Knicks · Gotta sign Mike Conley (page 2)

Welpee wrote:I have always advocated for getting Conley. I think we missed our opportunity in his first season in Utah when he struggled. Should've made a move for him then. Now, I think it all depends on how much money he wants. I doubt he'll come cheap after an all-star season.

Yep missed the window. Utah is not going to let him go.

Utah spent a lot on the trade and what would it have cost to seduce Utah into giving up on him? We tossed around Dennis like he was worthless but it got us DRose and this season is not the same without him.
Then you have Conley at big numbers on our books. You might also not get Randle as this level if you don’t give him the ball.
IN fact, we all might have been happy enough to have moved Randle for Conley before this season (as fans).
If a player is not performing like Conley was, what metric without (as said) hindsight do you go after him?

Big bucket last night was when RJ got the ball on the right side, went to the rim, drew a double, ball got kicked out and I think Bullock whipped it to IQ. That was playmaking by RJ. Here is our elite wing at 20 years old in the making.
Payton does enough of what the coach wants to get games going. He is a big guard with good defense and hustle. In some form Payton is what Thibs wants frank to do on offense. Payton probes and can get to the rim. When Elf’s shot is on his game opens up much better.
As for a “Star” pg, not sure where this comes from. DRose facsimile of his former self is a thing of beauty when he is healthy and sharp. His minutes are about right to prolong this run. Frank is not a PG. I don’t know if he sticks and nothong should be a suprise but Thibs has not given up on him and one might see a reboot of him in some fashion. Not sure Frank quite agrees with that but we’ll see. What ever we did with him and Knox is not whats going on now. I’ll give 1248 some props for calling vet leadership for yoot to learn from. Question is will they be around long enough to produce from the knowledge. At some point given contract constraints we have to apply and give them a chance. We’ll have to see when that happens if at all.

we really can't have our 2 main pg's be over 30 with that many minutes - it's just asking for trouble.

We found a gem late in round 1 with IQ - hopefully with 3 chances we can luck out again.

Jmpasq wrote:

Welpee wrote:I have always advocated for getting Conley. I think we missed our opportunity in his first season in Utah when he struggled. Should've made a move for him then. Now, I think it all depends on how much money he wants. I doubt he'll come cheap after an all-star season.

Yep missed the window. Utah is not going to let him go.

good thing its not up to Utah, its up to Conley and the Knicks

xavier wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:hes gonna want 3 years 90mm pass

No legit agent would allow him to ask that cause he would be laughed out of wherever he is

Martin. I think Conley makes over 30 mm now

Now he earns even more (34.5), but it was a long time ago when he signed that contract. At the time, he was considered one of the best PGs in the league, and even then some thought the contract was way too big after all.

Meanwhile, he has gone from (almost) star through a player who is "finished" to the solid starter he is today. But there’s no way anyone will give him anything near 30 per season.

Yes, thanks.

Utah is in a strange spot. VERY good team. Next year they will be at $134M in salary without Conley. I don't know how the luxury tax works but I gotta assume his money will count a LOT against that cap.

And then there is the market: how many teams will even HAVE cap space to offer a soon to be 34 year old? Like 3 teams.

I am starting to like Jalen Brunson but have no idea of the exact mechanics of his contract (and Mitch's) and what Dallas would do or what salary number they won't cross. If Jalen is given a contract of say $13-15M, I doubt they match. If Dallas is hunting a big name FA, can they match Jalen while also keeping enough cap space for another more important player for them?

I don't know what Conley or Ball give you that Brunson does not at a MUCH cheaper contract, and on the other side of things, he has much better upside and demonstrated orchestrating, shooting, and rim attaching at an age of 24 that fits with the rest of the guys. Feel like he fits the Rose/Thibs culture to a T too.

franco12 wrote:we really can't have our 2 main pg's be over 30 with that many minutes - it's just asking for trouble.

We found a gem late in round 1 with IQ - hopefully with 3 chances we can luck out again.

I’m not against Conley at all, he has long been under rated in the western conference for many years ( his first all star appearance age 33? ) But having 2 main pgs at that age is a risky business. And I don’t see us acquiring him at a lower price in order to mitigate the associated risk unfortunately. On occasions though, you have to roll the dice? Risk vs reward scenario. Fortune favors the brave.

fishmike wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Welpee wrote:I have always advocated for getting Conley. I think we missed our opportunity in his first season in Utah when he struggled. Should've made a move for him then. Now, I think it all depends on how much money he wants. I doubt he'll come cheap after an all-star season.

Yep missed the window. Utah is not going to let him go.

good thing its not up to Utah, its up to Conley and the Knicks

Bird rights matter. They could give him a max deal and the most money. They are already over the cap they won't want to lose him for nothing.

Jmpasq wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Welpee wrote:I have always advocated for getting Conley. I think we missed our opportunity in his first season in Utah when he struggled. Should've made a move for him then. Now, I think it all depends on how much money he wants. I doubt he'll come cheap after an all-star season.

Yep missed the window. Utah is not going to let him go.

good thing its not up to Utah, its up to Conley and the Knicks

Bird rights matter. They could give him a max deal and the most money. They are already over the cap they won't want to lose him for nothing.

you think Utah is giving Conley close to $40mm next year? If they arent the bird rights have no play in this. They may not want to lose him but what are they going to do about it? Utah is at $130mm next year before resigning Conley.

SupremeCommander wrote:I’ll be honest, I don’t love the idea of Conley... but I do love the idea of 48 minutes split between Conley and Rose

this is it in a nutshell. We keep all our picks and players while securing veteran PG play and rim protection.

The formula is simple. Guys can always get hurt but on paper you always have Conely/Rose on the floor running the ship. You always have elite rim protection with Mitch/Noel. You we pound you with Randle/RJ and supporting them you have the young guys under contract in IQ/Obi/Knox and you are gonna have 3 rookies possibly as well. Thats 12 guys. Rest of the roster will be what opportunities present themselves, but that is the blueprint.

So what contract do you offer him?

martin wrote:So what contract do you offer him?

thats where Leon and WWW come in. I dont know. I think you push hard for Conley and Schroder and see who you can sign and who makes the most fiscal sense.

Knicks are at $50mm w/ Randle, RJ, Mitch, IQ, Knox, Obi
Cap is $112 for next year
after draft picks and cap holds Knicks should have $55ish

I think you need to lock up two pieces... Noel and a PG. I think Schroder and Conley are great fits and this path has us keeping all our young players and draft assets.

After that I am not sure how Bullock/Rose work. I think Rose will come back on some exception. Maybe we can fit them both in. I dont know but I have pretty high expectations to be honest.

If we are replacing Rose with Conley, cool. Not a fan of pairing two 33 year-olds at the PG position without a young and upcoming point to take the reigns in a year or two. Especially since most of you guys don't believe Quick can play point. I would like to see him get a legit shot before we completely close the door on that idea.

The odds are in favor of us resigning Rose since Thibs will be here for at least another 4 years. Brunson is at the top of my list if he is available this summer. If not, Schroder, Nunn and Ball will be available this summer and all 3 are in the same age bracket as our core players.

Uptown wrote:If we are replacing Rose with Conley, cool. Not a fan of pairing two 33 year-olds at the PG position without a young and upcoming point to take the reigns in a year or two. Especially since most of you guys don't believe Quick can play point. I would like to see him get a legit shot before we completely close the door on that idea.

The odds are in favor of us resigning Rose since Thibs will be here for at least another 4 years. Brunson is at the top of my list if he is available this summer. If not, Schroder, Nunn and Ball will be available this summer and all 3 are in the same age bracket as our core players.

I’ve nothing against Brunson, we could do a lot worse. I think I prefer him over Conley due to respective ages. My biggest question with him is he really the orchestrator I crave? What does he bring in addition that IQ etc don’t? Relationship with Thibs etc. ( although I do believe he would potentially thrive playing for TT )

In order of personal preference:- ( of current names suggested )

Lonzo
Brunson
Schroeder
Conley
Nunn

Uptown wrote:If we are replacing Rose with Conley, cool. Not a fan of pairing two 33 year-olds at the PG position without a young and upcoming point to take the reigns in a year or two. Especially since most of you guys don't believe Quick can play point. I would like to see him get a legit shot before we completely close the door on that idea.

The odds are in favor of us resigning Rose since Thibs will be here for at least another 4 years. Brunson is at the top of my list if he is available this summer. If not, Schroder, Nunn and Ball will be available this summer and all 3 are in the same age bracket as our core players.

We could always draft that young pg *cough cough* Jared Butler. Could see that guard being eased in at the PG spot to take the back up slot by end of the season. The main idea behind this is that it saves the Knicks the risk of taking on unproven talent. Give him 2 year 40+ with a PO. Team Option would be most ideal so that we can get a max player ala Lavine in 2022 but not a must since 2023 is stacked as well.

Uptown wrote:If we are replacing Rose with Conley, cool. Not a fan of pairing two 33 year-olds at the PG position without a young and upcoming point to take the reigns in a year or two. Especially since most of you guys don't believe Quick can play point. I would like to see him get a legit shot before we completely close the door on that idea.

The odds are in favor of us resigning Rose since Thibs will be here for at least another 4 years. Brunson is at the top of my list if he is available this summer. If not, Schroder, Nunn and Ball will be available this summer and all 3 are in the same age bracket as our core players.

He's not a PG.

You need Mad handle to be an effective PG, and his handle is not even on Randles level. He's a scorer, who's more effective off the ball, and he has embraced his role.

You have to have the mindset of being a pg from Day 1, and IQ's 1st, 2nd option is to score, that's what the coaching staff ask of him, they are not trying to convert him into a PG..not even close.

I agree about having 2 PGs in their 30's, unless it's for a 1 yr run at a title

Uptown wrote:If we are replacing Rose with Conley, cool. Not a fan of pairing two 33 year-olds at the PG position without a young and upcoming point to take the reigns in a year or two. Especially since most of you guys don't believe Quick can play point. I would like to see him get a legit shot before we completely close the door on that idea.

The odds are in favor of us resigning Rose since Thibs will be here for at least another 4 years. Brunson is at the top of my list if he is available this summer. If not, Schroder, Nunn and Ball will be available this summer and all 3 are in the same age bracket as our core players.

much more worried about quality pay for my money than age and Conley is the best of that crop and playing at a very high level with no signs of tail off. The whole team will be very young and there will be likely 3 incoming rookies. The only age on the roster will be where its most valuable.

If IQ greatly improves that's awesome. Not a lot of teams out there who are worried about what to do with all the good guard play. Having Conley and Rose running the ship lets us draft and develop a PG in the next couple years while competing for a title. If that's IQ great.

fishmike wrote:

Uptown wrote:If we are replacing Rose with Conley, cool. Not a fan of pairing two 33 year-olds at the PG position without a young and upcoming point to take the reigns in a year or two. Especially since most of you guys don't believe Quick can play point. I would like to see him get a legit shot before we completely close the door on that idea.

The odds are in favor of us resigning Rose since Thibs will be here for at least another 4 years. Brunson is at the top of my list if he is available this summer. If not, Schroder, Nunn and Ball will be available this summer and all 3 are in the same age bracket as our core players.

much more worried about quality pay for my money than age and Conley is the best of that crop and playing at a very high level with no signs of tail off. The whole team will be very young and there will be likely 3 incoming rookies. The only age on the roster will be where its most valuable.

If IQ greatly improves that's awesome. Not a lot of teams out there who are worried about what to do with all the good guard play. Having Conley and Rose running the ship lets us draft and develop a PG in the next couple years while competing for a title. If that's IQ great.

Totally agree with the bold. Don't want us throwing max dollars at Ball just because he may be the best available pg this summer. I think Brunson can give us the best bang for our buck this summer, but I'm not sure he will be available. Nunn is another guard I would look very closely at. Similar to Rozier when the Hornets signed him, Nunn may be on the verge of a serious uptick in play with a bigger role and more playing time.

I like Conley, and if fact he runs the point better than Rose does. Just don't think we need both to play the role of the vet-lead guard. With both of them on the roster, there wont any playing time for the Pg we might draft. Plus, I'm curious how much money Conley would command on the open market?

Love that we have 3 picks in the top 32, but I'm skeptical that we 3 rookies will be here when camp opens next fall...

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Uptown wrote:If we are replacing Rose with Conley, cool. Not a fan of pairing two 33 year-olds at the PG position without a young and upcoming point to take the reigns in a year or two. Especially since most of you guys don't believe Quick can play point. I would like to see him get a legit shot before we completely close the door on that idea.

The odds are in favor of us resigning Rose since Thibs will be here for at least another 4 years. Brunson is at the top of my list if he is available this summer. If not, Schroder, Nunn and Ball will be available this summer and all 3 are in the same age bracket as our core players.

much more worried about quality pay for my money than age and Conley is the best of that crop and playing at a very high level with no signs of tail off. The whole team will be very young and there will be likely 3 incoming rookies. The only age on the roster will be where its most valuable.

If IQ greatly improves that's awesome. Not a lot of teams out there who are worried about what to do with all the good guard play. Having Conley and Rose running the ship lets us draft and develop a PG in the next couple years while competing for a title. If that's IQ great.

Totally agree with the bold. Don't want us throwing max dollars at Ball just because he may be the best available pg this summer. I think Brunson can give us the best bang for our buck this summer, but I'm not sure he will be available. Nunn is another guard I would look very closely at. Similar to Rozier when the Hornets signed him, Nunn may be on the verge of a serious uptick in play with a bigger role and more playing time.

I like Conley, and if fact he runs the point better than Rose does. Just don't think we need both to play the role of the vet-lead guard. With both of them on the roster, there wont any playing time for the Pg we might draft. Plus, I'm curious how much money Conley would command on the open market?

Love that we have 3 picks in the top 32, but I'm skeptical that we 3 rookies will be here when camp opens next fall...

my thought and plan is super simple. We are really young and have two young 2 way star guys in Randle/RJ who can really play with anyone. We gotta get a 3rd guy while we are able to spend.

Think about simply replacing Elf with a close to all star caliber guy (like Phi did w/ Tobias as a "3rd" guy). Thats Conley/Schroder. We will likely lose Burks but its possible to bring back Noel/Bllock/Rose

You can keep ALL the key guys together, improve your guard play and have a deep team thats big and a defensive juggernaught