Knicks · Its blurry...but we can see the vision (page 9)

VDesai wrote:Once he gets low he's usually taking the shot. In all honesty you'd like to see it more, especially as teams give him mismatches. OKC defended him with Jalen Williams and we couldn't really exploit it. He has such great touch it seems like never misses.

He seems way better passing out of the high post than low post

I think a lot of us thought KAT was a finesse guy but he's just not. He's a power guy with incredible skill.

I do believe in this team's talent and roster construction and it's coach. We need a better bench and depth but some of those answers may come from internal growth. I think the squad merits patience.

East is also a wild show. I imagine some team seed (Knicks again?) is going to have to deal with a "We just needed to get healthy" 76rs team. Then you have Giannis, a who knows Cle team that never losses and Orlando with a defense like Larry Brown's Pistons

Gotta earn it. Unless you are the Pacers who got wildly lucky and had no right being in the conference finals.

fishmike wrote:I think going into the season most thought we were at least close to be the 2nd best team in the East and an ECF finals team.

I do believe in this team's talent and roster construction and it's coach. We need a better bench and depth but some of those answers may come from internal growth. I think the squad merits patience.

East is also a wild show. I imagine some team seed (Knicks again?) is going to have to deal with a "We just needed to get healthy" 76rs team. Then you have Giannis, a who knows Cle team that never losses and Orlando with a defense like Larry Brown's Pistons

Gotta earn it. Unless you are the Pacers who got wildly lucky and had no right being in the conference finals.

Not for nothing but Dallas from last year is in the same position as the Knicks this year. They went 50-32 and don't think anyone would have considered them an elite team during the regular season. A few tweaks and an optimal run to the finals.

martin wrote:

fishmike wrote:I think going into the season most thought we were at least close to be the 2nd best team in the East and an ECF finals team.

I do believe in this team's talent and roster construction and it's coach. We need a better bench and depth but some of those answers may come from internal growth. I think the squad merits patience.

East is also a wild show. I imagine some team seed (Knicks again?) is going to have to deal with a "We just needed to get healthy" 76rs team. Then you have Giannis, a who knows Cle team that never losses and Orlando with a defense like Larry Brown's Pistons

Gotta earn it. Unless you are the Pacers who got wildly lucky and had no right being in the conference finals.

Not for nothing but Dallas from last year is in the same position as the Knicks this year. They went 50-32 and don't think anyone would have considered them an elite team during the regular season. A few tweaks and an optimal run to the finals.

I think another wing with some bulk to take 15-20 off the bench would do wonders for the team. Are OG/Mikal not being as aggressive for energy preservation? Are they being asked to gamble less? Hard to know.

VDesai wrote:

martin wrote:

fishmike wrote:I think going into the season most thought we were at least close to be the 2nd best team in the East and an ECF finals team.

I do believe in this team's talent and roster construction and it's coach. We need a better bench and depth but some of those answers may come from internal growth. I think the squad merits patience.

East is also a wild show. I imagine some team seed (Knicks again?) is going to have to deal with a "We just needed to get healthy" 76rs team. Then you have Giannis, a who knows Cle team that never losses and Orlando with a defense like Larry Brown's Pistons

Gotta earn it. Unless you are the Pacers who got wildly lucky and had no right being in the conference finals.

Not for nothing but Dallas from last year is in the same position as the Knicks this year. They went 50-32 and don't think anyone would have considered them an elite team during the regular season. A few tweaks and an optimal run to the finals.

I think another wing with some bulk to take 15-20 off the bench would do wonders for the team. Are OG/Mikal not being as aggressive for energy preservation? Are they being asked to gamble less? Hard to know.

Feel like Precious could help out a lot once he gets his groove going on, and if he and KAT can do some minutes together too or whether or not Precious can be a small ball C.

Mitch getting back and then rounding back into shape will be the domino that sets everything forward IMHO

If Knicks think Huk and Mitch could be OK for post trade deadline, Sims will be gone and then perhaps TJ Warren and Shamet can figure out who is hot and can make a shot when Mikal/OG sit.

We shall see.

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VDesai wrote:A more mobile Mitch makes sense. Faster pace. Probably needs to cover more ground. I think you wanna see him as a lob/dunk threat like he used to be too.

He played 59 games 2 years ago, 31 last year and he's missed the first 42 here. I love Mitch but who knows what we get if anything. He may be entering expiring contract zone

fishmike wrote:

VDesai wrote:A more mobile Mitch makes sense. Faster pace. Probably needs to cover more ground. I think you wanna see him as a lob/dunk threat like he used to be too.

yeah that's nice but lets be realistic... ANY Mitch is nice. He's missed so much time

He played 59 games 2 years ago, 31 last year and he's missed the first 42 here. I love Mitch but who knows what we get if anything. He may be entering expiring contract zone

Who knows how many games he stays healthy, but what we're asking for is around 20 mpg, where he doesn't have to worry about foul trouble and can focus on wreaking havoc on D and the boards. I'm hopeful he can help, as I'm starting to feel like we're not gonna be able to flip him for adequate value.

Two of the top players Tom Thibodeau ever coached – and the two players probably most responsible for his NBA championship – believe he’s being “stubborn” with his minutes distribution and it’s going to cost the Knicks in the playoffs.

“At some point, you got staff, you got assistants, you got a GM, you got presidents (who should tell Thibodeau to stop playing the starters so much),” Kevin Garnett said on his podcast, “Ticket & The Truth,” co-hosted by Paul Pierce.

“And, it’s a data league, bro. Data is probably telling you, ‘Hey, the starting 5 is playing way more minutes than the average starting 5 in the league. So I’m sure he’s heard this. It goes back to what Paul just said – (Thibodeau) is so stuck in his ways and he knows how to win one way, man.”

fishmike wrote:I think going into the season most thought we were at least close to be the 2nd best team in the East and an ECF finals team.

I do believe in this team's talent and roster construction and it's coach. We need a better bench and depth but some of those answers may come from internal growth. I think the squad merits patience.

East is also a wild show. I imagine some team seed (Knicks again?) is going to have to deal with a "We just needed to get healthy" 76rs team. Then you have Giannis, a who knows Cle team that never losses and Orlando with a defense like Larry Brown's Pistons

Gotta earn it. Unless you are the Pacers who got wildly lucky and had no right being in the conference finals.

Biggest thing for me is that you can’t reasonably judge the current team until we have a solid bench.
Sure we can always improve the starting rotation but we can’t really say they are not enough until we have a competent bench that allows the starters to play reasonable minutes.

martin wrote:Big Mitch, weighing in. Super light?

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Many sleeping on MR.
Would ask those who think MR is not important the question, What happened to “we want to be a great defensive team?” We now are saying we want a stretch 5 that does not rim protect?

Why are we double teaming players that don’t warrant it? At the cost of… open threes!
Thibs can’t be this stupid, can he?

Payne on fire in the first half and gets 4 minutes 2nd half.
Thibs can’t be this stupid, can he?

Crashing boards then rotating out to 3pt line, 40+ minutes a night, players exhausted.
Mikal getting no or little rest.

Thibs can’t be this stupid, can he?

Thibs CAN’T maximize our talent. They won’t fire him now but after another poor injury riddled post season, then? Please.

CanItGetAnyWorse wrote:Why are we still protecting the paint at the cost of open 3’s, GAME AFTER GAME?
Thibs can’t be this stupid, can he?

Why are we double teaming players that don’t warrant it? At the cost of… open threes!
Thibs can’t be this stupid, can he?

Payne on fire in the first half and gets 4 minutes 2nd half.
Thibs can’t be this stupid, can he?

Crashing boards then rotating out to 3pt line, 40+ minutes a night, players exhausted.
Mikal getting no or little rest.

Thibs can’t be this stupid, can he?

Thibs CAN’T maximize our talent. They won’t fire him now but after another poor injury riddled post season, then? Please.

Do feel Thibs is stubborn. Feel the more the press complains about minutes, the more he pushes to do the opposite.

Last nights game is an example of a game that he had the opportunity to play some of the youngsters or just even Payne and Deuce more to give starters more rest. Two, who were the only ones on the plus side on +/-.

However, be careful of the grass is always greener. Thibs has kept us competitive since being here.
We are too 5 in the NBA. 3 in an East with a red hot Cavs team and the defending champions.
Better record than last year with a bench that needs to be ant the level of the expectations. Agree expectations are high and he can do things better but let’s keep perspective.

These two havent played the consistent roles they are supposed to in the vision.

VDesai wrote:The vision is being clouded by the Jekyl and Hyde play of OG and Mikal. Wingstop gets all the minutes, but they don't defend all game, cant score off the dribble and run hot and cold on open shooting.

These two havent played the consistent roles they are supposed to in the vision.

How do we trade one of them? Can we do a 1 for 2? I feel like this team is the team they are all in on.

jaydh wrote:Probably could have gotten Kessler + Clarkson for the 5 picks used on Bridges. Robinson will fix things, but there will be nothing like having iHart and Robinson to rotate. They were our defense. Kessler/Robinson rotation could have been good.

Kessler + Sexton would have been a conversation.

Still think Bridges is the real deal though.

I’m kind of heart-throbbing on Huk. No reason to rush the kiddo, but his length and agility remind me of healthy Mitch. They gotta coach him up a bit, but I think we have one in the cylinder…

franco12 wrote:

VDesai wrote:The vision is being clouded by the Jekyl and Hyde play of OG and Mikal. Wingstop gets all the minutes, but they don't defend all game, cant score off the dribble and run hot and cold on open shooting.

These two havent played the consistent roles they are supposed to in the vision.

How do we trade one of them? Can we do a 1 for 2? I feel like this team is the team they are all in on.