I keep hearing this team has such a small window, especially after seeing the Marc Berman article this morning. He's talking about Tyson Chandler having crazy mileage, Stoudemire possibly only having 1 more year as a starter, and Melo being on the back end of his prime and showing signs of age. But as long as the team keeps stocking up on depth, i really do think this big 3 can bring at least 1 championship and be competitive for many years. It all comes down to health and chemistry. The Celtics Big 3 were all over the age of 30 and still got 5 good years as contenders. Garnett sacrificed his offense and filled a role on the team as the leader and elite post defender. While he is a better player, it is safe to say that Chandler is this team's Garnett. Garnett, like Chandler, came out of high school and had a lot of mileage by the time he got to Boston. Pierce maintained the role on the team as the elite offensive player, who always came thru in the clutch, and was most likely to take over the game. He also improved defensively at that point in his career. I believe this is the transformation Anthony will make. His offensive game will continue to thrive and will not decline with age, as he is a skilled offensive player who does not rely on athletic ability alone. He should remain a top NBA scorer until age 35 as long as he stays healthy. Stoudemire is this team's Ray Allen. He is one dimensional as strictly an offensive player, but is the much needed 2nd option that teams need to focus on. Shumpert is the Rondo, the young stud who as a 2nd year player has a lot of question marks, but is without question an elite defensive player already. That is how Rondo was at that stage in his career. Celtics continuously stocked up on veterans for depth, and Knicks have done a great job of that this summer. Kidd, Camby, Wallace, Novak, Brewer, and possibly Smith all bring something to the table off the bench that will give teams fits. I am very excited for this team as for once in my lifetime i see a method to the madness and i real plan in building a team. This team isn't just a collection of talent where we throw something against the wall and see what sticks. This is a team built to compliment and bring together 2 elite offensive players and 1 elite defensive player so the results match the overall talent. Season is right around the corner, it's going to be great.
we do have a small window. I dont mind just as long as we win within these 2-3 years. I mean The Celtics are different because both garnett and pierce are in great shape even in their older age and they are hall of famers. Also they have a great young point guard in rondo.
IrishKnickFan wrote:we do have a small window. I dont mind just as long as we win within these 2-3 years. I mean The Celtics are different because both garnett and pierce are in great shape even in their older age and they are hall of famers. Also they have a great young point guard in rondo.
Pierce never looks in great shape to me. As far as mileage goes Garnett came to the NBA out of high school so he has quite a bit of mileage despite being in good shape. Playing him at the 5 was a great move last year. I think the Knicks are a lot like that 2008 Celts team. I am hoping Kidd has a Jeter like renaissance this year. I think the Kidd, Camby, Thomas pick ups are being underrated. I think those guys provide a lot of talent, character, leadership and experience to a team that needs that.
From Hahn's twitter:
The #Knicks roster will be the oldest in the NBA. But in reality it won't be as old as some are suggesting. More:On opening night, Mike Woodson's projected starting five (Felton, Smith, Anthony, Stoudemire and Chandler) will have an average age of 28.4. Is that old?
Woodson's projected nine-man rotation -- essentially his core players (adding Kidd, Brewer, Novak and Camby) -- will have an average age of 30.5.
Kidd (39) and Camby (38) certainly jack the average up considerably, but the absence of a key contributor in Iman Shumpert (22) can not be overlooked.
The true age issue is in the overall depth of the team, where players such as Pablo Prigioni (35), Rasheed Wallace (38) and Kurt Thomas (40) complete the bench. But that begs the question: would you rather turn to experience from your bench to get through an injury or foul trouble or would you rather have an unproven young player sitting there biding his time?
Even inexperienced guys like James White (30 on opening night) and Chris Copeland (28) raise the average.
If J.R.'s brother, Chris (24) or shooting guard Mychal Thompson (24) make the roster, they'd be only the second player aside from Iman under the age of 27.
The similarity starts and ends with Amare and Melo being two stars who haven't won the big one yet and should theoretically be willing to make whatever sacrifices they need to win as they've already had pretty monster individual years, all star appearances etc.
I think most people on this board and most hardcore NBA fans would safely say KG is a much much much better player than Amare or Melo or Chandler. KG/Garnett/Allen/Rondo's games all fit MUCH better than our current roster. Rondo was all about passing the ball and couldn't moan about not getting shots as a rookie with no jump shot playing with the Big 3.
Not saying Ainge is a genius as everything just fell into place. How often does a player who is a beast on both ends of the floor like KG become available? The Rondo draft pick was great but I'm going with lucky on that one as Ainge's history of drafting and FA signings (Jeff Green???) doesn't exactly point to genius.
Luck/chance plays a huge role in all of this. Who knows if Melo/Amare grew up in a different basketball culture or had different coaches early in their careers they easily have the talent to be dominant on both ends of the floor but they got maxed out, commercials, all stars playing the way they play anyway.
CrushAlot wrote:From Hahn's twitter:The #Knicks roster will be the oldest in the NBA. But in reality it won't be as old as some are suggesting. More:On opening night, Mike Woodson's projected starting five (Felton, Smith, Anthony, Stoudemire and Chandler) will have an average age of 28.4. Is that old?
Woodson's projected nine-man rotation -- essentially his core players (adding Kidd, Brewer, Novak and Camby) -- will have an average age of 30.5.
Kidd (39) and Camby (38) certainly jack the average up considerably, but the absence of a key contributor in Iman Shumpert (22) can not be overlooked.
The true age issue is in the overall depth of the team, where players such as Pablo Prigioni (35), Rasheed Wallace (38) and Kurt Thomas (40) complete the bench. But that begs the question: would you rather turn to experience from your bench to get through an injury or foul trouble or would you rather have an unproven young player sitting there biding his time?
Even inexperienced guys like James White (30 on opening night) and Chris Copeland (28) raise the average.
If J.R.'s brother, Chris (24) or shooting guard Mychal Thompson (24) make the roster, they'd be only the second player aside from Iman under the age of 27.
won't be a problem if they come into camp well-conditioned
I wish this team had KG, Pierce, Allen and Rondo like the 2008 Celtics. We have flawed Amare and Melo. And it ends right there. The question is are we even better than the Celtics THIS year. 5yrs later? Celtics 5yrs older. Are we better?
Unfortunately that comparison isn't even close. The Celtics had parts that fit together we do not. Chandler has no offense to speak of and isn't the defender Garnett was at the time. Amare is a huge.injury risk that plays on side of the floor and does it without efficiency right now. none of the big three were labeled selfish and their best three.was.far superior to ours.
And more importantly they complimented each others games while our big three are redundant and inhibit each others success.
Chandler is not in KG's stratosphere.
Melo = PP
Amare = wild card
Rondo >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Felton/Kidd
Too often this team or any team for that matter are judged by the individual talents rather than how they perform as a group. This team was somewhat lost in terms of it's identity, but they found themselves and performed up to their real potential towards the close of the season. I find it strange that so many seem to ignore that fact. This team is built to perform at a high level defensively. The Celtics didn't win as individuals. That's why even well into their 30's they remain effective. Only if you rely on individual physical skill does it matter how old you are. I think STAT and Melo are beginning to realize this fact. Woody has to teach them how to win as a team. That's why he brought in Hakeem. It's not just about teaching the bigs to play in the post. It's about showing them how to play with each other and off of each other. SO far on Defense the team has been able to come together. It's the offense that has to mesh much better and that's why they brought in Felton and Kidd and to a lesser extent Prigioni. These are PG's that should be able to distribute the ball effectively and get people in their spots. That's a huge key to getting everyone to play together as a team.
The problem is under the new cba, every team has a small window. Even if we'd signed young players with potential instead of the vets, for the minimum, if they'd shown anything we couldn't afford to resign them in a year or two.
gunsnewing wrote:I wish this team had KG, Pierce, Allen and Rondo like the 2008 Celtics. We have flawed Amare and Melo. And it ends right there. The question is are we even better than the Celtics THIS year. 5yrs later? Celtics 5yrs older. Are we better?
Allen and Pierce were flawed just like Melo and Stoudemire.
Knixkik wrote:gunsnewing wrote:I wish this team had KG, Pierce, Allen and Rondo like the 2008 Celtics. We have flawed Amare and Melo. And it ends right there. The question is are we even better than the Celtics THIS year. 5yrs later? Celtics 5yrs older. Are we better?
Allen and Pierce were flawed just like Melo and Stoudemire.
Chandler is flawed too.
KG is not flawed and the best player by far on that team.
mrKnickShot wrote:Knixkik wrote:gunsnewing wrote:I wish this team had KG, Pierce, Allen and Rondo like the 2008 Celtics. We have flawed Amare and Melo. And it ends right there. The question is are we even better than the Celtics THIS year. 5yrs later? Celtics 5yrs older. Are we better?
Allen and Pierce were flawed just like Melo and Stoudemire.
Chandler is flawed too.
KG is not flawed and the best player by far on that team.
You are right as much as I love Chandler his lack of offensive skills is what puts him below KG.
IrishKnickFan wrote:mrKnickShot wrote:Knixkik wrote:gunsnewing wrote:I wish this team had KG, Pierce, Allen and Rondo like the 2008 Celtics. We have flawed Amare and Melo. And it ends right there. The question is are we even better than the Celtics THIS year. 5yrs later? Celtics 5yrs older. Are we better?
Allen and Pierce were flawed just like Melo and Stoudemire.
Chandler is flawed too.
KG is not flawed and the best player by far on that team.
You are right as much as I love Chandler his lack of offensive skills is what puts him below KG.
He is not just below KG, he should not be discussed in the same sentence.
mrKnickShot wrote:IrishKnickFan wrote:mrKnickShot wrote:Knixkik wrote:gunsnewing wrote:I wish this team had KG, Pierce, Allen and Rondo like the 2008 Celtics. We have flawed Amare and Melo. And it ends right there. The question is are we even better than the Celtics THIS year. 5yrs later? Celtics 5yrs older. Are we better?
Allen and Pierce were flawed just like Melo and Stoudemire.
Chandler is flawed too.
KG is not flawed and the best player by far on that team.
You are right as much as I love Chandler his lack of offensive skills is what puts him below KG.
He is not just below KG, he should not be discussed in the same sentence.
Yeah I never said he should i was just stating the diifferences in tehir game. I mean i love Chandler because of his defense and his hustle. Garnett is an idiot but its amazing that he could still play this well at his age
Yeah, except Amare will never, ever be Kevin Garnett.
One similarity: the Knicks will also win 50+ games
I love how Grunny was realistic and said 'as a backup plan to amare suddenly playing great d let's surround him with chandler, Camby, krazy eyes, and sheed.
Believe baby!
mrKnickShot wrote:
Rondo >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Felton/Kidd
PG play is the real wildcard IMO. I read that Kidd will be closing out games but I don't know if thats just Kidd talking. Felton said that he was eager to learn from Kidd which is great to hear a vet admit that he isn't a finished product. I wish Stat had felt that way sooner, but better late than never.
You're right about Rondo, I seriously doubt they would have won a title without him. If Felton can take Kidd's lead and look to be a pass first PG, and doesn't call his own number too much we should be in good shape. Prigioni looked good against Team USA and made some really nice passes in traffic. He won't get a lot of minutes unless someone gets hurt but I get the feeling that he is going to surprise some fans.
