Vmart wrote:Nalod wrote:I’m not one to study form as intricate as some of you but it looks like he is working on the footwork as much as delivery. A quick smooth delivery. As for distance, I’m not going to sweat this out in June. We are not there to see the whole workout nor has been instruction as to what the drive is for. My take is Frank is not in Westchester as he needs a fresh approach and perhaps its demoralizing if your being shopped. My guess also is his fate with the knicks is largely base on his cap hold and what happens in free agency. He needs a situation where he can get an opportunity. He played 78 games his rookie year. He needed last season awful. He was hurt most of the year. ITs not a question of him putting in the work, its how much absorbs into his game.
Maybe if he wears a headband it will make him at least seem more animated.
Perhaps he can change his citizenship to “Canadian”, seems to be all the cool kids are from there now!!
Frank is practicing in Frisco TX. He needs a fresh approach for sure and he needs to get away from the Knicks training staff. He needs to get back to his basics. If I were to advise any of the young Knick players have your own development crew. The Knicks can’t help in that department.
He definitely needs to try something different because what he is doing hasn’t worked. He needed to show growth last year not regression. It is going to be hard for him to get minutes with Kadeem, DSJ, Trier, Dot and RJ. I am not sure where the hate is coming from for the Knicks staff. If you want to fault the Knicks for where Frank is at I think you criticize them for trying to make him a point guard and doing it in the nba. Frank played mostly off the ball in France and was not ready to make the leap to the nba as a point guard. If that was the goal he should have spent a year or two in West Chester playing on the ball.
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Not sure there is hate on the staff. We can only make assumptions. He knows what he is deficient in and Is suppose him and his agent know if he is being shopped or not, and what the parameters are. . We can only guess what he needs. NBA players have gurus not associated with teams that they hire out to work on their game away from the team. He has a new agent and perhaps he is in Frisco on the advice of the team to work with this one dude who they like. Im just guessing.
Nalod wrote:Not sure there is hate on the staff. We can only make assumptions. He knows what he is deficient in and Is suppose him and his agent know if he is being shopped or not, and what the parameters are. . We can only guess what he needs. NBA players have gurus not associated with teams that they hire out to work on their game away from the team. He has a new agent and perhaps he is in Frisco on the advice of the team to work with this one dude who they like. Im just guessing.
Frank's new guy is highly regarded:
https://www.timmartinbball.com/aboutI'm confident he's getting pro-level training. Sometimes it's good to hear another voice. Guys use different trainers all the time. It amazes how much we can make out of these mini video clips.
Nalod wrote:Not sure there is hate on the staff. We can only make assumptions. He knows what he is deficient in and Is suppose him and his agent know if he is being shopped or not, and what the parameters are. . We can only guess what he needs. NBA players have gurus not associated with teams that they hire out to work on their game away from the team. He has a new agent and perhaps he is in Frisco on the advice of the team to work with this one dude who they like. Im just guessing.
I was responding to VMart advising all young players to have their own trainers because the Knick staff can’t help them develop. Also said that Frank needs to get away from the Knicks training staff. I wouldn’t call that an endorsement.
CrushAlot wrote:Nalod wrote:Not sure there is hate on the staff. We can only make assumptions. He knows what he is deficient in and Is suppose him and his agent know if he is being shopped or not, and what the parameters are. . We can only guess what he needs. NBA players have gurus not associated with teams that they hire out to work on their game away from the team. He has a new agent and perhaps he is in Frisco on the advice of the team to work with this one dude who they like. Im just guessing.
I was responding to VMart advising all young players to have their own trainers because the Knick staff can’t help them develop. Also said that Frank needs to get away from the Knicks training staff. I wouldn’t call that an endorsement.
420+ players last season had a better plus/minus, in fact frank (among all pg) was at the bottom with only bayless and sexton beneath him..
Turtle foot calderon was better than frank
I know some around here say I make sht up, so I decided to add the link
http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_...
This is under fiz watch and the knicks development program
Nalod wrote:Not sure there is hate on the staff. We can only make assumptions. He knows what he is deficient in and Is suppose him and his agent know if he is being shopped or not, and what the parameters are. . We can only guess what he needs. NBA players have gurus not associated with teams that they hire out to work on their game away from the team. He has a new agent and perhaps he is in Frisco on the advice of the team to work with this one dude who they like. Im just guessing.
No one is hating on the staff. They just aren’t any good at developing and training.
He’s so slow
I still wanna hang onto him
Better than mudiay
Nalod wrote:Not sure why he wore black socks. They make his feet look slower.
The gray tee shirt is also not form fitting. Would show if he has worked on weights.
Really, why did they post these videos and what can we get out fo them?
The video wasn't that impressive since he wasn't doing any real advanced work. But it seems his trainer *for this video* is working on muscle memory for the adjustments to his shot. As Nard pointed out seems a little bit more fluid. He will then look to build on that.
His moves while slow(I know you were being sarcastic) seem to be about how to set up his shot within that fluidity and create muscle memory for it. Pace and difficulty will then start to pick up.
Cartman718 wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Cartman718 wrote:GustavBahler wrote:The shooting drills Barrett is going through (in Barrett thread) look more challenging. Those are the kind of drills Frank should be posting online.
exactly.
RJ's step back looks nice.
yes very nice
His physical & mental makeup at 18-19 is so impressive.
newyorknewyork wrote:Nalod wrote:Not sure why he wore black socks. They make his feet look slower.
The gray tee shirt is also not form fitting. Would show if he has worked on weights.
Really, why did they post these videos and what can we get out fo them?
The video wasn't that impressive since he wasn't doing any real advanced work. But it seems his trainer *for this video* is working on muscle memory for the adjustments to his shot. As Nard pointed out seems a little bit more fluid. He will then look to build on that.
His moves while slow(I know you were being sarcastic) seem to be about how to set up his shot within that fluidity and create muscle memory for it. Pace and difficulty will then start to pick up.
Exactly the season starts in October and we’re in June. Frank needs a reliable 3 pt shot if he’s gonna have value. Wes Matthews and Courtney Lee has whole careers based on that 3 pt shot. They need to start there and go forward.
StarksEwing1 wrote:We are in a position where we can be patient with him. Kid is still extremely young. Injuries have been very frustrating. Just when it looks like he is having a couple decent offensive games he gets injured.
If the Knicks don't net any FAs then they can just keep trying to develop him on the back end as there is no pressure or rush based on whats in front of him. Looking to mold a player that could play spot mins at the 1-3.
Siakam didn't do anything special for the first 2 years in the NBA as he wasn't ready even though he came in the league at 22 years old. If they could redo the draft he would be taken in the lottery over other bigs like Chriss, Poeltl, Maker, Bender. Even though it took his 3rd year and the age of 25 to break out. A high level role player who defends multiple positions. Knocks down 3s, puts the ball on the floor.
Somewhere a “highlights” video was posted of Frank. The extract of success demonstrates ability to get it done on both ends.
In my opinion last season was about players getting the green light and “feeling it” at this level. Then dial it back with precision down the road. Frank, again in my opinion (I’m not speaking like I really have knowledge or in his head) frustrated coaches who wanted him to create more. He is all too willing to start the offense. Thing is we had no system to really start!!!! We know he is unselfish. We wanted him to “Feel the creations”. By the time he was starting to do so he had shoulder and groin issues. At 5mm per his cap space became valueable and he is unproven still.
Reality is he is still here because of his contract and he might get another chance. For those in the second round or undrafted one can see how tenuous it is. Some players must get pissed they have more ready ability and yet this kid has the contract!!! It’s not always fair!!
The video as said demonstrates working on memory and the instinct that if space is created take the shot. He is overthinking it. Trier will need to go the other way funny enough. Frank over passes. Call it timid or unselfish? He is to nice? Too French? Needs more “Street”? “Needed more Gleague”?
I won’t pretend to know the answers. Berman had him gone draft night. While he won’t play summer league he will practice with his team or if traded they will want him to be there too. For now, he is a knicks. He is in the states working under contract. He has had a full year with his coach and the coach that will be here next year. He has likely been told what he needs to do to play. He might have been told attempts would be to trade him. We don’t know if nobody is interested, the price was not enough, or knicks have interest in still keeping him.
We can make shyt up and pretend we do.
Me, I hope he sticks, and hope he succeeds!!!! Simple really.
Once Frank get his first two steps right making longer strides in his dribble steps to confuse opponents his jumper will be polish, I'm looking for Frank to work hard on his athleticism-speed and on his dribble-pass being able to hit moving teammates with the ball with either hand.
Nalod wrote:Somewhere a “highlights” video was posted of Frank. The extract of success demonstrates ability to get it done on both ends. In my opinion last season was about players getting the green light and “feeling it” at this level. Then dial it back with precision down the road. Frank, again in my opinion (I’m not speaking like I really have knowledge or in his head) frustrated coaches who wanted him to create more. He is all too willing to start the offense. Thing is we had no system to really start!!!! We know he is unselfish. We wanted him to “Feel the creations”. By the time he was starting to do so he had shoulder and groin issues. At 5mm per his cap space became valueable and he is unproven still.
Reality is he is still here because of his contract and he might get another chance. For those in the second round or undrafted one can see how tenuous it is. Some players must get pissed they have more ready ability and yet this kid has the contract!!! It’s not always fair!!
The video as said demonstrates working on memory and the instinct that if space is created take the shot. He is overthinking it. Trier will need to go the other way funny enough. Frank over passes. Call it timid or unselfish? He is to nice? Too French? Needs more “Street”? “Needed more Gleague”?
I won’t pretend to know the answers. Berman had him gone draft night. While he won’t play summer league he will practice with his team or if traded they will want him to be there too. For now, he is a knicks. He is in the states working under contract. He has had a full year with his coach and the coach that will be here next year. He has likely been told what he needs to do to play. He might have been told attempts would be to trade him. We don’t know if nobody is interested, the price was not enough, or knicks have interest in still keeping him.
We can make shyt up and pretend we do.
Me, I hope he sticks, and hope he succeeds!!!! Simple really.
The Knicks coaching-staff and head-coach Fizdale's substitution started the 2018-19 season off TANKING!
When we seen the Knicks first starter lineup in the first Knicks game of the season vs Hawks .. That same starter lineup were never put on the court throughout any of the pre-season games. Coach Fizdale change of lineup and change of player rotation kept all the Knick players confuse from day one of the start of the season.
Fizdale change the rotation of players after the second game of the season, then Fizdale change the Knicks starter lineup after the 4th game into the season (That's TANKING!). Plus Fizdale had no type of ball movement in the Knicks offense, and no type of defensive position in the system to stop opponents transition performance nor their half-court performance the first 41 games of the season.
Plus Fizdale's use of a 2nd season Frank at the start of the season having Frank in all 4 quarters of the game in a different lineup each quarter, plus Frank only receiving 20 minute of playing-time per game. Com'on! A pass-first guard Frank playing in a Isolation-offense system, the Knicks offense were one or two passes then shoot having 3 to 4 shoot-first teammates in the lineup that don't play any defense Timmy, Knox, Trier, Mario, or Kanter. The Knicks looked and played much better on the court when coach Hornacek had Frank & Baker in the backcourt, or Frank & Burke in the backcourt. Fizdale's coaching last season were a complete JOKE = 17 win season !!!
The size, the D instinct he already has, NY would be VERY DUMB to let him go.
He will be a good player. Kawhii was not a great offensive player his first few years in the league. He developed.
Frank is 20 years old. He needs time to develop. He hass a nice shot already, just needs his confidence to go up. It will and he will be fine and a at least a good rotation player.
Just my thoughts
I am beyond shocked he wasn't moved during the draft
SupremeCommander wrote:I am beyond shocked he wasn't moved during the draft
why? Based on Berman's reports? There is no reason to trade this kid. Makes no sense. You work another year with him and keep him healthy. He's going to be 21. I mean why give up on a kid with his skills, size and no attitude problems? You keep him in the mix. Defensive stoppers with PG skills are worth developing.
fishmike wrote:SupremeCommander wrote:I am beyond shocked he wasn't moved during the draft
why? Based on Berman's reports? There is no reason to trade this kid. Makes no sense. You work another year with him and keep him healthy. He's going to be 21. I mean why give up on a kid with his skills, size and no attitude problems? You keep him in the mix. Defensive stoppers with PG skills are worth developing.
I agree with this no need to move Frank. He does everything right just needs confidence and aggressiveness. It’s just a matter of when he maybe the best player in the team.
fishmike wrote:SupremeCommander wrote:I am beyond shocked he wasn't moved during the draft
why? Based on Berman's reports? There is no reason to trade this kid. Makes no sense. You work another year with him and keep him healthy. He's going to be 21. I mean why give up on a kid with his skills, size and no attitude problems? You keep him in the mix. Defensive stoppers with PG skills are worth developing.
lol, you're demanding evidence for my statement, yet what empirical evidence do we have that he is a legitimate NBA player? Oh, yeah, his 0.4 DWS was CERTAINLY a hallmark of a great defensive player 
. Oh yeah, his negative win shares in both years inspires hope. No attitude problems? are you kidding me? That kid is constantly down on himself and his environment.
but sure, come out guns blazing. Like I'm the problem here. Just because everyone wants him to be a player--INCLUDING MYSELF--doesn't mean that he's a good NBA player. Because the honest truth is he is a bigger lottery bust than Michael Sweetney:
Rk
▲ Player From To G MP PER TS% 3PAr FTr ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG% OWS DWS WS WS/48 OBPM DBPM BPM VORP
1 Frank Ntilikina 2018 2019 121 2610 6.7 .430 .348 .125 2.0 9.0 5.5 19.8 1.8 1.1 18.5 16.8 -3.2 1.5 -1.8 -0.032 -3.8 -0.7 -4.5 -1.7
2 Mike Sweetney 2004 2005 119 2003 16.6 .580 .003 .500 13.8 19.8 16.8 4.9 1.2 1.5 16.4 19.6 3.5 1.8 5.2 .126 -0.7 -1.1 -1.8 0.1
Just because you say it louder don't make it truer
SupremeCommander wrote:fishmike wrote:SupremeCommander wrote:I am beyond shocked he wasn't moved during the draft
why? Based on Berman's reports? There is no reason to trade this kid. Makes no sense. You work another year with him and keep him healthy. He's going to be 21. I mean why give up on a kid with his skills, size and no attitude problems? You keep him in the mix. Defensive stoppers with PG skills are worth developing.
lol, you're demanding evidence for my statement, yet what empirical evidence do we have that he is a legitimate NBA player? Oh, yeah, his 0.4 DWS was CERTAINLY a hallmark of a great defensive player . Oh yeah, his negative win shares in both years inspires hope. No attitude problems? are you kidding me? That kid is constantly down on himself and his environment.
but sure, come out guns blazing. Like I'm the problem here. Just because everyone wants him to be a player--INCLUDING MYSELF--doesn't mean that he's a good NBA player. Because the honest truth is he is a bigger lottery bust than Michael Sweetney:
Rk
▲ Player From To G MP PER TS% 3PAr FTr ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG% OWS DWS WS WS/48 OBPM DBPM BPM VORP
1 Frank Ntilikina 2018 2019 121 2610 6.7 .430 .348 .125 2.0 9.0 5.5 19.8 1.8 1.1 18.5 16.8 -3.2 1.5 -1.8 -0.032 -3.8 -0.7 -4.5 -1.7
2 Mike Sweetney 2004 2005 119 2003 16.6 .580 .003 .500 13.8 19.8 16.8 4.9 1.2 1.5 16.4 19.6 3.5 1.8 5.2 .126 -0.7 -1.1 -1.8 0.1
Just because you say it louder don't make it truer
and just before you misrepresent me, I have often advocated holding onto Frank because his value is nothing. There is more to gain by him improving than there is by getting a secodn rounder for him. But, again, I am surprised that he wasn't dealt. Apparently the Frank fanboys have meltdowns when they hear that
