Knicks · Should there be a limit on how many times a team can be in the lottery because of poor performance and loss of games? (page 1)

Papabear Says

It seems that there are several teams always hoovering around being in the lottery. Either because of poor management or just purposely blowing up the team or teams always having a loosing record year after year. Cleveland comes in mind. Top picks in the past few years.That's like money in the bank. I think that if you are a top 5 lottery team you can't be in the top 5 the next year even if you do a trade. This is how some teams build their roster. They tank their team for top draft picks.
What do you think??

no, just make it an even chance of winning for all non-playoff teams, so teams don't tank and the worst team doesn't have a guaranteed top 3 selection...

hmmm? i get your sentiment but i really dont think these teams TRY to be bad on purpose. Often the draft is a lottery (no pun intended). Especially nowadays, these kids ARENT READY for the pros. So all you do is draft RAW talent, that gets seasoned on the bench for a few yrs. Then by the time theyre ready to blossom, they have been traded away to another team. Back to your point though, I wouldnt penalize a team for being bad ONLY because theyre not trying to be (no intent). The teams who are good have gotten lucky with the draft or have locked up their star players

tkf wrote:no, just make it an even chance of winning for all non-playoff teams, so teams don't tank and the worst team doesn't have a guaranteed top 3 selection...

Papabear Says

Hmmm that's a good suggestion. On my goodness I can't believe I kinda agree with TKF

Papabear wrote:

tkf wrote:no, just make it an even chance of winning for all non-playoff teams, so teams don't tank and the worst team doesn't have a guaranteed top 3 selection...

Papabear Says

Hmmm that's a good suggestion. On my goodness I can't believe I kinda agree with TKF

we actually don't agree on one big thing, other basketball related stuff... no problem...

tkf wrote:

Papabear wrote:

tkf wrote:no, just make it an even chance of winning for all non-playoff teams, so teams don't tank and the worst team doesn't have a guaranteed top 3 selection...

Papabear Says

Hmmm that's a good suggestion. On my goodness I can't believe I kinda agree with TKF

we actually don't agree on one big thing, other basketball related stuff... no problem...

Papabear Says

That's why I put in the word kinda agree

tkf wrote:no, just make it an even chance of winning for all non-playoff teams, so teams don't tank and the worst team doesn't have a guaranteed top 3 selection...

then a team that just barely missed the playoffs could come away with the top pick while a team who really does need the help falls way down. there is no easy way to do this. the op idea may work well. you cant win the top pick X amount of times over Y years.

callmened wrote:hmmm? i get your sentiment but i really dont think these teams TRY to be bad on purpose. Often the draft is a lottery (no pun intended). Especially nowadays, these kids ARENT READY for the pros. So all you do is draft RAW talent, that gets seasoned on the bench for a few yrs. Then by the time theyre ready to blossom, they have been traded away to another team. Back to your point though, I wouldnt penalize a team for being bad ONLY because theyre not trying to be (no intent). The teams who are good have gotten lucky with the draft or have locked up their star players

Its complete luck. I havent seen a sure fire great prospect that was worth tanking for a shot at since Lebron. Clevelands number 1 pick this year is mehhh. Nerlens Noel a 206 pound center/PF with no offensive game. Ben McLemore a spot up jump shooter with athletic ability but cant create off the dribble or for his teammates. Otto Porter , Cody Zeller, Anthony Bennett? Trey Burke interests me some but for Cleveland who has a PG

I don't have a problem with how it's set up now. Papabear's proposal is just going to further damage the already weak teams in the league.

sidsanders wrote:

tkf wrote:no, just make it an even chance of winning for all non-playoff teams, so teams don't tank and the worst team doesn't have a guaranteed top 3 selection...

then a team that just barely missed the playoffs could come away with the top pick while a team who really does need the help falls way down. there is no easy way to do this. the op idea may work well. you cant win the top pick X amount of times over Y years.

fine.. then it will force teams to be even that much sharper in their scouting and putting talent together... the key is to get good to great teams in the league... what would be better for a team that just missed the playoffs, lets say with 42 wins, to get a top player and have a chance to quickly join the elites?

Bonn1997 wrote:I don't have a problem with how it's set up now. Papabear's proposal is just going to further damage the already weak teams in the league.

how? those weak teams have had top picks for years, and still are weak..it will force them to be that much better in every other area....

tkf wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:I don't have a problem with how it's set up now. Papabear's proposal is just going to further damage the already weak teams in the league.

how? those weak teams have had top picks for years, and still are weak..it will force them to be that much better in every other area....

That's like saying taking someone's food stamps away will make them get a job. Maybe they've had bad luck and a couple of bad decisions in the past. You can't just take the one resource people have away and expect improvement.

Bonn1997 wrote:

tkf wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:I don't have a problem with how it's set up now. Papabear's proposal is just going to further damage the already weak teams in the league.

how? those weak teams have had top picks for years, and still are weak..it will force them to be that much better in every other area....

That's like saying taking someone's food stamps away will make them get a job. Maybe they've had bad luck and a couple of bad decisions in the past. You can't just take the one resource people have away and expect improvement.

but this isn't food stamps bonn, these Franchises have millions of dollars, and are paying front office people mega bucks to build a winner.. with an equal shot, it still gives them a chance to get a great player, what this will also do, is take away a team who has a great player, who may get injured, the team tanks to get another shot at a great player... I don't really like that...

how about the teams that are not bad enough to qualify for a top pick? what about them, should they be stuck in mediocrity, year after year... maybe it should be adjusted a bit, for instance, if you finished with in the top 3 one year, the next year, you can't win the overall #1 pick.... or something of that nature.. give other teams, even teams that are not that bad, but still lottery a chance to improve themselves as well.

I think the current system works. If they tank then that is their cross to carry.

tkf wrote:no, just make it an even chance of winning for all non-playoff teams, so teams don't tank and the worst team doesn't have a guaranteed top 3 selection...

I think teams that obviously tank should be eliminated from the lottery and they should be fined by the league. Fans shouldn't have to pay full price to see a product that is actively trying to lose.

It's hard to say what is right. At this point, with the system as f'd up as it is, if you get the wrong franchise player or get good too quickly with the wrong infrastructure, you have 0% chance of winning for 3-5 years until the contracts expire. That's the disappointing part. At this point, I would much rather non-guaranteed contracts since we effectively have a hard cap.

As far as the draft and teams tanking, I think it's less of an issue if it isn't so hard to build teams properly in the first place and there isn't so much penalty for a mistake.

DurzoBlint wrote:

tkf wrote:no, just make it an even chance of winning for all non-playoff teams, so teams don't tank and the worst team doesn't have a guaranteed top 3 selection...

I think teams that obviously tank should be eliminated from the lottery and they should be fined by the league. Fans shouldn't have to pay full price to see a product that is actively trying to lose.

I can almost agree with that... I think tanking just ruins the integrity of the game..

tkf wrote:no, just make it an even chance of winning for all non-playoff teams, so teams don't tank and the worst team doesn't have a guaranteed top 3 selection...

The lottery is fixed , stop dreaming.

As I watched the outcome of who would win the #1 pick I knew Cleveland was going to win.

What Lebron did, was a slap in the face to the massa's of the association. They had to reward that Cleveland owner some way for the runaway that got away.

Here's Cleveland's owner's rant.

Dear Cleveland, All Of Northeast Ohio and Cleveland Cavaliers Supporters Wherever You May Be Tonight;

As you now know, our former hero, who grew up in the very region that he deserted this evening, is no longer a Cleveland Cavalier.

This was announced with a several day, narcissistic, self-promotional build-up culminating with a national TV special of his "decision" unlike anything ever "witnessed" in the history of sports and probably the history of entertainment.

Clearly, this is bitterly disappointing to all of us.

The good news is that the ownership team and the rest of the hard-working, loyal, and driven staff over here at your hometown Cavaliers have not betrayed you nor NEVER will betray you.

There is so much more to tell you about the events of the recent past and our more than exciting future. Over the next several days and weeks, we will be communicating much of that to you.

You simply don't deserve this kind of cowardly betrayal.

You have given so much and deserve so much more.

In the meantime, I want to make one statement to you tonight:

"I PERSONALLY GUARANTEE THAT THE CLEVELAND CAVALIERS WILL WIN AN NBA CHAMPIONSHIP BEFORE THE SELF-TITLED FORMER ‘KING’ WINS ONE"

You can take it to the bank.

If you thought we were motivated before tonight to bring the hardware to Cleveland, I can tell you that this shameful display of selfishness and betrayal by one of our very own has shifted our "motivation" to previously unknown and previously never experienced levels.

Some people think they should go to heaven but NOT have to die to get there.

Sorry, but that's simply not how it works.

This shocking act of disloyalty from our home grown "chosen one" sends the exact opposite lesson of what we would want our children to learn. And "who" we would want them to grow-up to become.

But the good news is that this heartless and callous action can only serve as the antidote to the so-called "curse" on Cleveland, Ohio.

The self-declared former "King" will be taking the "curse" with him down south. And until he does "right" by Cleveland and Ohio, James (and the town where he plays) will unfortunately own this dreaded spell and bad karma.

Just watch.

Sleep well, Cleveland.

Tomorrow is a new and much brighter day....

I PROMISE you that our energy, focus, capital, knowledge and experience will be directed at one thing and one thing only:

DELIVERING YOU the championship you have long deserved and is long overdue....

Dan Gilbert
Majority Owner
Cleveland Cavaliers

NO that's why there's a LOTTERY