It's funny looking back at the numbers because we cherish or at least talk about these era of Knicks team alot, but the stats aren't really that impressive...
some notes on the 94 team from my own recollection:
Doc Rivers was our rock at point guard...his numbers weren't even that good but he got alot of respect while he played for us. I remember us feeling like we'd never replace Doc after he blew his knee out after 19 games...then we go and get Derek Harper who played 27 games for us and he put up similiar unimpressive numbers. He stepped up big time in the playoffs though. John Starks had surgery to repair cartilage in his knee that year, but made the all-star team before that. He came back waaaaay earlier than he was supposed to in time to play well in the playoffs. Ewing had a weird leg injury during the end of the year where he had to where stockings. He wasn't himself in the playoffs.
some notes on the 99 team from my own recollection:
strike shortened season. the Knicks had traded Oakley and Mason in the off season. They Had Sprewell and Houston starting at the 2/3 and a two headed point guard in Child and Ward. Larry Johnson played both 3/4 all year back and forth and Camby was in Van Gundy's dog house until Ewing tore his achillies. Camby emerges, Sprewell is let lose and Houston started doing coke or something because the Knicks went ape shit on the league down the stretch and into the playoffs.
Considering all this...who would have won in a 7 game series for the championship?
Nalod@ 7/27/2012 10:46 AM
I think the 94 team wins. Ewing eats up Camby.
Stats never looked good in the riley "dead ball era". By that, we played slow half court style where Van Gundy had to go to more uptempo playing to our strenth.
Yes, in 96 we should have let Ewing walk and kept Nellie. Hindsite gives us that perspective.
But Ewing was a big draw and nobody could envision life without him.
EnySpree@ 7/27/2012 10:51 AM
The two finals appearances were only 5 years apart....alot changed in that time frame...Only Ewing remained.
Looking back now, when the Knicks were trading away Oakley, Starks and Mason...they probably should have tried to trade Ewing too. They went younger but didn't take it all the way. Probably should have.
Bonn1997@ 7/27/2012 11:01 AM
You look at the advanced stats of the 1994 team and a two things become apparent. A) PER is a bad stat. Such a great team had only 1 player with an impressive PER. B) Every player that got major minutes had a good to great win share.
jrodmc@ 7/27/2012 12:24 PM
Obviously a healthy Ewing would trump almost everything over the 99 team except: 1) 94 has no answer to Spree 2) 99 has no answer to Ewing 2) 94 had Charles Smith. No Knick team with Charles Smith is ever going to win anything. 3) 99 had Chris Dudley. No Knick team with Chris Dudley is ever going to win anything.
They would play for fourteen weeks with the series tied and everyone would die trying to end game 7. Game called on account of player deaths.
knicks1248@ 7/27/2012 12:48 PM
jrodmc wrote:Obviously a healthy Ewing would trump almost everything over the 99 team except: 1) 94 has no answer to Spree 2) 99 has no answer to Ewing 2) 94 had Charles Smith. No Knick team with Charles Smith is ever going to win anything. 3) 99 had Chris Dudley. No Knick team with Chris Dudley is ever going to win anything.
They would play for fourteen weeks with the series tied and everyone would die trying to end game 7. Game called on account of player deaths.
charles smith avg 4 rebounds..I always felt that he was the worse knick ever
EnySpree@ 7/27/2012 12:49 PM
94 was a slow it down offensive team that defended like life depended on it and held everyone accountable.
99 was a team in transition that wanted to play slow at first but were was too athletic to waste. They found their mojo when Ewing went down.
It would be a game of styles...whoever could stamp their will on the game would win. Houston in his prime vs. John Starks in his prime would be hell to pay for Houston. Starks was crazy. Houston was tough in his own right but when Starks was rolling he was a tough annoying bastard. Sprewell was the starting small fwd. In the open floor and on the perimeter he would be unguardable but Mason and even Charles Smith would give him fits trying to drive especially with Oakley and Ewing lurking. Larry Johnson is skilled enough to play against that 94 team but he would have been alone in there against those guys. Camby and KT would provide some help but KT wasn't in the plans as much back then and Camby was just a ball of energy. I think the point guard situation is a wash with Harper and Greg Anthony vs Childs and Ward
mrKnickShot@ 7/27/2012 1:13 PM
1994 was bigger and far more intimidating.
toodarkmark@ 7/28/2012 10:49 AM
Stats really can't measure how powerful and intimidating the 94 team was. If only Rolando Blackman's back had not gone out and we had his jump shot for at least two seasons.
And I felt Derek Harper was far superior to Doc Rivers in running the team. If the Knicks had won game 7, Harper would have been the MVP. Rivers was ok, better than Anthony ever played for us. Except maybe that 92 Bulls series. That play got Mark Jackson traded, and Anthony just never progressed.
smackeddog@ 7/28/2012 12:41 PM
It's strange how we remember things differently than they were. I always remember Camby going on a tear in the playoffs, but in actual fact, I don't think he really got it going until the Pacers series- did he do much vs Miami or the Hawks? I do remember him being in JVGs dog house- his reputation was one of laziness and softness- he fainted during one of his first Raptors practices, and sat out a game with us due to an in growing toe nail!
Also, i always think of Kurt Thomas as a tough vet, but re-watching a few 1999 playoff games on youtube, he seemed more like a rookie out of his depth- not the tough dude he became.
I was always annoyed Allan Houston didn't score more back then- he could be infuriatingly passive a lot of the time- he stepped up his game in the playoffs though.
EnySpree@ 7/28/2012 5:23 PM
Camby embarrassed the Hawks....well the whole Knicks squad just took it to their asses. Camby had that legendary dunk over Mutombo, and the countless athletic tip ins he had in Indiana....I think the guys on that run too turns having great moments....Houston destroying Reggie Miller, LJ's 4 point play, Sprewells dunk over that bum in san antonio......
94 had alot of gangsta shit moments....Riley refused to play more than 6 guys. He was bugging for that. Aside from Rolando Blackman they had Tony Campbell too, who was a decent scorer before his knick stint.
fun to think about those days.....and then there was OJ, smh
jrodmc@ 7/30/2012 8:28 AM
94 was just... Charles Smith. Starks, painful to watch, even more painful to live through. Ewing in the prime of life. Oakley airballs. So dayum close to a chip. No bench. I don't understand who Riley was supposed to play. Hubert Davis? Greg Anthony? Herb Williams?
99 was magical, Spree "eclectricity", Houston's floater, Ewing/LJ wearing down and out. One of the penultimate 2-guards playing out of position the whole year. I was praying and hoping JVG would just start Spree at PG, and trade Chris Dudley for two cups of coffee before the Finals started. Charlie Football, best backup PG to ever start at PG in a Finals.
K22@ 7/30/2012 10:04 AM
jrodmc wrote:99 was magical, Spree "eclectricity", Houston's floater, Ewing/LJ wearing down and out. One of the penultimate 2-guards playing out of position the whole year. I was praying and hoping JVG would just start Spree at PG, and trade Chris Dudley for two cups of coffee before the Finals started. Charlie Football, best backup PG to ever start at PG in a Finals.
Remember when someone said Charlie Ward would never lead the Knicks to a championship? Ultimately and sadly, he was right, but, Ward was the starting point guard for a team that made it to the Finals. The guy who said that quote? Well, he did it like this to get closer to the light.
jrodmc@ 7/30/2012 10:43 AM
K22 wrote:
jrodmc wrote:99 was magical, Spree "eclectricity", Houston's floater, Ewing/LJ wearing down and out. One of the penultimate 2-guards playing out of position the whole year. I was praying and hoping JVG would just start Spree at PG, and trade Chris Dudley for two cups of coffee before the Finals started. Charlie Football, best backup PG to ever start at PG in a Finals.
Remember when someone said Charlie Ward would never lead the Knicks to a championship? Ultimately and sadly, he was right, but, Ward was the starting point guard for a team that made it to the Finals. The guy who said that quote? Well, he did it like this to get closer to the light.
And that's roughly akin to saying Chris Dudley was the starting center for a team that was in the Finals.
94, Riley didn't have much in the way of choices; he went with the best horses he had and rode them dirty and wet through 7 games. 99, JVG did have better choices but rode dead horsemeat to no where. Not that '99 team had a shot in hell against the Spurs anyway, but...
ChuckBuck@ 7/30/2012 12:46 PM
1994 had a healthy Ewing near his prime so I have to give the edge there.
That said the 1999 Knicks were the most fun to watch, because their run to the NBA Finals was so improbable considering their regular season struggles and barely making the playoffs as an 8th seed.
chewy@ 7/30/2012 11:33 PM
This is one of the best post I read on this board. But I have to go with 94 team. To much defense n toughness. Ewing would use and abuse young Camby. If 99 was to win childs n ward would have to play superior.
