Knicks · As fans we forget so soon (page 3)

playa2 wrote:When you are in the playoffs , most young players don't play like they did in the reg season.

The veteran players know what to expect, the Celtics, the Heat, the rest of these teams will fold under pressure. The regular season is for positioning, but once the games begin the veteran teams are the ones that know how to win on the road.

Yes, the game changes, that is why having strong fundamentals/DEF/philosophy is crucial
Woodson has to be able to adjust to his injuries and philosophies as well
I am not blaming everything on Woodson but we had these problems since our injuries, while he never changed/adapted/adjusted to these changes
And he deserves to be accountable for it, he is stubborn

You cannot have a strong defensive system if 2-3 player's are constantly getting beat and need help, I don't care how much you preach it
TEAM DEF starts with the coverage, players, and abilities of 1v1 DEF
He has had plenty of time with practice to go tweak it, on both DEF and offense where we had problems since our injuries

His unwillingness to admit we need help at PG and a true PF not a Center playing PF, not starting JR Smith when we need his abilities
He is very loyal to his veterans and players, maybe that is why he does not want to cut anyone, but we need help and need to stop the bleeding
Kidd is NOT a PG and we lose his ability to spread the floor playing as the 3rd, sometimes 4th option, and exerts too much energy at the position without being effective is a triple negative

We don't have the ability to spread the floor, ability to penetrate, and play off the double triple teams we first had, so set more screens *off the ball, to free other's up*, run more plays and options, instead of having JR/Melo take poor shot one after another

Apart from Melo being the #1 in that department, players such as Chandler, Shumpert, Felton, Kidd and Smith (and in my opinion Camby's importance is underrated by most) are the ones that we must, I repeat MUST keep healthy if we want to stand a chance of winning anything.
Others are great assets to have, but when you have multiple guys within that group of players missing games it becomes a real issue.
Shumpert's perimiter defense would've made a huge difference atleast in a couple of games, while having a PG that can actualy run helps a lot, and having 2 beasts guarding the rim makes me feel much more confident on defense.

sebstar wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

playa2 wrote:Personally I think guys need something to whine about for us not winning 90% of our games, because of our fast start. Those people are called sometime fans, bandwagon jumpers, the i've been hurt before you won't hurt me again fans.

We're second in the division, doing better than anyone predicted in the preseason, and honestly these boards have never, never been worse. The worst part of us losing is coming on these boards and reading hater, after hater, spew their gleefully warped logic (Oh, every knick win doesn't count, only their losses are the truth! Trade everyone who hasn't had a monster game in the past week! We suck! Every team is better than us! Everything is going to get worse, and only worse! Amar'e hasn't hit his stride after 23 minutes- he must suck! Our players are immature! Everything our players do is wrong, and everything opposing players do is right!).

What happened to all the fun? The positivity or enthusiasm?

Derangement syndrome::

Obama : Fox news message board
Carmelo : Ultimate Knicks message board

A lot of people here have this psychological need for things to be bad, so their own fragile egos can be vindicated about being right about "the trade", and also the memory of their mediocre favorites like Gallo and lin can also be vindicated. Its all so stupid.

Again, it's also a non-psychotic worldview issue. We could win a chip and they'd begrudgingly talk about "cap space" and "building through the draft" and "playing the right way" and "sustainability".

Facts be damned!

I suppose things would make alot more sense here if martin and andrew would just rename the site ultimateNBA.com. Or UltimateBasketcaseball.com

smackeddog wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

playa2 wrote:Some people react like they have some sort of major investment in the team.

Even pro owners don't start to sweat until the playoffs roll around.

People need something else to complain about other than their own life choices and problems.

To be fair, I'd say we all have some sort of emotional investment in the team, as well as time and money. But I agree, the level of criticism seems to suggest people are projecting some sort of other issues onto the team, which I get- it's just annoying and for me, its taking some of the fun out of it, reading people trashing everything all the time. I wouldn't mind, but compared to the last 10 years, this season we have things pretty good.

I agree about a handle of people but how boring would this place be if everyone agreed and was not allowed to be critical? Kinda defeats the purpose of a forum/discussion in my honest opinion

It's not criticism itself that's the downer, but the sheer amount of it and the fact it's not even in any sort of fun way, if that makes sense. It's like having someone come round to your house and spend the whole time insulting the color of the walls, the carpet, the quality of the building, your girlfriend, your family, the clothes you are wearing etc etc, and constantly claiming "I told you so!"- you just get to the point of wanting to scream "STFU and GTFO!"

+1

too many around here cannot see the forest for the trees.

how long has it been that the the Knicks have sucked? Now they're leading the division and were first in the Eastern Conference for a little bit. Who gives a fuck about Carmelo Anthony's efficiency stats or that Jason Kidd and Marcus Camby are old? focused on all the wrong things but it's America and people can do whatever the fuck they want, regardless of whether or not it makes any rational and/or logical sense

playa2 wrote:People might need to be called out on this one. People complain about our slump, well go to any other team in the association and take out their starting backcourt and watch how the plummet in the win loss columns. Our depth has kept us above water, just wait until we get healthy my friends everybody will be afraid to play us.

I used to agree with this sentiment, but then you'll get into an argument with tkf (or similar) and it isn't worth the time/effort. I remember in 2006, right before I quit posting on Real GM, I got into an argument with that moderator over whether or not Dirk would be a Hall of Famer. He went on some rant about how stupid I was and how bad Dirk is/was. You just got to deal with stupid bullshit on a sports forum

GustavBahler wrote:Some folks just like dropping a turd in the punch bowl to watch the reaction.

Best part is, after the reaction. They get all innocent and such, start asking questions like why people are singling them out and what not.

like if anyone will remember Steph Curry and his first year's as injury prone to the way he has elevated his game now

How Camby was consistent not too long ago for many seasons in a row as a top rebounder/shot blocker in the league as he was doubted every year because of his age/history of injuries

Amare's MVP play/chant's and went from being a MVP candidate to a horrible player post Melo trade and the time after

Raymond Felton's first run here in Knick's as he was having a career year and traded for Melo, was traded for Andre Miller and a 1st round pick *as a FAT PG during lockout year and the changes this year*

How Jeremy Lin elevated the Knick's roster and the run he made to help us get in to the playoffs
How he actually played TEAM BALL/moved the ball, and got our roster to play as 1 unit, however some remember him as a ball hogger saying "Linsanity got in his head"

Wilson Chandler *versatile defender, as well as offensive player, and looked like a younger Gereld Wallace*/Gallo's value prior to the trade, their development, and ceiling/potential they had, but are remembered as ROLE players

Jared Jeffries and how he sucked for his first time here as a Knick and the improvements he made last year
How he was such a glue player, the intangibles he brings, and was part of our DEFENSIVE core that important during the run
Chandler/JJ/Iman were the big 3 DEFENSIVELY as Fields/Lin/Novak *did his job by boxing out*

Tony Douglous went from being one of the better young shooter's in the league and to complete garbage as he couldn't recover and regain his confidence after the lock out season

JR Smith's as a low IQ, only scoring mentality he had for his entire career, and how he is improved in all area's of his game this year as a legit All Star candidate
Ronnie Brewer looking like a complete steal at the start of the season hitting many 3point shot's, good cuts, and solid DEF, turning in to a poor rotation player
Novak as he was the league's highest efficient 3pt shooter and we now fail to utilize his ability without Jeffries here along with solid penetration/ball movement/player movement/picks off the ball

How well we played at the start of the season and the recipe of the success with 2 PG's *although Kidd isn't really one*, playing with ball movement, cut's, and trusted in each other on both ends

DEFENSE, Speed, penetration, ball movement, multiple ball handler's, Melo's ability to create shot's off mismatches for himself and the team at the PF

Because reg season gets thrown out the window, what you do in reg season doesn't guarantee you will do it come postseason.

Veteran teams with playoff experience in 7 game series usually win it all.

I like our chances.

playa2 wrote:When the playoffs start why don't these teams play the same ?

Because reg season gets thrown out the window, what you do in reg season doesn't guarantee you will do it come postseason.

Veteran teams with playoff experience in 7 game series usually win it all.

I like our chances.

No, teams that finish with one of the 2 best records in their conference usually win it all.

We are getting healthier by the week, just you wait and see.

playa2 wrote:So are you saying we don't have that chance how far are we from having the best record in our conference.

We are getting healthier by the week, just you wait and see.

Where did I say that? I was just countering your claim that veteran teams are the ones that usually win it all.

VCoug wrote:

playa2 wrote:So are you saying we don't have that chance how far are we from having the best record in our conference.

We are getting healthier by the week, just you wait and see.

Where did I say that? I was just countering your claim that veteran teams are the ones that usually win it all.

Sorry , I was commenting on Guns response

Ray Felton takes us to another level.

playa2 wrote:When we get our starting pg back we are going to run teams out the gym like we did in the beginning of the season.

Ray Felton takes us to another level.

If Felton being out is the difference in this team then we are in serious trouble