Off Topic · UNIV OF MOBIL COACH (page 2)
playa2 wrote:Nalod wrote:I did a google "how to argue with a conspiracy theorist" and was shocked how many articles came up.No time to read them all but some were very informative. Most say its an impossible endeavor.
I'll take that advice to heart. The subject is very interesting.
“The conspiracy community regularly seizes on one slip of the tongue, misunderstanding or slight discrepancy to defeat 20 pieces of solid evidence; accepts one witness of theirs, even if he or she is a provable nut, as being far more credible than 10 normal witnesses on the other side; treats rumours, even questions, as the equivalent of proof; leaps from the most minuscule of discoveries to the grandest of conclusions; and insists, as the late lawyer Louis Nizer once observed, that the failure to explain everything perfectly negates all that is explained.”
— Vincent Bugliosi, from Reclaiming History: The Assassination of President John F. Kennedy.
The subject of "Denialism" is an interesting one and one I have read up on.
In the end, I won't debate playa2 on this. It maybe his passion to follow up on these matters but not mine do debunk. Seems many do a fine job themselves.
Funny you mentioned the word conspiracy theorist, I would consider myself a Truth Patriot.
Nalod I have a question for you, do you consider yourself an open minded critical thinking person, if so how can you possibly ridicule an opinion when you haven't even done 30 minutes of research into the matter?
Lets get one rule in place, I don't want to disrespect you because I don't really know you well. I respect those that were in the military but at the same time temper gratitude as it was employment for you and not compulsory. I assume you went to both serve your country but you were paid as well.
Its a volunteer service even if you are compelled by patriot aspirations. I hope you found gratification in your service.
My rule I propose is that we simply keep the issue and if its an issue I don't respect its just the issue and not Playa2.
That said I think its a great mask to use being a "Patriot". Timothy McVeigh and many a grand wizard have used extreme patriotism to justify right wing actions. Extreme Tea Party views use the mask as well to justify its position. Im using this an an example and not putting to question your motivations. I have a friend who is a tea party member and has all kinds of flags and "W" stickers on his car. They are fans of rush and glen beck. Its a mask for stupidity and mistake entertainment for news. Not everyone mind you. Being a patriot to me is to uphold the constitution. Not defend ones position on gay marriage. Making a living on trying to discredit Obama and his origin of birth was lame.
I am fascinated by the lengths by which persons seeking "truth" will go and the delusions that are fabricated. Personally its a dangerous thought process. Fear mongering never elevated any worthy cause or society. There are many very ugly instances in history that people used destructive tactics to motivate its people. Somtimes it was for worthy long term causes but most often it was not.
We have an open society and one that promotes truth. I will trust there is a process that will bring some issues to surface. I suppose its a question of credibility and who will bring it. When Garrison bought the kennedy conspiracy to the surface it was credible. When Watergate broke it was credible. Im sure for those two there are many many instances that went undetected. Some might be for our benefit, others not.
I have stated I don't believe the world is lilly white and as it reported, but I am generally an optimist and think this country is really quite good. There is a dark side to it all but there are many dark forces in this world. To me the dark side is usually motivated by the economics of things. Who profits, who does not. Maybe being open minded works both ways too?
If your Patriot ambitions are helping me live a beautiful life then I appreciate it. If they are paranoid delusions of self importance and help you deal with the sequence of events that answers are not at the moment attainable and prefer to assume its a "plot" then I hope you seek what our looking for without us being in a death camp thinking "damn, Playa was right".
If being a "truth patriot" defines you then your going to be highly offended by this. For that Im sorry but its not my intention to do so, just discuss the issue.
That being said, you will have the benefit of the last word or "laugh" as I really don't wish to take this discussion any further. When arguments are promoted based on subjective matters its there is not an attainable conclusion. I doubt either of us will "win" and I prefer to just respectfully agree to disagree.
What I will tell you is this, when it comes to lies by a shadow govt you must understand the wrong doers don't have to cover it up totally.
Even a bucket that has a few leaks can still do the job of carrying water from here to there! They only need to fool 80% of the public, which isn't hard to do when you control the major networks and newspapers. The 10-20% that do figure it out (and the fewer still who will dare to speak their minds about it) can be very easily marginalized with the propaganda label "conspiracy theorist." The 80% + never take us critical thinkers seriously because they want to be part of the majority. This is known as group think.
In the past you've have asked me "tell me how did they do X.Y.Z and who does it benefit ?
I don't have every missing piece of the puzzle. But I have enough pieces to KNOW that the government-media version ever since 911 type of false flags is not true!
Ex: Imagine if I gave you a 100 piece jigsaw puzzle, and told you that the image is of a beach in Hawaii.
But after snapping 30 pieces together, you notice polar bears, snow capped mountains, and men covered in furs. Although there are still 70 missing pieces, you already have enough to KNOW that the image is NOT that of a beach in Hawaii. It's the same with solving conspiracies. I may not have all of the details, but I have laid out enough pieces to know that the official stories has been pure lie.
You said "Being a patriot to me is to uphold the constitution". I will say being Paul Revere warning people on what's happening is my version of being a Patriot.
Nalod you also say above that "We have an open society and one that promotes truth". I BEG TO DIFFER, lies are the norm today and people prosper from lying daily.
I don't expect you to comment after this, I've given you my thought process and I hope it cleared up the "they are all the same type" stereotype that your post above implies.
I'm hoping this makes sense to you ?
I did not intend to lump you in to McVeigh, it was just a point.
Like I said, I won't be doing this anymore.
shadow government? Perhaps thats the big one.
Paul Revere would never have the cred if the redcoats never came. They did.
You made your point. I understand where your coming from.
Nalod wrote:
I did not intend to lump you in to McVeigh, it was just a point.Like I said, I won't be doing this anymore.
shadow government? Perhaps thats the big one.
Paul Revere would never have the cred if the redcoats never came. They did.
You made your point. I understand where your coming from.
You point was talking about a fringe group and a guy who may have been set up.
These false flags have to keep coming to eventually set up "MARTIAL LAW" 9/11 was enough !