Knicks · Stephen A Smith: Orlando inquires about Amare and Chandler (page 3)

Postups: As Magic plot to keep Howard, other scenarios blossom

The only other team capable of making a credible postseason offer to get Howard to one of the markets on his list would be the Knicks, who could offer Amare Stoudemire and Tyson Chandler. (Of course, this would only work if the struggling Knicks made it past the trade deadline with their key pieces intact.) While such a proposal from the Knicks would provide more star power, Stoudemire's uninsurable knees could be a deal-killer. Example from the recent past: At one point, an Eastern Conference team had a deal in place to acquire Stoudemire from the Suns for a top-five pick, and the trade was rejected by the team's medical staff because Stoudemire "might not be playing in five years," an official from that team said. That was four years ago.

A couple of things to consider. First, the new collective bargaining agreement provides no incentive for a free agent in Howard's position to work with his team on a sign-and-trade because he can no longer get a five-year deal with max raises that way. So why would Howard work with the Magic on sign-and-trade?

One reason is obvious: If Howard is hell-bent on going to a team with no cap room -- such as the Lakers or Knicks -- a trade is the only way he's getting there. The other is more subtle, but equally important: Despite Howard's admission this week that he thought Carmelo Anthony gave him "good advice" by telling him to "do what's best for you," Howard is perhaps the most image conscious of the NBA's top stars. He saw how LeBron became a villain after abandoning Cleveland, and that was after the Cavs got assets in return via a sign-and-trade. Howard doesn't want to take on the same pariah status, and if he worked with the Magic in a scenario that got them a superstar or multiple All-Stars in return, it would remove the sting of his departure and do much less damage to his image.

The final point should be obvious to anyone who's walked inside the Amway Center. This is an opulent palace that was built for Howard, and if he leaves, someone with big enough star power needs to replace him. This can't be the House that Draft Picks and Trade Exceptions Built. It must be the House That Fill in the Blank Built. Or better yet, Fill in the Blake.

GustavBahler wrote:http://www.cbssports.com/nba/story/16944...

Postups: As Magic plot to keep Howard, other scenarios blossom

The only other team capable of making a credible postseason offer to get Howard to one of the markets on his list would be the Knicks, who could offer Amare Stoudemire and Tyson Chandler. (Of course, this would only work if the struggling Knicks made it past the trade deadline with their key pieces intact.) While such a proposal from the Knicks would provide more star power, Stoudemire's uninsurable knees could be a deal-killer. Example from the recent past: At one point, an Eastern Conference team had a deal in place to acquire Stoudemire from the Suns for a top-five pick, and the trade was rejected by the team's medical staff because Stoudemire "might not be playing in five years," an official from that team said. That was four years ago.

A couple of things to consider. First, the new collective bargaining agreement provides no incentive for a free agent in Howard's position to work with his team on a sign-and-trade because he can no longer get a five-year deal with max raises that way. So why would Howard work with the Magic on sign-and-trade?

One reason is obvious: If Howard is hell-bent on going to a team with no cap room -- such as the Lakers or Knicks -- a trade is the only way he's getting there. The other is more subtle, but equally important: Despite Howard's admission this week that he thought Carmelo Anthony gave him "good advice" by telling him to "do what's best for you," Howard is perhaps the most image conscious of the NBA's top stars. He saw how LeBron became a villain after abandoning Cleveland, and that was after the Cavs got assets in return via a sign-and-trade. Howard doesn't want to take on the same pariah status, and if he worked with the Magic in a scenario that got them a superstar or multiple All-Stars in return, it would remove the sting of his departure and do much less damage to his image.

The final point should be obvious to anyone who's walked inside the Amway Center. This is an opulent palace that was built for Howard, and if he leaves, someone with big enough star power needs to replace him. This can't be the House that Draft Picks and Trade Exceptions Built. It must be the House That Fill in the Blank Built. Or better yet, Fill in the Blake.

This might be a stupid questions but can crazy Jimmy D insure his knees for the magic? Meaning if the knees go on the Magic, Dolan can garuntee 2 yrs payment or some sort of compensation?

martin wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Nalod wrote:http://espn.go.com/espnradio/newyork/pla...

Classic vintage SAS!

Awesome.

I usually can't stand him but he has a right to this rant.

same. dude was off the hook funny

agreed.

"the orlando magic, let me preface this by saying they have categorically DENIED THIS, have contacted the knicks about amar'e stoudemire and tyson chandler."

let me preface this by saying they have categorically DENIED THIS

lol. oh stephen a.

With that said, I have to agree with him on this one. Amar'e has been off and some of it stems from stuff that's been around since he's been in the league. The guy has a very low IQ when it comes to basketball and this problem is not being fixed as far as I see. If it can't be, then you do this trade as soon as possible, as much as we love both Amar'e and Tyson. Howard and Melo are a MUCH better fit, afterall. If we are STILL swithing on screens after that...... then it's time to fire Mr. D'Antoni. He's always been all about switching, back to when he had Jared Jefferies guarding PGs b/c Nate and Duhon couldn't do it.

Trading for Howard does have its faults though.

There is noone to direct traffic on the defensive end. Howard is a great man defender and help defender but is he a defensive general like Tyson?

We would be taking back alot of dead weight. Duhon, Hedo and possibly Q? Hedo may be the only guy worth keeping. As a guy off the bench. Duhon played ok under Mike so maybe he can be a backup backup?

I got to admit after trade we wold like nice. Starting Harrelson next to Howard would be a good idea because Howard already plays next to a similar player in Anderson.

After the trade what will we look like, hypothetically?
Iman
Fields
Carmelo
Harrelson?
Howard

We still need a PG and a backup PG. Maybe Duhon fills the backup PG role. We still need a general. And I think we need to start Iman at the 2 (he's a 2) and move Fields to the backup 3 with Douglas as the backup 2.

One of my biggest issues though os leadership. Neither Dwight or Melo strikes me as a leader like Amare was last year. Who fills the leadership void?

BRIGGS wrote:I wouldnt do it if Im Orlando--I mean take one look at the Knicks standings!!

BRIGGS wrote:I wouldnt do it if Im Orlando--I mean take one look at the Knicks standings!!

They could very well succeed with Tyson-Amare.

Question is, with Dwight-Hedo, is it a better fit for us?

mrKnickShot wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:http://www.cbssports.com/nba/story/16944...

Postups: As Magic plot to keep Howard, other scenarios blossom

The only other team capable of making a credible postseason offer to get Howard to one of the markets on his list would be the Knicks, who could offer Amare Stoudemire and Tyson Chandler. (Of course, this would only work if the struggling Knicks made it past the trade deadline with their key pieces intact.) While such a proposal from the Knicks would provide more star power, Stoudemire's uninsurable knees could be a deal-killer. Example from the recent past: At one point, an Eastern Conference team had a deal in place to acquire Stoudemire from the Suns for a top-five pick, and the trade was rejected by the team's medical staff because Stoudemire "might not be playing in five years," an official from that team said. That was four years ago.

A couple of things to consider. First, the new collective bargaining agreement provides no incentive for a free agent in Howard's position to work with his team on a sign-and-trade because he can no longer get a five-year deal with max raises that way. So why would Howard work with the Magic on sign-and-trade?

One reason is obvious: If Howard is hell-bent on going to a team with no cap room -- such as the Lakers or Knicks -- a trade is the only way he's getting there. The other is more subtle, but equally important: Despite Howard's admission this week that he thought Carmelo Anthony gave him "good advice" by telling him to "do what's best for you," Howard is perhaps the most image conscious of the NBA's top stars. He saw how LeBron became a villain after abandoning Cleveland, and that was after the Cavs got assets in return via a sign-and-trade. Howard doesn't want to take on the same pariah status, and if he worked with the Magic in a scenario that got them a superstar or multiple All-Stars in return, it would remove the sting of his departure and do much less damage to his image.

The final point should be obvious to anyone who's walked inside the Amway Center. This is an opulent palace that was built for Howard, and if he leaves, someone with big enough star power needs to replace him. This can't be the House that Draft Picks and Trade Exceptions Built. It must be the House That Fill in the Blank Built. Or better yet, Fill in the Blake.

This might be a stupid questions but can crazy Jimmy D insure his knees for the magic? Meaning if the knees go on the Magic, Dolan can garuntee 2 yrs payment or some sort of compensation?

Good question.

Nalod wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:I wouldnt do it if Im Orlando--I mean take one look at the Knicks standings!!

But......They have the shooters to surround Amare and a point guard.

They could very well succeed with Tyson-Amare.

Question is, with Dwight-Hedo, is it a better fit for us?

That is a great point. Amare/Tyson might be the most you can get for Dwight.

GustavBahler wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:http://www.cbssports.com/nba/story/16944...

Postups: As Magic plot to keep Howard, other scenarios blossom

The only other team capable of making a credible postseason offer to get Howard to one of the markets on his list would be the Knicks, who could offer Amare Stoudemire and Tyson Chandler. (Of course, this would only work if the struggling Knicks made it past the trade deadline with their key pieces intact.) While such a proposal from the Knicks would provide more star power, Stoudemire's uninsurable knees could be a deal-killer. Example from the recent past: At one point, an Eastern Conference team had a deal in place to acquire Stoudemire from the Suns for a top-five pick, and the trade was rejected by the team's medical staff because Stoudemire "might not be playing in five years," an official from that team said. That was four years ago.

A couple of things to consider. First, the new collective bargaining agreement provides no incentive for a free agent in Howard's position to work with his team on a sign-and-trade because he can no longer get a five-year deal with max raises that way. So why would Howard work with the Magic on sign-and-trade?

One reason is obvious: If Howard is hell-bent on going to a team with no cap room -- such as the Lakers or Knicks -- a trade is the only way he's getting there. The other is more subtle, but equally important: Despite Howard's admission this week that he thought Carmelo Anthony gave him "good advice" by telling him to "do what's best for you," Howard is perhaps the most image conscious of the NBA's top stars. He saw how LeBron became a villain after abandoning Cleveland, and that was after the Cavs got assets in return via a sign-and-trade. Howard doesn't want to take on the same pariah status, and if he worked with the Magic in a scenario that got them a superstar or multiple All-Stars in return, it would remove the sting of his departure and do much less damage to his image.

The final point should be obvious to anyone who's walked inside the Amway Center. This is an opulent palace that was built for Howard, and if he leaves, someone with big enough star power needs to replace him. This can't be the House that Draft Picks and Trade Exceptions Built. It must be the House That Fill in the Blank Built. Or better yet, Fill in the Blake.

This might be a stupid questions but can crazy Jimmy D insure his knees for the magic? Meaning if the knees go on the Magic, Dolan can garuntee 2 yrs payment or some sort of compensation?

Good question.

I doubt the league would allow and even Dolan would shy away from paying both Dwight's and Amare's salaries for three years while only one of them is actually on the team.

BRIGGS wrote:I wouldnt do it if Im Orlando--I mean take one look at the Knicks standings!!

If they lose Howard for nothing they are a lottery team. The lottery is a gamble.

Remember a trade can be vetoed if the receiving teams doesnt think the player is medically sound.

BRIGGS wrote:I wouldnt do it if Im Orlando--I mean take one look at the Knicks standings!!

Yes, but look at their GM- the biggest baffoon in the nba! He's the guy who brought in Gilbert Arenas's contract, Turkeyglu's, signed Chris Duhon to that big contract when no one else would touch him- it is a miracle he has kep his job so long.

Still, the Howard trade ain't going to happen, and I'm glad- we'd have a centre and SF and nothing else- how the heck are you going to get a good PF, SG or PG AND bench with the MLE once per year?

I think Amar'e still has his explosiveness- once every few games he shows it on a play- the problem is he's sulking and not making the effort- that Berman article confirms he's bothered by Melo taking over the team.

MS wrote:Iman is a good player, but I can't believe people are making him out to be someone that kills the trade for Dwight. You give up the farm for this guy. This isn't Melo. This guy actually produces wins and makes everyone better.

Bonn1997 wrote:

MS wrote:Iman is a good player, but I can't believe people are making him out to be someone that kills the trade for Dwight. You give up the farm for this guy. This isn't Melo. This guy actually produces wins and makes everyone better.

+1
Literally, you do give up the farm for him. Orlando can pick whoever they want on our roster and tell us to take back whatever contracts they want us to.

And so what has been learnt from the melo trade experience? Absolutely nothing at all...

MS wrote:Iman is a good player, but I can't believe people are making him out to be someone that kills the trade for Dwight. You give up the farm for this guy. This isn't Melo. This guy actually produces wins and makes everyone better.

Iman has star potential, and with the new CBA and our cap situation, we are not going to be able to acquire another star. All this team needs is a good pg, and we can win and we can allow Iman to develop into the SG most think he can become. Why trade him for Howard only to be left with team that can compete but not win it all because we have no backcourt players. I think we do what we should have done in the Melo deal and play hardball. An offer of Stat, Tyson, Douglas, and Fields, with $3 million added would be about as good a deal as the Magic could hope to get. All of those players are under 30 and Douglas and Fields are on rookie deals. Given Bynum's injury history, I would honestly consider the Knicks deal over a Bynum/Gasol deal. I would probably still take Bynum and Gasol, but it would be close when you consider adding Douglas and Fields.