Last season signing Kemba & Fournier and giving Randle an extension. Now after a year we are trying to get out of all 3, with Kemba already gone - after we had to give up assets to do it.
Same people are still here who made those decisions.
We did the same thing with Noah and a host of others over the years. At least I have more faith in this front office than those from years past.
Knicks need to be careful going all in on Mitchell or it could turn out to be another mistake.
Might as well just trade Randle and Fournier for Westbrook’s expiring contract at this point lol
Making mistakes is part of being a GM- everything is a calculated risk. Cleaning up mistakes is an important part of the job- better than doubling down so you don't have to admit something didn't work out!
Last summers moves were okay (there weren't many options), but we got unlucky with all of them- Noel and Rose got injured, Randle had an absolute meltdown. If Noel had performed like the previous season (not a huge ask), his contract would have been fine, could have got a second rounder at the least back. Likewise with Rose. I'm not a fan of extending players a season in advance because you never know what might happen, but at the time Randle's contract was decent even if he had a slight regression.
Worst mistake was $8mil for 2 seasons for Kemba- 1 season would have been fine, or a minimum contract would have been fine, but that second year blew up in our face. Though likely OKC only agreed to the buyout because we were saving them $16mil.
TLover wrote:Might as well just trade Randle and Fournier for Westbrook’s expiring contract at this point lol
I think Fournier is the one move that wasn't a mistake, we just need to wait it out until the deadline or offseason- when he just has 1 season left his contract is is fine as an expiring for such a good shooter- think you could get a second rounder or two or late first for him then, like he got last time he was in the same position.
Trading 6 first round picks plus Obi and IQ absolutely is a mistake
The Kemba signing was a low risk move. 2 year deal we easily got out of a year early. The Fournier contract is bad but not horrible. The Randle contract I definitely admit horrible mistake. They had contractual control over him another year and could have either extended him the following season if he continued to play great and the team was winning or trade him for picks as an expiring deal
smackeddog wrote:TLover wrote:Might as well just trade Randle and Fournier for Westbrook’s expiring contract at this point lol
I think Fournier is the one move that wasn't a mistake, we just need to wait it out until the deadline or offseason- when he just has 1 season left his contract is is fine as an expiring for such a good shooter- think you could get a second rounder or two or late first for him then, like he got last time he was in the same position.
Fournier is the best pure shooter on the roster. Going forward with an actual full time point guard he will be better for us
Philc1 wrote:smackeddog wrote:TLover wrote:Might as well just trade Randle and Fournier for Westbrook’s expiring contract at this point lol
I think Fournier is the one move that wasn't a mistake, we just need to wait it out until the deadline or offseason- when he just has 1 season left his contract is is fine as an expiring for such a good shooter- think you could get a second rounder or two or late first for him then, like he got last time he was in the same position.
Fournier is the best pure shooter on the roster. Going forward with an actual full time point guard he will be better for us
Steve Novak 2.0
2.0 since he can dribble at least twice before losing it.
jaydh wrote:Philc1 wrote:smackeddog wrote:TLover wrote:Might as well just trade Randle and Fournier for Westbrook’s expiring contract at this point lol
I think Fournier is the one move that wasn't a mistake, we just need to wait it out until the deadline or offseason- when he just has 1 season left his contract is is fine as an expiring for such a good shooter- think you could get a second rounder or two or late first for him then, like he got last time he was in the same position.
Fournier is the best pure shooter on the roster. Going forward with an actual full time point guard he will be better for us
Steve Novak 2.0
2.0 since he can dribble at least twice before losing it.
Think you mean to say Porzingis is Steve Novak the $150 million glorified version
smackeddog wrote:Making mistakes is part of being a GM- everything is a calculated risk. Cleaning up mistakes is an important part of the job- better than doubling down so you don't have to admit something didn't work out!Last summers moves were okay (there weren't many options), but we got unlucky with all of them- Noel and Rose got injured, Randle had an absolute meltdown. If Noel had performed like the previous season (not a huge ask), his contract would have been fine, could have got a second rounder at the least back. Likewise with Rose. I'm not a fan of extending players a season in advance because you never know what might happen, but at the time Randle's contract was decent even if he had a slight regression.
Worst mistake was $8mil for 2 seasons for Kemba- 1 season would have been fine, or a minimum contract would have been fine, but that second year blew up in our face. Though likely OKC only agreed to the buyout because we were saving them $16mil.
This but to add to it the assets they used to get out of their mistakes were assets they collected themselves. So in my mind they cancel each other out. Now they will be judged on how the team actually does this season.
jaydh wrote:Philc1 wrote:smackeddog wrote:TLover wrote:Might as well just trade Randle and Fournier for Westbrook’s expiring contract at this point lol
I think Fournier is the one move that wasn't a mistake, we just need to wait it out until the deadline or offseason- when he just has 1 season left his contract is is fine as an expiring for such a good shooter- think you could get a second rounder or two or late first for him then, like he got last time he was in the same position.
Fournier is the best pure shooter on the roster. Going forward with an actual full time point guard he will be better for us
Steve Novak 2.0
2.0 since he can dribble at least twice before losing it.
One huge difference is Novak couldnt make a 3 with anyone near him. Fournier can.
GustavBahler wrote:jaydh wrote:Philc1 wrote:smackeddog wrote:TLover wrote:Might as well just trade Randle and Fournier for Westbrook’s expiring contract at this point lol
I think Fournier is the one move that wasn't a mistake, we just need to wait it out until the deadline or offseason- when he just has 1 season left his contract is is fine as an expiring for such a good shooter- think you could get a second rounder or two or late first for him then, like he got last time he was in the same position.
Fournier is the best pure shooter on the roster. Going forward with an actual full time point guard he will be better for us
Steve Novak 2.0
2.0 since he can dribble at least twice before losing it.
One huge difference is Novak couldnt make a 3 with anyone near him. Fournier can.
Well yeah he needed Jeremy Lin to drive to the basket to draw a triple team just so he could kick it out to him for a wide open 3. That was novak’s entire game
Clean wrote:smackeddog wrote:Making mistakes is part of being a GM- everything is a calculated risk. Cleaning up mistakes is an important part of the job- better than doubling down so you don't have to admit something didn't work out!Last summers moves were okay (there weren't many options), but we got unlucky with all of them- Noel and Rose got injured, Randle had an absolute meltdown. If Noel had performed like the previous season (not a huge ask), his contract would have been fine, could have got a second rounder at the least back. Likewise with Rose. I'm not a fan of extending players a season in advance because you never know what might happen, but at the time Randle's contract was decent even if he had a slight regression.
Worst mistake was $8mil for 2 seasons for Kemba- 1 season would have been fine, or a minimum contract would have been fine, but that second year blew up in our face. Though likely OKC only agreed to the buyout because we were saving them $16mil.
This but to add to it the assets they used to get out of their mistakes were assets they collected themselves. So in my mind they cancel each other out. Now they will be judged on how the team actually does this season.
Every team that isn’t managed by Pat Riley makes mistakes.
Philc1 wrote:Clean wrote:smackeddog wrote:Making mistakes is part of being a GM- everything is a calculated risk. Cleaning up mistakes is an important part of the job- better than doubling down so you don't have to admit something didn't work out!Last summers moves were okay (there weren't many options), but we got unlucky with all of them- Noel and Rose got injured, Randle had an absolute meltdown. If Noel had performed like the previous season (not a huge ask), his contract would have been fine, could have got a second rounder at the least back. Likewise with Rose. I'm not a fan of extending players a season in advance because you never know what might happen, but at the time Randle's contract was decent even if he had a slight regression.
Worst mistake was $8mil for 2 seasons for Kemba- 1 season would have been fine, or a minimum contract would have been fine, but that second year blew up in our face. Though likely OKC only agreed to the buyout because we were saving them $16mil.
This but to add to it the assets they used to get out of their mistakes were assets they collected themselves. So in my mind they cancel each other out. Now they will be judged on how the team actually does this season.
Every team that isn’t managed by Pat Riley makes mistakes.
He also makes mistakes. Exhibit 1 is that terrible Duncan Robinson contract.
Ugh, these threads for 3 more months….
Like others have mentioned, making mistakes is part of the business. Leon Rose recognizes mistakes and makes moves to correct them. That is what good GMS do. Now we just have to hope he does not give up too much to get Donovan Mitchell.
Clean wrote:Philc1 wrote:Clean wrote:smackeddog wrote:Making mistakes is part of being a GM- everything is a calculated risk. Cleaning up mistakes is an important part of the job- better than doubling down so you don't have to admit something didn't work out!Last summers moves were okay (there weren't many options), but we got unlucky with all of them- Noel and Rose got injured, Randle had an absolute meltdown. If Noel had performed like the previous season (not a huge ask), his contract would have been fine, could have got a second rounder at the least back. Likewise with Rose. I'm not a fan of extending players a season in advance because you never know what might happen, but at the time Randle's contract was decent even if he had a slight regression.
Worst mistake was $8mil for 2 seasons for Kemba- 1 season would have been fine, or a minimum contract would have been fine, but that second year blew up in our face. Though likely OKC only agreed to the buyout because we were saving them $16mil.
This but to add to it the assets they used to get out of their mistakes were assets they collected themselves. So in my mind they cancel each other out. Now they will be judged on how the team actually does this season.
Every team that isn’t managed by Pat Riley makes mistakes.
He also makes mistakes. Exhibit 1 is that terrible Duncan Robinson contract.
#2 is Lowry contract.
martin wrote:Clean wrote:Philc1 wrote:Clean wrote:smackeddog wrote:Making mistakes is part of being a GM- everything is a calculated risk. Cleaning up mistakes is an important part of the job- better than doubling down so you don't have to admit something didn't work out!Last summers moves were okay (there weren't many options), but we got unlucky with all of them- Noel and Rose got injured, Randle had an absolute meltdown. If Noel had performed like the previous season (not a huge ask), his contract would have been fine, could have got a second rounder at the least back. Likewise with Rose. I'm not a fan of extending players a season in advance because you never know what might happen, but at the time Randle's contract was decent even if he had a slight regression.
Worst mistake was $8mil for 2 seasons for Kemba- 1 season would have been fine, or a minimum contract would have been fine, but that second year blew up in our face. Though likely OKC only agreed to the buyout because we were saving them $16mil.
This but to add to it the assets they used to get out of their mistakes were assets they collected themselves. So in my mind they cancel each other out. Now they will be judged on how the team actually does this season.
Every team that isn’t managed by Pat Riley makes mistakes.
He also makes mistakes. Exhibit 1 is that terrible Duncan Robinson contract.
#2 is Lowry contract.
Fournier and Randle aren’t even bad contracts. Fourniers contract is aging the best out of all of those shooters that got paid. Robinson, Hield, Harris, Bertans etc. it’s not like will be just a salary dump situation. Leon will move them only if there’s a bigger fish or better fit.
Knixkik wrote:martin wrote:Clean wrote:Philc1 wrote:Clean wrote:smackeddog wrote:Making mistakes is part of being a GM- everything is a calculated risk. Cleaning up mistakes is an important part of the job- better than doubling down so you don't have to admit something didn't work out!Last summers moves were okay (there weren't many options), but we got unlucky with all of them- Noel and Rose got injured, Randle had an absolute meltdown. If Noel had performed like the previous season (not a huge ask), his contract would have been fine, could have got a second rounder at the least back. Likewise with Rose. I'm not a fan of extending players a season in advance because you never know what might happen, but at the time Randle's contract was decent even if he had a slight regression.
Worst mistake was $8mil for 2 seasons for Kemba- 1 season would have been fine, or a minimum contract would have been fine, but that second year blew up in our face. Though likely OKC only agreed to the buyout because we were saving them $16mil.
This but to add to it the assets they used to get out of their mistakes were assets they collected themselves. So in my mind they cancel each other out. Now they will be judged on how the team actually does this season.
Every team that isn’t managed by Pat Riley makes mistakes.
He also makes mistakes. Exhibit 1 is that terrible Duncan Robinson contract.
#2 is Lowry contract.
Fournier and Randle aren’t even bad contracts. Fourniers contract is aging the best out of all of those shooters that got paid. Robinson, Hield, Harris, Bertans etc. it’s not like will be just a salary dump situation. Leon will move them only if there’s a bigger fish or better fit.
Agree. I consider a bad contract to be one that a team is going to have a lot of trouble unloading without taking some kind of hit. Because of the player, the deal, a combination of the two. Neither of these conditions apply.
One reason Rose was able to come in and accumulate picks, was due to the him not inheriting any bad contracts, other than Noah's. Which still wasnt a big cap hit.
That’s why we shouldn’t panic.
Leon had a horrific offseason last year.
This year has actually be strategic and we made two great signings and bringing back Mitch was smart.
Thibs is the real issue. We needed to push the pace last season and his combinations were not effective.
We have enough horses defensively to up the tempo and apply pressure and keep everyone fresh. Grimes needs to start and Fournier needs to move to the bench.
We can rebuild and add a lot of value to our players…
MS wrote:That’s why we shouldn’t panic. Leon had a horrific offseason last year.
This year has actually be strategic and we made two great signings and bringing back Mitch was smart.
Thibs is the real issue. We needed to push the pace last season and his combinations were not effective.
We have enough horses defensively to up the tempo and apply pressure and keep everyone fresh. Grimes needs to start and Fournier needs to move to the bench.
We can rebuild and add a lot of value to our players…
What would you have done in Leon’s spot?
Randle just had a historic year and RJ was pretty good.
What was your play?
Also, please let us know how you push the ball without guys who can really push the ball. Teams are built around their own strengths and you are calling for the opposite and without the types of players you need to fill those roles.
Never mentioned by, uh, some is notwithstanding one's opinion on the FA signings of the Rose FO through this last season (I'd say not great, not the worst), they have continued a policy of intelligent cap management and most importantly not trading away our #1 picks foolishly. In fact they have parlayed them into multiple picks and assets, while also drafting well. All of which constitutes a smart non-sugar rush build. Fans who don't like it should go find videos of games from the Isaiah era.
