Knicks · Chandler is a monster--Amare and Carmelo have to fit the team--not the other way around (page 4)

jrodmc wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:From the Tommy Dee piece. http://www.theknicksblog.com/2012/02/09/...

So it would seem that Amar’e will be a fit, which leaves us with Melo, who has to assume the Paul Pierce roll in all of this. Pierce knows when his touches are coming and he learned this very quickly with Rondo in Rondo’s rookie year. Credit Rondo for this, but also Pierce as well. Pierce has learned to CLOSE possessions not DOMINATE them. That’s a Hall of Fame and champion quality.

That takes selflessness.

I don't usually agree with Tommy Dee, but that's a pretty good point.

It is great they pointed out the Celtics Model. This is what the Knicks need to become. They have the center the celtics lacked in this offense, they just need a real shooter at the SG position.

It's also nice that now that we have our Rondo/Nash/PG our front's about 150 years younger than the Celts.

I like the Tyson Jaw Protrusion; reminiscent of Spree...

good call on the jaw protrusion!

and yeah..hopefully everyone looks better with Lin just like everyone on the Cs looks better with Rondo.
Remember the knocks on Rondo - drafted late, can't shoot, can't be the starting PG on a championship team, etc.

earthmansurfer wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

Nalod wrote:
Melo as a star is very attractive to many fans. They root for big numbers.

We root for wins.

Melo is not stupid and the team knows what was missing.

Remember Melo made a decision to want to play for mDA.

MDA is inflexible because he is a good coach. Thats right, he only knows his way and thats what good coaches do.

Sometimes its not a good fit and time to move on.

Or in the year of the Dragon you get a gift!

Yeah, fans root for big numbers. But most of us prefer winning. If you can get both then all the better.

I don't at all see Melo as a smart player or one who makes his teamates much better. Maybe a bit on the latter with his passing at times, but generally he prefers ISO - till now anyway. At the same time I don't see Melo as stupid, just a bit selfish. Now maybe this can change.

Melo came to NY first and DAntoni was the coach. I'm not sure he really wanted to play for him, but he did play for him in the Olympics I think, so maybe you are right.

MDA is damn inflexible and it's a big complaint I have. But when he gets the right pg, Like Lin, I think you will see his system take over. Got to give him some credit there.

Now that we have Lin, MDA is the right coach. I didn't like him before Lin and I wanted him gone, but not cause he was bad. Rather because he was inflexible and had the wrong PG and it's hard to find PG's for his system. We have to see what we can do with MDA and Lin. If the system changes Lin, though still great or good, might not be able to show what he has. He has given a lot of credit to the system.

Year of the Dragon baby!

I'm not sure if it's selfishness or overconfidence. I think he thinks he's Ray Allen when he's taking jump-shots.

Self confidence he has for sure. But when you are shooting terribly (for weeks) and hurting and still taking shots, that is stupidity to me. The line isn't so fine between selfishness and confidence. All of these guys have self confidence (except maybe Douglas right now). This is what I worry about, Melo doesn't seem to think he should defer even when his game is off. The good thing (I hope) is that Lin is turning into something special, and he might just lead this team through some of the problems of the past.

Alternately it can be called heroics. He probably was trying to lead the team fighting through his injuries to get us some 'W's. Yes he has been a ball stopper but it was out of necessity. He tried the ball movement offense saw the results and tried to take over and win games all by himself. No I don't support that but I can see why he did it. You think it's frustrating to watch TD chucking bricks, think what it's like to be Melo when that sheet is goin on.

Im thinking Lin with some Tats and cornrows will for sure bring everyone on board "Linsanity"!

“I feel confident against anybody,’’ said Chandler, whose Mavericks dispatched the Lakers in a sweep in the second round last spring. “As long as we play as a team, we can beat anybody. It’s not about whose in the lineup. It’s about how the lineup plays together. Right now we’re playing great basketball.''

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/ko...

Is he sending a message?

GoNyGoNyGo wrote:“I feel confident against anybody,’’ said Chandler, whose Mavericks dispatched the Lakers in a sweep in the second round last spring. “As long as we play as a team, we can beat anybody. It’s not about whose in the lineup. It’s about how the lineup plays together. Right now we’re playing great basketball.''

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/ko...

Is he sending a message?

Absolutely. He is the Peoples Captain.

NYKBocker wrote:

GoNyGoNyGo wrote:“I feel confident against anybody,’’ said Chandler, whose Mavericks dispatched the Lakers in a sweep in the second round last spring. “As long as we play as a team, we can beat anybody. It’s not about whose in the lineup. It’s about how the lineup plays together. Right now we’re playing great basketball.''

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/ko...

Is he sending a message?

Absolutely. He is the Peoples Captain.

Great catch. Shared the same quote because it is worded perfectly.

Tyson is ABSOLUTELY sending a message. In the same manner Amar'e started last season with, "The Knicks Are Back", which was more of a public relations line, this is similar in its tone - but slightly different in its intended audience.

Chandler is talking to his running buddies.

Nalod wrote:Empower the coach.

Extend him.

Install stability and continuity.

If you want to attract some Veteran players to fill roles you have to have this.

Build a culture and do it without Isiah!

exactly, I thought it was silly not to extend him, or just let him go at the beginning of the year... the lame duck status was just bad management in this case..

fishmike wrote:

holfresh wrote:U guys know we just played the Wizards, Nets and Jazz right?

Yes.. and the reason for the buzz around this this kid is the Jazz had a good record and are good team. Wall was a #1 pick and Deron a top 3 PG in the NBA and Lin outplayed them bother head to head. Not to mention the fact the 2 weeks ago the Knicks struggled to win these games.

Having watched some more talented (or at least higher regarded) players than Lin struggle to get the P&R going what is really impressive is watching he and Chandler work it too perfection. Lin has a very quick release and his midrange jumper is excellent. Chandler is uber athletic, has great hands and obviously finishes beautifully around the basket, and he's knocking down enough FTs.

which is why i am tired of the excuse that amare and melo need more time to figure out how to work together.. LOL.. lin and chandler look like stockton and malone( J/k but you get the picture) after just 3 games.... if you can play team ball, you can play with anyone at any time..

tkf wrote:

Nalod wrote:Empower the coach.

Extend him.

Install stability and continuity.

If you want to attract some Veteran players to fill roles you have to have this.

Build a culture and do it without Isiah!

exactly, I thought it was silly not to extend him, or just let him go at the beginning of the year... the lame duck status was just bad management in this case..

Isn't it crazy that 2 weeks ago, most everyone wanted him fired, including me. Now that a PG seems to be able to run the offense, everyone is saying that he should stay! I am 5050 on MDA, but I would, when they reach .500, extend him 1 year.

whoever started the poll a few weeks ago about whether it was MDA, the system or the PG, I guess we ALL know the answer now.

MS wrote:You know the thing that is really amusing. The fact that most posters while we were losing to the same teams we just beat were bitching and moaning about the team needing time to gel, they haven't been together, blah, blah blah. This is the same Wizards team that we had to beat at the buzzer with Melo and Amare. This is a Nets team that was going to beat our asses with Melo and Amare. Our schedule has been a joke we should be a the top of the conference and without Lin we would have been 1-2 in these games.

Although, Lin might not keep this up it's a difference between a me first ball player with no basketball IQ and a kid that just understands how important it is getting everyone invovled. It was fun to watch him last night. Everyone wanted to trade Landry and made stupid threads about him being garbage. But, when you play team ball you have an undrafted point guard, a second round pick and a castoff playing beautifully within a team concept.

Amare will look great when he comes back, Melo I am not so sure. Watch the way he handles himself, sulks, throws his hands up. Melo holding the ball has destroyed this team. Landry struggled, Shumpert struggled, Amare struggled, Douglas that's a different story. It's just a same we don't have Gallo, Chandler, Moz to play in this concept. We saw how it worked last year when everyone buys in and it can continue to work.

God forbid we can get Davis healthy and have a whole game of Ball movement the Knicks would actually give teams all they can handle. But it's all on Melo and no one else if he is moving the ball the Knicks will win, if not the smiles you saw on everyones faces, the five guys in double figure will again become losses to the Raptors, Bucks, Bobcats, etc.

very well said.

GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:From the Tommy Dee piece. http://www.theknicksblog.com/2012/02/09/...

So it would seem that Amar’e will be a fit, which leaves us with Melo, who has to assume the Paul Pierce roll in all of this. Pierce knows when his touches are coming and he learned this very quickly with Rondo in Rondo’s rookie year. Credit Rondo for this, but also Pierce as well. Pierce has learned to CLOSE possessions not DOMINATE them. That’s a Hall of Fame and champion quality.

That takes selflessness.

I don't usually agree with Tommy Dee, but that's a pretty good point.

Yeah I hope people don't go to overboard and say we don't need Melo and Stat to win.

Every team needs someone they can throw the ball to at the end of the shot clock who can create for himself. Especially in the playoffs where teams have plenty of time to learn your go to plays and you have often improvise when plays break down.

I guess the point of the MDA system is supposed to be that instead of all set plays he instills a set of principles so supposedly everyone on offense is on the same page and knows what to do when the 1st or 2nd or 3rd options on a possession are taken away.

The last time I had this much fun watching the Knicks play was when Amare was rolling off that crazy streak of games and Felton/Stoneface Chandler/Gallo etc were contributing too.

which is why MDA's system works very well when you have players that can play a bit without having to be micromanaged every posession...

tkf wrote:

fishmike wrote:

holfresh wrote:U guys know we just played the Wizards, Nets and Jazz right?

Yes.. and the reason for the buzz around this this kid is the Jazz had a good record and are good team. Wall was a #1 pick and Deron a top 3 PG in the NBA and Lin outplayed them bother head to head. Not to mention the fact the 2 weeks ago the Knicks struggled to win these games.

Having watched some more talented (or at least higher regarded) players than Lin struggle to get the P&R going what is really impressive is watching he and Chandler work it too perfection. Lin has a very quick release and his midrange jumper is excellent. Chandler is uber athletic, has great hands and obviously finishes beautifully around the basket, and he's knocking down enough FTs.

which is why i am tired of the excuse that amare and melo need more time to figure out how to work together.. LOL.. lin and chandler look like stockton and malone( J/k but you get the picture) after just 3 games.... if you can play team ball, you can play with anyone at any time..

its a a great point and begs the question about Melo's talent willingness to learn, fit in or play team basketball.

Now he will have to, because there is a real tidal wave building here and he's going to get swept away.

Also look... ITS THE PLAYERS.

We dont need to fire the coach, just get a PG who can share the ball and run the P&R.

Also the Knick defense has been pretty good this year. Great job MDA (or did we just sing a new center... I forget)

People are funny

I think Melo and Amare will be fine. A quality Pg solves a lot of issues. Lin will be given the keys to the offense, Melo and Amare are going to get there numbers off of what he creates. Melo will get open looks at 3 all game. Amare will get a lot of P&R opportunities. Chandler's offense will come down but he will get his from the dirty work and being the P&R focal point when Amare is resting.

tkf wrote:

fishmike wrote:

holfresh wrote:U guys know we just played the Wizards, Nets and Jazz right?

Yes.. and the reason for the buzz around this this kid is the Jazz had a good record and are good team. Wall was a #1 pick and Deron a top 3 PG in the NBA and Lin outplayed them bother head to head. Not to mention the fact the 2 weeks ago the Knicks struggled to win these games.

Having watched some more talented (or at least higher regarded) players than Lin struggle to get the P&R going what is really impressive is watching he and Chandler work it too perfection. Lin has a very quick release and his midrange jumper is excellent. Chandler is uber athletic, has great hands and obviously finishes beautifully around the basket, and he's knocking down enough FTs.

which is why i am tired of the excuse that amare and melo need more time to figure out how to work together.. LOL.. lin and chandler look like stockton and malone( J/k but you get the picture) after just 3 games.... if you can play team ball, you can play with anyone at any time..

tkf that's so true, man. I don't want to hear that "give them some time" shit anymore.

we all know amare will ahve no problems since he thrives with a goood pg. Melo on the other hand is a mystery. Its not just that he takes so many shots its just that he is to slow and methodical on offense. Right now we are moving up tempo and the ball movement is the best all season