Knicks · Rudy Gobert Trade (page 1)
* Thibs refuses to play anything other than his way. I think the development of Obi speaks volumes. Obi played center in college and has slowly morphed into a wing. Maybe that was always his path to being a NBA player, but there are plenty of small ball centers who have the similar physical tools as Obi. Surprisingly, Obi has shared 70 of 540 minutes this season with Randle this season at the front end. With Robinson out and a big hole at center, the answer has been more Sims and Hart.
* So I think it's pretty clear that Thibs will only play centers in drop coverage who can protect the paint. I guess it's clear where this is going.Gobert has his flaws but in terms of what Thibs is looking for in a center, he's the perfect fit.
* Minnesota really have their backs to the wall on this one. Whatever they were hoping to accomplish with the Gobert trade hasn't worked ou. theringer.com had a long article on Anthony Edwards a week ago and the gist was basically it took him 10 games to register an assist to Gobert and his splits with Gobert have been terrible.
* I don't think Gobert's value can get much lower than it is, and I also think it's more of a question of fit. I think all those traded draft picks are really go it to hurt the franchise when they continue to flounder and start pushing against the luxury tax. At some point you have to cut bait.
* The Knicks have a surplus of draft picks but I think their value, because of lottery protections, are actually pretty low. That is, they are unlikely to help the current core their ceiling.
* The deal I propose is:
Knicks trade
Rose
Fournier
Hartenstein
Dallas pick and Detroit pick
Minnesota trades:
Rudy Gobert
Minnesota is out of the 23, 25 drafts. The Dallas pick is likely to convey this season and Detroit in 2025, when the protections fall off. Hartenstein is an OK fit as he at least won't clog up the paint. Rose will give Minnesota some salary cap relief and at least they won't be forced into trading D-Lo immediately. Fournier can spread the floor on Minnesota.
Knicks get Robinson and Gobert so 48 solid minutes of rim protection. Both can reliably pick up the slack if the other is injury. It's fricking bonkers to have 55 million committed to the center position in this day and age, but with the personnel the Knicks have and looking around at which players available, and taking into account Thibs style of play and the unlikely possibility that Thibs/ Rose go anywhere soon, I think this might be the best move to make.
Knixkik wrote:The timing on this is strange because suddenly Minnesota is winning games. They wouldn’t do this, nor would the Knicks. Knicks could always trade for Poeltl and get something similar accomplished. Gobert isn’t that good. But either way neither team would be interested.
Minnesota 7-3 without Gobert and 21-23 with him. They beat GSW without him last night.
KAT has not played in two months.
I doubt after 50 games they give up on this so fast.
He will make $41 million next yr, $43 million and $46 million after that. NO F'IN way do we trade for this . Plus give up 2 #1 draft picks.
So Minny trades essentially 6 drafts to resell gobert for 1/3 of their cost? And on the Knicks side y?? U have mitch Robinson hartenstein has improved and 3 draft picks. Minnesota traded Walker Kessler in that deal for gobert and he’s coming on very strong( although Minny will continue to pay for years)
I agree with both of you. As Jon Snow says "A fair trade leaves both sides unhappy."
In terms of Gobert's cost- it's not in a vacuum. Hart and Fournier are on the books for 27 million next season as is. The cost is high in years 3 and 4 but hopefully by that time RJ Grimes and IQ are peaking. It's essentially locking in a Brunson IQ Grimes RJ Randle Robinson Gobert core for the next four years.
In terms of what Minnesota gave up- swaps aren't picks. Who knows if they ever convert or what their average value is. The Dallas and Pistons picks should be relatively the same value as the traded 23, 25 picks.
Kessler is really good. I'm sure Minnesota would be happy to undo the trade and get Kessler pack. Not really here not there though.
gradyandrew wrote:He will make $41 million next yr, $43 million and $46 million after that. NO F'IN way do we trade for this . Plus give up 2 #1 draft picks.
So Minny trades essentially 6 drafts to resell gobert for 1/3 of their cost? And on the Knicks side y?? U have mitch Robinson hartenstein has improved and 3 draft picks. Minnesota traded Walker Kessler in that deal for gobert and he’s coming on very strong( although Minny will continue to pay for years)
I agree with both of you. As Jon Snow says "A fair trade leaves both sides unhappy."In terms of Gobert's cost- it's not in a vacuum. Hart and Fournier are on the books for 27 million next season as is. The cost is high in years 3 and 4 but hopefully by that time RJ Grimes and IQ are peaking. It's essentially locking in a Brunson IQ Grimes RJ Randle Robinson Gobert core for the next four years.
In terms of what Minnesota gave up- swaps aren't picks. Who knows if they ever convert or what their average value is. The Dallas and Pistons picks should be relatively the same value as the traded 23, 25 picks.
Kessler is really good. I'm sure Minnesota would be happy to undo the trade and get Kessler pack. Not really here not there though.
That team will never win a championship and fans will catch it.
BRIGGS wrote:gradyandrew wrote:He will make $41 million next yr, $43 million and $46 million after that. NO F'IN way do we trade for this . Plus give up 2 #1 draft picks.
So Minny trades essentially 6 drafts to resell gobert for 1/3 of their cost? And on the Knicks side y?? U have mitch Robinson hartenstein has improved and 3 draft picks. Minnesota traded Walker Kessler in that deal for gobert and he’s coming on very strong( although Minny will continue to pay for years)
I agree with both of you. As Jon Snow says "A fair trade leaves both sides unhappy."In terms of Gobert's cost- it's not in a vacuum. Hart and Fournier are on the books for 27 million next season as is. The cost is high in years 3 and 4 but hopefully by that time RJ Grimes and IQ are peaking. It's essentially locking in a Brunson IQ Grimes RJ Randle Robinson Gobert core for the next four years.
In terms of what Minnesota gave up- swaps aren't picks. Who knows if they ever convert or what their average value is. The Dallas and Pistons picks should be relatively the same value as the traded 23, 25 picks.
Kessler is really good. I'm sure Minnesota would be happy to undo the trade and get Kessler pack. Not really here not there though.That team will never win a championship and fans will catch it.
That team is the worst in last 20 years. We are second worse.
Big prediction you got there.
New ownership, new GM 50 games in. I would not guess they win a chip this year either. But relevance is the first objective.
We 50 years since our last chip this spring. That like "Never".
gradyandrew wrote:Knixkik wrote:The timing on this is strange because suddenly Minnesota is winning games. They wouldn’t do this, nor would the Knicks. Knicks could always trade for Poeltl and get something similar accomplished. Gobert isn’t that good. But either way neither team would be interested.Minnesota 7-3 without Gobert and 21-23 with him. They beat GSW without him last night.
Why would they completely change course on a 10 game sample size? They invested too much for that. Knicks would never even trade 1 pick for Gobert, and twolves can’t afford to sell low. They are stuck with him.
The twolves deal was the most ridiculous trade I can remember from the moment it was made. It was undeniably a bad deal without any type of hindsight. They hired the Denver president and paid him big just to make that ridiculous trade. It was just reckless.
Knixkik wrote:gradyandrew wrote:Knixkik wrote:The timing on this is strange because suddenly Minnesota is winning games. They wouldn’t do this, nor would the Knicks. Knicks could always trade for Poeltl and get something similar accomplished. Gobert isn’t that good. But either way neither team would be interested.Minnesota 7-3 without Gobert and 21-23 with him. They beat GSW without him last night.
Why would they completely change course on a 10 game sample size? They invested too much for that. Knicks would never even trade 1 pick for Gobert, and twolves can’t afford to sell low. They are stuck with him.
The twolves deal was the most ridiculous trade I can remember from the moment it was made. It was undeniably a bad deal without any type of hindsight. They hired the Denver president and paid him big just to make that ridiculous trade. It was just reckless.
Will go down as a bad trade. I think Walker Kessler will give u close--and soon just as good or better than what Gobert brings soon. The multi pick trade has to be a superstar and youre set otherwise or else its an albatross. We have Grimes IQ and Robinson through the draft. We might have 2-3 picks in rd 1 in what looks like a great draft. The draft picks are prob worth more in a trade near the draft anyway.
BRIGGS wrote:Knixkik wrote:gradyandrew wrote:Knixkik wrote:The timing on this is strange because suddenly Minnesota is winning games. They wouldn’t do this, nor would the Knicks. Knicks could always trade for Poeltl and get something similar accomplished. Gobert isn’t that good. But either way neither team would be interested.Minnesota 7-3 without Gobert and 21-23 with him. They beat GSW without him last night.
Why would they completely change course on a 10 game sample size? They invested too much for that. Knicks would never even trade 1 pick for Gobert, and twolves can’t afford to sell low. They are stuck with him.
The twolves deal was the most ridiculous trade I can remember from the moment it was made. It was undeniably a bad deal without any type of hindsight. They hired the Denver president and paid him big just to make that ridiculous trade. It was just reckless.
Will go down as a bad trade. I think Walker Kessler will give u close--and soon just as good or better than what Gobert brings soon. The multi pick trade has to be a superstar and youre set otherwise or else its an albatross. We have Grimes IQ and Robinson through the draft. We might have 2-3 picks in rd 1 in what looks like a great draft. The draft picks are prob worth more in a trade near the draft anyway.
It was honestly a great trade for ainge. He did it again. Fleeced a team. He honestly could have kept Mitchell and did a retool around him just based on that deal. But obviously things were bad with Mitchell at the time and no turning back.
BRIGGS wrote:Knixkik wrote:gradyandrew wrote:Knixkik wrote:The timing on this is strange because suddenly Minnesota is winning games. They wouldn’t do this, nor would the Knicks. Knicks could always trade for Poeltl and get something similar accomplished. Gobert isn’t that good. But either way neither team would be interested.Minnesota 7-3 without Gobert and 21-23 with him. They beat GSW without him last night.
Why would they completely change course on a 10 game sample size? They invested too much for that. Knicks would never even trade 1 pick for Gobert, and twolves can’t afford to sell low. They are stuck with him.
The twolves deal was the most ridiculous trade I can remember from the moment it was made. It was undeniably a bad deal without any type of hindsight. They hired the Denver president and paid him big just to make that ridiculous trade. It was just reckless.
Will go down as a bad trade. I think Walker Kessler will give u close--and soon just as good or better than what Gobert brings soon. The multi pick trade has to be a superstar and youre set otherwise or else its an albatross. We have Grimes IQ and Robinson through the draft. We might have 2-3 picks in rd 1 in what looks like a great draft. The draft picks are prob worth more in a trade near the draft anyway.
Kessler,Lauri and Sexton all doing very well, and then there are the picks.
You get some hindsight to see Kessler in NBA uni to make determination. I do recall you mention him last year.
You mention often. Still, they did well. I guess you did too.
Takes 5 years to really determine who did well or not. Looks win-win thus far.
Utah is settling to where it should be and the rebuild will take some time to figure out.
Cav's window is sooner but have to give it two seasons to see where they at. Mobley ascension will be the x-factor.
Im fine with not doing that trade for DM. Perhaps if we don't do Brunson deal i'd feel otherwise.