Knicks · Why is Randle still our primary Ball handler (page 2)
knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.
You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right nowDude, if you don't realize we are a slower team with randle as a ball handler and mitch as a center, your nuts...Neither one of them are fast players. Randle gets that rebound he's trotting up the court, not sprinting, same with mitch.
The defense is suffering because teams are swinging the ball and shooting 3's and playing small ball, and we are countering that with a slow line up that can't recover in time.
You want know why mitch is avg 1 block, because teams are more perimeter centric.
You saw it yourself last night were we traded 3 point baskets like a layup drill, and you see it in from every team
Yeah I still don't get your point. When Randle brings the ball up the court slowly, it has nothing to do with Mitch. You should detach one from the other.
When Randle plays poorly, it has nothing to do with Mitch.
I personally think both of them play too many minutes with a squad this deep.Mitch is tied for 25th in rebound playing 30 min per game, and blocking just 1 shot
Randle doesn't need to play 37/40 minutes a night..when you have OBI, or can even go with a line up of
Mitch
RJ
Fournier
burks
RoseRandle
obie
burks
IQ
KembaRandle
Rj
Fornier
Kemba
RoseThere's so many ways to use this talent IMO to speed the pace on both ends
you keep bringing up blocks like it's the only way to gauge defense. Mitch is turning into a very good defensive center, he intimidates/alters shots and players coming near where he could be.
Dude has zero preseason and has been rehabbing since like March.
And yet he got better IMHO. First start of season where it doesn't take him like 5-10 games to realize he shouldn't foul a dude and he is patrolling quite nicely.
martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.
You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right nowDude, if you don't realize we are a slower team with randle as a ball handler and mitch as a center, your nuts...Neither one of them are fast players. Randle gets that rebound he's trotting up the court, not sprinting, same with mitch.
The defense is suffering because teams are swinging the ball and shooting 3's and playing small ball, and we are countering that with a slow line up that can't recover in time.
You want know why mitch is avg 1 block, because teams are more perimeter centric.
You saw it yourself last night were we traded 3 point baskets like a layup drill, and you see it in from every team
Yeah I still don't get your point. When Randle brings the ball up the court slowly, it has nothing to do with Mitch. You should detach one from the other.
When Randle plays poorly, it has nothing to do with Mitch.
I personally think both of them play too many minutes with a squad this deep.Mitch is tied for 25th in rebound playing 30 min per game, and blocking just 1 shot
Randle doesn't need to play 37/40 minutes a night..when you have OBI, or can even go with a line up of
Mitch
RJ
Fournier
burks
RoseRandle
obie
burks
IQ
KembaRandle
Rj
Fornier
Kemba
RoseThere's so many ways to use this talent IMO to speed the pace on both ends
you keep bringing up blocks like it's the only way to gauge defense. Mitch is turning into a very good defensive center, he intimidates/alters shots and players coming near where he could be.
Dude has zero preseason and has been rehabbing since like March.
And yet he got better IMHO. First start of season where it doesn't take him like 5-10 games to realize he shouldn't foul a dude and he is patrolling quite nicely.
But Martin The fact is mitch is a very limited skilled player who should be getting limited minutes. For all of the things he can't do, the only thing your able to come back with is he plays defense..
He can't pass, but he plays defense
he can't shoot, but he plays defense
He's slow, but he plays defense
Below avg rebonder for his size and athletic ability, but he plays defense
poor FT shooter, but he plays defense
some how ends up on the floor(while we cringe hoping he gets up) more than any player on the court.
He has poor spacing on PnR, but he play's defense
we were 18-23 when Mitch went down last yr (5 games under 500), once he went down, Randle blew up and we finish 10 games over 500
He is a solid 22 min per night player nothing more, he's grabbing his shorts anything after, and he certainly isn't chasing no guards and wings off the 3 point line, he's not an energy guy for more than 10 minutes.
The knicks could have offer Mitch an extension weeks ago....why haven't they?
I'm going to say this over and over again, HE IS NOT A GOOD FIT NEXT TO RANDLE. I'm not saying he's the sole reason randle is struggling, but he plays a part because of the spacing.
If he so good defensively why have we NOSE DIVE in defensive rating this yr...His IQ is nowhere near Noels
martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.
You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right nowDude, if you don't realize we are a slower team with randle as a ball handler and mitch as a center, your nuts...Neither one of them are fast players. Randle gets that rebound he's trotting up the court, not sprinting, same with mitch.
The defense is suffering because teams are swinging the ball and shooting 3's and playing small ball, and we are countering that with a slow line up that can't recover in time.
You want know why mitch is avg 1 block, because teams are more perimeter centric.
You saw it yourself last night were we traded 3 point baskets like a layup drill, and you see it in from every team
Yeah I still don't get your point. When Randle brings the ball up the court slowly, it has nothing to do with Mitch. You should detach one from the other.
When Randle plays poorly, it has nothing to do with Mitch.
I personally think both of them play too many minutes with a squad this deep.Mitch is tied for 25th in rebound playing 30 min per game, and blocking just 1 shot
Randle doesn't need to play 37/40 minutes a night..when you have OBI, or can even go with a line up of
Mitch
RJ
Fournier
burks
RoseRandle
obie
burks
IQ
KembaRandle
Rj
Fornier
Kemba
RoseThere's so many ways to use this talent IMO to speed the pace on both ends
you keep bringing up blocks like it's the only way to gauge defense. Mitch is turning into a very good defensive center, he intimidates/alters shots and players coming near where he could be.
Dude has zero preseason and has been rehabbing since like March.
And yet he got better IMHO. First start of season where it doesn't take him like 5-10 games to realize he shouldn't foul a dude and he is patrolling quite nicely.
For the last time (I hope). The Knicks utilize team rebounding. This results in other team members getting easier rebounds rather than Mitch Robinson. His lack of official defensive rebounds is not reflective of his effect on the game.
He leads the league in BoxOuts per game.
https://www.nba.com/stats/players/box-ou...
Notwithstanding this fact, the man is still top 10 (9) in offensive rebounds per game where he is able to attack the rebound more freely.
https://www.nba.com/stats/players/tradit...
His blocks are down and he still looks a step slow while adjusting to this weight and recovery from injury, but the effort stats are there.
knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.
You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right nowDude, if you don't realize we are a slower team with randle as a ball handler and mitch as a center, your nuts...Neither one of them are fast players. Randle gets that rebound he's trotting up the court, not sprinting, same with mitch.
The defense is suffering because teams are swinging the ball and shooting 3's and playing small ball, and we are countering that with a slow line up that can't recover in time.
You want know why mitch is avg 1 block, because teams are more perimeter centric.
You saw it yourself last night were we traded 3 point baskets like a layup drill, and you see it in from every team
Yeah I still don't get your point. When Randle brings the ball up the court slowly, it has nothing to do with Mitch. You should detach one from the other.
When Randle plays poorly, it has nothing to do with Mitch.
I personally think both of them play too many minutes with a squad this deep.Mitch is tied for 25th in rebound playing 30 min per game, and blocking just 1 shot
Randle doesn't need to play 37/40 minutes a night..when you have OBI, or can even go with a line up of
Mitch
RJ
Fournier
burks
RoseRandle
obie
burks
IQ
KembaRandle
Rj
Fornier
Kemba
RoseThere's so many ways to use this talent IMO to speed the pace on both ends
you keep bringing up blocks like it's the only way to gauge defense. Mitch is turning into a very good defensive center, he intimidates/alters shots and players coming near where he could be.
Dude has zero preseason and has been rehabbing since like March.
And yet he got better IMHO. First start of season where it doesn't take him like 5-10 games to realize he shouldn't foul a dude and he is patrolling quite nicely.
But Martin The fact is mitch is a very limited skilled player who should be getting limited minutes. For all of the things he can't do, the only thing your able to come back with is he plays defense..
He can't pass, but he plays defense
he can't shoot, but he plays defense
He's slow, but he plays defense
Below avg rebonder for his size and athletic ability, but he plays defense
poor FT shooter, but he plays defense
some how ends up on the floor(while we cringe hoping he gets up) more than any player on the court.
He has poor spacing on PnR, but he play's defensewe were 18-23 when Mitch went down last yr (5 games under 500), once he went down, Randle blew up and we finish 10 games over 500
He is a solid 22 min per night player nothing more, he's grabbing his shorts anything after, and he certainly isn't chasing no guards and wings off the 3 point line, he's not an energy guy for more than 10 minutes.
The knicks could have offer Mitch an extension weeks ago....why haven't they?
I'm going to say this over and over again, HE IS NOT A GOOD FIT NEXT TO RANDLE. I'm not saying he's the sole reason randle is struggling, but he plays a part because of the spacing.
If he so good defensively why have we NOSE DIVE in defensive rating this yr...His IQ is nowhere near Noels
Mitch is averaging nearly a double, double at about 30 mins a game. He's also averaging 2.5 blocks a game. This is from his updated stats on bball reference. He's not the greatest rebounder, but he ain't below average. Really, it's too early in the season to be doing this, but Mitch has improved as a passer as well. His assist rate has seen an uptick.You saw how RJ was able to leverage Mitch's gravity with alley oops with drives as well. His spacing isn't poor on the pick and roll because some always needs to keep a body on him. And he's still working himself back in shape. Also, you can't mention the Knicks record without Mitch and not mention the Knicks record with D Rose. Rose's tear on offense kinda happened around the same time Mitch went down.
knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.
You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right nowDude, if you don't realize we are a slower team with randle as a ball handler and mitch as a center, your nuts...Neither one of them are fast players. Randle gets that rebound he's trotting up the court, not sprinting, same with mitch.
The defense is suffering because teams are swinging the ball and shooting 3's and playing small ball, and we are countering that with a slow line up that can't recover in time.
You want know why mitch is avg 1 block, because teams are more perimeter centric.
You saw it yourself last night were we traded 3 point baskets like a layup drill, and you see it in from every team
Yeah I still don't get your point. When Randle brings the ball up the court slowly, it has nothing to do with Mitch. You should detach one from the other.
When Randle plays poorly, it has nothing to do with Mitch.
I personally think both of them play too many minutes with a squad this deep.Mitch is tied for 25th in rebound playing 30 min per game, and blocking just 1 shot
Randle doesn't need to play 37/40 minutes a night..when you have OBI, or can even go with a line up of
Mitch
RJ
Fournier
burks
RoseRandle
obie
burks
IQ
KembaRandle
Rj
Fornier
Kemba
RoseThere's so many ways to use this talent IMO to speed the pace on both ends
you keep bringing up blocks like it's the only way to gauge defense. Mitch is turning into a very good defensive center, he intimidates/alters shots and players coming near where he could be.
Dude has zero preseason and has been rehabbing since like March.
And yet he got better IMHO. First start of season where it doesn't take him like 5-10 games to realize he shouldn't foul a dude and he is patrolling quite nicely.
But Martin The fact is mitch is a very limited skilled player who should be getting limited minutes. For all of the things he can't do, the only thing your able to come back with is he plays defense..
He can't pass, but he plays defense
he can't shoot, but he plays defense
He's slow, but he plays defense
Below avg rebonder for his size and athletic ability, but he plays defense
poor FT shooter, but he plays defense
some how ends up on the floor(while we cringe hoping he gets up) more than any player on the court.
He has poor spacing on PnR, but he play's defensewe were 18-23 when Mitch went down last yr (5 games under 500), once he went down, Randle blew up and we finish 10 games over 500
He is a solid 22 min per night player nothing more, he's grabbing his shorts anything after, and he certainly isn't chasing no guards and wings off the 3 point line, he's not an energy guy for more than 10 minutes.
The knicks could have offer Mitch an extension weeks ago....why haven't they?
I'm going to say this over and over again, HE IS NOT A GOOD FIT NEXT TO RANDLE. I'm not saying he's the sole reason randle is struggling, but he plays a part because of the spacing.
If he so good defensively why have we NOSE DIVE in defensive rating this yr...His IQ is nowhere near Noels
https://www.nba.com/stats/players/defens...
This is DefRtg sorted by players playing more than 20 minutes. The Knicks starting lineup as a whole aren’t doing great at getting stops. But if you look at the starting 5, Randle and Robinson are the best DefRtg players on the team.
Kemba is the big outlier giving up 118 pts per 100 possessions.
Compare that to the same sort from 20-21
https://www.nba.com/stats/players/defens...
All the Knicks were better at defense last year, and Robinson (106) was better than Noel (108.5)
Short answer is that the Knicks need their new lineup to tighten up its defense. But there is nothing to suggest that Robinson is the reason. That’s anecdotal at best and not supported by numbers or facts.
knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.
You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right nowDude, if you don't realize we are a slower team with randle as a ball handler and mitch as a center, your nuts...Neither one of them are fast players. Randle gets that rebound he's trotting up the court, not sprinting, same with mitch.
The defense is suffering because teams are swinging the ball and shooting 3's and playing small ball, and we are countering that with a slow line up that can't recover in time.
You want know why mitch is avg 1 block, because teams are more perimeter centric.
You saw it yourself last night were we traded 3 point baskets like a layup drill, and you see it in from every team
Yeah I still don't get your point. When Randle brings the ball up the court slowly, it has nothing to do with Mitch. You should detach one from the other.
When Randle plays poorly, it has nothing to do with Mitch.
I personally think both of them play too many minutes with a squad this deep.Mitch is tied for 25th in rebound playing 30 min per game, and blocking just 1 shot
Randle doesn't need to play 37/40 minutes a night..when you have OBI, or can even go with a line up of
Mitch
RJ
Fournier
burks
RoseRandle
obie
burks
IQ
KembaRandle
Rj
Fornier
Kemba
RoseThere's so many ways to use this talent IMO to speed the pace on both ends
you keep bringing up blocks like it's the only way to gauge defense. Mitch is turning into a very good defensive center, he intimidates/alters shots and players coming near where he could be.
Dude has zero preseason and has been rehabbing since like March.
And yet he got better IMHO. First start of season where it doesn't take him like 5-10 games to realize he shouldn't foul a dude and he is patrolling quite nicely.
But Martin The fact is mitch is a very limited skilled player who should be getting limited minutes. For all of the things he can't do, the only thing your able to come back with is he plays defense..
He can't pass, but he plays defense
he can't shoot, but he plays defense
He's slow, but he plays defense
Below avg rebonder for his size and athletic ability, but he plays defense
poor FT shooter, but he plays defense
some how ends up on the floor(while we cringe hoping he gets up) more than any player on the court.
He has poor spacing on PnR, but he play's defensewe were 18-23 when Mitch went down last yr (5 games under 500), once he went down, Randle blew up and we finish 10 games over 500
He is a solid 22 min per night player nothing more, he's grabbing his shorts anything after, and he certainly isn't chasing no guards and wings off the 3 point line, he's not an energy guy for more than 10 minutes.
The knicks could have offer Mitch an extension weeks ago....why haven't they?
I'm going to say this over and over again, HE IS NOT A GOOD FIT NEXT TO RANDLE. I'm not saying he's the sole reason randle is struggling, but he plays a part because of the spacing.
If he so good defensively why have we NOSE DIVE in defensive rating this yr...His IQ is nowhere near Noels
Mitch is one of the more twitch fast centers in the league and probably the fastest up and down the court for C's. I don't know what you are seeing.
And Randle forgot he's a PF on defense, AO scored 36 pts on Randle without sweating.
MitchRob is an above the rim player that should be scoring in double-digits every game with Randle handling the rock.
martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.
You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right nowDude, if you don't realize we are a slower team with randle as a ball handler and mitch as a center, your nuts...Neither one of them are fast players. Randle gets that rebound he's trotting up the court, not sprinting, same with mitch.
The defense is suffering because teams are swinging the ball and shooting 3's and playing small ball, and we are countering that with a slow line up that can't recover in time.
You want know why mitch is avg 1 block, because teams are more perimeter centric.
You saw it yourself last night were we traded 3 point baskets like a layup drill, and you see it in from every team
Yeah I still don't get your point. When Randle brings the ball up the court slowly, it has nothing to do with Mitch. You should detach one from the other.
When Randle plays poorly, it has nothing to do with Mitch.
I personally think both of them play too many minutes with a squad this deep.Mitch is tied for 25th in rebound playing 30 min per game, and blocking just 1 shot
Randle doesn't need to play 37/40 minutes a night..when you have OBI, or can even go with a line up of
Mitch
RJ
Fournier
burks
RoseRandle
obie
burks
IQ
KembaRandle
Rj
Fornier
Kemba
RoseThere's so many ways to use this talent IMO to speed the pace on both ends
you keep bringing up blocks like it's the only way to gauge defense. Mitch is turning into a very good defensive center, he intimidates/alters shots and players coming near where he could be.
Dude has zero preseason and has been rehabbing since like March.
And yet he got better IMHO. First start of season where it doesn't take him like 5-10 games to realize he shouldn't foul a dude and he is patrolling quite nicely.
But Martin The fact is mitch is a very limited skilled player who should be getting limited minutes. For all of the things he can't do, the only thing your able to come back with is he plays defense..
He can't pass, but he plays defense
he can't shoot, but he plays defense
He's slow, but he plays defense
Below avg rebonder for his size and athletic ability, but he plays defense
poor FT shooter, but he plays defense
some how ends up on the floor(while we cringe hoping he gets up) more than any player on the court.
He has poor spacing on PnR, but he play's defensewe were 18-23 when Mitch went down last yr (5 games under 500), once he went down, Randle blew up and we finish 10 games over 500
He is a solid 22 min per night player nothing more, he's grabbing his shorts anything after, and he certainly isn't chasing no guards and wings off the 3 point line, he's not an energy guy for more than 10 minutes.
The knicks could have offer Mitch an extension weeks ago....why haven't they?
I'm going to say this over and over again, HE IS NOT A GOOD FIT NEXT TO RANDLE. I'm not saying he's the sole reason randle is struggling, but he plays a part because of the spacing.
If he so good defensively why have we NOSE DIVE in defensive rating this yr...His IQ is nowhere near Noels
Mitch is one of the more twitch fast centers in the league and probably the fastest up and down the court for C's. I don't know what you are seeing.
HoopsHype had him as the 4th slowest Center in the NBA last season, I didn't believe it at first, but right before he got hurt i started paying close attention to him and I notice he was always the last guy down court on both ends.
Kemet wrote:Every time Randle dribble-dribble the ball down court our offense become a half-court offense, because our opponent are back set up on defense, the clock is running the more Randle dribble to the FT line, our ball movement is usually one or two teammates if Randle don't shoot the ball. The problem has been Randle passing to a moving teammate, or cutter to the basket leads to a turn-over. The Raptors team had 8 turnovers however, Randle & Barrett combine had 7 turn-overs. The Raptors play-maker VanVleet has been averaging 3 turnovers a game without Lowry. Playing us for 37 min VanVleet average 1 turnover. We applied no defensive pressure on the Raptors PG, and he made us look like bums throughout the 2nd half.
And Randle forgot he's a PF on defense, AO scored 36 pts on Randle without sweating.
MitchRob is an above the rim player that should be scoring in double-digits every game with Randle handling the rock.
AO is listed as a SG/SF, he's essentially a wing player and Randle is not. Randle doesn't have the speed either to rotate to the perimeter when the ball swings out to the perimeter.
Like i said earlier in the thread, when teams are play small ball we don't counter, when we did (the last preseason game with obi and randle) we came back from 12 down in 4 minutes.
knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.
You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right nowDude, if you don't realize we are a slower team with randle as a ball handler and mitch as a center, your nuts...Neither one of them are fast players. Randle gets that rebound he's trotting up the court, not sprinting, same with mitch.
The defense is suffering because teams are swinging the ball and shooting 3's and playing small ball, and we are countering that with a slow line up that can't recover in time.
You want know why mitch is avg 1 block, because teams are more perimeter centric.
You saw it yourself last night were we traded 3 point baskets like a layup drill, and you see it in from every team
Yeah I still don't get your point. When Randle brings the ball up the court slowly, it has nothing to do with Mitch. You should detach one from the other.
When Randle plays poorly, it has nothing to do with Mitch.
I personally think both of them play too many minutes with a squad this deep.Mitch is tied for 25th in rebound playing 30 min per game, and blocking just 1 shot
Randle doesn't need to play 37/40 minutes a night..when you have OBI, or can even go with a line up of
Mitch
RJ
Fournier
burks
RoseRandle
obie
burks
IQ
KembaRandle
Rj
Fornier
Kemba
RoseThere's so many ways to use this talent IMO to speed the pace on both ends
you keep bringing up blocks like it's the only way to gauge defense. Mitch is turning into a very good defensive center, he intimidates/alters shots and players coming near where he could be.
Dude has zero preseason and has been rehabbing since like March.
And yet he got better IMHO. First start of season where it doesn't take him like 5-10 games to realize he shouldn't foul a dude and he is patrolling quite nicely.
But Martin The fact is mitch is a very limited skilled player who should be getting limited minutes. For all of the things he can't do, the only thing your able to come back with is he plays defense..
He can't pass, but he plays defense
he can't shoot, but he plays defense
He's slow, but he plays defense
Below avg rebonder for his size and athletic ability, but he plays defense
poor FT shooter, but he plays defense
some how ends up on the floor(while we cringe hoping he gets up) more than any player on the court.
He has poor spacing on PnR, but he play's defensewe were 18-23 when Mitch went down last yr (5 games under 500), once he went down, Randle blew up and we finish 10 games over 500
He is a solid 22 min per night player nothing more, he's grabbing his shorts anything after, and he certainly isn't chasing no guards and wings off the 3 point line, he's not an energy guy for more than 10 minutes.
The knicks could have offer Mitch an extension weeks ago....why haven't they?
I'm going to say this over and over again, HE IS NOT A GOOD FIT NEXT TO RANDLE. I'm not saying he's the sole reason randle is struggling, but he plays a part because of the spacing.
If he so good defensively why have we NOSE DIVE in defensive rating this yr...His IQ is nowhere near Noels
Mitch is one of the more twitch fast centers in the league and probably the fastest up and down the court for C's. I don't know what you are seeing.
HoopsHype had him as the 4th slowest Center in the NBA last season, I didn't believe it at first, but right before he got hurt i started paying close attention to him and I notice he was always the last guy down court on both ends.
LAST season? When the Knicks purposely slowed the game down cause they didn't have the personal to run? Or a PG in first unit to push ball? That old, irrelevant stat?
Bro, if you want to make a point and have a link to some website that keeps track of things and want to share that, it would be step 1 to actually starting to make a point
EwingsGlass wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.
You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right nowDude, if you don't realize we are a slower team with randle as a ball handler and mitch as a center, your nuts...Neither one of them are fast players. Randle gets that rebound he's trotting up the court, not sprinting, same with mitch.
The defense is suffering because teams are swinging the ball and shooting 3's and playing small ball, and we are countering that with a slow line up that can't recover in time.
You want know why mitch is avg 1 block, because teams are more perimeter centric.
You saw it yourself last night were we traded 3 point baskets like a layup drill, and you see it in from every team
Yeah I still don't get your point. When Randle brings the ball up the court slowly, it has nothing to do with Mitch. You should detach one from the other.
When Randle plays poorly, it has nothing to do with Mitch.
I personally think both of them play too many minutes with a squad this deep.Mitch is tied for 25th in rebound playing 30 min per game, and blocking just 1 shot
Randle doesn't need to play 37/40 minutes a night..when you have OBI, or can even go with a line up of
Mitch
RJ
Fournier
burks
RoseRandle
obie
burks
IQ
KembaRandle
Rj
Fornier
Kemba
RoseThere's so many ways to use this talent IMO to speed the pace on both ends
you keep bringing up blocks like it's the only way to gauge defense. Mitch is turning into a very good defensive center, he intimidates/alters shots and players coming near where he could be.
Dude has zero preseason and has been rehabbing since like March.
And yet he got better IMHO. First start of season where it doesn't take him like 5-10 games to realize he shouldn't foul a dude and he is patrolling quite nicely.
But Martin The fact is mitch is a very limited skilled player who should be getting limited minutes. For all of the things he can't do, the only thing your able to come back with is he plays defense..
He can't pass, but he plays defense
he can't shoot, but he plays defense
He's slow, but he plays defense
Below avg rebonder for his size and athletic ability, but he plays defense
poor FT shooter, but he plays defense
some how ends up on the floor(while we cringe hoping he gets up) more than any player on the court.
He has poor spacing on PnR, but he play's defensewe were 18-23 when Mitch went down last yr (5 games under 500), once he went down, Randle blew up and we finish 10 games over 500
He is a solid 22 min per night player nothing more, he's grabbing his shorts anything after, and he certainly isn't chasing no guards and wings off the 3 point line, he's not an energy guy for more than 10 minutes.
The knicks could have offer Mitch an extension weeks ago....why haven't they?
I'm going to say this over and over again, HE IS NOT A GOOD FIT NEXT TO RANDLE. I'm not saying he's the sole reason randle is struggling, but he plays a part because of the spacing.
If he so good defensively why have we NOSE DIVE in defensive rating this yr...His IQ is nowhere near Noels
https://www.nba.com/stats/players/defens...
This is DefRtg sorted by players playing more than 20 minutes. The Knicks starting lineup as a whole aren’t doing great at getting stops. But if you look at the starting 5, Randle and Robinson are the best DefRtg players on the team.
Kemba is the big outlier giving up 118 pts per 100 possessions.
Compare that to the same sort from 20-21https://www.nba.com/stats/players/defens...
All the Knicks were better at defense last year, and Robinson (106) was better than Noel (108.5)
Short answer is that the Knicks need their new lineup to tighten up its defense. But there is nothing to suggest that Robinson is the reason. That’s anecdotal at best and not supported by numbers or facts.
The lost of Payton and Bullock on the defensive side is definitely evident. On the flip side we are definitely scoring more points.
BigDaddyG wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.
You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right nowDude, if you don't realize we are a slower team with randle as a ball handler and mitch as a center, your nuts...Neither one of them are fast players. Randle gets that rebound he's trotting up the court, not sprinting, same with mitch.
The defense is suffering because teams are swinging the ball and shooting 3's and playing small ball, and we are countering that with a slow line up that can't recover in time.
You want know why mitch is avg 1 block, because teams are more perimeter centric.
You saw it yourself last night were we traded 3 point baskets like a layup drill, and you see it in from every team
Yeah I still don't get your point. When Randle brings the ball up the court slowly, it has nothing to do with Mitch. You should detach one from the other.
When Randle plays poorly, it has nothing to do with Mitch.
I personally think both of them play too many minutes with a squad this deep.Mitch is tied for 25th in rebound playing 30 min per game, and blocking just 1 shot
Randle doesn't need to play 37/40 minutes a night..when you have OBI, or can even go with a line up of
Mitch
RJ
Fournier
burks
RoseRandle
obie
burks
IQ
KembaRandle
Rj
Fornier
Kemba
RoseThere's so many ways to use this talent IMO to speed the pace on both ends
you keep bringing up blocks like it's the only way to gauge defense. Mitch is turning into a very good defensive center, he intimidates/alters shots and players coming near where he could be.
Dude has zero preseason and has been rehabbing since like March.
And yet he got better IMHO. First start of season where it doesn't take him like 5-10 games to realize he shouldn't foul a dude and he is patrolling quite nicely.
But Martin The fact is mitch is a very limited skilled player who should be getting limited minutes. For all of the things he can't do, the only thing your able to come back with is he plays defense..
He can't pass, but he plays defense
he can't shoot, but he plays defense
He's slow, but he plays defense
Below avg rebonder for his size and athletic ability, but he plays defense
poor FT shooter, but he plays defense
some how ends up on the floor(while we cringe hoping he gets up) more than any player on the court.
He has poor spacing on PnR, but he play's defensewe were 18-23 when Mitch went down last yr (5 games under 500), once he went down, Randle blew up and we finish 10 games over 500
He is a solid 22 min per night player nothing more, he's grabbing his shorts anything after, and he certainly isn't chasing no guards and wings off the 3 point line, he's not an energy guy for more than 10 minutes.
The knicks could have offer Mitch an extension weeks ago....why haven't they?
I'm going to say this over and over again, HE IS NOT A GOOD FIT NEXT TO RANDLE. I'm not saying he's the sole reason randle is struggling, but he plays a part because of the spacing.
If he so good defensively why have we NOSE DIVE in defensive rating this yr...His IQ is nowhere near Noels
Mitch is averaging nearly a double, double at about 30 mins a game. He's also averaging 2.5 blocks a game. This is from his updated stats on bball reference. He's not the greatest rebounder, but he ain't below average. Really, it's too early in the season to be doing this, but Mitch has improved as a passer as well. His assist rate has seen an uptick.You saw how RJ was able to leverage Mitch's gravity with alley oops with drives as well. His spacing isn't poor on the pick and roll because some always needs to keep a body on him. And he's still working himself back in shape. Also, you can't mention the Knicks record without Mitch and not mention the Knicks record with D Rose. Rose's tear on offense kinda happened around the same time Mitch went down.
He has a totally of 8 blocks on the season, 3 of those came in 1 game.
How can he block shots when teams are shooting more and more 3's, Fast breaks are leading to more open 3's than layups.
I forgot what game i was watching the other day, But the 2 teams combine for just 5 TWO point attempts in the entire 2nd quarter.
knicks1248 wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.
You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right nowDude, if you don't realize we are a slower team with randle as a ball handler and mitch as a center, your nuts...Neither one of them are fast players. Randle gets that rebound he's trotting up the court, not sprinting, same with mitch.
The defense is suffering because teams are swinging the ball and shooting 3's and playing small ball, and we are countering that with a slow line up that can't recover in time.
You want know why mitch is avg 1 block, because teams are more perimeter centric.
You saw it yourself last night were we traded 3 point baskets like a layup drill, and you see it in from every team
Yeah I still don't get your point. When Randle brings the ball up the court slowly, it has nothing to do with Mitch. You should detach one from the other.
When Randle plays poorly, it has nothing to do with Mitch.
I personally think both of them play too many minutes with a squad this deep.Mitch is tied for 25th in rebound playing 30 min per game, and blocking just 1 shot
Randle doesn't need to play 37/40 minutes a night..when you have OBI, or can even go with a line up of
Mitch
RJ
Fournier
burks
RoseRandle
obie
burks
IQ
KembaRandle
Rj
Fornier
Kemba
RoseThere's so many ways to use this talent IMO to speed the pace on both ends
you keep bringing up blocks like it's the only way to gauge defense. Mitch is turning into a very good defensive center, he intimidates/alters shots and players coming near where he could be.
Dude has zero preseason and has been rehabbing since like March.
And yet he got better IMHO. First start of season where it doesn't take him like 5-10 games to realize he shouldn't foul a dude and he is patrolling quite nicely.
But Martin The fact is mitch is a very limited skilled player who should be getting limited minutes. For all of the things he can't do, the only thing your able to come back with is he plays defense..
He can't pass, but he plays defense
he can't shoot, but he plays defense
He's slow, but he plays defense
Below avg rebonder for his size and athletic ability, but he plays defense
poor FT shooter, but he plays defense
some how ends up on the floor(while we cringe hoping he gets up) more than any player on the court.
He has poor spacing on PnR, but he play's defensewe were 18-23 when Mitch went down last yr (5 games under 500), once he went down, Randle blew up and we finish 10 games over 500
He is a solid 22 min per night player nothing more, he's grabbing his shorts anything after, and he certainly isn't chasing no guards and wings off the 3 point line, he's not an energy guy for more than 10 minutes.
The knicks could have offer Mitch an extension weeks ago....why haven't they?
I'm going to say this over and over again, HE IS NOT A GOOD FIT NEXT TO RANDLE. I'm not saying he's the sole reason randle is struggling, but he plays a part because of the spacing.
If he so good defensively why have we NOSE DIVE in defensive rating this yr...His IQ is nowhere near Noels
Mitch is averaging nearly a double, double at about 30 mins a game. He's also averaging 2.5 blocks a game. This is from his updated stats on bball reference. He's not the greatest rebounder, but he ain't below average. Really, it's too early in the season to be doing this, but Mitch has improved as a passer as well. His assist rate has seen an uptick.You saw how RJ was able to leverage Mitch's gravity with alley oops with drives as well. His spacing isn't poor on the pick and roll because some always needs to keep a body on him. And he's still working himself back in shape. Also, you can't mention the Knicks record without Mitch and not mention the Knicks record with D Rose. Rose's tear on offense kinda happened around the same time Mitch went down.He has a totally of 8 blocks on the season, 3 of those came in 1 game.
How can he block shots when teams are shooting more and more 3's, Fast breaks are leading to more open 3's than layups.
I forgot what game i was watching the other day, But the 2 teams combine for just 5 TWO point attempts in the entire 2nd quarter.
My bad, I was looking at their projected stats, not their actual stats. Still, it's too early, to read anything into it. What are opponents shooting at the rim when he's in the game? What's the point differential when he's on the court? Those are the stats that really tell us what Mitch means to the defense, not just blocks.
BigDaddyG wrote:knicks1248 wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:knicks1248 wrote:martin wrote:Mitch playing with Randle has nothing to do with Randle's poor shot choice or his hero ball, iso mentality. Not the turnovers either.
You want a spacer at the 5, go find one, not many out there, and not many out there who can defend at the level Mitch does. And defense is one of Knicks' weaknesses right nowDude, if you don't realize we are a slower team with randle as a ball handler and mitch as a center, your nuts...Neither one of them are fast players. Randle gets that rebound he's trotting up the court, not sprinting, same with mitch.
The defense is suffering because teams are swinging the ball and shooting 3's and playing small ball, and we are countering that with a slow line up that can't recover in time.
You want know why mitch is avg 1 block, because teams are more perimeter centric.
You saw it yourself last night were we traded 3 point baskets like a layup drill, and you see it in from every team
Yeah I still don't get your point. When Randle brings the ball up the court slowly, it has nothing to do with Mitch. You should detach one from the other.
When Randle plays poorly, it has nothing to do with Mitch.
I personally think both of them play too many minutes with a squad this deep.Mitch is tied for 25th in rebound playing 30 min per game, and blocking just 1 shot
Randle doesn't need to play 37/40 minutes a night..when you have OBI, or can even go with a line up of
Mitch
RJ
Fournier
burks
RoseRandle
obie
burks
IQ
KembaRandle
Rj
Fornier
Kemba
RoseThere's so many ways to use this talent IMO to speed the pace on both ends
you keep bringing up blocks like it's the only way to gauge defense. Mitch is turning into a very good defensive center, he intimidates/alters shots and players coming near where he could be.
Dude has zero preseason and has been rehabbing since like March.
And yet he got better IMHO. First start of season where it doesn't take him like 5-10 games to realize he shouldn't foul a dude and he is patrolling quite nicely.
But Martin The fact is mitch is a very limited skilled player who should be getting limited minutes. For all of the things he can't do, the only thing your able to come back with is he plays defense..
He can't pass, but he plays defense
he can't shoot, but he plays defense
He's slow, but he plays defense
Below avg rebonder for his size and athletic ability, but he plays defense
poor FT shooter, but he plays defense
some how ends up on the floor(while we cringe hoping he gets up) more than any player on the court.
He has poor spacing on PnR, but he play's defensewe were 18-23 when Mitch went down last yr (5 games under 500), once he went down, Randle blew up and we finish 10 games over 500
He is a solid 22 min per night player nothing more, he's grabbing his shorts anything after, and he certainly isn't chasing no guards and wings off the 3 point line, he's not an energy guy for more than 10 minutes.
The knicks could have offer Mitch an extension weeks ago....why haven't they?
I'm going to say this over and over again, HE IS NOT A GOOD FIT NEXT TO RANDLE. I'm not saying he's the sole reason randle is struggling, but he plays a part because of the spacing.
If he so good defensively why have we NOSE DIVE in defensive rating this yr...His IQ is nowhere near Noels
Mitch is averaging nearly a double, double at about 30 mins a game. He's also averaging 2.5 blocks a game. This is from his updated stats on bball reference. He's not the greatest rebounder, but he ain't below average. Really, it's too early in the season to be doing this, but Mitch has improved as a passer as well. His assist rate has seen an uptick.You saw how RJ was able to leverage Mitch's gravity with alley oops with drives as well. His spacing isn't poor on the pick and roll because some always needs to keep a body on him. And he's still working himself back in shape. Also, you can't mention the Knicks record without Mitch and not mention the Knicks record with D Rose. Rose's tear on offense kinda happened around the same time Mitch went down.He has a totally of 8 blocks on the season, 3 of those came in 1 game.
How can he block shots when teams are shooting more and more 3's, Fast breaks are leading to more open 3's than layups.
I forgot what game i was watching the other day, But the 2 teams combine for just 5 TWO point attempts in the entire 2nd quarter.
My bad, I was looking at their projected stats, not their actual stats. Still, it's too early, to read anything into it. What are opponents shooting at the rim when he's in the game? What's the point differential when he's on the court? Those are the stats that really tell us what Mitch means to the defense, not just blocks.
I'm not sure of any of the other stats, my point is he's a limited player that should not be getting 30 minutes, especially when teams play small. There's no way we should be getting out rebounded by a bunch of wing players on the raptors, I mean Cole Anthony grab 16 boards, that happens because they are long rebounds off of miss perimeter shots, and once they grab those boards they are off and running.
watch him carefully tonight and you'll see.
Keep in my mind I think he's a solid player we should keep at a low cost..I just don't agree with him starting..Thats THIBS with his hard on for RIM protection
I told ya so
Philc1 wrote:I was saying we needed to trade him last summer for a package
I told ya so
You'll have to get in line for that one :)