Knicks · A smart and calculated leap of faith(trade) can turn things around for the knicks quickly (page 1)

I don't buy all this trade rumors circulating now, its just sports writers running out of things to write about, no real weight on those reports. But this extra long offseason considering it has just started for the knicks is just unbearable for me. I can't help but indulge these reports with my own dream scenario.

Trading for Booker for the right trade pieces will help turn things around. I dont know if the numbers will work but a package of Randle, knox, DSJ, the knicks 2020 first and Dallas' 2022 first will be ok with me. Im hoping the To give the clippers 1st rounder instead.

If we can keep our 1st round and draft Toppin if we can't lets just sign Gallo or Bertams. Our line-up can look like this:

Starters:
C- Mitch
PF- Toppin/Gallo/Bertans
SF- RJ
SG- Booker
PG- Frank

Reserves
C/PF 38th pick of the draft/Wooten
SF- Iggy
SG- Dotson
PG- jared Harper

This can set us up in a good spot to be a player in the star studded free agency the next year if we still have cap space to bring in another star. Hopefully if that happens in 2 years Mitch and RJ can be on their way to being stars themselves!

A couple of things....

1) I said this last Summer and it turned out I was correct. You don’t know if Mitch is ready to be a starter. He really hasn’t developed that much yet.

2) There is zero chance the Suns take that package in return for Booker. They want a sure-fire star that will put their team over the hump. Nothing in that proposed package does that. They might very well ask for RJ, Mitch AND OUR future first round picks. Not any of the crap Dallas will give us. In that case, it is totally not worth it to trade for Booker if we learned from the Melo and Marbury trades.

Please give up the Booker fantasy. We would have a better chance of getting Ingram from the Pelicans, who is an actual restricted free agent.

TheGame wrote:Please give up the Booker fantasy. We would have a better chance of getting Ingram from the Pelicans, who is an actual restricted free agent.

What about Zach Lavigne. He's a more realistic target. I like Booker a lot more, but it is what it is.

Trying to turn things around quickly is why we've been terrible for the last 2 decades save for a yr or 2. We need to stop with the quick fixes and build this thing from the ground up.

As i said in the opening of the thread, im not really high on this happening and I will only entertain a trade with the package i have at most.it will be a quick fix but i don't think its a package that will mortgage our future, we will still have one first round pick each year moving forward. This is far from the Melo trade with the Nuggets. The only young stars im interested in are Booker, Beal And maybe Markanen to trade for and Ingram to sign in the offseason because their ages aligns with our core's ages.

Im not hoping for anything at this point but if during the course of the offseason i wake up to the news of anyof these players are traded or signed by our team and we still have most of our young core intact and have atleast 1 first rounder every year moving forward, I will be happy and I hope many knick fans will be happy as well.

BigDaddyG wrote:

TheGame wrote:Please give up the Booker fantasy. We would have a better chance of getting Ingram from the Pelicans, who is an actual restricted free agent.

What about Zach Lavigne. He's a more realistic target. I like Booker a lot more, but it is what it is.

I guess it all comes down to price. I'd rather try and sign guys like Gallinari and VanVleet for free who are true impact players and keep all of the assets. We have a real chance to steal some guys in free agency for less than market value due to the pandemic having such an impact on small market finances.

BigDaddyG wrote:

TheGame wrote:Please give up the Booker fantasy. We would have a better chance of getting Ingram from the Pelicans, who is an actual restricted free agent.

What about Zach Lavigne. He's a more realistic target. I like Booker a lot more, but it is what it is.

You couldn't give me Lavine. Another of the too cool for school camp. And he's more flashy than good

Suns aren't going to trade Booker until at least after next season. If they do it will be for someone like Ben Simmons. They aren't going to sell Booker for assets.

What about Victor Oladipo? He's not as young but i don't think Indiana is going to pay him. He still has to prove he's just as good as before, but if he is, is he worth the max? Or via trade he will be cheaper as an upcoming free agent.

Jimbo5 wrote:I don't buy all this trade rumors circulating now, its just sports writers running out of things to write about, no real weight on those reports. But this extra long offseason considering it has just started for the knicks is just unbearable for me. I can't help but indulge these reports with my own dream scenario.

Trading for Booker for the right trade pieces will help turn things around. I dont know if the numbers will work but a package of Randle, knox, DSJ, the knicks 2020 first and Dallas' 2022 first will be ok with me. Im hoping the To give the clippers 1st rounder instead.

If we can keep our 1st round and draft Toppin if we can't lets just sign Gallo or Bertams. Our line-up can look like this:

Starters:
C- Mitch
PF- Toppin/Gallo/Bertans
SF- RJ
SG- Booker
PG- Frank

Reserves
C/PF 38th pick of the draft/Wooten
SF- Iggy
SG- Dotson
PG- jared Harper

This can set us up in a good spot to be a player in the star studded free agency the next year if we still have cap space to bring in another star. Hopefully if that happens in 2 years Mitch and RJ can be on their way to being stars themselves!

Booker is the only legit starter, that line up would win 28-32 games....Frank and mitch a starter...lol

I wouldn't even go after Booker unless I could pair him with another ALL star.

Since we already have RJ, i would be more focus on a legit starting PG and some stretch bigs who can also rebound

knicks1248 wrote:

Jimbo5 wrote:I don't buy all this trade rumors circulating now, its just sports writers running out of things to write about, no real weight on those reports. But this extra long offseason considering it has just started for the knicks is just unbearable for me. I can't help but indulge these reports with my own dream scenario.

Trading for Booker for the right trade pieces will help turn things around. I dont know if the numbers will work but a package of Randle, knox, DSJ, the knicks 2020 first and Dallas' 2022 first will be ok with me. Im hoping the To give the clippers 1st rounder instead.

If we can keep our 1st round and draft Toppin if we can't lets just sign Gallo or Bertams. Our line-up can look like this:

Starters:
C- Mitch
PF- Toppin/Gallo/Bertans
SF- RJ
SG- Booker
PG- Frank

Reserves
C/PF 38th pick of the draft/Wooten
SF- Iggy
SG- Dotson
PG- jared Harper

This can set us up in a good spot to be a player in the star studded free agency the next year if we still have cap space to bring in another star. Hopefully if that happens in 2 years Mitch and RJ can be on their way to being stars themselves!

Booker is the only legit starter, that line up would win 28-32 games....Frank and mitch a starter...lol

I wouldn't even go after Booker unless I could pair him with another ALL star.

Since we already have RJ, i would be more focus on a legit starting PG and some stretch bigs who can also rebound

Pair with all star. No shit.
How does that happen?

Nalod wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

Jimbo5 wrote:I don't buy all this trade rumors circulating now, its just sports writers running out of things to write about, no real weight on those reports. But this extra long offseason considering it has just started for the knicks is just unbearable for me. I can't help but indulge these reports with my own dream scenario.

Trading for Booker for the right trade pieces will help turn things around. I dont know if the numbers will work but a package of Randle, knox, DSJ, the knicks 2020 first and Dallas' 2022 first will be ok with me. Im hoping the To give the clippers 1st rounder instead.

If we can keep our 1st round and draft Toppin if we can't lets just sign Gallo or Bertams. Our line-up can look like this:

Starters:
C- Mitch
PF- Toppin/Gallo/Bertans
SF- RJ
SG- Booker
PG- Frank

Reserves
C/PF 38th pick of the draft/Wooten
SF- Iggy
SG- Dotson
PG- jared Harper

This can set us up in a good spot to be a player in the star studded free agency the next year if we still have cap space to bring in another star. Hopefully if that happens in 2 years Mitch and RJ can be on their way to being stars themselves!

Booker is the only legit starter, that line up would win 28-32 games....Frank and mitch a starter...lol

I wouldn't even go after Booker unless I could pair him with another ALL star.

Since we already have RJ, i would be more focus on a legit starting PG and some stretch bigs who can also rebound

Pair with all star. No shit.
How does that happen?

They get paid millions to figure that out.

knicks1248 wrote:

Nalod wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

Jimbo5 wrote:I don't buy all this trade rumors circulating now, its just sports writers running out of things to write about, no real weight on those reports. But this extra long offseason considering it has just started for the knicks is just unbearable for me. I can't help but indulge these reports with my own dream scenario.

Trading for Booker for the right trade pieces will help turn things around. I dont know if the numbers will work but a package of Randle, knox, DSJ, the knicks 2020 first and Dallas' 2022 first will be ok with me. Im hoping the To give the clippers 1st rounder instead.

If we can keep our 1st round and draft Toppin if we can't lets just sign Gallo or Bertams. Our line-up can look like this:

Starters:
C- Mitch
PF- Toppin/Gallo/Bertans
SF- RJ
SG- Booker
PG- Frank

Reserves
C/PF 38th pick of the draft/Wooten
SF- Iggy
SG- Dotson
PG- jared Harper

This can set us up in a good spot to be a player in the star studded free agency the next year if we still have cap space to bring in another star. Hopefully if that happens in 2 years Mitch and RJ can be on their way to being stars themselves!

Booker is the only legit starter, that line up would win 28-32 games....Frank and mitch a starter...lol

I wouldn't even go after Booker unless I could pair him with another ALL star.

Since we already have RJ, i would be more focus on a legit starting PG and some stretch bigs who can also rebound

Pair with all star. No shit.
How does that happen?

They get paid millions to figure that out.

seems like a waste given you got it all figured out.

Knixkik wrote:What about Victor Oladipo?

Good defender. Teams will be more apt to try for shorter contracts in general with COVID19. Too many variables at this point. One thing clear though, to be a Knick, NY will have to offer him max years/max money.

Is he worth it? What's the goal of the team.

Some teams only want to win a ring at all costs.

Some teams are fine with fielding an interesting "product" that is fun to watch, will get booted out of the playoffs mid to early and keeps the revenue rolling while understanding they'll never win a ring.

****

On an aside ( not relating to Dipo in any way), an interesting target would be Alex Caruso of the Lakers. Knicks would have to wait another season though.

The OP trade idea is completely lopsided in Nyk’s favor. Any GM would piggy back that cost for booker and then some.

If you want to get better without giving up any major assets other than cash, I’d think the guy to after is Ingram or one of those (R)FAs. Sign one guy then trade for another guy.

Interesting you mentioned The idea of signing Brandon Ingram, for me that would be perfect. Do you think it will be possible for the knicks to seriously target Ingram? Can Leon Rose's new Cap Guru Brock Aller prove his worth and construct a back-end poison pill contract that the Pelicans can't accept? Is there a way to construct a poison pill contract and somehow still be able to work around the loophole so that the knick can still maintain some form of cap flexibility moving forward? I think the only way the knicks can pry away Ingram from the Pelicans is with a poison pill contract coz we can expect the pelicans to match any max contract in front of them.

Unless any of our young core takes a major step forward in their development, ideally the knicks need to get a young talent who just turned the development corner via a trade or straight up signing to move us a bit further. But how to get that player is another problem altogether. I do think the head coaching hire will be the major factor in which direction to go moving forward. The past few years our coaches didn't have the ability to truly harness and develop our youth. If we strike gold in our coaching hire and see a substantial improvement with our youth, then we can maintain the course and build the team slowly through the draft. I still believe the slow and steady route is still the way to go but the only way that will work is if we have the right coach leading the team.

I have this bad feeling the front office will make another coaching hire disaster by choosing Jason kidd with the hopes of getting a superstar. They should forget Giannis, that will never happen, Phil messed things up too much. They hired Fiz for his ties with Lebron and still he choose the Lakers. I hope they don't choose Kidd, that for me is a wrong move.

Jimbo5 wrote:Interesting you mentioned The idea of signing Brandon Ingram, for me that would be perfect. Do you think it will be possible for the knicks to seriously target Ingram?

No real chance at Ingram. He can get more money and more years from a team with a better situation.

Guys the Knicks CAN get ( I am NOT saying they should get them )

A) Chris Paul

B) John Wall

C) Blake Griffin

D) Tobias Harris/Al Horford

E) CJ McCollum

Chris Paul has the best chance ( but thin) of providing some kind of value to the end of his monster deal.

At this point, I think the 76ers would give you Harris and Horford for basically nothing just to dump their contracts.

Wall's contract is the worst in the league

While there is likely not a fit, I suspect the Warriors would give up Andrew Wiggins to the Knicks if they could get Robert Covington in a three team trade. I'm not looking at the cap and rosters at the moment though. Odds are the Knicks would have to eat some bad Rockets contracts to start.

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No real chance at Ingram. He can get more money and more years from a team with a better situation.

Guys the Knicks CAN get ( I am NOT saying they should get them )

A) Chris Paul

B) John Wall

C) Blake Griffin

D) Tobias Harris/Al Horford

E) CJ McCollum

Chris Paul has the best chance ( but thin) of providing some kind of value to the end of his monster deal.

At this point, I think the 76ers would give you Harris and Horford for basically nothing just to dump their contracts.

Wall's contract is the worst in the league

While there is likely not a fit, I suspect the Warriors would give up Andrew Wiggins to the Knicks if they could get Robert Covington in a three team trade. I'm not looking at the cap and rosters at the moment though. Odds are the Knicks would have to eat some bad Rockets contracts to start.
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Yes, the list of players there are more realistic, but none of them interests me unfortunately. I do think of them as stopgaps and not real solutions. Only way i think it will be worth it to get Wall, Paul, Griffin, McCollm is if we get 2 first rounders for taking their salaries off their current team. By getting those players it will still be in line with the slow rebuild approach. I dont think getting any of these players can push us to contender status and the windows of these players will probably close once our youth may come to their own. But if we get 2 first rounders and a young player in return, we should consider it.

Jimbo5 wrote: I do think of them as stopgaps and not real solutions. Only way i think it will be worth it to get Wall, Paul, Griffin, McCollm is if we get 2 first rounders for taking their salaries off their current team. By getting those players it will still be in line with the slow rebuild approach. I dont think getting any of these players can push us to contender status and the windows of these players will probably close once our youth may come to their own. But if we get 2 first rounders and a young player in return, we should consider it.

A "solution" to what goal?

If the answer is to be a contender, then No, that won't happen. But odds are it won't happen anyway. Given what LBJ and the Warriors have left in the tank, and most teams crossing their fingers for Greek Freak down the road, I just don't see a contention window for a long time.

Chris Paul is overpaid. But he's got leadership, is battle tested and pedigree and I think he can make the rest of the young Knicks better and drag this team into the playoffs ( they'd squeak in and wouldn't last long though)

Maybe it would be a chance to just have some fun basketball.

Some people see the Seven Second Or Less Suns as a failure. But were they really? The team was fun to watch. The fans got to have exciting basketball for a while. Even if Sarver didn't sell off players and picks, it's not a lock they would have won a ring anyway.

Billy Beane said it best ( when he traded for Johnny Damon), you just can't keep rebuilding forever. I think this goes beyond chasing a ring and also into not dragging your fanbase too far down a hole. Does that mean the Knicks should scrap all their picks and young players? No. I think you can keep your picks, keep trying to draft the best you can, try to run a mostly clean cap and have one luxury ( a big one...) in a Chris Paul.

Do I think he's worth 40 rocks a year? No

Do I think he can give this team a few years of fun basketball to a weary set of fans? Yes.

I'm not saying the Knicks should do this, I am saying there are different pathways to see "success" in the NBA.

I would pass on Horford/Harris and anyone else that signed mega deals that are long in length, sends
the team backwards.

Booker is intriguing because of his age. At 23rd he’s only scratching the surface. The Suns like the Knicks are a bottom 5 franchise with rotating coaches and little to no stability. Booker paired with a superstar would be a nice selling point of the pipe dream is Giannis or AD. You need a serious guard. Outside of Ball who I do believe is going to be an Allstar I would give the Suns our pick, both Dallas picks, Knox, Smith and whatever gets it done outside of Mitch and RJ. You actually put together an unbelievable foundation under 24 years old. Then you have something to sell in free agency.

Outside of that, Chris Paul is the guy. These kids don’t know how to play yet and a veteran that can put them in the right spots will transfer their games. We need a floor general and he did change his diet and his body got rest this season so can make it two years without being a long term killer.