Knicks · Some Rose, IQ discussions going on around league (page 2)

I live in fear of an IQ and Obi, salary and picks package for KAT

I would hate, HATE trading IQ for a pick or two

I hope these rumours are just a negotiating tactic for IQ to accept a lower salary, like the FO did with RJ

Clean wrote:We essentially had to trade our 11th pick and a bunch of 2nd round picks to get out of Kemba, Noel and Burks contracts.

I thought the trade was Kemba Noel Burks, shit-ton of second rounders for 3 protected first round picks with the added ability of cap space to cleanly sign Brunson/Hart.

Or do you think it was somewhere in between the two?

martin wrote:

Clean wrote:We essentially had to trade our 11th pick and a bunch of 2nd round picks to get out of Kemba, Noel and Burks contracts.

I thought the trade was Kemba Noel Burks, shit-ton of second rounders for 3 protected first round picks with the added ability of cap space to cleanly sign Brunson/Hart.

Or do you think it was somewhere in between the two?

I might not be understanding your question but we had to trade our 1st round pick because if we drafted without dropping the contracts we did we would not have enough cap space to sign the free agents we wanted. The 11th pick is not great but it is better than the ones we got back. That was pretty apparent when Ainge who loves draft picks wanted nothing to do with the picks we got back during negotiations with the Jazz.

Clean wrote:

martin wrote:

Clean wrote:We essentially had to trade our 11th pick and a bunch of 2nd round picks to get out of Kemba, Noel and Burks contracts.

I thought the trade was Kemba Noel Burks, shit-ton of second rounders for 3 protected first round picks with the added ability of cap space to cleanly sign Brunson/Hart.

Or do you think it was somewhere in between the two?

I might not be understanding your question but we had to trade our 1st round pick because if we drafted without dropping the contracts we did we would not have enough cap space to sign the free agents we wanted. The 11th pick is not great but it is better than the ones we got back. That was pretty apparent when Ainge who loves draft picks wanted nothing to do with the picks we got back during negotiations with the Jazz.

I don't have the time to google all the trades at the moment, but the bolded is not based in any reality and just the lazy anti-Knick nonsense that came out of draft night. If anyone is interested look it up. But if you're going to criticize there's no need to make crap up or leave out the truth..

I'm guessing we are not shopping IQ, but just listening to offers as they come in.

"We want Quickley and will give you X for him."
"I don't know, we like him a lot too. We'd need some additional picks on top of that."

Going on record, I'd trade Grimes before IQ. He's had growing pains, but has grown his game in several different ways over the last 2.25 years. He went through playmaking Bootcamp, coming out with legit PG skills. Now his rebounding and defense are garnering attention. Who would've guess that out of everything, it'd be his shooting that we'd be groaning about in year 3? Not worried about that as a long-term problem.

Just due diligence. Nobody on the roster is untradeable, but can't see the FO wanting to hit the reset button on 1st round steal.

MaTT4281 wrote:I'm guessing we are not shopping IQ, but just listening to offers as they come in.

"We want Quickley and will give you X for him."
"I don't know, we like him a lot too. We'd need some additional picks on top of that."

Going on record, I'd trade Grimes before IQ. He's had growing pains, but has grown his game in several different ways over the last 2.25 years. He went through playmaking Bootcamp, coming out with legit PG skills. Now his rebounding and defense are garnering attention. Who would've guess that out of everything, it'd be his shooting that we'd be groaning about in year 3? Not worried about that as a long-term problem.

Just due diligence. Nobody on the roster is untradeable, but can't see the FO wanting to hit the reset button on 1st round steal.

BING-GOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

KnickDanger wrote:

Clean wrote:

martin wrote:

Clean wrote:We essentially had to trade our 11th pick and a bunch of 2nd round picks to get out of Kemba, Noel and Burks contracts.

I thought the trade was Kemba Noel Burks, shit-ton of second rounders for 3 protected first round picks with the added ability of cap space to cleanly sign Brunson/Hart.

Or do you think it was somewhere in between the two?

I might not be understanding your question but we had to trade our 1st round pick because if we drafted without dropping the contracts we did we would not have enough cap space to sign the free agents we wanted. The 11th pick is not great but it is better than the ones we got back. That was pretty apparent when Ainge who loves draft picks wanted nothing to do with the picks we got back during negotiations with the Jazz.

I don't have the time to google all the trades at the moment, but the bolded is not based in any reality and just the lazy anti-Knick nonsense that came out of draft night. If anyone is interested look it up. But if you're going to criticize there's no need to make crap up or leave out the truth..

yeah Clean is straight up wrong.. we got 3 FRPs back in those moves, so we gave up 11 but got 3 futures that will eventually convert: (this doesnt include the 2023 Dallas pick that's ours)

2023 first round draft pick from Detroit
Detroit's 1st round pick to New York protected for selections 1-18 in 2023, 1-18 in 2024, 1-13 in 2025, 1-11 in 2026 and 1-9 in 2027; if Detroit has not conveyed a 1st round pick to New York by 2027, then Detroit will instead convey its 2027 2nd round pick to New York (via Houston to Oklahoma City) [Detroit-Houston, 11/24/2020; Houston-Oklahoma City, 7/30/2021; New York-Oklahoma City, 6/23/2022]

2023 first round draft pick from Washington
Washington's 1st round pick to New York protected for selections 1-14 in 2023, 1-12 in 2024, 1-10 in 2025 and 1-8 in 2026; if Washington has not conveyed a 1st round pick to New York by 2026, then Washington will instead convey its 2026 2nd round pick and 2027 2nd round pick to New York (via Houston to Oklahoma City) [Houston-Washington, 12/2/2020; Houston-Oklahoma City, 7/30/2021; New York-Oklahoma City, 6/23/2022]

2025 first round draft pick from Milwaukee
Milwaukee's 2025 1st round pick to New Orleans protected for selections 5-30 or to New York protected for selections 1-4 (Milwaukee's obligation to New Orleans or New York will thereafter be extinguished) (via New Orleans to Portland to Detroit to New York) [Denver-Milwaukee-New Orleans-Oklahoma City, 11/23/2020; New Orleans-Portland, 2/8/2022; Detroit-Portland, 7/6/2022; Detroit-New York, 7/6/2022]

We also have too many incoming 2nd rounders to count, so we will have a lot of shots of grabbing EU or unscouted talent

We are +4 FRPs next few drafts with tons of 2nd rounders. They are shopping hard from every angle. Lebron or AD might shake free...

^^^ basically the next time Wash/Det fall into late lottery or better than 12ish in the next 5 years we get their #1, and the Bucks pick is only top 4 protected. It will really help build the pipe line

I think this the real Freedom Katz....

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if we are looking for an upgrade, who is likely to be sent out? IQ does make sense- but it doesn't make sense to trade BOTH IQ and Rose- who is going to be our back up PG?

I think you're probably going with a package of Obi, IQ, Fournier and draft picks. what comes back?

franco12 wrote:if we are looking for an upgrade, who is likely to be sent out? IQ does make sense- but it doesn't make sense to trade BOTH IQ and Rose- who is going to be our back up PG?

I think you're probably going with a package of Obi, IQ, Fournier and draft picks. what comes back?

Donovan Mitchel

We finally find a keeper PG in the young starter Brunson!

It's early in the season ....
D.Rose leadership should be coaching the Knicks offense for 20 to 26 minutes on the court each night.
Bunson's 14 game performance show signs why it took Brunson four seasons to become a NBA starter, and why Dallas traded KP for PG Dinwiddie on the deadline.

The extension to RJ Barrett messed up any decent Knicks trade during the season ....
Fournier no longer in the rotation, and covid Barrett's inconsistency receiving major minutes.

Cam Reddish and Quickley will have to keep playing consistently well at the SG & SF position in the 9 man rotation.

Knixkik wrote:Trading quickley would be dumb as he can play 2 positions off the bench and has been elite defensively. Unless it’s for a star of course. He’s also close with Obi and others and the chemistry would get hurt if he was moved. Rose makes more sense if there’s a deal out there as grimes can logically fill in that rotation spot.

Agree. Do not trade IQ. Rose I could care less

Keep IQ he’s a great value guard for us. Rose maybe..

franco12 wrote:if we are looking for an upgrade, who is likely to be sent out? IQ does make sense- but it doesn't make sense to trade BOTH IQ and Rose- who is going to be our back up PG?

I think you're probably going with a package of Obi, IQ, Fournier and draft picks. what comes back?

That is it. Thas is the question you start with. The question of who goes out comes afterwards.

The Knicks most need a player at the SG/SF position who can create his own shot from the perimeter and be a reliable 3 point bomber without being a liability on defense and without being turnover-prone. An All-Star, in other words. Such guys only become available when their current team has a logjam at their position or if they fall out with their existing team. Until one becomes available (like DM was), talking about who should be traded is a futile exercise, most appropriate for journalists trying to sell papers.

RJ was supposed to be this player for us. But whenever he tried to create his own shot, it ended up being a bad shot. He has moved away from that somewhat, but what does he have coming in return?

IQ is a big part of the knicks rotation. I dont see them trading him unless the return is substantial and could atleast match his role in the team.

Rose is the coach's pet, seems hard to imagine the knicks trading him but between the two, Rose is the one id rather them trade.

This team is riddled with inconsistencies, from their perimeter defense to low FG percentages. Alot in the team are going through some form of a shooting slump. When will the FO take a stand regarding the seasom? I know its early but sooner or later alot will ask for the kids to play more minutes i hape the FO would rather focus on trading Fournier and Randle, go full blowm youth movement hopefully be lucky in the draft and draft a certified cornerstone player.

Fred Katz, doing the good work.

Fred, take it one level deeper and help us understand if NYKnicks players are also blocking out in the painted area at elevated rates to also help the IQ rebounding.

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The Knicks have been a bottom-10 defensive rebounding team to start the season, not what anyone should expect from a group with more brawn than finesse. Their top defensive rebounder right now is a bouncy, little guard. And their offense, which has gone in and out throughout the season, can be better off for it.

Say hello to Immanuel Quickley, your quick-twitching, loose-ball-chasing rebounding specialist who was in the news Friday after The Athletic’s Shams Charania reported that the Knicks “have shown a willingness to discuss” him in trade talks. But for now, Quickley remains — as does some of the best small-man rebounding in the league. Heading into Friday night’s match against the Golden State Warriors, Quickley was tied with Julius Randle for first on the Knicks in defensive boards per 36 minutes and defensive rebound rate.

Better than Mitchell Robinson. Better than Jericho Sims and Isaiah Hartenstein. Better than them all.

His 7.0 rebounds per 36 minutes are second-best among all non-big men in the NBA. Only the 6-foot-7 Luka Dončić averages more.

“I try to go get it, and it helps us start the break faster,” Quickley said. “(It) helps me be able to help teammates get easy buckets.”

It’s working.

The Knicks are seeing a similar payoff to what the Thunder did. New York is averaging an elite 1.22 points per possession on plays immediately following Quickley’s defensive rebounds, according to information tracked by Second Spectrum. For perspective, no offense in NBA history has averaged 1.22 points per possession for a season.

I'll trade RJ Barrett before IQ

Back in 2019, My draft pick was D. Hunter but imagine if they drafted D. Garland instead. How different would this team be today?
I would imagine they still draft O. Topping the following year but instead of IQ, they maybe go with drafting D. Bane in the later rounds, eliminating the need to sign E. Fournier (who I actually like) that following Summer.

anyway....

Swishfm3 wrote:I'll trade RJ Barrett before IQ

Back in 2019, My draft pick was D. Hunter but imagine if they drafted D. Garland instead. How different would this team be today?
I would imagine they still draft O. Topping the following year but instead of IQ, they maybe go with drafting D. Bane in the later rounds, eliminating the need to sign E. Fournier (who I actually like) that following Summer.

anyway....

You lost me at liking EF. EF makes me not like Scott Perry.

EwingsGlass wrote:

Swishfm3 wrote:I'll trade RJ Barrett before IQ

Back in 2019, My draft pick was D. Hunter but imagine if they drafted D. Garland instead. How different would this team be today?
I would imagine they still draft O. Topping the following year but instead of IQ, they maybe go with drafting D. Bane in the later rounds, eliminating the need to sign E. Fournier (who I actually like) that following Summer.

anyway....

You lost me at liking EF. EF makes me not like Scott Perry.

Fourniers (Allan Houston) scoring skills belong on teams like the Heats or 76ers where Embiid draws double team, or Butler draw double team to kick-out to open perimeter scorer (EF).

Randle either shoot or commit a turnover when drawing a double team.
Randle lack of effort on the defensive end are Randle being to focus on rebounding position rather than defending opponents.

The Knicks young-core players MitchRob, Toppin, and Quickley's performance showed they are future keepers throughout their rookie contract.

I too, would trade RJ Barrett before combo-guard Quickley creativeness on both sides of the court.
When Quickley grabs a defensive rebound, he looks to score in the next 3 to 4 seconds by throwing lob passes to Toppin, and now Cam Reddish.
Four seasons of Randle and Barrett grabbing a defensive rebound and dribble the ball down court.

Brunson & Randle & Barrett's playing time have to decrease to 24 to 28 minutes each till midseason.
There's no chemistry among the Knicks starter trio in the 16 games.
The Knicks do have nice team chemistry from D.Rose Quickley and Toppin !!!

Can't trade IQ. He is too important to the team.