Knicks · College basketball and nba draft thread 2022 (page 32)

BRIGGS @ 6/12/2022 3:05 PM
BingBong wrote:Hi...I'm new here so take it easy on me. I'm a die-hard, long-suffering Knicks' fan. With that said, I'll share my view on the upcoming draft.

First and foremost, we need a world class PG that seems as elusive as getting a crystal clear picture of Sasquatch. We never seem to get high enough in the draft order to grab a great PG and to trade for one means gutting the team and the future to finally solve one problem, albeit, it's a big one...and in turn, end up with more problems in other areas. Apart from the PG position, we are pretty strong with youngsters who look like the real deal.

Secondly, it almost seems a given that Robinson will be gone. He obviously is looking for a huge payday and some team will give it to him, but probably not the Knicks. Hence, we're going to need a big guy to replace him.

The draft: Ivey and Daniels are good, but neither are pure point guards and more off guards that are wickedly good. Grimes is a really solid shooting guard and Quick is a great off guard and can play the point, but neither is a pure PT. McBride might become one in a year but still needs NBA seasoning and Thibs doesn't seem to like playing rookies in important positions unless they are top 5 lottery picks. So instead of a lost season by turning the ball over to rookies, we fill in the blanks with old expensive vets so we can be a middling team that picks late in the lottery instead of up front.

Anyhow...the draft. As I see it, at number 11 overall we are not getting a world class pure point guard at that spot. Personally, I hope we go with center Mark Williams to replace Robinson who is almost certainly gone. Williams is the tallest (7'2), has the widest wing span, and the most experienced of the big 4 on the board (Holmgren, Duren, and Kessler). His game is similar to Robinson's and there wouldn't be much difference in the paint. He's also going to get heavier and stronger as his body fills out. He will be a solid NBA big man.

He's also has the highest shooting percentage and can make free throws

This draft is filled with quality forwards and off guards, but light on big men and of course, pure point guards. So if we stick at no. 11, I hope we go for a big man. We have high end NBA forwards as it is and don't need more to compete with RJ, JR, Obi, Cam, etc. I have an idea for point guard which I will present on another post. So for me, if I was to pick at number 11, I'd take Mark Williams. If we end up keeping Robinson somehow (which I doubt, but is possible), the Robinson/Williams tandem would be the best in the NBA...IMHO

Really no such thing as a pure pg anymore. I’d call it lead guard. I’m with rpknicks here. Jalen Williams is still an under the radar prospect as the lottery is concerned. When a player starts in rd 2 and ascends— like chris Duarte did last year— it surprises you. But I think he’s the young big lead guard we’ve been missing. Measurable off the charts with Iq to match. He’d be avail at 11 I believe and less than sharpe dropping I’d select him.

No way on green earth do I see a center prospect worthy at 11. That’s what 42 is for. Other than bam adabeyo there’s been no good lottery big man in a decade. They are highly devalued. No way wouod I pick a 7 footer this year at 11. Waste

martin @ 6/12/2022 3:22 PM
The best to Berman and his family.

Feel like Johnny Davis would be the safe route if Knicks can't trade up or down.

I think Atlanta is hot and heavy for Ayton (maybe Capella and Bogi?) and then would be OK to get value for Gallo in exchange for Fournier (Knicks would maybe not re-up Gallo, he has only $5M guareenteed for next year).

smackeddog @ 6/12/2022 3:34 PM
martin wrote:The best to Berman and his family.

Feel like Johnny Davis would be the safe route if Knicks can't trade up or down.

I think Atlanta is hot and heavy for Ayton (maybe Capella and Bogi?) and then would be OK to get value for Gallo in exchange for Fournier (Knicks would maybe not re-up Gallo, he has only $5M guareenteed for next year).

Berman does seem an okay guy- I used to get wound up by his articles, but he really makes the effort to engage with Knick fans and appear on a lot of the podcasts and YouTube channels, and unlike former beat writers like Isola or Howard beck, never became bitter or took to mocking fans. Plus he was pumping out those articles throughout the pandemic when there was nothing to write about!

Do wish his family well.

Doubt he drops this info as his last tweet for a while unless it’s based on solid intel (likely from his main source, Thibs). Was hoping we’d trade Fournier to the Kings as part of a deal for the 4th (they need shooting and got rid of Hield in the Sabonis deal), but jigs prediction of us drafting Davis would indicate a trade for the 4th ain’t happening.

BigDaddyG @ 6/12/2022 3:54 PM
smackeddog wrote:
martin wrote:The best to Berman and his family.

Feel like Johnny Davis would be the safe route if Knicks can't trade up or down.

I think Atlanta is hot and heavy for Ayton (maybe Capella and Bogi?) and then would be OK to get value for Gallo in exchange for Fournier (Knicks would maybe not re-up Gallo, he has only $5M guareenteed for next year).

Berman does seem an okay guy- I used to get wound up by his articles, but he really makes the effort to engage with Knick fans and appear on a lot of the podcasts and YouTube channels, and unlike former beat writers like Isola or Howard beck, never became bitter or took to mocking fans. Plus he was pumping out those articles throughout the pandemic when there was nothing to write about!

Do wish his family well.

Doubt he drops this info as his last tweet for a while unless it’s based on solid intel (likely from his main source, Thibs). Was hoping we’d trade Fournier to the Kings as part of a deal for the 4th (they need shooting and got rid of Hield in the Sabonis deal), but jigs prediction of us drafting Davis would indicate a trade for the 4th ain’t happening.


Eh, that trade was never gonna happen. I can see why Thibs would be a fan of Davis. Gives effort, super competitor... but I think Branham is the choice for that pick if you're going wing. I think he has more upside than Davis as a playmaker and shot creator. Eason or Sochon would probably be my choices, but Eason's workouts have reportedly been sub par and Sochon has been suspiciously quiet.
BingBong @ 6/12/2022 5:20 PM
Really no such thing as a pure pg anymore. I’d call it lead guard. I’m with rpknicks here. Jalen Williams is still an under the radar prospect as the lottery is concerned. When a player starts in rd 2 and ascends— like chris Duarte did last year— it surprises you. But I think he’s the young big lead guard we’ve been missing. Measurable off the charts with Iq to match. He’d be avail at 11 I believe and less than sharpe dropping I’d select him.

No way on green earth do I see a center prospect worthy at 11. That’s what 42 is for. Other than bam adabeyo there’s been no good lottery big man in a decade. They are highly devalued. No way wouod I pick a 7 footer this year at 11. Waste - Briggs

I agree that the traditional PG (pass first, shoot only if have to) is long gone. Today's PGs have to be superb ball handlers and be able to shoot the lights out while distributing the ball when appropriate.

I don't know that much about Jalen Williams other than what I've read here and from watching a few of his videos. He seems like an all-purpose SF/SG to me and like Quick, can handle the dribble pretty well at the NBA level. With RJ cemented at the SF position and Grimes showing he's got the makings of a future All Star I'm not sure where he'll play. And Quick is more of an off guard than PG (to me anyway). Seems like a log jam coming if we draft JW.

The PG's today that seem to be what every team wants are the ones like Doncic, Young, Morant, etc. They are tremendous ball handlers, can distribute well, but can carry the team on their backs if necessary and shoot threes with the best of the long shooters. In today's game, your PG needs to be able to score at will. The old "pass first PG" is a dying (if not already dead) breed of ball player.

As far as Mark Williams goes, you never need a big man until you do...then it's good luck finding a worthy one. And from everything I've read, I don't think Robinson will be a Knick next year. And that creates a big hole to fill. Whether or not the front office feels the way I do is a whole other story. Next week's draft will be interesting that's for sure.

martin @ 6/12/2022 7:10 PM
BRIGGS @ 6/12/2022 7:13 PM
BingBong wrote:
Really no such thing as a pure pg anymore. I’d call it lead guard. I’m with rpknicks here. Jalen Williams is still an under the radar prospect as the lottery is concerned. When a player starts in rd 2 and ascends— like chris Duarte did last year— it surprises you. But I think he’s the young big lead guard we’ve been missing. Measurable off the charts with Iq to match. He’d be avail at 11 I believe and less than sharpe dropping I’d select him.

No way on green earth do I see a center prospect worthy at 11. That’s what 42 is for. Other than bam adabeyo there’s been no good lottery big man in a decade. They are highly devalued. No way wouod I pick a 7 footer this year at 11. Waste - Briggs

I agree that the traditional PG (pass first, shoot only if have to) is long gone. Today's PGs have to be superb ball handlers and be able to shoot the lights out while distributing the ball when appropriate.

I don't know that much about Jalen Williams other than what I've read here and from watching a few of his videos. He seems like an all-purpose SF/SG to me and like Quick, can handle the dribble pretty well at the NBA level. With RJ cemented at the SF position and Grimes showing he's got the makings of a future All Star I'm not sure where he'll play. And Quick is more of an off guard than PG (to me anyway). Seems like a log jam coming if we draft JW.

The PG's today that seem to be what every team wants are the ones like Doncic, Young, Morant, etc. They are tremendous ball handlers, can distribute well, but can carry the team on their backs if necessary and shoot threes with the best of the long shooters. In today's game, your PG needs to be able to score at will. The old "pass first PG" is a dying (if not already dead) breed of ball player.

As far as Mark Williams goes, you never need a big man until you do...then it's good luck finding a worthy one. And from everything I've read, I don't think Robinson will be a Knick next year. And that creates a big hole to fill. Whether or not the front office feels the way I do is a whole other story. Next week's draft will be interesting that's for sure.

I think if u see jalen Williams as a lead guard/ pg then it’s a different view. I see a 6-6 point guard who can shoot pass handle defend. He’s much more of a natural pg than 1/2 the class. No way would I settle for a center— wgat center did u c in the playoffs impact more than a couple games culmulatively? I kind of liked aldones Williams in the mid season but he’s a second rd to udfa type prospect. I still like Tati Eason quite a bit. But the Knicks have been looking pg for 20 years and I think this is a grand opportunity ott to get 1. Centers. Unless the prospect is Alonzo mourning upside are like running backs in the nfl— valuable but 2 Nd rd or late first only. 11 for a center is drastically high in this draft. You’ll still have choices early 2 Nd rd to udfa. It’s the lead guard skill players u take high

wargames @ 6/13/2022 1:15 AM
Johnny Davis has been underrated but I don’t think he makes it to #11. Definitely a Thibs kind of player.
SergioNYK @ 6/13/2022 8:18 AM
wargames wrote:Johnny Davis has been underrated but I don’t think he makes it to #11. Definitely a Thibs kind of player.

I like Davis the more and more I see and read about him. Definitely a Thibs type! Like a more talented Grimes tbh. His defense and motor is already there so I don't think he'll have much trouble finding minutes. And his midrange and post game is very good. He's got a lot of Booker/Billups in his game. The 3pt shooting is a little concerning since he shot it poorly but I think he can improve that. He'd be a steal at 11!

Sadly, I think Portland or San Antonio will take him. He's the perfect replacement for McCollum and he's also a Pops type.

Chandler @ 6/13/2022 8:21 AM
BRIGGS wrote:
BingBong wrote:Hi...I'm new here so take it easy on me. I'm a die-hard, long-suffering Knicks' fan. With that said, I'll share my view on the upcoming draft.

First and foremost, we need a world class PG that seems as elusive as getting a crystal clear picture of Sasquatch. We never seem to get high enough in the draft order to grab a great PG and to trade for one means gutting the team and the future to finally solve one problem, albeit, it's a big one...and in turn, end up with more problems in other areas. Apart from the PG position, we are pretty strong with youngsters who look like the real deal.

Secondly, it almost seems a given that Robinson will be gone. He obviously is looking for a huge payday and some team will give it to him, but probably not the Knicks. Hence, we're going to need a big guy to replace him.

The draft: Ivey and Daniels are good, but neither are pure point guards and more off guards that are wickedly good. Grimes is a really solid shooting guard and Quick is a great off guard and can play the point, but neither is a pure PT. McBride might become one in a year but still needs NBA seasoning and Thibs doesn't seem to like playing rookies in important positions unless they are top 5 lottery picks. So instead of a lost season by turning the ball over to rookies, we fill in the blanks with old expensive vets so we can be a middling team that picks late in the lottery instead of up front.

Anyhow...the draft. As I see it, at number 11 overall we are not getting a world class pure point guard at that spot. Personally, I hope we go with center Mark Williams to replace Robinson who is almost certainly gone. Williams is the tallest (7'2), has the widest wing span, and the most experienced of the big 4 on the board (Holmgren, Duren, and Kessler). His game is similar to Robinson's and there wouldn't be much difference in the paint. He's also going to get heavier and stronger as his body fills out. He will be a solid NBA big man.

He's also has the highest shooting percentage and can make free throws

This draft is filled with quality forwards and off guards, but light on big men and of course, pure point guards. So if we stick at no. 11, I hope we go for a big man. We have high end NBA forwards as it is and don't need more to compete with RJ, JR, Obi, Cam, etc. I have an idea for point guard which I will present on another post. So for me, if I was to pick at number 11, I'd take Mark Williams. If we end up keeping Robinson somehow (which I doubt, but is possible), the Robinson/Williams tandem would be the best in the NBA...IMHO

Really no such thing as a pure pg anymore. I’d call it lead guard. I’m with rpknicks here. Jalen Williams is still an under the radar prospect as the lottery is concerned. When a player starts in rd 2 and ascends— like chris Duarte did last year— it surprises you. But I think he’s the young big lead guard we’ve been missing. Measurable off the charts with Iq to match. He’d be avail at 11 I believe and less than sharpe dropping I’d select I. That’s what 42 is for. Other than bam adabeyo there’s been no good lottery big man in a decade. They are highly devalued. No way wouod I pick a 7 footer this year at 11. Waste

Evan Mobley? You spent the better part of this past season preaching for a center who can score.

I would not be adverse to a center but they need to be able to guard the perimeter too

Nalod @ 6/13/2022 8:29 AM
BingBong wrote:Hi...I'm new here so take it easy on me. I'm a die-hard, long-suffering Knicks' fan. With that said, I'll share my view on the upcoming draft.

First and foremost, we need a world class PG that seems as elusive as getting a crystal clear picture of Sasquatch. We never seem to get high enough in the draft order to grab a great PG and to trade for one means gutting the team and the future to finally solve one problem, albeit, it's a big one...and in turn, end up with more problems in other areas. Apart from the PG position, we are pretty strong with youngsters who look like the real deal.

Secondly, it almost seems a given that Robinson will be gone. He obviously is looking for a huge payday and some team will give it to him, but probably not the Knicks. Hence, we're going to need a big guy to replace him.

The draft: Ivey and Daniels are good, but neither are pure point guards and more off guards that are wickedly good. Grimes is a really solid shooting guard and Quick is a great off guard and can play the point, but neither is a pure PT. McBride might become one in a year but still needs NBA seasoning and Thibs doesn't seem to like playing rookies in important positions unless they are top 5 lottery picks. So instead of a lost season by turning the ball over to rookies, we fill in the blanks with old expensive vets so we can be a middling team that picks late in the lottery instead of up front.

Anyhow...the draft. As I see it, at number 11 overall we are not getting a world class pure point guard at that spot. Personally, I hope we go with center Mark Williams to replace Robinson who is almost certainly gone. Williams is the tallest (7'2), has the widest wing span, and the most experienced of the big 4 on the board (Holmgren, Duren, and Kessler). His game is similar to Robinson's and there wouldn't be much difference in the paint. He's also going to get heavier and stronger as his body fills out. He will be a solid NBA big man.

He's also has the highest shooting percentage and can make free throws

This draft is filled with quality forwards and off guards, but light on big men and of course, pure point guards. So if we stick at no. 11, I hope we go for a big man. We have high end NBA forwards as it is and don't need more to compete with RJ, JR, Obi, Cam, etc. I have an idea for point guard which I will present on another post. So for me, if I was to pick at number 11, I'd take Mark Williams. If we end up keeping Robinson somehow (which I doubt, but is possible), the Robinson/Williams tandem would be the best in the NBA...IMHO

Take a center, the fans will yell “We need a PG”!!!!
We do, but we need one now as I see it. That said, you take the best player possible. Even if its a PF.
Why? that player can force a team to make a move to make minutes. But it won’t be right away, right?
Even Duece is likey not ready to step up and start. Im going with probabilty. There is always rookie outliers that blow us way and we wish we would have drafted that kid.

So you take the player with the upside.

Duren might be that guy. Williams might be more ready to play. If we let Mitch walk, fans be like “What a waste”. Maybe yes short term but what does that cap space do going forward. “But we spend it on EF and “That lazy no good fan hating bipolar Randle”……..when we could have had mitch!!!!

Take the player with the upside.
Best case scenario is EF, Rndle, Obi, even RJ are all tradable if we draft a miracle like a Donovan Mitchell or other who outplays his draft position. Like Grimes and IQ have? We are doing it fellas, we are draftng value!!

Take the best player regardless of positon.

BigDaddyG @ 6/13/2022 8:40 AM
Nalod wrote:
BingBong wrote:Hi...I'm new here so take it easy on me. I'm a die-hard, long-suffering Knicks' fan. With that said, I'll share my view on the upcoming draft.

First and foremost, we need a world class PG that seems as elusive as getting a crystal clear picture of Sasquatch. We never seem to get high enough in the draft order to grab a great PG and to trade for one means gutting the team and the future to finally solve one problem, albeit, it's a big one...and in turn, end up with more problems in other areas. Apart from the PG position, we are pretty strong with youngsters who look like the real deal.

Secondly, it almost seems a given that Robinson will be gone. He obviously is looking for a huge payday and some team will give it to him, but probably not the Knicks. Hence, we're going to need a big guy to replace him.

The draft: Ivey and Daniels are good, but neither are pure point guards and more off guards that are wickedly good. Grimes is a really solid shooting guard and Quick is a great off guard and can play the point, but neither is a pure PT. McBride might become one in a year but still needs NBA seasoning and Thibs doesn't seem to like playing rookies in important positions unless they are top 5 lottery picks. So instead of a lost season by turning the ball over to rookies, we fill in the blanks with old expensive vets so we can be a middling team that picks late in the lottery instead of up front.

Anyhow...the draft. As I see it, at number 11 overall we are not getting a world class pure point guard at that spot. Personally, I hope we go with center Mark Williams to replace Robinson who is almost certainly gone. Williams is the tallest (7'2), has the widest wing span, and the most experienced of the big 4 on the board (Holmgren, Duren, and Kessler). His game is similar to Robinson's and there wouldn't be much difference in the paint. He's also going to get heavier and stronger as his body fills out. He will be a solid NBA big man.

He's also has the highest shooting percentage and can make free throws

This draft is filled with quality forwards and off guards, but light on big men and of course, pure point guards. So if we stick at no. 11, I hope we go for a big man. We have high end NBA forwards as it is and don't need more to compete with RJ, JR, Obi, Cam, etc. I have an idea for point guard which I will present on another post. So for me, if I was to pick at number 11, I'd take Mark Williams. If we end up keeping Robinson somehow (which I doubt, but is possible), the Robinson/Williams tandem would be the best in the NBA...IMHO

Take a center, the fans will yell “We need a PG”!!!!
We do, but we need one now as I see it. That said, you take the best player possible. Even if its a PF.
Why? that player can force a team to make a move to make minutes. But it won’t be right away, right?
Even Duece is likey not ready to step up and start. Im going with probabilty. There is always rookie outliers that blow us way and we wish we would have drafted that kid.

So you take the player with the upside.

Duren might be that guy. Williams might be more ready to play. If we let Mitch walk, fans be like “What a waste”. Maybe yes short term but what does that cap space do going forward. “But we spend it on EF and “That lazy no good fan hating bipolar Randle”……..when we could have had mitch!!!!

Take the player with the upside.
Best case scenario is EF, Rndle, Obi, even RJ are all tradable if we draft a miracle like a Donovan Mitchell or other who outplays his draft position. Like Grimes and IQ have? We are doing it fellas, we are draftng value!!

Take the best player regardless of positon.


Yeah, I hate going back to this example, but imagine if the Blazers drafted Jordan instead of Bowie. You take the best player available. If you feel Williams is the best prospect available at #11, then you take him. But I don't believe in reaching for a prospect based on need. This teams has so many boxes to check that it doesn't make sense. I'm a big fan of Grimes,Obi and IQ. I think Cam has the skills to do some things if ever finds consistency. But none of those guys are good enough right for the Knicks to write anyone off the draft board.
BingBong @ 6/13/2022 8:55 AM
Soooo, not a lot of love for a center

I get it. And I imagine the guys in the front office also get it (knock on wood) and we take the best player available or have what appears to be the most potential. Hopefully the FO has done their homework and are ready to do some wheeling and dealing to bring this team another step closer to the promise land. As a die-hard Knick fan though, I feel a bit like Charlie Brown kicking a football with Lucy holding. Tease, tease, tease - bam! flat on my back again.

Well, we're another day closer to finding out what they're thinking. Hopefully it will be as good as it was the last couple of years. I think those drafts were solid anyway...considering where we were drafting.

Nalod @ 6/13/2022 9:30 AM
BigDaddyG wrote:
Nalod wrote:
BingBong wrote:Hi...I'm new here so take it easy on me. I'm a die-hard, long-suffering Knicks' fan. With that said, I'll share my view on the upcoming draft.

First and foremost, we need a world class PG that seems as elusive as getting a crystal clear picture of Sasquatch. We never seem to get high enough in the draft order to grab a great PG and to trade for one means gutting the team and the future to finally solve one problem, albeit, it's a big one...and in turn, end up with more problems in other areas. Apart from the PG position, we are pretty strong with youngsters who look like the real deal.

Secondly, it almost seems a given that Robinson will be gone. He obviously is looking for a huge payday and some team will give it to him, but probably not the Knicks. Hence, we're going to need a big guy to replace him.

The draft: Ivey and Daniels are good, but neither are pure point guards and more off guards that are wickedly good. Grimes is a really solid shooting guard and Quick is a great off guard and can play the point, but neither is a pure PT. McBride might become one in a year but still needs NBA seasoning and Thibs doesn't seem to like playing rookies in important positions unless they are top 5 lottery picks. So instead of a lost season by turning the ball over to rookies, we fill in the blanks with old expensive vets so we can be a middling team that picks late in the lottery instead of up front.

Anyhow...the draft. As I see it, at number 11 overall we are not getting a world class pure point guard at that spot. Personally, I hope we go with center Mark Williams to replace Robinson who is almost certainly gone. Williams is the tallest (7'2), has the widest wing span, and the most experienced of the big 4 on the board (Holmgren, Duren, and Kessler). His game is similar to Robinson's and there wouldn't be much difference in the paint. He's also going to get heavier and stronger as his body fills out. He will be a solid NBA big man.

He's also has the highest shooting percentage and can make free throws

This draft is filled with quality forwards and off guards, but light on big men and of course, pure point guards. So if we stick at no. 11, I hope we go for a big man. We have high end NBA forwards as it is and don't need more to compete with RJ, JR, Obi, Cam, etc. I have an idea for point guard which I will present on another post. So for me, if I was to pick at number 11, I'd take Mark Williams. If we end up keeping Robinson somehow (which I doubt, but is possible), the Robinson/Williams tandem would be the best in the NBA...IMHO

Take a center, the fans will yell “We need a PG”!!!!
We do, but we need one now as I see it. That said, you take the best player possible. Even if its a PF.
Why? that player can force a team to make a move to make minutes. But it won’t be right away, right?
Even Duece is likey not ready to step up and start. Im going with probabilty. There is always rookie outliers that blow us way and we wish we would have drafted that kid.

So you take the player with the upside.

Duren might be that guy. Williams might be more ready to play. If we let Mitch walk, fans be like “What a waste”. Maybe yes short term but what does that cap space do going forward. “But we spend it on EF and “That lazy no good fan hating bipolar Randle”……..when we could have had mitch!!!!

Take the player with the upside.
Best case scenario is EF, Rndle, Obi, even RJ are all tradable if we draft a miracle like a Donovan Mitchell or other who outplays his draft position. Like Grimes and IQ have? We are doing it fellas, we are draftng value!!

Take the best player regardless of positon.


Yeah, I hate going back to this example, but imagine if the Blazers drafted Jordan instead of Bowie. You take the best player available. If you feel Williams is the best prospect available at #11, then you take him. But I don't believe in reaching for a prospect based on need. This teams has so many boxes to check that it doesn't make sense. I'm a big fan of Grimes,Obi and IQ. I think Cam has the skills to do some things if ever finds consistency. But none of those guys are good enough right for the Knicks to write anyone off the draft board.

Its a great example but in hindsight Clyde Drexler was an allstar and nobody knew that Jordan would be what he became. Also Sam Bowie was thought to be quite a good player with upside! It did not turn out and in hindsight could they have built around jordan and traded Clyde, or they play together? Maybe. The stars lined up also with Phil being his coach at the right maturity level for him to accept that kind of coaching. PHil was unproven and unorthodox. He was smart to bring in Tex to implement the triangle. The rest is history as we know it. But small things do matter and can change a franchise Trajectory. Krause was a freaking genius. He might have been an ass about it, but he was the architect of that.

BigDaddyG @ 6/13/2022 2:46 PM
martin @ 6/13/2022 5:48 PM
martin @ 6/13/2022 5:49 PM
Could be interesting stash or slow develop pick

Marv @ 6/13/2022 8:59 PM
Nalod wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
Nalod wrote:
BingBong wrote:Hi...I'm new here so take it easy on me. I'm a die-hard, long-suffering Knicks' fan. With that said, I'll share my view on the upcoming draft.

First and foremost, we need a world class PG that seems as elusive as getting a crystal clear picture of Sasquatch. We never seem to get high enough in the draft order to grab a great PG and to trade for one means gutting the team and the future to finally solve one problem, albeit, it's a big one...and in turn, end up with more problems in other areas. Apart from the PG position, we are pretty strong with youngsters who look like the real deal.

Secondly, it almost seems a given that Robinson will be gone. He obviously is looking for a huge payday and some team will give it to him, but probably not the Knicks. Hence, we're going to need a big guy to replace him.

The draft: Ivey and Daniels are good, but neither are pure point guards and more off guards that are wickedly good. Grimes is a really solid shooting guard and Quick is a great off guard and can play the point, but neither is a pure PT. McBride might become one in a year but still needs NBA seasoning and Thibs doesn't seem to like playing rookies in important positions unless they are top 5 lottery picks. So instead of a lost season by turning the ball over to rookies, we fill in the blanks with old expensive vets so we can be a middling team that picks late in the lottery instead of up front.

Anyhow...the draft. As I see it, at number 11 overall we are not getting a world class pure point guard at that spot. Personally, I hope we go with center Mark Williams to replace Robinson who is almost certainly gone. Williams is the tallest (7'2), has the widest wing span, and the most experienced of the big 4 on the board (Holmgren, Duren, and Kessler). His game is similar to Robinson's and there wouldn't be much difference in the paint. He's also going to get heavier and stronger as his body fills out. He will be a solid NBA big man.

He's also has the highest shooting percentage and can make free throws

This draft is filled with quality forwards and off guards, but light on big men and of course, pure point guards. So if we stick at no. 11, I hope we go for a big man. We have high end NBA forwards as it is and don't need more to compete with RJ, JR, Obi, Cam, etc. I have an idea for point guard which I will present on another post. So for me, if I was to pick at number 11, I'd take Mark Williams. If we end up keeping Robinson somehow (which I doubt, but is possible), the Robinson/Williams tandem would be the best in the NBA...IMHO

Take a center, the fans will yell “We need a PG”!!!!
We do, but we need one now as I see it. That said, you take the best player possible. Even if its a PF.
Why? that player can force a team to make a move to make minutes. But it won’t be right away, right?
Even Duece is likey not ready to step up and start. Im going with probabilty. There is always rookie outliers that blow us way and we wish we would have drafted that kid.

So you take the player with the upside.

Duren might be that guy. Williams might be more ready to play. If we let Mitch walk, fans be like “What a waste”. Maybe yes short term but what does that cap space do going forward. “But we spend it on EF and “That lazy no good fan hating bipolar Randle”……..when we could have had mitch!!!!

Take the player with the upside.
Best case scenario is EF, Rndle, Obi, even RJ are all tradable if we draft a miracle like a Donovan Mitchell or other who outplays his draft position. Like Grimes and IQ have? We are doing it fellas, we are draftng value!!

Take the best player regardless of positon.


Yeah, I hate going back to this example, but imagine if the Blazers drafted Jordan instead of Bowie. You take the best player available. If you feel Williams is the best prospect available at #11, then you take him. But I don't believe in reaching for a prospect based on need. This teams has so many boxes to check that it doesn't make sense. I'm a big fan of Grimes,Obi and IQ. I think Cam has the skills to do some things if ever finds consistency. But none of those guys are good enough right for the Knicks to write anyone off the draft board.

Its a great example but in hindsight Clyde Drexler was an allstar and nobody knew that Jordan would be what he became. Also Sam Bowie was thought to be quite a good player with upside! It did not turn out and in hindsight could they have built around jordan and traded Clyde, or they play together? Maybe. The stars lined up also with Phil being his coach at the right maturity level for him to accept that kind of coaching. PHil was unproven and unorthodox. He was smart to bring in Tex to implement the triangle. The rest is history as we know it. But small things do matter and can change a franchise Trajectory. Krause was a freaking genius. He might have been an ass about it, but he was the architect of that.

I gotta disagree with this one. That move had idiotic written all over it from the moment they made it.

Bowie had a super strong sophomore year, then had injuries at the the end of it that made him miss the next TWO entire years. When he came back, he was good but not as good.

Versus Jordan?? Who was transcendant alll 3 years of his college career? And a clutch national title game winner?

The capper - drexler was 6’7” and clearly would have thrived moving to forward.

One of the dumbest moves in nba history from the moment it occurred.

BigDaddyG @ 6/14/2022 7:07 AM
Marv wrote:
Nalod wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
Nalod wrote:
BingBong wrote:Hi...I'm new here so take it easy on me. I'm a die-hard, long-suffering Knicks' fan. With that said, I'll share my view on the upcoming draft.

First and foremost, we need a world class PG that seems as elusive as getting a crystal clear picture of Sasquatch. We never seem to get high enough in the draft order to grab a great PG and to trade for one means gutting the team and the future to finally solve one problem, albeit, it's a big one...and in turn, end up with more problems in other areas. Apart from the PG position, we are pretty strong with youngsters who look like the real deal.

Secondly, it almost seems a given that Robinson will be gone. He obviously is looking for a huge payday and some team will give it to him, but probably not the Knicks. Hence, we're going to need a big guy to replace him.

The draft: Ivey and Daniels are good, but neither are pure point guards and more off guards that are wickedly good. Grimes is a really solid shooting guard and Quick is a great off guard and can play the point, but neither is a pure PT. McBride might become one in a year but still needs NBA seasoning and Thibs doesn't seem to like playing rookies in important positions unless they are top 5 lottery picks. So instead of a lost season by turning the ball over to rookies, we fill in the blanks with old expensive vets so we can be a middling team that picks late in the lottery instead of up front.

Anyhow...the draft. As I see it, at number 11 overall we are not getting a world class pure point guard at that spot. Personally, I hope we go with center Mark Williams to replace Robinson who is almost certainly gone. Williams is the tallest (7'2), has the widest wing span, and the most experienced of the big 4 on the board (Holmgren, Duren, and Kessler). His game is similar to Robinson's and there wouldn't be much difference in the paint. He's also going to get heavier and stronger as his body fills out. He will be a solid NBA big man.

He's also has the highest shooting percentage and can make free throws

This draft is filled with quality forwards and off guards, but light on big men and of course, pure point guards. So if we stick at no. 11, I hope we go for a big man. We have high end NBA forwards as it is and don't need more to compete with RJ, JR, Obi, Cam, etc. I have an idea for point guard which I will present on another post. So for me, if I was to pick at number 11, I'd take Mark Williams. If we end up keeping Robinson somehow (which I doubt, but is possible), the Robinson/Williams tandem would be the best in the NBA...IMHO

Take a center, the fans will yell “We need a PG”!!!!
We do, but we need one now as I see it. That said, you take the best player possible. Even if its a PF.
Why? that player can force a team to make a move to make minutes. But it won’t be right away, right?
Even Duece is likey not ready to step up and start. Im going with probabilty. There is always rookie outliers that blow us way and we wish we would have drafted that kid.

So you take the player with the upside.

Duren might be that guy. Williams might be more ready to play. If we let Mitch walk, fans be like “What a waste”. Maybe yes short term but what does that cap space do going forward. “But we spend it on EF and “That lazy no good fan hating bipolar Randle”……..when we could have had mitch!!!!

Take the player with the upside.
Best case scenario is EF, Rndle, Obi, even RJ are all tradable if we draft a miracle like a Donovan Mitchell or other who outplays his draft position. Like Grimes and IQ have? We are doing it fellas, we are draftng value!!

Take the best player regardless of positon.


Yeah, I hate going back to this example, but imagine if the Blazers drafted Jordan instead of Bowie. You take the best player available. If you feel Williams is the best prospect available at #11, then you take him. But I don't believe in reaching for a prospect based on need. This teams has so many boxes to check that it doesn't make sense. I'm a big fan of Grimes,Obi and IQ. I think Cam has the skills to do some things if ever finds consistency. But none of those guys are good enough right for the Knicks to write anyone off the draft board.

Its a great example but in hindsight Clyde Drexler was an allstar and nobody knew that Jordan would be what he became. Also Sam Bowie was thought to be quite a good player with upside! It did not turn out and in hindsight could they have built around jordan and traded Clyde, or they play together? Maybe. The stars lined up also with Phil being his coach at the right maturity level for him to accept that kind of coaching. PHil was unproven and unorthodox. He was smart to bring in Tex to implement the triangle. The rest is history as we know it. But small things do matter and can change a franchise Trajectory. Krause was a freaking genius. He might have been an ass about it, but he was the architect of that.

I gotta disagree with this one. That move had idiotic written all over it from the moment they made it.

Bowie had a super strong sophomore year, then had injuries at the the end of it that made him miss the next TWO entire years. When he came back, he was good but not as good.

Versus Jordan?? Who was transcendant alll 3 years of his college career? And a clutch national title game winner?

The capper - drexler was 6’7” and clearly would have thrived moving to forward.

One of the dumbest moves in nba history from the moment it occurred.


Wasn't Drexler a forward in college who converted to SG in the pros? It just seemed a like a bad value play by Portland.
EwingsGlass @ 6/14/2022 7:40 AM
martin wrote:Could be interesting stash or slow develop pick

I like the idea of stashing some big guys and getting them an NBA level workout regimen.

Nalod @ 6/14/2022 8:58 AM
BigDaddyG wrote:
Marv wrote:
Nalod wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
Nalod wrote:
BingBong wrote:Hi...I'm new here so take it easy on me. I'm a die-hard, long-suffering Knicks' fan. With that said, I'll share my view on the upcoming draft.

First and foremost, we need a world class PG that seems as elusive as getting a crystal clear picture of Sasquatch. We never seem to get high enough in the draft order to grab a great PG and to trade for one means gutting the team and the future to finally solve one problem, albeit, it's a big one...and in turn, end up with more problems in other areas. Apart from the PG position, we are pretty strong with youngsters who look like the real deal.

Secondly, it almost seems a given that Robinson will be gone. He obviously is looking for a huge payday and some team will give it to him, but probably not the Knicks. Hence, we're going to need a big guy to replace him.

The draft: Ivey and Daniels are good, but neither are pure point guards and more off guards that are wickedly good. Grimes is a really solid shooting guard and Quick is a great off guard and can play the point, but neither is a pure PT. McBride might become one in a year but still needs NBA seasoning and Thibs doesn't seem to like playing rookies in important positions unless they are top 5 lottery picks. So instead of a lost season by turning the ball over to rookies, we fill in the blanks with old expensive vets so we can be a middling team that picks late in the lottery instead of up front.

Anyhow...the draft. As I see it, at number 11 overall we are not getting a world class pure point guard at that spot. Personally, I hope we go with center Mark Williams to replace Robinson who is almost certainly gone. Williams is the tallest (7'2), has the widest wing span, and the most experienced of the big 4 on the board (Holmgren, Duren, and Kessler). His game is similar to Robinson's and there wouldn't be much difference in the paint. He's also going to get heavier and stronger as his body fills out. He will be a solid NBA big man.

He's also has the highest shooting percentage and can make free throws

This draft is filled with quality forwards and off guards, but light on big men and of course, pure point guards. So if we stick at no. 11, I hope we go for a big man. We have high end NBA forwards as it is and don't need more to compete with RJ, JR, Obi, Cam, etc. I have an idea for point guard which I will present on another post. So for me, if I was to pick at number 11, I'd take Mark Williams. If we end up keeping Robinson somehow (which I doubt, but is possible), the Robinson/Williams tandem would be the best in the NBA...IMHO

Take a center, the fans will yell “We need a PG”!!!!
We do, but we need one now as I see it. That said, you take the best player possible. Even if its a PF.
Why? that player can force a team to make a move to make minutes. But it won’t be right away, right?
Even Duece is likey not ready to step up and start. Im going with probabilty. There is always rookie outliers that blow us way and we wish we would have drafted that kid.

So you take the player with the upside.

Duren might be that guy. Williams might be more ready to play. If we let Mitch walk, fans be like “What a waste”. Maybe yes short term but what does that cap space do going forward. “But we spend it on EF and “That lazy no good fan hating bipolar Randle”……..when we could have had mitch!!!!

Take the player with the upside.
Best case scenario is EF, Rndle, Obi, even RJ are all tradable if we draft a miracle like a Donovan Mitchell or other who outplays his draft position. Like Grimes and IQ have? We are doing it fellas, we are draftng value!!

Take the best player regardless of positon.


Yeah, I hate going back to this example, but imagine if the Blazers drafted Jordan instead of Bowie. You take the best player available. If you feel Williams is the best prospect available at #11, then you take him. But I don't believe in reaching for a prospect based on need. This teams has so many boxes to check that it doesn't make sense. I'm a big fan of Grimes,Obi and IQ. I think Cam has the skills to do some things if ever finds consistency. But none of those guys are good enough right for the Knicks to write anyone off the draft board.

Its a great example but in hindsight Clyde Drexler was an allstar and nobody knew that Jordan would be what he became. Also Sam Bowie was thought to be quite a good player with upside! It did not turn out and in hindsight could they have built around jordan and traded Clyde, or they play together? Maybe. The stars lined up also with Phil being his coach at the right maturity level for him to accept that kind of coaching. PHil was unproven and unorthodox. He was smart to bring in Tex to implement the triangle. The rest is history as we know it. But small things do matter and can change a franchise Trajectory. Krause was a freaking genius. He might have been an ass about it, but he was the architect of that.

I gotta disagree with this one. That move had idiotic written all over it from the moment they made it.

Bowie had a super strong sophomore year, then had injuries at the the end of it that made him miss the next TWO entire years. When he came back, he was good but not as good.

Versus Jordan?? Who was transcendant alll 3 years of his college career? And a clutch national title game winner?

The capper - drexler was 6’7” and clearly would have thrived moving to forward.

One of the dumbest moves in nba history from the moment it occurred.


Wasn't Drexler a forward in college who converted to SG in the pros? It just seemed a like a bad value play by Portland.

No shit.
All im saying is if you want to fully undestand then you have to look at where portand was at that moment. perhsps the season before, the coaching, the yoot, the draft picks, and learn about what sam bowie was at that moment and how he might have fit in to that vision. Also what was Jordan projected to be? Not just what was the Portland scouting report o Jordan, but the teams below them and did they attempt to trade up? We know in hindsight how it played out and without a doubt portland had regret. Remember, Hakeem as great as he was needed a few seasons to figure it out before he hit his potential. And there was a time when Hakeem was unhappy with Rockets and wanted out. The Two chips they won in that era validates him as the top pick, but if they could do it over do you still take him no. 1? Also think how much perfect storm comes together before Jordan starts winning chips.

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