Victor Oladipo is returning on January 29th, from what I read. Does this make Malcolm Brogdon expendable? If yes, I would seriously consider giving up a nice package including the first pick and Randle. Is this silliness? If not, the Knicks should look into it.
Allanfan20 wrote:Victor Oladipo is returning on January 29th, from what I read. Does this make Malcolm Brogdon expendable? If yes, I would seriously consider giving up a nice package including the first pick and Randle. Is this silliness? If not, the Knicks should look into it.
I don't think so. He was signed because they compliment each other perfectly. But he also compliments Barrett perfectly and the knicks didn't even show interest in him as a FA. Knicks are only interested in lead guards that can't shoot.
Knixkik wrote:Allanfan20 wrote:Victor Oladipo is returning on January 29th, from what I read. Does this make Malcolm Brogdon expendable? If yes, I would seriously consider giving up a nice package including the first pick and Randle. Is this silliness? If not, the Knicks should look into it.
I don't think so. He was signed because they compliment each other perfectly. But he also compliments Barrett perfectly and the knicks didn't even show interest in him as a FA. Knicks are only interested in lead guards that can't shoot.
do your research bro... Brogden was restricted and TRADED to the Pacers for 4 draft picks, including the Pacers 2020 first rounder. He was never on the FA market.
Knicks would love a PG who shoots, those guys cost more.
Signed 4-yr $85MM contract with MIL Saturday, July 6, 2019 as part of a sign-and-trade with IND.
Brogden cost over $20mm a year and draft picks. Not bad but do make that trade with Frank and DS on the roster and locked in for two more years each? And we have 17 wins... none of those things add up
fishmike wrote:Knixkik wrote:Allanfan20 wrote:Victor Oladipo is returning on January 29th, from what I read. Does this make Malcolm Brogdon expendable? If yes, I would seriously consider giving up a nice package including the first pick and Randle. Is this silliness? If not, the Knicks should look into it.
I don't think so. He was signed because they compliment each other perfectly. But he also compliments Barrett perfectly and the knicks didn't even show interest in him as a FA. Knicks are only interested in lead guards that can't shoot.
do your research bro... Brogden was restricted and TRADED to the Pacers for 4 draft picks, including the Pacers 2020 first rounder. He was never on the FA market.Knicks would love a PG who shoots, those guys cost more.
Signed 4-yr $85MM contract with MIL Saturday, July 6, 2019 as part of a sign-and-trade with IND.
Brogden cost over $20mm a year and draft picks. Not bad but do make that trade with Frank and DS on the roster and locked in for two more years each? And we have 17 wins... none of those things add up
I know very well that he was traded. But he was a restricted FA and Knicks were never once linked to him. Common sense says they never really pursued him in any way. The trade you're referring to was just compensation to ensure the Bucks didn't match. It was by all intensive purposes a free agent deal. Knicks had additional picks and could have easily made the same move. Not saying it made the most sense, but in retrospect he's the guard this team really lacks.
Knixkik wrote:fishmike wrote:Knixkik wrote:Allanfan20 wrote:Victor Oladipo is returning on January 29th, from what I read. Does this make Malcolm Brogdon expendable? If yes, I would seriously consider giving up a nice package including the first pick and Randle. Is this silliness? If not, the Knicks should look into it.
I don't think so. He was signed because they compliment each other perfectly. But he also compliments Barrett perfectly and the knicks didn't even show interest in him as a FA. Knicks are only interested in lead guards that can't shoot.
do your research bro... Brogden was restricted and TRADED to the Pacers for 4 draft picks, including the Pacers 2020 first rounder. He was never on the FA market.Knicks would love a PG who shoots, those guys cost more.
Signed 4-yr $85MM contract with MIL Saturday, July 6, 2019 as part of a sign-and-trade with IND.
Brogden cost over $20mm a year and draft picks. Not bad but do make that trade with Frank and DS on the roster and locked in for two more years each? And we have 17 wins... none of those things add up
I know very well that he was traded. But he was a restricted FA and Knicks were never once linked to him. Common sense says they never really pursued him in any way. The trade you're referring to was just compensation to ensure the Bucks didn't match. It was by all intensive purposes a free agent deal. Knicks had additional picks and could have easily made the same move. Not saying it made the most sense, but in retrospect he's the guard this team really lacks.
Nope it wasn't a FA deal. Brodgen had to agree where to go, so he had leverage. And the 2 owners did an old school deal between the 2 of them so as to not create a cap hold, overpay on the player, and a forced situation.
Every other team in the NBA was locked out of this restricted free agent because of the player and the 2 owners.
Win, win, win.
martin wrote:Knixkik wrote:fishmike wrote:Knixkik wrote:Allanfan20 wrote:Victor Oladipo is returning on January 29th, from what I read. Does this make Malcolm Brogdon expendable? If yes, I would seriously consider giving up a nice package including the first pick and Randle. Is this silliness? If not, the Knicks should look into it.
I don't think so. He was signed because they compliment each other perfectly. But he also compliments Barrett perfectly and the knicks didn't even show interest in him as a FA. Knicks are only interested in lead guards that can't shoot.
do your research bro... Brogden was restricted and TRADED to the Pacers for 4 draft picks, including the Pacers 2020 first rounder. He was never on the FA market.Knicks would love a PG who shoots, those guys cost more.
Signed 4-yr $85MM contract with MIL Saturday, July 6, 2019 as part of a sign-and-trade with IND.
Brogden cost over $20mm a year and draft picks. Not bad but do make that trade with Frank and DS on the roster and locked in for two more years each? And we have 17 wins... none of those things add up
I know very well that he was traded. But he was a restricted FA and Knicks were never once linked to him. Common sense says they never really pursued him in any way. The trade you're referring to was just compensation to ensure the Bucks didn't match. It was by all intensive purposes a free agent deal. Knicks had additional picks and could have easily made the same move. Not saying it made the most sense, but in retrospect he's the guard this team really lacks.
Nope it wasn't a FA deal. Brodgen had to agree where to go, so he had leverage. And the 2 owners did an old school deal between the 2 of them so as to not create a cap hold, overpay on the player, and a forced situation.
Every other team in the NBA was locked out of this restricted free agent because of the player and the 2 owners.
Win, win, win.
Brogdon had to agree where to go. So if the Knicks came calling and got him to agree to a deal quickly like they did Randle and Portis, and then offered Milwaukee a couple draft picks to prevent them from matching, they could have potentially done that. Maybe Brodgon wanted Indiana and not someplace like NY, who knows. But it was a creative deal on Indiana's end that the Knicks could have easily competed with. It really doesn't matter at this point, but it was a free agent deal in the sense the team reached out to player and player agreed to a contract. Everything that happened after that was a result of Milwaukee being able to stall and possibly match the offer sheet.
I did want us to sign Brogden BUT (aside from the points mentioned above)I remember reading that the reason he fell in the draft were long term injury concerns.
I think Mills and Perry had zeroed in on Rozier as their pg, and got blindsided when the Hornets offered that size of contract- left them hoping DSJr would get better.
smackeddog wrote:I did want us to sign Brogden BUT (aside from the points mentioned above)I remember reading that the reason he fell in the draft were long term injury concerns.I think Mills and Perry had zeroed in on Rozier as their pg, and got blindsided when the Hornets offered that size of contract- left them hoping DSJr would get better.
Yeah Rozier would have made a lot of sense. He can shoot it too.
Knixkik wrote:smackeddog wrote:I did want us to sign Brogden BUT (aside from the points mentioned above)I remember reading that the reason he fell in the draft were long term injury concerns.I think Mills and Perry had zeroed in on Rozier as their pg, and got blindsided when the Hornets offered that size of contract- left them hoping DSJr would get better.
Yeah Rozier would have made a lot of sense. He can shoot it too.
The FO is just too Conservative and in experienced to make the kind of power moves that can elevate the franchise to the next level.
They don't want to truly commit to anything long term, which is why they continue to fall short.
They are starting to realize their mistakes, but the process will be as long as anyone of the young players they are trying to develop
knicks1248 wrote:Knixkik wrote:smackeddog wrote:I did want us to sign Brogden BUT (aside from the points mentioned above)I remember reading that the reason he fell in the draft were long term injury concerns.I think Mills and Perry had zeroed in on Rozier as their pg, and got blindsided when the Hornets offered that size of contract- left them hoping DSJr would get better.
Yeah Rozier would have made a lot of sense. He can shoot it too.
The FO is just too Conservative and in experienced to make the kind of power moves that can elevate the franchise to the next level.
They don't want to truly commit to anything long term, which is why they continue to fall short.
They are starting to realize their mistakes, but the process will be as long as anyone of the young players they are trying to develop
I agree with this. They are determined to show they aren't like previous regimes and won't offer long-term contracts to non-superstars and won't deal picks. That is fine, but eventually they have to commit to something for us to take a step forward.
Knixkik wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Knixkik wrote:smackeddog wrote:I did want us to sign Brogden BUT (aside from the points mentioned above)I remember reading that the reason he fell in the draft were long term injury concerns.I think Mills and Perry had zeroed in on Rozier as their pg, and got blindsided when the Hornets offered that size of contract- left them hoping DSJr would get better.
Yeah Rozier would have made a lot of sense. He can shoot it too.
The FO is just too Conservative and in experienced to make the kind of power moves that can elevate the franchise to the next level.
They don't want to truly commit to anything long term, which is why they continue to fall short.
They are starting to realize their mistakes, but the process will be as long as anyone of the young players they are trying to develop
I agree with this. They are determined to show they aren't like previous regimes and won't offer long-term contracts to non-superstars and won't deal picks. That is fine, but eventually they have to commit to something for us to take a step forward.
Like maybe a commitment to not trading away draft picks and maintaining cap space and developing players? As opposed to the usual ADD fan base/media pressured blow your wad moves that are the Knicks' recent history?
knicks1248 wrote:Knixkik wrote:smackeddog wrote:I did want us to sign Brogden BUT (aside from the points mentioned above)I remember reading that the reason he fell in the draft were long term injury concerns.I think Mills and Perry had zeroed in on Rozier as their pg, and got blindsided when the Hornets offered that size of contract- left them hoping DSJr would get better.
Yeah Rozier would have made a lot of sense. He can shoot it too.
The FO is just too Conservative and in experienced to make the kind of power moves that can elevate the franchise to the next level.
They don't want to truly commit to anything long term, which is why they continue to fall short.
They are starting to realize their mistakes, but the process will be as long as anyone of the young players they are trying to develop
Rainman Hypocritical:
At 18mm per season Tim Hardaway was a Mills abomination.
at about the same money per year Rozier and THjr have nearly the same per 36min stats this season.
The are committed to the long term rebuilding thru youth. Rainman wants a panic starphuch. That's a great idea. 
Hornets are 15-28. Now Im not gonna sit here and stick my chest out like we some baddass team. Im not happy but at the same Time I won't berate the FO for doing one thing and thinking they would have been great to sign Rozier when he is doing what a healthy THjr is doing in a supporting role on a better team.
Nalod wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Knixkik wrote:smackeddog wrote:I did want us to sign Brogden BUT (aside from the points mentioned above)I remember reading that the reason he fell in the draft were long term injury concerns.I think Mills and Perry had zeroed in on Rozier as their pg, and got blindsided when the Hornets offered that size of contract- left them hoping DSJr would get better.
Yeah Rozier would have made a lot of sense. He can shoot it too.
The FO is just too Conservative and in experienced to make the kind of power moves that can elevate the franchise to the next level.
They don't want to truly commit to anything long term, which is why they continue to fall short.
They are starting to realize their mistakes, but the process will be as long as anyone of the young players they are trying to develop
Rainman Hypocritical:
At 18mm per season Tim Hardaway was a Mills abomination.
at about the same money per year Rozier and THjr have nearly the same per 36min stats this season.
The are committed to the long term rebuilding thru youth. Rainman wants a panic starphuch. That's a great idea.
Hornets are 15-28. Now Im not gonna sit here and stick my chest out like we some baddass team. Im not happy but at the same Time I won't berate the FO for doing one thing and thinking they would have been great to sign Rozier when he is doing what a healthy THjr is doing in a supporting role on a better team.
I think people are missing one thing about Rozier. The reason he's putting solid, not spectacular, shooting stats is because he's not put in the position of being the primary ball handler. Put him in this lineup and you probably won't see the same level efficiency. Graham kinda balances him out on that roster. Rozier is a good player, but he's not what we really need at this time, especially at his current salary.
BigDaddyG wrote:Nalod wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Knixkik wrote:smackeddog wrote:I did want us to sign Brogden BUT (aside from the points mentioned above)I remember reading that the reason he fell in the draft were long term injury concerns.I think Mills and Perry had zeroed in on Rozier as their pg, and got blindsided when the Hornets offered that size of contract- left them hoping DSJr would get better.
Yeah Rozier would have made a lot of sense. He can shoot it too.
The FO is just too Conservative and in experienced to make the kind of power moves that can elevate the franchise to the next level.
They don't want to truly commit to anything long term, which is why they continue to fall short.
They are starting to realize their mistakes, but the process will be as long as anyone of the young players they are trying to develop
Rainman Hypocritical:
At 18mm per season Tim Hardaway was a Mills abomination.
at about the same money per year Rozier and THjr have nearly the same per 36min stats this season.
The are committed to the long term rebuilding thru youth. Rainman wants a panic starphuch. That's a great idea.
Hornets are 15-28. Now Im not gonna sit here and stick my chest out like we some baddass team. Im not happy but at the same Time I won't berate the FO for doing one thing and thinking they would have been great to sign Rozier when he is doing what a healthy THjr is doing in a supporting role on a better team.
I think people are missing one thing about Rozier. The reason he's putting solid, not spectacular, shooting stats is because he's not put in the position of being the primary ball handler. Put him in this lineup and you probably won't see the same level efficiency. Graham kinda balances him out on that roster. Rozier is a good player, but he's not what we really need at this time, especially at his current salary.
Im on record for saying similar about Hardaway. He was our 1 or 2 option for the bulk of his games with us. He is not that player. He was paid an average median wage for the position. Now he gets fed from Doncic and has some decent shooters around him.
To the OP I think Brogdon was bought in to pair with Olidipo and they have to see that out the remainder of this year and likely into next. Simon family ownsership has been a very solid group for many years. No chips since the ABA days but they field competitive teams most years and are stable. This was a solid move for them.
Nalod wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Knixkik wrote:smackeddog wrote:I did want us to sign Brogden BUT (aside from the points mentioned above)I remember reading that the reason he fell in the draft were long term injury concerns.I think Mills and Perry had zeroed in on Rozier as their pg, and got blindsided when the Hornets offered that size of contract- left them hoping DSJr would get better.
Yeah Rozier would have made a lot of sense. He can shoot it too.
The FO is just too Conservative and in experienced to make the kind of power moves that can elevate the franchise to the next level.
They don't want to truly commit to anything long term, which is why they continue to fall short.
They are starting to realize their mistakes, but the process will be as long as anyone of the young players they are trying to develop
Rainman Hypocritical:
At 18mm per season Tim Hardaway was a Mills abomination.
at about the same money per year Rozier and THjr have nearly the same per 36min stats this season.
The are committed to the long term rebuilding thru youth. Rainman wants a panic starphuch. That's a great idea.
Hornets are 15-28. Now Im not gonna sit here and stick my chest out like we some baddass team. Im not happy but at the same Time I won't berate the FO for doing one thing and thinking they would have been great to sign Rozier when he is doing what a healthy THjr is doing in a supporting role on a better team.
The only team building through youth is the Cavs, ATL, and Knicks, the worst teams in the NBA.
Going into 7 straight lottery season and your talking about "panic starphuc".
We haven't had a decent pg under mills entire tenure, in fact we haven't had a decent roster under him neither.
dude is on the verge of getting fired, and you think patiences.
What do you think is going to happen when the FO changes, you think they going to continue with his process like he did after phil.
New FO will clean shop from top to bottom, you know that..
BigDaddyG wrote:Nalod wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Knixkik wrote:smackeddog wrote:I did want us to sign Brogden BUT (aside from the points mentioned above)I remember reading that the reason he fell in the draft were long term injury concerns.I think Mills and Perry had zeroed in on Rozier as their pg, and got blindsided when the Hornets offered that size of contract- left them hoping DSJr would get better.
Yeah Rozier would have made a lot of sense. He can shoot it too.
The FO is just too Conservative and in experienced to make the kind of power moves that can elevate the franchise to the next level.
They don't want to truly commit to anything long term, which is why they continue to fall short.
They are starting to realize their mistakes, but the process will be as long as anyone of the young players they are trying to develop
Rainman Hypocritical:
At 18mm per season Tim Hardaway was a Mills abomination.
at about the same money per year Rozier and THjr have nearly the same per 36min stats this season.
The are committed to the long term rebuilding thru youth. Rainman wants a panic starphuch. That's a great idea.
Hornets are 15-28. Now Im not gonna sit here and stick my chest out like we some baddass team. Im not happy but at the same Time I won't berate the FO for doing one thing and thinking they would have been great to sign Rozier when he is doing what a healthy THjr is doing in a supporting role on a better team.
I think people are missing one thing about Rozier. The reason he's putting solid, not spectacular, shooting stats is because he's not put in the position of being the primary ball handler. Put him in this lineup and you probably won't see the same level efficiency. Graham kinda balances him out on that roster. Rozier is a good player, but he's not what we really need at this time, especially at his current salary.
I think eventually Barrett will take some primary play-making responsibility. But i agree with you, Rozier is in a great position there.
knicks1248 wrote:Nalod wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Knixkik wrote:smackeddog wrote:I did want us to sign Brogden BUT (aside from the points mentioned above)I remember reading that the reason he fell in the draft were long term injury concerns.I think Mills and Perry had zeroed in on Rozier as their pg, and got blindsided when the Hornets offered that size of contract- left them hoping DSJr would get better.
Yeah Rozier would have made a lot of sense. He can shoot it too.
The FO is just too Conservative and in experienced to make the kind of power moves that can elevate the franchise to the next level.
They don't want to truly commit to anything long term, which is why they continue to fall short.
They are starting to realize their mistakes, but the process will be as long as anyone of the young players they are trying to develop
Rainman Hypocritical:
At 18mm per season Tim Hardaway was a Mills abomination.
at about the same money per year Rozier and THjr have nearly the same per 36min stats this season.
The are committed to the long term rebuilding thru youth. Rainman wants a panic starphuch. That's a great idea.
Hornets are 15-28. Now Im not gonna sit here and stick my chest out like we some baddass team. Im not happy but at the same Time I won't berate the FO for doing one thing and thinking they would have been great to sign Rozier when he is doing what a healthy THjr is doing in a supporting role on a better team.
The only team building through youth is the Cavs, ATL, and Knicks, the worst teams in the NBA.
Going into 7 straight lottery season and your talking about "panic starphuc".
We haven't had a decent pg under mills entire tenure, in fact we haven't had a decent roster under him neither.
dude is on the verge of getting fired, and you think patiences.
What do you think is going to happen when the FO changes, you think they going to continue with his process like he did after phil.
New FO will clean shop from top to bottom, you know that..
The griz are rebuilding via youth and the draft and are doing very well
They still dont know if Oladipo will come bsck 100 percent. Pretty sure they wouldnt push a trade this season.
GustavBahler wrote:They still dont know if Oladipo will come bsck 100 percent. Pretty sure they wouldnt push a trade this season.
I hope his comeback is more along the lines of Zach Lavine and not KP. I like Ola's game.
I am pretty sure Brogdon has a fused foot. If/when that goes he might be done. He is a great player and I think would be a great Knick.
BigDaddyG wrote:GustavBahler wrote:They still dont know if Oladipo will come bsck 100 percent. Pretty sure they wouldnt push a trade this season.
I hope his comeback is more along the lines of Zach Lavine and not KP. I like Ola's game.
Ditto, Oladipo was my pick of that draft to be an impact player, has that extra gear. He had surgery for a fully torn quad. They have to sew it back on to the knee with some kind of fabric. Thats a serious injury to come back from.
When I tore my quad last fall, everyone who looked at the mri said it was a complete rupture, werent
sure if I would make a full recovery at my age. Turns out it was only a partial tear, quad was still attached. Was a big relief, but the rehab is no joke, still have another few months to go.
Oladipo injury is more serious, hopefully his age and conditioning, will help him get back to 100 percent.
