts. Getting AD and one big FA would put this team in an incredible position to build a title contender.

Your post is very objective....Smith has had games like this before, tonight guys were knocking down shots, it's that simple. He's the best
all around pg on this team, hands down....He is a better defender than he is given credit for...The energy of the offense and the ball movement Spike's up (shout out to Spike Lee!!!)when he is on the floor. Hopefully he continues to play with same level of confidence he displayed last night.

disagree... Smith is great at being fast and getting a shot off. The league is full of those guys. He's never created for the team like he did tonight from start to finish. This was absolutely his best game as a Knick and hopefully one to grow on. He looked fantastic and so did the guys around him. Mitch, Dotson, Knox....

Smith jr has been getting the most minutes of his career, and its starting to pay dividends. Disagree that players with Smith jr's ability to get to the rim, kick out for a 3, are a dime a dozen.

Its not just being able to run fast, those players are a dime a dozen. Smith jr can use that speed in more ways than a player who mostly is fast at going north/south. Can put that speed to use in different ways, like slicing through the D for a lob to Mitch. Or those kick outs to Dotson. Not all fast players can do that, and with Smith jr's burst.

If anything, DSJ at times looks like he is trying to figure out how to make the best use of his speed. Gets ahead of the offense, turns the ball over. Didnt see that last night.

Fizdale is giving Smith jr the PT to work tbrough his mistakes, in a way he couldnt in Dallas.
We saw last night why its worth not trading Smith jr until we've had another season to see where his game is going.

fishmike wrote:Smith is great at being fast and getting a shot off. The league is full of those guys.

GustavBahler wrote:Disagree that players with Smith jr's ability to get to the rim, kick out for a 3, are a dime a dozen.

Right well... I didnt write that did I? That is the point. DSjr hasnt shown the ability to do that consistently. Last night he did.

GustavBahler wrote:Its not just being able to run fast, those players are a dime a dozen

this is exactly what I wrote which you disagreed with

Anyone can run up and down the court fast, and get a shot off. Thats what you have reduced Smith jr's skill set to, not me. I tried to explain that there is more to his skill set than that very vague description of what Smith jr brings to the table.

BigDaddyG wrote:

SupremeCommander wrote:did hell freeze over

Nah, the Spurs aren't good either. Not horrible, like we are, but still bad.

I know they aren't what they were, tat said, they are still in the playoffs in the West. LBJ left Cleveland, where he would have been a top 3 team in the East, and now is likely to miss the playoffs... I expect most teams that are playoff teams to overlook playing the Knicks but I don't expect any team that Pop coaches to do that. I am shocked by the outcome

fishmike wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Uptown wrote:

homeskillitprigioni wrote:Dotson, Mitchell...and yeah DSJ were really good tonight.

I have not been a DSJ guy at all and didn't care when he put up the 31 point night or whatever it was because I felt like it was a fluke. If he's going to succeed as a winning player in this league, his game has to be what we saw tonight. He is not a good enough scorer or shooter to warrant the role he wanted in Dallas or what he played like he wanted here in these first few games. Tonight was the first time I saw him actually play the role he'd need to for it to even have a chance to work. I still don't think it's the role he's going to want but I'm an objective guy and will be the first to say I'm wrong if he does. Even then I'm not sure he's a good enough pure PG but he'll at least have a chance if he embraces that mentality.

All of that being said...no hesitation if any of these guys had to go in a deal for AD. Mitchell I'd try to keep out of it but that's not a deal-breaker in the end. And Dotson and DSJ are replaceable parts. Getting AD and one big FA would put this team in an incredible position to build a title contender.

Your post is very objective....Smith has had games like this before, tonight guys were knocking down shots, it's that simple. He's the best
all around pg on this team, hands down....He is a better defender than he is given credit for...The energy of the offense and the ball movement Spike's up (shout out to Spike Lee!!!)when he is on the floor. Hopefully he continues to play with same level of confidence he displayed last night.

disagree... Smith is great at being fast and getting a shot off. The league is full of those guys. He's never created for the team like he did tonight from start to finish. This was absolutely his best game as a Knick and hopefully one to grow on. He looked fantastic and so did the guys around him. Mitch, Dotson, Knox....

Smith jr has been getting the most minutes of his career, and its starting to pay dividends. Disagree that players with Smith jr's ability to get to the rim, kick out for a 3, are a dime a dozen.

Its not just being able to run fast, those players are a dime a dozen. Smith jr can use that speed in more ways than a player who mostly is fast at going north/south. Can put that speed to use in different ways, like slicing through the D for a lob to Mitch. Or those kick outs to Dotson. Not all fast players can do that, and with Smith jr's burst.

If anything, DSJ at times looks like he is trying to figure out how to make the best use of his speed. Gets ahead of the offense, turns the ball over. Didnt see that last night.

Fizdale is giving Smith jr the PT to work tbrough his mistakes, in a way he couldnt in Dallas.
We saw last night why its worth not trading Smith jr until we've had another season to see where his game is going.

fishmike wrote:Smith is great at being fast and getting a shot off. The league is full of those guys.

GustavBahler wrote:Disagree that players with Smith jr's ability to get to the rim, kick out for a 3, are a dime a dozen.

Right well... I didnt write that did I? That is the point. DSjr hasnt shown the ability to do that consistently. Last night he did.

GustavBahler wrote:Its not just being able to run fast, those players are a dime a dozen

this is exactly what I wrote which you disagreed with

Playmaking Vision
It would be easy to fall into the trap of thinking DSJ is a shoot-first gunner who doesn’t make his teammates better. Smith is not the archetype of a “pure” point guard, but it would be a mistake to underestimate his passing vision and playmaking ability. The guy is far from a black hole when he takes it to the rim. Per NBA.com, Smith passes the ball on 47.2% of his drives. That’s the 9th-highest percentage among the 64 players to record at least 400 drives this season. Even more impressive, The BBall Index ranks DSJ in the 97th percentile league-wide in their Playmaking category. Check out this montage of five skip/ cross-court passes:

Before the trade to New York, Smith was posting a league average efficiency on pick-and-rolls including passes, per Synergy. Considering Smith’s age and high-volume usage on pick-and-rolls, the fact that he is already average is extremely promising. In addition to kick-outs, Smith also keeps the bigs fed on lobs and dump-offs. DSJ has recorded 49 assists for the Knicks so far; 10 of those have been on alley-oop dunks (8 to DeAndre and 2 to Mitchell Robinson).