Knicks · Knicks and the upcoming trade market... (page 5)

Knixkik wrote:

martin wrote:😉

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You know this is what the Knicks are waiting on. They want to build around Brunson, Mitchell and Randle as a big 3 with Hart, Robinson, DDV etc as a supporting cast and see how close they are. It would likely be Barrett and either Quickley signed and traded or Grimes, plus all of the picks required. They should be able to still fill the roster from there.

Don't think you can package a sign and trade guy and there are rules about signing a restricted FA the trading him (don't think you can do it for a year-i could be wrong about time but I know there are rules)

The only package that works without a time restriction featuring the guys you suggested are Grimes or IQ and Barrett by the deadline.

IMO, I'm only trading Barrett for an upgraded young big wing or a superstar (Booker, Edwards, maybe Ingram, Bane)

https://www.forbes.com/sites/rahathuq/2023/12/14/houston-rockets-forward-tari-eason-rounding-into-form-after-injury/ haven't mentioned Tari Eason recently

A trade that Detroit might consider is Quickley for Jaden Ivey. He's still a work in progress, but we would be getting a potential future star, who might need a change of scenery. Then trade Grimes for Bogdonavich.

Detroit would be getting a young starting quality guard at pg and SG. Who is further along than Ivey. They would also get a 3 and D wing who looks like he would thrive in an uptempo offense.

NY would get younger and older at the same time. It would also clear up the logjam at guard. Get us the backup PF we need in Bogs. As Brunson gets older, Ivey would hopefully be stepping up his game.

I would then trade either RJ or Randle with picks and players, in a deal for a star who will improve ball movement, and clutch play in crunch time.

GustavBahler wrote:A trade that Detroit might consider is Quickley for Jaden Ivey. He's still a work in progress, but we would be getting a potential future star, who might need a change of scenery. Then trade Grimes for Bogdonavich.

Detroit would be getting a young starting quality guard at pg and SG. Who is further along than Ivey. They would also get a 3 and D wing who looks like he would thrive in an uptempo offense.

NY would get younger and older at the same time. It would also clear up the logjam at guard. Get us the backup PF we need in Bogs. As Brunson gets older, Ivey would hopefully be stepping up his game.

I would then trade either RJ or Randle with picks and players, in a deal for a star who will improve ball movement, and clutch play in crunch time.

Guy I am really interested in on Detroit is Isiah Stewart. I really loved Ivey in the draft and Bogs is a really good. If you could get either Bogs or Jaden and Stewart, for a reasonable price (not IQ AND Grimes), should be a deal that should be considered.

joec32033 wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:A trade that Detroit might consider is Quickley for Jaden Ivey. He's still a work in progress, but we would be getting a potential future star, who might need a change of scenery. Then trade Grimes for Bogdonavich.

Detroit would be getting a young starting quality guard at pg and SG. Who is further along than Ivey. They would also get a 3 and D wing who looks like he would thrive in an uptempo offense.

NY would get younger and older at the same time. It would also clear up the logjam at guard. Get us the backup PF we need in Bogs. As Brunson gets older, Ivey would hopefully be stepping up his game.

I would then trade either RJ or Randle with picks and players, in a deal for a star who will improve ball movement, and clutch play in crunch time.

Guy I am really interested in on Detroit is Isiah Stewart. I really loved Ivey in the draft and Bogs is a really good. If you could get either Bogs or Jaden and Stewart, for a reasonable price (not IQ AND Grimes), should be a deal that should be considered.

Not all that familiar with his game. Will pay more attention next time.

I hope the FO makes a run at Ivey, I think they would listen to an IQ/Ivey swap. Sixth man of the year runner-up. 20 ppg starter at 2 postions. That should get their attention. Both players look like they could use a change of scenery.

My hope is we still have a shot at OG by the summer despite the lawsuit. With Brunson and Randle being this good, they could really use his skill set. I’d rather deal Barrett than quickley. Maybe Barrett, grimes and pick for OG. Toronto doesn’t want to deal with us but Sam Rose is now his agent and maybe the threat of signing outright with Indiana, San Antonio or Detroit is enough. I still go back and forth, but Barrett just isn’t a great fit with Randle, and Randle is playing so well and is the less tradable player anyways. Swapping Barrett and grimes with OG in the rotation makes sense if we can backfill that 9th man spot with either McBride or a rookie wing that we draft such as Terrence Shannon, Kevin McCullar or Reed Sheppard. All of them are 2-way players. Resigning Quickley is imperative. He’s just so valuable to this team. He’s tough to trade too because of sign and trade restrictions.

The other main option is going after Mitchell again. Barrett, grimes and lots of picks. The salaries should be close but we may have to add a minor piece or 2. They have guard concerns so they may want McBride. Again moving quickley this summer is tough. Adding Mitchell leaves us small but that’s a problem for another day. We need to add an nba ready wing in the draft, plus sign one via free agency. Royce O’Neale, Reggie Bullock, Torrey Craig and Naji Marshall are 3&D options.

A rotation of Brunson, Mitchell, O’Neale, Randle, and Mitch with Quickley, DiVincenzo, Hart and Hartenstein is small but it raises the ceiling of the team pretty significantly.

Contrary a rotation of Brunson, DDV, Anunoby, Randle, Mitch with Quickley, Hart, Hartenstein, and either deuce or a rookie wing/ guard off the bench doesn’t raise the ceiling a lot but is much more balanced being built around Brunson and Randle.

Knixkik wrote:My hope is we still have a shot at OG by the summer despite the lawsuit. With Brunson and Randle being this good, they could really use his skill set. I’d rather deal Barrett than quickley. Maybe Barrett, grimes and pick for OG. Toronto doesn’t want to deal with us but Sam Rose is now his agent and maybe the threat of signing outright with Indiana, San Antonio or Detroit is enough. I still go back and forth, but Barrett just isn’t a great fit with Randle, and Randle is playing so well and is the less tradable player anyways. Swapping Barrett and grimes with OG in the rotation makes sense if we can backfill that 9th man spot with either McBride or a rookie wing that we draft such as Terrence Shannon, Kevin McCullar or Reed Sheppard. All of them are 2-way players. Resigning Quickley is imperative. He’s just so valuable to this team. He’s tough to trade too because of sign and trade restrictions.

The other main option is going after Mitchell again. Barrett, grimes and lots of picks. The salaries should be close but we may have to add a minor piece or 2. They have guard concerns so they may want McBride. Again moving quickley this summer is tough. Adding Mitchell leaves us small but that’s a problem for another day. We need to add an nba ready wing in the draft, plus sign one via free agency. Royce O’Neale, Reggie Bullock, Torrey Craig and Naji Marshall are 3&D options.

A rotation of Brunson, Mitchell, O’Neale, Randle, and Mitch with Quickley, DiVincenzo, Hart and Hartenstein is small but it raises the ceiling of the team pretty significantly.

Contrary a rotation of Brunson, DDV, Anunoby, Randle, Mitch with Quickley, Hart, Hartenstein, and either deuce or a rookie wing/ guard off the bench doesn’t raise the ceiling a lot but is much more balanced being built around Brunson and Randle.

Why are we giving up Barret, Grimes AND a pick for OG? Shouldn't we be getting a pick instead?

Knixkik wrote:My hope is we still have a shot at OG by the summer despite the lawsuit. With Brunson and Randle being this good, they could really use his skill set. I’d rather deal Barrett than quickley. Maybe Barrett, grimes and pick for OG. Toronto doesn’t want to deal with us but Sam Rose is now his agent and maybe the threat of signing outright with Indiana, San Antonio or Detroit is enough. I still go back and forth, but Barrett just isn’t a great fit with Randle, and Randle is playing so well and is the less tradable player anyways. Swapping Barrett and grimes with OG in the rotation makes sense if we can backfill that 9th man spot with either McBride or a rookie wing that we draft such as Terrence Shannon, Kevin McCullar or Reed Sheppard. All of them are 2-way players. Resigning Quickley is imperative. He’s just so valuable to this team. He’s tough to trade too because of sign and trade restrictions.

The other main option is going after Mitchell again. Barrett, grimes and lots of picks. The salaries should be close but we may have to add a minor piece or 2. They have guard concerns so they may want McBride. Again moving quickley this summer is tough. Adding Mitchell leaves us small but that’s a problem for another day. We need to add an nba ready wing in the draft, plus sign one via free agency. Royce O’Neale, Reggie Bullock, Torrey Craig and Naji Marshall are 3&D options.

A rotation of Brunson, Mitchell, O’Neale, Randle, and Mitch with Quickley, DiVincenzo, Hart and Hartenstein is small but it raises the ceiling of the team pretty significantly.

Contrary a rotation of Brunson, DDV, Anunoby, Randle, Mitch with Quickley, Hart, Hartenstein, and either deuce or a rookie wing/ guard off the bench doesn’t raise the ceiling a lot but is much more balanced being built around Brunson and Randle.

You make a strong case for OG, but I'm not so sure thats enough to put us over the top, which I believe the next big trade should do. I agree there is a case to be made for trading RJ, not Quickley or Randle. But the glut at guard, and IQ's asking price makes me believe he will be gone this season or offseason. Hope Im wrong. I proposed Jaden Ivey as a trade target. Absent that happening, I wouldnt mind a run at Derozan, if he wasnt going for a max or near max contract, after his contract expires.

As for Randle, we go through these amazing stretches, followed by wishing we had sold high. Feels like we're there again. The one team who might be open to a trade, are the Pelicans. Randle has a history there, so there is a "coming home" aspect to a possible trade. Zion is playing like he could use a change of scenery. Specifically to the team he wished had drafted him.

Scott Perry was right that sometimes the grass isnt always greener when players change teams. But I would say that its worth the risk when that player wanted to play for a specific team all along. Like Zion wanted to be a Knick.

It just might be a case of Zion needing a bigger spotlight to bring out the best in his game and conditioning. Randle has been playing great since his early ankle issues. But he's almost 30, playing great but lost a step.

The one team that might be willing to give the Knicks fair value in a trade, has a young player with a superstar ceiling who would likely welcome a trade. Show the league what he can do under the biggest spotlight.

Zions issues are not the spot light.
No "CAA" thing to wish upon?
Change of scenery is often over used. When its effective is when a player leaves a coach an system that does not enhance that players skill set or there are players that chemistry won't work for many reasons.
Being unmotivated shows a lack of professionalism regardless. He never said he wanted to be a knick, just said MSG was awesome. Maybe the notion that within 5 blocks anywhere around the garden is a cornucopia of culinary delights many are open 24/7?
There is an old saying "you always take the weather with you where ever you go". That means change of location does not change the baggage you carry. More domestic instances are "buying a new house will help our marriage", or "lets have another baby, it will make us happy again". So what is it about Zion that Gustav knows that the rest of the world does not?

Ivey is starting for Detroit again. Their season is lost and giving up on a young talent after a season and a third would be foolish for them. What does Gustav know about his game and career that insinuates they are throwing in the towel on him? And if so why should we go in on him if we are more "win now"? Im not against the move Btw. I suggested a spitball a few weeks ago when they benched him for Sasser and suggested IQ as the likely trade chip, no doubt with a protected pick, perhaps theirs?

Bogdonowhatever is playing and putting up numbers but im curious where he would play? at 34-35 and a free agent I don't gather his cost is much but there will be bidders for him. He could just get bought out and pick up the rest of the money with new team if he is in fact on an expiring?

In season big trades are rare, and multiple ones even more so. I doubt we move IQ, RJ and Grimes and reconstitute the roster mid year. With Mitch out there are many issues with trades. I was thinking prior to him getting hurt the path to elite contention might not include Mitch and thus his ability and contract was a huge chip.

Minny is doing very well so the KAT thing is a non subject this year. they face tax issues going forward so its possible this summer. He has settled in nice with that team. Maturity and health are there.

DM? Love the starphuch of it but next to JB? Not sure about that.
Funny, we all look back at "Frazier and Monroe" and think it was heaven sent. Fact is there were issues. Clyde sacrificed and Earl had knee issues. Earl exploded on the league and Baltimore in 1971 made the finals. Earl could have jumped to the ABA had he played out his season. He held out and got traded to Knicks who paid him well enough. He also had a bad knee. My point was that team made the finals in 72' losing to the incredible Lakers that year. Making the finals was not because Earl and Clyde were amazing as a tandem. Earl's longevity was surprising and when was better post Clyde era as a high volume player on a not so good Knicks team. What does DM have to do with that? Not much but its been written about. DM and Jb are two wonderful talents. The defense might suffer and too much iso already?
Dare I say "trade JB"? But..........
Would anyone trade JB for DM even straight up? Its a cold decision to say yes.

Knicks aren't trading JB or Randle.

gradyandrew wrote:Knicks aren't trading JB or Randle.

Fan and media "spitballing" - or hating - aside, the only reason they would be traded is a tear down. Not happening soon.

gradyandrew wrote:Knicks aren't trading JB or Randle.

We have some posters that like to play pretend GM and discuss.
But.......
Lets assume Clev calls up, money aside, and does DM for JB straight up. Do you do it?
I know he "Family" but you get to chose one vs. the other. No other trades on the table at the moment.
My heart says no. But.....
Logic says do it.

unload RJ/Quick/Grimes/boatload of picks and get back Donovan and OG.

Brunson - Mitchell - OG - Randle - Mitch
DDV - Deuce - Josh Hart - Isiah Hart

DLeethal wrote:unload RJ/Quick/Grimes/boatload of picks and get back Donovan and OG.

Brunson - Mitchell - OG - Randle - Mitch
DDV - Deuce - Josh Hart - Isiah Hart

Leon, make it so!!!

DLeethal wrote:unload RJ/Quick/Grimes/boatload of picks and get back Donovan and OG.

Brunson - Mitchell - OG - Randle - Mitch
DDV - Deuce - Josh Hart - Isiah Hart

pretty much where i'm at.

RJ + a pick or two for OG

Grimes, IQ + 2-3 picks for DM.

But I think there's a 3 way to be had for DM with CLE getting back Lavine & IQ and CHI getting back Grimes + multiple picks.

nycericanguy wrote:

DLeethal wrote:unload RJ/Quick/Grimes/boatload of picks and get back Donovan and OG.

Brunson - Mitchell - OG - Randle - Mitch
DDV - Deuce - Josh Hart - Isiah Hart

pretty much where i'm at.

RJ + a pick or two for OG

Grimes, IQ + 2-3 picks for DM.

But I think there's a 3 way to be had for DM with CLE getting back Lavine & IQ and CHI getting back Grimes + multiple picks.

+1

and im only making that trade for OG if DM is coming. Because I think with a Brunson/DM backcourt you need that big, elite wing defender.

I wouldn't trade for OG alone.

nycericanguy wrote:and im only making that trade for OG if DM is coming. Because I think with a Brunson/DM backcourt you need that big, elite wing defender.

I wouldn't trade for OG alone.

Why not?

martin wrote:

nycericanguy wrote:and im only making that trade for OG if DM is coming. Because I think with a Brunson/DM backcourt you need that big, elite wing defender.

I wouldn't trade for OG alone.

Why not?

he's a role player not a game changer by himself

As currently constructed we need RJ's scoring and ability to draw fouls more than another 3 & D guy.

nycericanguy wrote:

martin wrote:

nycericanguy wrote:and im only making that trade for OG if DM is coming. Because I think with a Brunson/DM backcourt you need that big, elite wing defender.

I wouldn't trade for OG alone.

Why not?

he's a role player not a game changer by himself

As currently constructed we need RJ's scoring and ability to draw fouls more than another 3 & D guy.

My thought process - and hope - was that without someone like RJ in rotation, his usage and shots would go to Grimes, IQ, Hart, DDV.

I'm still a Grimes proponent and just think the lack of touches is in his head. He has got to do better but think he is boxed in some by RJ and the rest of the minutes rotation. Give him a bigger role and I think we would see a lot better version of him.

Maybe not the Coby White evolution that started with Zach LaVine sitting, but a better cross of Michael Cooper and Byron Scott with more drive ability.

martin wrote:

nycericanguy wrote:

martin wrote:

nycericanguy wrote:and im only making that trade for OG if DM is coming. Because I think with a Brunson/DM backcourt you need that big, elite wing defender.

I wouldn't trade for OG alone.

Why not?

he's a role player not a game changer by himself

As currently constructed we need RJ's scoring and ability to draw fouls more than another 3 & D guy.

My thought process - and hope - was that without someone like RJ in rotation, his usage and shots would go to Grimes, IQ, Hart, DDV.

I'm still a Grimes proponent and just think the lack of touches is in his head. He has got to do better but think he is boxed in some by RJ and the rest of the minutes rotation. Give him a bigger role and I think we would see a lot better version of him.

Maybe not the Coby White evolution that started with Zach LaVine sitting, but a better cross of Michael Cooper and Byron Scott with more drive ability.

no matter how you slice it there aren't enough minutes for everyone unless we make a 2 or 3 for 1 trade.

RJ, Grimes, IQ, DDV and JHart are all at or near career lows in mpg.

Swapping RJ for OG, who is used to playing 35mpg, doesn't resolve any of that.

I agree about Grimes, I think he can be as good as OG, but these guys are going to have a hard time flourishing as currently constructed. there's just no way to keep all 5 guys happy and fed.