martin wrote:fishmike wrote:lol yeah this didnt age well throwing Brunson shade 
think of it as the reverse-reverse jinx. You didn't want Brunson on the team so by pointing out how bad he is, he outperforms and then makes his situation so bad for the Knicks (cause they are no longer in the range for a S&T) and conversely so good for Dallas that they end up keeping him at a ridiculous contract price. For you this is a win-win.
I would actually like Brunson... just not for anything like what he's gonna cost. Before this it would have been bad, now its impossible.
martin wrote:fishmike wrote:lol yeah this didnt age well throwing Brunson shade
think of it as the reverse-reverse jinx. You didn't want Brunson on the team so by pointing out how bad he is, he outperforms and then makes his situation so bad for the Knicks (cause they are no longer in the range for a S&T) and conversely so good for Dallas that they end up keeping him at a ridiculous contract price. For you this is a win-win.
since there is at least one other series, can we anticipate a reverse-reverse-reverse jinx?
i don't want to derail the thread but if we can't get a solid pg we should be thinking of a coach on the staff who makes mediocre guards real good. What's Kenny Atikinson doing? I'm sure there are others
Chandler wrote:martin wrote:fishmike wrote:lol yeah this didnt age well throwing Brunson shade
think of it as the reverse-reverse jinx. You didn't want Brunson on the team so by pointing out how bad he is, he outperforms and then makes his situation so bad for the Knicks (cause they are no longer in the range for a S&T) and conversely so good for Dallas that they end up keeping him at a ridiculous contract price. For you this is a win-win.
since there is at least one other series, can we anticipate a reverse-reverse-reverse jinx?
i don't want to derail the thread but if we can't get a solid pg we should be thinking of a coach on the staff who makes mediocre guards real good. What's Kenny Atikinson doing? I'm sure there are others
oh absolutely, after Brunson gets eaten alive by GSW he'll be signing with the Knicks for the MLE
BTW, talking about staff who makes mediocre guards real good... that's Johnny Bryant's job and he is doing just fine.
I don't know if anyone has read this or posted this:
https://www.spotrac.com/research/nba/a-d...
Here is the Max deal he can sign with other teams:
2022-23: $30,250,000
2023-24: $31,762,500
2024-25: $33,275,000
2025-26: $34,787,500
Total: Four years, $130,075,000
And then an entirely reasonable middle ground that I think most would be ok with us signing him for?
2022-23: $18,800,000
2023-24: $19,740,000
2024-25: $20,680,000
2025-26: $21,620,000
Total: Four years, $80,840,000
jesus. 80 million doesn't go as far as it used to
Can we get Tyus for like 50 Mil? Different player, but serves the same purpose.
Chandler wrote:martin wrote:fishmike wrote:lol yeah this didnt age well throwing Brunson shade
think of it as the reverse-reverse jinx. You didn't want Brunson on the team so by pointing out how bad he is, he outperforms and then makes his situation so bad for the Knicks (cause they are no longer in the range for a S&T) and conversely so good for Dallas that they end up keeping him at a ridiculous contract price. For you this is a win-win.
since there is at least one other series, can we anticipate a reverse-reverse-reverse jinx?
i don't want to derail the thread but if we can't get a solid pg we should be thinking of a coach on the staff who makes mediocre guards real good. What's Kenny Atikinson doing? I'm sure there are others
Kenny Atkinson is like with Warriors and rumored to be interviewing with Lakers for head coach job.
Read up on our Johnny Bryant who has Damian Lillard and Donovan mitchell on his resume. One might add Quick and RJ ascension is IN PART due to his work. Good reputation and seen as eventual successor to Thibs for now.
wargames wrote:Can we get Tyus for like 50 Mil? Different player, but serves the same purpose.
We don’t have the cap room this offseason. A team like the pistons does and will probably offer Tus Jones 3 yrs $50 million as opposed to 4 yrs $90 million for Brunson
why is Detroit even in the mix? they invested a lottery pick on the French kid and then Cade is supposed to be handling the ball too/most
Chandler wrote:
why is Detroit even in the mix? they invested a lottery pick on the French kid and then Cade is supposed to be handling the ball too/most
The French is very much like the French kid we drafted 
That said, Detroit is being thrown in with every free agent because of their cap space. I don't think it's really clear what their plans are.
I don't see how Dallas can let Brunson go. Their team is basically Doncic and a bunch of nobodies. GSW had a team and Dallas basically had Doncic and Brunson with a tiny bit of Bullock.
Brunson has played huge- gritty game last night- we would be lucky to add him to our team. I agree he doesn't put us on a path to a championship, but it would get our talent to perform to their max potential, and beggars can't be choosers.
I don’t see it either. Mavs have made such a run in the playoffs I have a hard time seeing Cuban letting a key guy like Brunson go. Cuban doesn’t care about luxury tax
Jalen Brunson. I said max contract. Now it’s a given
The Knicks would trade ANY one of their players for him. Rj Randle. Iq. Yes. In fact they might be willing to give any two players. Perhaps. No one on the Knicks is as valuable as Brunson
BRIGGS wrote:Jalen Brunson. I said max contract. Now it’s a givenThe Knicks would trade ANY one of their players for him. Rj Randle. Iq. Yes. In fact they might be willing to give any two players. Perhaps. No one on the Knicks is as valuable as Brunson
I say BS - Brunson is no doubt a very good player but I think it's more about the fit for him on Dallas. Yes he is capable when Luka doesn't play but it is an ideal situation for a player when the offense is designed with 3-4 shooters standing around the 3 pt line.
We would trade Randle for him because we desperately need a quality PG and some of us here would trade Randle for a "carton of eggs."
I would not trade RJ for him and would be on the fence about giving up IQ for him.
BRIGGS wrote:Jalen Brunson. I said max contract. Now it’s a givenThe Knicks would trade ANY one of their players for him. Rj Randle. Iq. Yes. In fact they might be willing to give any two players. Perhaps. No one on the Knicks is as valuable as Brunson
I’ve been pushing Brunson since early in the year. Knicks should have made a strong offer for him. Now he’s a #2 option on a title contender. That typically commands a max contract but obviously being next to Luka does make it a bit harder to prove himself. Still, Middleton did it alongside Giannis in a similar circumstance at about the same age. At this rate if Brunson is putting up 20+ points, 6 asts and 4 rebs on a top 3 western conference team he’s an allstar.
I have my doubts about Brunson.
jskinny35 wrote:BRIGGS wrote:Jalen Brunson. I said max contract. Now it’s a givenThe Knicks would trade ANY one of their players for him. Rj Randle. Iq. Yes. In fact they might be willing to give any two players. Perhaps. No one on the Knicks is as valuable as Brunson
I say BS - Brunson is no doubt a very good player but I think it's more about the fit for him on Dallas. Yes he is capable when Luka doesn't play but it is an ideal situation for a player when the offense is designed with 3-4 shooters standing around the 3 pt line.
We would trade Randle for him because we desperately need a quality PG and some of us here would trade Randle for a "carton of eggs."
I would not trade RJ for him and would be on the fence about giving up IQ for him.
I think Brunson is capable of more than what we are seeing. On one hand, he gets the benefit of playing beside an elite player in Luka who draws alot of attention, but on the other hand, Luka is an extremely high usage player which causes Brunson to have multiple possessions on offensive end when he doesn't touch the ball. Its difficult to get into a rhythm playing beside Luka, if you are also a guys that needs the ball in your hands.
Other than Mitch, Brunson would be our best finisher in the paint. He's a high IQ low turnover player that if given a chance, can run the show and in my opinion can have several seasons where he is a fringe allstar. He is not a number 1 option, and he still needs to play alongside an elite player or two in order for him/us to be successful, but it would help if his usage increased more than what it is playing alongside Luka.
Uptown wrote:jskinny35 wrote:BRIGGS wrote:Jalen Brunson. I said max contract. Now it’s a givenThe Knicks would trade ANY one of their players for him. Rj Randle. Iq. Yes. In fact they might be willing to give any two players. Perhaps. No one on the Knicks is as valuable as Brunson
I say BS - Brunson is no doubt a very good player but I think it's more about the fit for him on Dallas. Yes he is capable when Luka doesn't play but it is an ideal situation for a player when the offense is designed with 3-4 shooters standing around the 3 pt line.
We would trade Randle for him because we desperately need a quality PG and some of us here would trade Randle for a "carton of eggs."
I would not trade RJ for him and would be on the fence about giving up IQ for him.
I think Brunson is capable of more than what we are seeing. On one hand, he gets the benefit of playing beside an elite player in Luka who draws alot of attention, but on the other hand, Luka is an extremely high usage player which causes Brunson to have multiple possessions on offensive end when he doesn't touch the ball. Its difficult to get into a rhythm playing beside Luka, if you are also a guys that needs the ball in your hands.
Other than Mitch, Brunson would be our best finisher in the paint. He's a high IQ low turnover player that if given a chance, can run the show and in my opinion can have several seasons where he is a fringe allstar. He is not a number 1 option, and he still needs to play alongside an elite player or two in order for him/us to be successful, but it would help if his usages increased more than what it is playing alongside Luka.
and that would be the reason Brunson would want to leave, to be with a franchise that allows him to be the PG and the driving force. The only way we get him is if he wants to come, and even then it's not a done deal.
Uptown wrote:<snip>
Other than Mitch, Brunson would be our best finisher in the paint. He's a high IQ low turnover player that if given a chance, can run the show and in my opinion can have several seasons where he is a fringe allstar. He is not a number 1 option, and he still needs to play alongside an elite player or two in order for him/us to be successful, but it would help if his usage increased more than what it is playing alongside Luka.
Brunson can be much more than he's shown to date - consider Fred Van Vleet and Kyle Lowry. None of them look the part of an elite PG with their thick, less than elite athleticism bodies. But boy are they effective.
On the other hand, maybe he'll be along the lines of a Raymond Felton. If that were the case, is that good enough to spend big bucks on? Felton also brought NCAA championship pedigree. Averaged 17.1ppg/9apg/3.6rpg in 54 games with the Knicks in 2010-2011 with the Knicks/D'Antoni, looking very much like a poor man's Steve Nash in the process.
He was then was traded as part of the Carmelo Anthony trade and never quite regained that luster. He wasn't the same player after he was brought back a few seasons later (no more MDA, gained weight, was involved in that gun thing, and lost confidence).
The other bit of course is whether he'd even want to be here.
The only thing going for the Knicks at the moment is the whole hometown thing (born in New Brunswick NJ, college in Philly). Even if the Knicks could blow him away with money, he'd have to look at the fit.
There are 2 ball hogs (Randle/RJ), lack of a winning/playoff pedigree, and a lack of a clear picture of what the PG position looks like (an aging/frequently injured PG in Rose & Walker, some hungry young combo guards in Quickley/McBride/Grimes, plus veteran combo guard/wing Burks). Right now there's a weird pecking order between Quickley/Burks/Rose. Quickley and McBride are seemingly on the rise (Quickley looked too good for summer league last year and showed improvement to end the season; McBride looked like he already mastered the G-league).
The recruiting story would have to be along the lines of:
* Building the big 3 with Randle and RJ
* elite finishing big men Obi and Mitch
* hometown boy makes good story
* bringing back the Mecca
* side endorsement/appearance deals. :)
* the potential of the #11th pick to add to the arsenal.
The Knicks need to dump some of the redundant pieces (Fournier/Burks; Walker/Rose; Noel/Mitch). As much as I'd like to see Mitch return, he'd be an excellent option for a trade package for Brunson, as they both have value above and beyond last year's salary.
