mrKnickShot wrote:Linsanity was the most exciting time I had as a knick fan in many many years, nobody can say that it wasn't. The issue is when posters dumbly state that players come back and kill Linsanity ignoring the drastic change in strength of schedule. MDA system which failed miserably was proven to work since we won during Linsanity. A cream puff schedule and context is often missed and/or intentionally ignored. Miami beat us 4-1 - but did they not do that against OKC?There are definitely two sides that are extreme and they are both silly positions and its quite boring to have to stick to party lines on everything. Its kind of cool when one can think for themselves even though it might piss off both sides/everyone.
Melo and Lin for each of their stretches made it exciting to watch basketball. I really hope he sux for houston so we can feel less crappy about him leaving - as evil as that sounds.
The knicks were awful prior to Woody (outside of Linsanity). Who was to blame? EVERYONE!! And I have said this numerous times. Melo SUCKED! AMARE was even worse, and MDA? If he were driving down a road and there was a detour, he would just sit there until they finished construction.
Basketball is one of the hardest/most fun to debate precisely because with 5 players all on the court at the same time playing on both sides of the ball it's never clear who should get the lion's share of the glory/blame. The MDA/Melo/Amare pairing was not working at all. Whose fault that is will never really be clear and there are those whose minds are made up and won't change.
I'm just looking forward to the season. The optimist in me is hoping Amare and Melo realize that the next 3 years will define their legacies as players and they both become more complete players. If not I suppose we can look forward to various factions of haters and lovers pissing and moaning on this board over 82 games. When will it be fair to pass judgement on Melo/Amare/Woody? Obviously there are those who will declare final conclusions after the 1st quarter against Brooklyn but since small sample size is getting such a bad name on this board, perhaps it's best to wait till the all star break?
tkf wrote:knickscity wrote:TKF are you saying lin is not a streaky scorer?
what I am saying is that lin brought a dynamic to this team we just don't get from our multi million dollar stars..
Nah, you said Melo was a streaky scorer, I won't deny that, but I'm asking you is Lin a streaky scorer as well?
simple yes or no.
knickscity wrote:tkf wrote:knickscity wrote:TKF are you saying lin is not a streaky scorer?
what I am saying is that lin brought a dynamic to this team we just don't get from our multi million dollar stars..
Nah, you said Melo was a streaky scorer, I won't deny that, but I'm asking you is Lin a streaky scorer as well?simple yes or no.
lin is not a scorer, he is a playmaker... a catalyst...
knickscity wrote:tkf wrote:knickscity wrote:TKF are you saying lin is not a streaky scorer?
what I am saying is that lin brought a dynamic to this team we just don't get from our multi million dollar stars..
Nah, you said Melo was a streaky scorer, I won't deny that, but I'm asking you is Lin a streaky scorer as well?simple yes or no.
lin is not a scorer, he is a playmaker... a catalyst... can he be streaky scoring.. sure, but carmelo is a streaky scorer and that is all he is... hence the constant playoff failures..
tkf wrote:knickscity wrote:tkf wrote:knickscity wrote:TKF are you saying lin is not a streaky scorer?
what I am saying is that lin brought a dynamic to this team we just don't get from our multi million dollar stars..
Nah, you said Melo was a streaky scorer, I won't deny that, but I'm asking you is Lin a streaky scorer as well?simple yes or no.
lin is not a scorer, he is a playmaker... a catalyst...
Lin is not a scorer? Really?
The human nature is to protect the hapiness they have with whatever it takes.
Sport fandome is to have fun and piece of mind in the mix of various live distructions and problems.
Fans will tell everybody and themselwse that whatever happened with their belowed team is good.
Lin out - it is good because Lin is yada-yada-yada; Lin in - it is good because Lin is yada-yada-yada.
Fans will lie themselves to the point they will belive in their lies like there is nothing else out there.
The only little problem is the reality which will hit in April 2013... Let talk then... and hope for the best.
When a guard averages more field goal attempts by a wide margin than assists, they are a scorer.
Lin is a scorer and a playmaker that makes other players better. In other words he is the type of PG the rest of the league wish they had with the exception of a few elite pgs
arkrud wrote:The human nature is to protect the hapiness they have with whatever it takes.
Sport fandome is to have fun and piece of mind in the mix of various live distructions and problems.
Fans will tell everybody and themselwse that whatever happened with their belowed team is good.
Lin out - it is good because Lin is yada-yada-yada; Lin in - it is good because Lin is yada-yada-yada.
Fans will lie themselves to the point they will belive in their lies like there is nothing else out there.
The only little problem is the reality which will hit in April 2013... Let talk then... and hope for the best.
so true happens all the time
knickscity wrote:When a guard averages more field goal attempts by a wide margin than assists, they are a scorer.
The only PG I can think of over the last 20 years who has consistently recorded more assists than fga is John Stockton. And everyone's favorite pg, Raymond Felton, has never come close.
Lin as a starter last year was at what 18.9pts 8.8assists 44% FG. Felton's career 11 and 5 @40% & 30% from 3. Hmmmm
gunsnewing wrote:Lin as a starter last year was at what 18.9pts 8.8assists 44% FG. Felton's career 11 and 5 @40% & 30% from 3. Hmmmm
Lin's numbers diminished each game and no matter how many stats are presented, the truth is that Felton is a better floor general than Lin and a much better fit for this team. That's all that matters.
gunsnewing wrote:Lin as a starter last year was at what 18.9pts 8.8assists 44% FG. Felton's career 11 and 5 @40% & 30% from 3. Hmmmm
Since you are using Lin's #'s which were compiled in MDA's system, why not compare it to Felton's #'s in the same system? I remember at one point Felton was playing at an allstar level under MDA and his numbers were something like 19 and 9.
VCoug wrote:knickscity wrote:When a guard averages more field goal attempts by a wide margin than assists, they are a scorer.
The only PG I can think of over the last 20 years who has consistently recorded more assists than fga is John Stockton. And everyone's favorite pg, Raymond Felton, has never come close.
I said by a wide margin.
GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:mrKnickShot wrote:Linsanity was the most exciting time I had as a knick fan in many many years, nobody can say that it wasn't. The issue is when posters dumbly state that players come back and kill Linsanity ignoring the drastic change in strength of schedule. MDA system which failed miserably was proven to work since we won during Linsanity. A cream puff schedule and context is often missed and/or intentionally ignored. Miami beat us 4-1 - but did they not do that against OKC?There are definitely two sides that are extreme and they are both silly positions and its quite boring to have to stick to party lines on everything. Its kind of cool when one can think for themselves even though it might piss off both sides/everyone.
Melo and Lin for each of their stretches made it exciting to watch basketball. I really hope he sux for houston so we can feel less crappy about him leaving - as evil as that sounds.
The knicks were awful prior to Woody (outside of Linsanity). Who was to blame? EVERYONE!! And I have said this numerous times. Melo SUCKED! AMARE was even worse, and MDA? If he were driving down a road and there was a detour, he would just sit there until they finished construction.
Basketball is one of the hardest/most fun to debate precisely because with 5 players all on the court at the same time playing on both sides of the ball it's never clear who should get the lion's share of the glory/blame. The MDA/Melo/Amare pairing was not working at all. Whose fault that is will never really be clear and there are those whose minds are made up and won't change.
I'm just looking forward to the season. The optimist in me is hoping Amare and Melo realize that the next 3 years will define their legacies as players and they both become more complete players. If not I suppose we can look forward to various factions of haters and lovers pissing and moaning on this board over 82 games. When will it be fair to pass judgement on Melo/Amare/Woody? Obviously there are those who will declare final conclusions after the 1st quarter against Brooklyn but since small sample size is getting such a bad name on this board, perhaps it's best to wait till the all star break?
Well put - LET THE GAMES BEGIN! There is no way anyone will wait until the allstar game to judge this team/players 
VCoug wrote:infinitilov100 wrote:gunsnewing wrote:newyorknewyork wrote:gunsnewing wrote:That contract will be looked at as a bargain as Lin makes the allstar team 3yrs in a row and then gets a new 5yr max contract at 100mil and earns every penny of it as a 26yr pg in his prime
Knicks have cap space when he becomes a free agent again. 
Yes exactly then we can send shumpert along with 5 future first and second rd picks to houston for jeremy lin who we shoulve just kept in 2012
We're going to stick to the plan and that's to get Chris Paul.
You're shitting me right? We have absolutely nothing of value to trade for him, nothing. Of course, if we had kept Lin it's possible that he could have been the centerpiece for a CP3 trade.
Are you sure that the Clipps would have wanted Lin? Do you know their management and owner well enough to think that they would want to pay Lin all that money in that 3rd year? How can you be so sure? Do think that because the Nyets was kind enough to do Atlanta a favor and take on JJ that someone else is going to be that stupid and give an undrafted kid that much money?
VCoug wrote:infinitilov100 wrote:gunsnewing wrote:newyorknewyork wrote:gunsnewing wrote:That contract will be looked at as a bargain as Lin makes the allstar team 3yrs in a row and then gets a new 5yr max contract at 100mil and earns every penny of it as a 26yr pg in his prime
Knicks have cap space when he becomes a free agent again.
Yes exactly then we can send shumpert along with 5 future first and second rd picks to houston for jeremy lin who we shoulve just kept in 2012
We're going to stick to the plan and that's to get Chris Paul.
You're shitting me right? We have absolutely nothing of value to trade for him, nothing. Of course, if we had kept Lin it's possible that he could have been the centerpiece for a CP3 trade.
Watch Grunny get it done. He's a miracle worker.
gunsnewing wrote:good points GSTQ. Inconsistencies in arguments is the real problem here. Its the reason this topic will never go away until Lin retires
Good point. All the Lin cry babies will be crying until Lin retires.
tkf wrote:infinitilov100 wrote:knicks1248 wrote:CrushAlot wrote:knicks1248 wrote:holfresh wrote:knicks1248 wrote:DurzoBlint wrote:gunsnewing wrote:knickstorrents wrote:Reason is because it was personal, not business
+10000000000000000000
and you know this how...because it was in the papers? Unless you heard it from Dolan or, your a mind reader, you don't know what your talking about. Like I said before, lots of telepaths posting here.
because people are judge on there past not there future (in most cases) they said they would match and they had every intentions on doing that until it became personal...
My agent tells me that the knicks are big on me and I believe they'll match anything. my agent calls the rockets and tells them, hey if your serious about retaining my client, you may have to up the $ cause your wasting your ink with that contract thats going to be match in the blink of an eye, I figure if you add a few more $ you will atleast have them 2nd guessing themselves..
The rockets lose nothing cause they can waive him in the 3rd year, trade him, or if he plays upto the potential, they have a franchise player..
it was a business move on the rockets part, and a personal decision on the knicks part..
why would the knicks commit to 3 pgs before committing to lin ?
Because they weren't going cost close to 50 mil dollars for a guy who broke down after 25 games...
I don't know about that..The guy goes from not playing at all to playing close to 40 mins 5 times a wk..with almost no rest in between time, no adjustment period..
MDA PGs during his knick tenure where breaking down after 3/4 months regardless..
fields was the only player to play 66 games on the knicks roster last season..
57.85 mil in year 3, no sign and trades, any trade has to be dollar for dollar so no relief from year three of that contract unless the knicks waive Lin and stretch the cost out over several years. Those numbers and the limited options the Knicks had after commiting to that contract are why it was ummatchable from a business prospective. I assume the commitment to 3 point guards includes Pablo's 1 year deal at 488,000. I would just take that right out of your argument. The Knicks got Pablo because they wanted him and he cost them nothing. Kidd was obtained to mentor Lin and both his and Felton's contracts are much more reasonable in my opinion.
did you ever think Joe johnson would be traded with that contract..EVERY CONTRACT in the NBA is tradable
I'm not surprised that the Nyets traded for JJ. They were the only ones who would. That was a desperate move.
NY fans are incredible.. LOL.. desperate? how we got carmelo was desperate, we were played by both the nets and the nuggets... Our very knicks tried hard to get joe johnson, I wonder what the perception of him would have been had he been in a knicks uniform.. I like JJ, I hate his contract, but I like him.. he would have been a much better fit with our young team and amare than pairing amare with the iso first round exit king...
We won the prize. The Nyets lost. ha ha. It was going to be either Amar'e or Johnson and the Knicks made the right choice and I'm elated. We love our team the way it is and we are excited about the upcoming season.
tkf wrote:infinitilov100 wrote:gunsnewing wrote:muhaha wrote:Let's look at it from finacial perspective last year:- Lin helped Knicks making playoff, 179K (edit: NBA playoff pool for Knicks)
- Two playoff games, attendance: 19,763 x 2 = 39,526 @ $250 (conservative estimation of average price)
MSG raked in 9.8 million for Game 3+4
- MSG shops Linsanity jersey sales ??k
- MSG stocks up 12% during Linsanity, Feb 4-Feb 17, 100 mils for Dolan as majority share (conservative estimation).
Here is something else to consider:
- Knicks FO knew the extent of Lin's injury but didnt reveal until AFTER playoff ticket were mostly sold. With advance of medical technology, any decent hospital could easily diagosed a meniscus tear.
- They annouced, 'Knicks will match any offer up to a billion dollar when sales of 2012-2013 season tickets were in full swing.
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For all the money he made from above, Dolan only dished out $762,000.
Was Lin worth 25 million + tax for a guy who played 25 games last year and had a miserable shooting pct when it counted? Who Miami exposed as a ...
a
By saying 25 games is not enough of a sample size...but that one game in Miami....you really made yourself look like an a**!
Good post. Without Lin Knicks dont sniff the playoffs and we win 29 games. Yet we let him walk for NOthingNot making the playoffs with a team of melo and amare at 200mil wouldve been a dister
Without Woodson and players like Melo the Knicks don't make the playoffs. Lin helped to beat the useless teams.
as larry brown said.. delusional...
I don't share the same hate as you do for the Knicks as you so I'm delusional. You are sick.
tkf wrote:knickscity wrote:to give one credit and not the other is downright stupid.Lin had great games, so did Melo.
i don't think anyone doubts that neither had great games.. or at least shouldn't.. what some are doubting is impact... carmelo over 9 years is pretty much what you see.. a good streaky scorer... I can say his play has never inspired me, and his lack of leadership is troubling... lin for a moment gave hope for what could have been, he took a bunch of "role" players and a couple of starters and had them playing at a high level.... too bad we will never get to see it play out...
If you don't like our current players and coaches then leave our board. I'm sick and tied of all the cry babies. All you do is come on our board and complain. Houston has fan forums too.
