Knicks · Knicks acquire Felton and KURT Thomas (page 7)

JamesKPolk wrote:

Mray20 wrote:We need a pg who can hit some shots play tough d and who can get the ball to Amare and Melo, Felton is a great choice, Lin is a shoot first point guard and he has no defense , He thrived under Dantoni where he was allowed to do whatever he wanted. Felton played under Larry Brown in the slow it down half court offense and helped take a bad team to the playoffs with the Bobcats , I have no doubt he will excel under Woodson considering he was trained by Brown and has a similar philosophy of how the game should be played . He's not gonna put up big numbers but he will play his role and play hard.

Most revisionist history of all time.

Felton is just as bad as a defender. In fact, he was run out of Charlotte by LArry Brown for being overweight and a bad defender. He didn't lead anyone to anything.

Speaking of D'Antoni's system, no player thrived under that more than Felton. Guy from mediocre to All-star in that half-season he was here and now he's back to mediocre. He wasn't "trained" by Brown. Biggest lie I've ever read yet.

Thank you. Felton's style of play doesn't fit into a slow-it-down, grind-it-out offense at all. For that matter, neither does Amare's. Felton had, by far, the best stretch of his career while playing under MDA and has been mediocre at best the rest of the time. And as for his playoff experience, his made it there twice and played a total of 9 games. Of course, in the playoffs play tends to slow down so, since he was trained under Larry Brown, he should have played well. In those 9 games he put up 12 pts, 4.6 assists, and 1 steal while shooting 38% on fg and 27% on 3fg.

VCoug wrote:

JamesKPolk wrote:

Mray20 wrote:We need a pg who can hit some shots play tough d and who can get the ball to Amare and Melo, Felton is a great choice, Lin is a shoot first point guard and he has no defense , He thrived under Dantoni where he was allowed to do whatever he wanted. Felton played under Larry Brown in the slow it down half court offense and helped take a bad team to the playoffs with the Bobcats , I have no doubt he will excel under Woodson considering he was trained by Brown and has a similar philosophy of how the game should be played . He's not gonna put up big numbers but he will play his role and play hard.

Most revisionist history of all time.

Felton is just as bad as a defender. In fact, he was run out of Charlotte by LArry Brown for being overweight and a bad defender. He didn't lead anyone to anything.

Speaking of D'Antoni's system, no player thrived under that more than Felton. Guy from mediocre to All-star in that half-season he was here and now he's back to mediocre. He wasn't "trained" by Brown. Biggest lie I've ever read yet.

Thank you. Felton's style of play doesn't fit into a slow-it-down, grind-it-out offense at all. For that matter, neither does Amare's. Felton had, by far, the best stretch of his career while playing under MDA and has been mediocre at best the rest of the time. And as for his playoff experience, his made it there twice and played a total of 9 games. Of course, in the playoffs play tends to slow down so, since he was trained under Larry Brown, he should have played well. In those 9 games he put up 12 pts, 4.6 assists, and 1 steal while shooting 38% on fg and 27% on 3fg.

mrKnickShot wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

FeltonandAmare wrote:

Mray20 wrote:We need a pg who can hit some shots play tough d and who can get the ball to Amare and Melo, Felton is a great choice, Lin is a shoot first point guard and he has no defense , He thrived under Dantoni where he was allowed to do whatever he wanted. Felton played under Larry Brown in the slow it down half court offense and helped take a bad team to the playoffs with the Bobcats , I have no doubt he will excel under Woodson considering he was trained by Brown and has a similar philosophy of how the game should be played . He's not gonna put up big numbers but he will play his role and play hard.

I knew there was a reason I never changed my moniker or site name! I agree that Felton is a good fit but we should still match Lin and not let him go for nothing. If the rumor I heard is correct and we can find a way to trade Lin for something of value from Houston than that is a more acceptable option than just letting him walk. Either way having Felton back on board can do nothing but help.

any rumor you heard about the Knicks matching on Lin and then trading him to Houston is wrong. Knicks cannot sign and trade with Houston now that the offer sheet is signed. Knicks, if they match Lin, could not trade him to Houston for a year.

(which, frankly, I think the Knicks should match and trade him to Houston in a year)

Trade him in a year?

If he is a bust, houston won't touch him. If he is not, NY will never part with him.

yeah, i was just hoping i could trick grunwald into matching. you caught me.

Mray20 wrote:When Lin stinks it up in Houston with no Dantoni offense and defenses focused on him and Knicks are leading the Atlantic division I wonder what people on this board will say

When Felton stinks it up for the next four years with no Dantoni offense I wonder what people on this board will say.

Mray20 wrote:When Lin stinks it up in Houston with no Dantoni offense and defenses focused on him and Knicks are leading the Atlantic division I wonder what people on this board will say

To say that we'd be a better team without Lin is ridiculous. There are all sorts of reports that the Luxary tax is the issue that forces us to part ways with Lin. But after the third year, we will have $76M coming off the books the following year. We'll be able to start over completely. I see this more about Fields than Lin. Knicks were considering matching the Raptors offer sheet if no alternative at SG could be found. Felton/Kidd will share time at the SG behind JR. The Knicks have no back up at the SG and no money to get another competent SG. Knicks will match Lin's offer sheet.

FeltonandAmare wrote:

Mray20 wrote:When Lin stinks it up in Houston with no Dantoni offense and defenses focused on him and Knicks are leading the Atlantic division I wonder what people on this board will say

To say that we'd be a better team without Lin is ridiculous. There are all sorts of reports that the Luxary tax is the issue that forces us to part ways with Lin. But after the third year, we will have $76M coming off the books the following year. We'll be able to start over completely. I see this more about Fields than Lin. Knicks were considering matching the Raptors offer sheet if no alternative at SG could be found. Felton/Kidd will share time at the SG behind JR. The Knicks have no back up at the SG and no money to get another competent SG. Knicks will match Lin's offer sheet.

I agree. I think to continue to improve on last year the Knicks need Lin. 57 million in year3 is to much to pay in year 3 to keep hIm

You guys are already talking about how Felton wont thrive in Woodson's offense. Give him an offseason to get back in shape and a chance to prove himself again.
Grunwald has done an amazing job this offseason getting players that complement both Amare and Melo. J Kidd can slow things down for Melo like he likes it and you can go uptempo with Lin & Felton for Amare. And then you have KT (lmao I cant believe ol' crazy eyes is back!) and Tyson & Camby that solidify the defensive end of things. You have experienced, and that's not just a nice way of saying old, leaders who know what it takes to compete and have earned the respect of their peers. We have good locker room guys in Kidd and Tyson and some big guns in Melo, Novak and JR (who has been surprisingly self aware of his weaknesses and very humble in recent interviews). Its fair to be concerned whether the players will fit the coach's system, but it's also the job of the coach to work his players in and mold them into pieces that fit the system and adjust. So give it time and a chance...but we have the potential to be really really good next year.

IMHO as far as the assertion that Grunwald was trying to piss off Morey or be difficult by not allowing the delivery of the papers that's not his style...

Houston weakness is that they need guards

Grunwald went out and got the only ones worth a look AND for cheap!
Signed J Kidd and now Felton and now he's gonna make them think he might not sign Lin, lull them into a sense of security over 3 days.. then they WILL match Lin Tuesday night.

Success is the best revenge and he's just downright demoralizing them and basically showing Morey how its done. (Cue evil laugh)

And yet...after all these moves...you get the feeling the Knicks aren't done yet...as though something big will happen.

JamesKPolk wrote:

Welcome back.

Oh sure... It's always the passer's fault.

As for Lin, it does look like the Knicks soured on him but I guess we won't get a definitive answer as to why for a few days. My guess is that its more than the money. I don't believe Dolan liked how the negotiations played out. Maybe Lin felt like he had Dolan where he wanted him. Considering the opportunity Lin got in NY, maybe Dolan didn't appreciate that. Combine this with Grunwald maybe adding that Lin still hasn't proven anything.

It does explain Grunwald avoiding being served with the offer sheet. Seems like the actions of someone who is pissed off about something.

If Lin does stay I think the Felton signing is more of a demotion for Lin than anything else. Lin might be getting starter money but with all those PGs on the roster he probably will be getting backup minutes.

It's too bad Jared had to go, but it is what it is. I hope his knee procedures went well, and feel that sooner or later, he'll end up in a NYK uniform again.

This definitely looks like a move away from matching Lin, because we already have Kidd, Felton and Prigioni. As others have mentioned, it doesn't seem like Lin wants to be a Knick, so why overpay someone to be here, who would rather be somewhere else (unless he is going to be traded)?

It'll be interesting to see how Lin fares if the Knicks don't match. He will get his money, and Houston will have their PG, but they won't be going anywhere this year, whether they pull Dwight Howard out of a hat or not. (I hope that they DO get him, and that the experiment FAILS miserably, and the losses and drama leads to D(iva)-12 to demand a trade...again. That, and Lin being consistently shut down every night, now that teams have watched enough film to get the memo on Lin's strengths and limitations, as we saw last season before the knee injury.)

Grunwald seems to be setting up for another move, too. Hopefully it's a trade for CP3- that would be spitting in the faces of all of these teams who want to prevent the Knicks from becoming the next "super team".

...then again, IF the Knicks match on Lin, what is the possibility that we can trade him in a deal like that? The 3rd year "poison pill" limits our moves- it makes him untradeable if his performance doesn't measure up to that contract, and the lux tax hit just doesn't make that deal worth it IMO.

At this point, I'll be curious to see how Grunwald plots his next few moves if we do match, but I'm leaning towards seeing this for what it clearly appears to be. Lin's as good as gone, and the Knicks are moving on.

Let's see how cunning Rockets fans think Morey is after those Lin and D12 moves blow up in their faces.

Grunwald knows it's gut-check time. He didn't take the bait and overpay for Fields, which shows that he isn't willing to let these scalywag teams shake us down into overpaying for our own unproven players. These teams are playing chess with us, so we have to strategically move our pieces on the board, too.

I have nothing against Landry Fields and Jeremy Lin doing what they have to do for themselves business-wise. I am glad that they both got their money. It should be just as easy for it to be understood that the Knicks have to do what is best for the TEAM as well. If those teams want to pay that dough for those guys, that's on them. It doesn't mean that the Knicks brass is so thin-skinned as to cave to that pressure every time. We're trying to win CHAMPIONSHIPS.

We need to bring Lin back regardless but giving Ray 4 years would make it this trade indefensible in my mind (knowing that Tyson/Amare/Melo expire in 3 seasons).

Even if we do bring Lin back, 4 years is too much to give Ray.

There are reports that we're also trading our 2nd rounder this year, Papanikolaou. This just gets worse and worse.

CrushAlot wrote:I think grunwald is handling this well. The bulls have to make a decision on asik before the Knicks have to on Lin. If the bulls don't match asik's contract the rockets risk losing a shot at Howard if they get Lin. Someone needs to tell morey glen grunwald is running the Knicks now. Grunwald wins this chess match no matter how it plays out.

Great points. That would be hilarious to see Morey's scheme to explode in the Rockets' faces. All the sacrifices that they made, to get Dwight Howard leads to the reason they miss out on him, just like what happened to the Nyets. That would be classic!

IMHO, That's WTF Houston deserves for employing punk move tactics like this Lin mess, only for Lin to very possibly end up not living up to that inflated deal.

We will soon see what happens- the Knicks have till Tuesday to match.

CrushAlot wrote:I think grunwald is handling this well. The bulls have to make a decision on asik before the Knicks have to on Lin. If the bulls don't match asik's contract the rockets risk losing a shot at Howard if they get Lin. Someone needs to tell morey glen grunwald is running the Knicks now. Grunwald wins this chess match no matter how it plAys out.

Has a signed offer sheet been given to the Bulls?

VCoug wrote:http://www.postingandtoasting.com/2012/7...

There are reports that we're also trading our 2nd rounder this year, Papanikolaou. This just gets worse and worse.

I had a feeling he was part of the package, how could we get Felton for JJ/Gadzuric, while getting back their rights to a sharp shooter as well.
There has to be some incentive for Portland or any team to do a deal with us.

I did some more research on Papanikolaou, he does look like he can be a very promising player at his pick.

But honestly, we would have to face a poison pill with him, after his 2 years, developing him, unless we used our 3m exception or part of it to sign him, to guaranteed 3year deal to get his full bird rights.

holfresh wrote:Knicks are definitely better with Lin than without...But if all reports are to be believed, he doesn't want to be here...So we move on...This is the NY Knicks we are talking about here, not the Albany Patroons....

Lin certainly didn't do the Knicks any favors....