Knicks · Still high on Haliburton - best PG in draft (page 1)

Remains my number one PG in draft. See him as superior to Ball in terms of his all around game. Observations for improvement - reluctance to go left, small build,needs to attack the rim more aggressively, not shown much a mid range game.

But i think if he can bulk up and work on his ball handling, i like him as the knicks starting PG next to RJ, who’s a good cutter, off screen shooter, and mitch, who is a lob-catching machine. if you put some shooters around this kid, and get some defensively dependable big men down low, i think he could flourish.

I like him a lot, though I think Golden state might go after him (maybe trade down slightly)

He’s a great prospect. Doesn’t have elite upside like Ball but is easier to plug and play. He’s my top guy if we stay put wherever we draft. If we move up it would have to be for Ball simply because of his upside. But staying put and landing Haliburton would be a huge win.

Knixkik wrote:He’s a great prospect. Doesn’t have elite upside like Ball but is easier to plug and play. He’s my top guy if we stay put wherever we draft. If we move up it would have to be for Ball simply because of his upside. But staying put and landing Haliburton would be a huge win.

I think he’ll go 5th or 6th, and we’ll pick 7 or 8. We can’t land the 5th spot and only have an 8.somethng% chance at 6th. If we landed 1-3 or traded up we’d probably draft Ball, Wiseman or Edwards. Really by a cruel twist of fate, the odds of us getting him are very very slim, unfortunately.

Yeah he's who I'd like. And this "upside" s#!t -- how is that measured exactly?

Haliburton would be great. I think we trade the pick tho

fishmike wrote:Haliburton would be great. I think we trade the pick tho

I can see that happening if Leon particularly values Frank. From everything I hear, he does. I also don’t mind trading down if we have, say, the 8th pick.

Giving up assets for LeVine or Booker would be crazy to me.

smackeddog wrote:

Knixkik wrote:He’s a great prospect. Doesn’t have elite upside like Ball but is easier to plug and play. He’s my top guy if we stay put wherever we draft. If we move up it would have to be for Ball simply because of his upside. But staying put and landing Haliburton would be a huge win.

I think he’ll go 5th or 6th, and we’ll pick 7 or 8. We can’t land the 5th spot and only have an 8.somethng% chance at 6th. If we landed 1-3 or traded up we’d probably draft Ball, Wiseman or Edwards. Really by a cruel twist of fate, the odds of us getting him are very very slim, unfortunately.

Maybe not as slim as you think. If they want him bad enough and only need to move up a couple spots they can probably find a team willing to swap picks for additional assets, be it a future pick or cash since a lot of teams are strapped. Haliburton is a CAA guy so I’m sure they have an opinion of him and may be more invested in him for that reason. But I think moving up a spot or 2 is easy enough if they feel it’s worth it.

Haliburton would be a solid pick. I still like Hayes better, but I cannot argue that Haliburton looks solid. The issue with Haliburton is that he does not have a high ceiling. He rarely drives to the lane, does not go to the free throw line alot, and is only a so-so athlete. In my view, Ball is a much better pick. Ball is a far superior at breaking defenses down. He is just as good a passer, and while his jumper needs work, if Lonzo could turn himself into a decent shooter, Ball can turn himself into an above-average shooter. I think Ball's poor percentages were due mostly to poor shot selection rather than an inability to shoot. I will acknowledge that, for next year, Haliburton will probably perform better, because Ball still needs to grow into his body and work on his jumper, but in 3 years, I cannot see anyway Haliburton is going to be a better player than Ball, and I don't think it would be even close. Haliburton is more on a George Hill level. Ball will be on a Ben Simmons level.

Allanfan20 wrote:

fishmike wrote:Haliburton would be great. I think we trade the pick tho

I can see that happening if Leon particularly values Frank. From everything I hear, he does. I also don’t mind trading down if we have, say, the 8th pick.

Giving up assets for LeVine or Booker would be crazy to me.

I love Frank and gotta guess that Leon values him but does he really think Frank is ready and fully able to be a starting PG and be able to execute everything Thibs needs? Frank/DSJr enough?

Don't know.

TheGame wrote:Haliburton would be a solid pick. I still like Hayes better, but I cannot argue that Haliburton looks solid. The issue with Haliburton is that he does not have a high ceiling. He rarely drives to the lane, does not go to the free throw line alot, and is only a so-so athlete. In my view, Ball is a much better pick. Ball is a far superior at breaking defenses down. He is just as good a passer, and while his jumper needs work, if Lonzo could turn himself into a decent shooter, Ball can term himself into a great shooter. Yes, for next year, Haliburton would probably perform better, because still needs to grow into his body and work on his jumper, but in 3 years, I cannot see anyway Haliburton is going to be a better player than Ball, and I don't think it would be even close. Haliburton is more on a George Hill level. Ball will be on a Ben Simmons level.

No doubt Ball has more upside and can be a star at best case. Haliburton offers a high floor with his ability to fit into different lineups but doesn’t have that real high ceiling. George hill from Indiana isn’t a bad comp. I don’t know if there’s a great comp right now. He’s a unique player. His strengths are good passer, good spot up shooter and good defensive versatility. Weaknesses are explosiveness and scoring/shooting off the dribble. What player comes to mind with that ?

martin wrote:

Allanfan20 wrote:

fishmike wrote:Haliburton would be great. I think we trade the pick tho

I can see that happening if Leon particularly values Frank. From everything I hear, he does. I also don’t mind trading down if we have, say, the 8th pick.

Giving up assets for LeVine or Booker would be crazy to me.

I love Frank and gotta guess that Leon values him but does he really think Frank is ready and fully able to be a starting PG and be able to execute everything Thibs needs? Frank/DSJr enough?

Don't know.

I don’t know either. I like to hope Frank is communicating with Leon and now Thibs. We’ll see I guess.

Allanfan20 wrote:

fishmike wrote:Haliburton would be great. I think we trade the pick tho

I can see that happening if Leon particularly values Frank. From everything I hear, he does. I also don’t mind trading down if we have, say, the 8th pick.

Giving up assets for LeVine or Booker would be crazy to me.

Do we have anyone on this roster that is better then either one of them.

I don't know how much Leon Values frank or DSJ, When Leon was asks specifically about frank, he said he thinks frank can have success in the right situation...That can be here or any team in the league, and you can say that about 99% of NBA players

Keep in mind that The cap space has proven to almost be worthless when your a really bad team.

As far has Haliburton, he's a would be a decent pick

You are giving up assets for a player who is talented but also had decent talent around them... yet their teams are horrible. Now, you have little talent around that guy you acquired because you have up everything for him (like the Melo trade) and he has no history of winning in the NBA. Yes, it’s a terrible idea.

Allanfan20 wrote:You are giving up assets for a player who is talented but also had decent talent around them... yet their teams are horrible. Now, you have little talent around that guy you acquired because you have up everything for him (like the Melo trade) and he has no history of winning in the NBA. Yes, it’s a terrible idea.

I get your point, but how are you suggesting we turn this around fast

Allanfan20 wrote:

martin wrote:

Allanfan20 wrote:

fishmike wrote:Haliburton would be great. I think we trade the pick tho

I can see that happening if Leon particularly values Frank. From everything I hear, he does. I also don’t mind trading down if we have, say, the 8th pick.

Giving up assets for LeVine or Booker would be crazy to me.

I love Frank and gotta guess that Leon values him but does he really think Frank is ready and fully able to be a starting PG and be able to execute everything Thibs needs? Frank/DSJr enough?

Don't know.

I don’t know either. I like to hope Frank is communicating with Leon and now Thibs. We’ll see I guess.

I hope he is taking a million 3 point shots and also burning the midnight oil on finishing at the rim. And then psyching himself up and finding his inner Kobe

martin wrote:

Allanfan20 wrote:

martin wrote:

Allanfan20 wrote:

fishmike wrote:Haliburton would be great. I think we trade the pick tho

I can see that happening if Leon particularly values Frank. From everything I hear, he does. I also don’t mind trading down if we have, say, the 8th pick.

Giving up assets for LeVine or Booker would be crazy to me.

I love Frank and gotta guess that Leon values him but does he really think Frank is ready and fully able to be a starting PG and be able to execute everything Thibs needs? Frank/DSJr enough?

Don't know.

I don’t know either. I like to hope Frank is communicating with Leon and now Thibs. We’ll see I guess.

I hope he is taking a million 3 point shots and also burning the midnight oil on finishing at the rim. And then psyching himself up and finding his inner Kobe

No video’s then it did not happen! I like the ones with Mitch lighting it up vs. Midgets!

knicks1248 wrote:

Allanfan20 wrote:You are giving up assets for a player who is talented but also had decent talent around them... yet their teams are horrible. Now, you have little talent around that guy you acquired because you have up everything for him (like the Melo trade) and he has no history of winning in the NBA. Yes, it’s a terrible idea.

I get your point, but how are you suggesting we turn this around fast

I like the idea of signing Christian Wood. I like the idea of signing Bertans. I’m not against signing Gallo for cheap. I want to see how Rose drafts this Summer.... that’s if he doesn’t trade the pick(s).

And above all, I want to see how RJ advances next season and I want to see if Mitch and Frank take their games to another level under Thibs. I will say, I think the videos of Mitch pretending to be Melo are silly. I’m good with him working on his shot. I’m not good if he’s attempting to be a one on one perimeter player.

There is no clear direction though. I do know that we have given up a ton of assets for single players a lot of times, ever since we traded for McDyess. It never worked out.

martin wrote:

Allanfan20 wrote:

martin wrote:

Allanfan20 wrote:

fishmike wrote:Haliburton would be great. I think we trade the pick tho

I can see that happening if Leon particularly values Frank. From everything I hear, he does. I also don’t mind trading down if we have, say, the 8th pick.

Giving up assets for LeVine or Booker would be crazy to me.

I love Frank and gotta guess that Leon values him but does he really think Frank is ready and fully able to be a starting PG and be able to execute everything Thibs needs? Frank/DSJr enough?

Don't know.

I don’t know either. I like to hope Frank is communicating with Leon and now Thibs. We’ll see I guess.

I hope he is taking a million 3 point shots and also burning the midnight oil on finishing at the rim. And then psyching himself up and finding his inner Kobe

Agreed.

knicks1248 wrote:

Allanfan20 wrote:You are giving up assets for a player who is talented but also had decent talent around them... yet their teams are horrible. Now, you have little talent around that guy you acquired because you have up everything for him (like the Melo trade) and he has no history of winning in the NBA. Yes, it’s a terrible idea.

I get your point, but how are you suggesting we turn this around fast

You don't turn it around fast.

Nothing in NBA modern history shows you can turn it around fast. Someone will then cite the LBJ, Wade and Bosh teams, without the context that the groundwork for that team started four years before The Decision happened. Also the cap movement needed to make it happened started essentially two seasons before The Decision.

No one turns it around fast. The cap environment and salary structure essentially make it near impossible.

Progress is the Knicks winning 5-6 games more than the season before.

If we don't get Edwards, I think I would probably reluctantly draft Ball next... I will say we shouldn't necessarily chase a PG. Obi Toppin And James Wiseman would add talent. I would go Toppin with the third. With the Clippers pick, one of Kira Lewis, Nico Mannion, and Devon Dotson will be available and I think I would prefer all of those other potentially available players given how the team is built. I know realistically they are drafting a PG though