Knicks · Forum exercise: so-called haters list Melo's strengths; fans list his weaknesses (page 1)

I have always thought that it was a good mental exercise to be able to argue both sides of an issue, expressing arguments for either side of a debate. It requires intellectual honesty and by doing so opens ones mind or keeps it open, and also helps gain credibility with the people with whom one would otherwise be perpetually at odds. I am growing weary with all the endless debate based on ossified and atrophied points of view. It's like the gridlock we have in government.

I invite any of you to give it a shot! I am hoping it elevates the mood and creates good will.

Strengths

Strong Can Over Power Most Defenders
Quick Leaper Off Missed Shots Close To Basket
Excellent Midrange Shooter
Great First Step Off Dribble
Great Elevation On Jump Shot
Can Finish Shots With Lots Of Contact
Above Average FG
Decent Rebounder(although misleading at times)
Excellent Power Spin Dribble Into Lane
Pretty Good Bad Shot Maker
Very Good Isolation Player

Wait so I can only participate if I pick a side? What if I dont think of myself as being a hater or homer and just someone who tells it like it is. I say everyone just list pros and cons and then discuss which carries more weight? Or just accept that we are 30-15 and its not about any one player

I'm not a Melo hater nor Melo supporter. I simply enjoy and appreciate Melo as being our greatest overall Knick since Patrick Ewing. Our first true franchise leader since Patrick Ewing. And not even Ewing could score at Melo's clip/rate and/or from anywhere on the court such as Melo. In regards to myself, it's not about being a negative critic or positive homer in regards to Melo but everything about appreciating and being thankful for one of the greatest offensive forces our franchise has ever featured. Melo's just a pure scoring/offensive phenom in whom I enjoy come game time.

NYKMentality wrote:I'm not a Melo hater nor Melo supporter. I simply enjoy and appreciate Melo as being our greatest overall Knick since Patrick Ewing. Our first true franchise leader since Patrick Ewing. And not even Ewing could score at Melo's clip/rate and/or from anywhere on the court such as Melo. In regards to myself, it's not about being a negative critic or positive homer in regards to Melo but everything about appreciating and being thankful for one of the greatest offensive forces our franchise has ever featured. Melo's just a pure scoring/offensive phenom in whom I enjoy come game time.

list his weaknesses in one column and then list his strengths in a different column.

it's a good exercise.

gunsnewing wrote:Wait so I can only participate if I pick a side? What if I dont think of myself as being a hater or homer and just someone who tells it like it is. I say everyone just list pros and cons and then discuss which carries more weight? Or just accept that we are 30-15 and its not about any one player

list his strengths in one column and then list his weaknesses in another column.

Not sure why posters have come into this thread in true TROLL fashion if they didn't like the initial premise of creation.

Either post his Strengths and/or Weaknesses or stay out of the thread.

DK yes you should have started by posting both sides of Melo's game. I only posted his Strengths as I didn't want to bring the board down again.

I am not a hater. So I will list the weaknesses.

He complains to the refs too much, this was really bad in the beginning of the season, he has gotten somewhat better.

He could be better on D, now this is only based on the disparity between his dominance on O and his D being average.

He should be better at the free throw line, no reason for him to miss those and/or not to start a free throws made streak.

strengths:

perfect form on his jumpshot-- beautiful stroke
strong power dribbles from 16 feet and in
good spin moves to get to baseline fadeaway
good shooter behind screens going left
superior quick second ups for offensive rebounds usually off his own missed shots
combination of strength and speed creates constant matchup problems
good-natured

weaknesses:

poor shot selection
undeveloped footwork down low
sub-par ball handler outside of his power dribbles
does not use head and ball fakes enough to draw fouls
tends to hold the ball too long leading to stagnation and standing around
overrated finisher
often overwhelmed by bigger players
unmotivated defender makes too many silly fouls
lacks good court vision and planning ability-- the game has not slowed down for him
lacks poise and savvy
lacks leadership ability-- seems unable to take ownership when team is failing

Is good at:
- Can carry a team offensively
- Mid range game
- Second shot ability
- Presents matchup problems, requires double teams
- Can create/make shots that are of high difficulty

Needs to work on:
- Will go into all alone mode instead of sticking to the offense at times.
- Takes some bad pullup 3s, long rebound quick 3s
- Defensive intensity could be better.
- Can be frustrated by physical D and thrown off his game.
- End of quarter, half, game decisions are lacking. Too many times I've seen him trot the ball up the court with time winding down and settling for a long 3 instead of pushing the ball up the court to get a closer shot.

fishmike wrote:

NYKMentality wrote:I'm not a Melo hater nor Melo supporter. I simply enjoy and appreciate Melo as being our greatest overall Knick since Patrick Ewing. Our first true franchise leader since Patrick Ewing. And not even Ewing could score at Melo's clip/rate and/or from anywhere on the court such as Melo. In regards to myself, it's not about being a negative critic or positive homer in regards to Melo but everything about appreciating and being thankful for one of the greatest offensive forces our franchise has ever featured. Melo's just a pure scoring/offensive phenom in whom I enjoy come game time.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Im not a hater or supporter either. As Knick fan Im just waiting for him to do something interesting here that will provide a Knick memory that will last more than a week. Winning a playoff series would be a good start. While we are already MVPs and CHAMPS in some folks minds I find winning the big games to be even more enjoyable than dreaming of it.

PS: by big games I was not refering to the Olympics

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

I am a supporter, so I have no need to clinch to Dreams of average point guards taking over the nba like Godzilla or a 3rd wheel Euro scorer even sniffing Melo's jock strap. He is the best player the knicks have had in a looooooooooooong time and looking at where we are at right now,30-15 is better than a fiction 21-9 run. He deserves my support.

Charasmatic
Marketable
Durable
Prolific
sells tickets
Team winning % improved
is commited to winning

Exodus 20:3 says "Thou shalt not worship false idols."
Open hoof hard to market sneakers with.
egocentric/selfish/immature and thus gets tech's.
Not Kosher!

Just a few. Strength, Melo's ability to knife between defenders and lay it in. His ability to switch between an inside and outside game effortlessly.

Weakness, not being able to keep his head in the game at times. Sometimes takes too long after the catch to make his move to the rim. I don't mind ISO, lots of great players got great because they had the skill to consistently take advantage of a one on one situation. I will say it isn't as much of a problem this season.

Unforgiven

Carmelo is our Ray Lewis. No matter what Carmelo Anthony delivers on the court, it will never satisfy people who prefer their athletes more squeaky clean. (That includes tatoos) This in not an indictment of any so-called "hater". It is a stone cold fact of fandom. We prefer players who reflect our values and perceptions of ourselves.

Shot selection must conform to the "makeable" shot. When you can create any shot in the manual, what is a "good" shot? A shot with only one man on you? An open look without a hand in your face? Help me out here.

Of course, I despise the end of quarters when he stalls with the ball in his hands. As Andrew notes, it is a selfish and predictable move that makes the other four players invisible. Make or miss, clear outs are not my personal preference unless the dudes name is Michael Jordan. Even Michael trusted the Jordanaires to take a big shot.

Carmelo is a flawed individual with a bad attitude and an ingrained ghetto accent. He has created a mask with his smile to conceal his intense competitive fire. Don't let it fool you. Carmelo wants to win more than anything. On Broadway, he senses anger would not play well with the people on celebrity row. So he assumes the role of entertainer and smiles. He DOES enjoy the game. He enjoys the game like a sniper enjoys picking off targets from 500 yards.

Make no mistake. Carmelo had clear intent to jump Keven Garnett at the Celtics team bus. Garnett would have not backed down. It would not have been pretty. Thuggish behavior? Absolutely. Can it be corrected? Maybe. Maybe not. Some dudes operate on a competitive edge that is impossible to understand if you never played ball on an asphalt court you had to fight to keep. Literally.

No matter how much he tries he will never sound intelligent enough to satisfy the people who prefer their heroes to recite the Queen's english. You can take the kid out of Baltimore, but you cannot take the Baltimore (or Brooklyn) out of the kid. His pronunciation is rough around the edges. Until further notice, or a speech tutorial, that is just the way it is.

All of this nonsense about listing Carmelo's strengths and weaknesses is just that. Nonsense. Every player in the NBA has strengths and weaknesses. The undercurrent related to Mr. Anthony is about more than productivity. It is deeply shaded by perception. Those perceptions, unfortunately, are also shaded by racial preferences. He makes too much money, he does not work hard enough, he is incapable of thinking fast enough, he has never won anything of significance and we gave up too much to acquire him. Unforgiven. For all time.

No matter what Carmelo Anthony achieves, it will never be enough. This, he already understands.

pros:

great streak scorer
very good midrange shot
good strength
can finish at the basket although now getting his shot blocked a lot.
strong finisher around the basket
uncanny ability to get his own rebound off misses...ala zach randolph style..
wants to take the big shots....

cons:
not a good defender at all and worst of all not motivated to defend
lacks poise in physical games or games in which his shot is off
not a really good passer for a guy who has the ball as much as he does
doesn't move without the ball much
bad shot selection
not a leader
still selfish
will play hard under his terms only
sub par court vision

Yup, i deleted the posts that really has nothing to so with the topic. People gotta learn to stay on topic, or just not post at all

Strengths: high PPG and this year, above average scoring efficiency
Weaknesses: rebounding, blocks
Average: assist:to and steals
Basically the strength is scoring and, if he is going to be held to the standards of a star, the weaknesses are all other areas of the game.

Pros
- world class scorer from all areas on the court (this year)
- he gets his teammates easier shots due to the attention his opponents give him
- he's the most important offensive player on one of the best half court offenses I've ever seen

Cons
- awful temper and struggles to keep his emotions in check
- inconsistency with the hustle stats (for example: I don't believe for a second he's a below average rebounder - he can hit the glass he just doesn't do that nightly)
- really needs 'the star treatment'... his game suffered immensely when people were asking him why he and Amar'e underperformed together

Overall Score:
A- and one of the best players in the NBA. Subjectively, he's in my top-5 of active players. I think it would be very, very hard to argue that he's not in the top-15 and would be challenging to argue that he shouldn't be included in the top 10.

Anji wrote:He is the best player the knicks have had in a looooooooooooong time

This is fundamentally why I get so pissed off at the posters that harp on the areas that Melo needs to improve upon. Is Melo a perfect player? No. Do we all have a firm handle on areas we wish he would improve upon? Yes. But I fail to see why people don't support him when he is clearly the best player the Knicks have had since before the Andrew Lang incident. When posters say things that essentially imply someone better is around the corner, it really chaps my ass because - for the most part - they didn't post here when the Knicks were bad #realtalk

Pro's:

Super quick release
Terrific midrange shooter (the lost art)
Improved 3 point shooter
Good turnaround jumper on the baseline
Combination of speed and power makes him a tough cover
Uncanny ability to get his own miss
Strong finisher around the rim even with contact
Can score from anywhere on the court
Willing passer out of the double-team which gets open looks for others

Cons:

Plays D with his hands too much
Temper issues
Would like to see him curl off screens and move without the ball more
FTA has dipped this year....

misterearl wrote:Unforgiven

Carmelo is our Ray Lewis. No matter what Carmelo Anthony delivers on the court, it will never satisfy people who prefer their athletes more squeaky clean. (That includes tatoos) This in not an indictment of any so-called "hater". It is a stone cold fact of fandom. We prefer players who reflect our values and perceptions of ourselves.

Shot selection must conform to the "makeable" shot. When you can create any shot in the manual, what is a "good" shot? A shot with only one man on you? An open look without a hand in your face? Help me out here.

Of course, I despise the end of quarters when he stalls with the ball in his hands. As Andrew notes, it is a selfish and predictable move that makes the other four players invisible. Make or miss, clear outs are not my personal preference unless the dudes name is Michael Jordan. Even Michael trusted the Jordanaires to take a big shot.

Carmelo is a flawed individual with a bad attitude and an ingrained ghetto accent. He has created a mask with his smile to conceal his intense competitive fire. Don't let it fool you. Carmelo wants to win more than anything. On Broadway, he senses anger would not play well with the people on celebrity row. So he assumes the role of entertainer and smiles. He DOES enjoy the game. He enjoys the game like a sniper enjoys picking off targets from 500 yards.

Make no mistake. Carmelo had clear intent to jump Keven Garnett at the Celtics team bus. Garnett would have not backed down. It would not have been pretty. Thuggish behavior? Absolutely. Can it be corrected? Maybe. Maybe not. Some dudes operate on a competitive edge that is impossible to understand if you never played ball on an asphalt court you had to fight to keep. Literally.

No matter how much he tries he will never sound intelligent enough to satisfy the people who prefer their heroes to recite the Queen's english. You can take the kid out of Baltimore, but you cannot take the Baltimore (or Brooklyn) out of the kid. His pronunciation is rough around the edges. Until further notice, or a speech tutorial, that is just the way it is.

All of this nonsense about listing Carmelo's strengths and weaknesses is just that. Nonsense. Every player in the NBA has strengths and weaknesses. The undercurrent related to Mr. Anthony is about more than productivity. It is deeply shaded by perception. Those perceptions, unfortunately, are also shaded by racial preferences. He makes too much money, he does not work hard enough, he is incapable of thinking fast enough, he has never won anything of significance and we gave up too much to acquire him. Unforgiven. For all time.

No matter what Carmelo Anthony achieves, it will never be enough. This, he already understands.

Papabear Says

1 How many times have Melo been arrested?
2 How many times have Melo go charged with drunk driving
3 How many times have Melo beat his wife?
4 How many games this season have Melo saved
5 How many times this season have Melo scored more than 20 points
6 How many game have Melo sacrificed his body and didn't get a call
7 If you went to the games you'd see the love for Melo
8 How do we have a shot for a championship with out him
9 Who does the majority of fans come to MSG to see.
10 Who is the leader and star of the Knicks?
11 Who goes to special events for Kids? Melo
12 Who donates money to different boys clubs a his college? Melo
13 Doe's Melo take steroids?? NO
14 Is it a crime for Melo to smile?
15 You speak of Melo waiting for Garnet at the bus. Well guess what? if Garnet would have done the same thing to Oakly Garnet would have been droped right there on the hard wood floor.

You can point out all of the bad things you want about the man. But without Melo this team don't go to far in the playoffs.
This blog topic to me and I'm talking about my opinion is for the birds because you can say what you want, pick out his flaws. THEN WHAT? He is still the best player we've had since Patrick Ewing. So I will say the good things about him and those who have the negative things to say guess what?? You can't change a thing about Melo.He is rich, Famous, and his own man. He will be who he is like it or not.The Alfa Leader of the Knicks