Knicks · For this to work Brgs needs to play 5 (page 2)

I don't think Dirk plays in the post all the time and he's roughly the same size(7' 250 lbs). Dirk plays alot of faceup game as well.

Dirk sometimes plays in the post if he has a mismatch. Most of the time to set up his patented step back jumper.

Not saying Bargs is on the same level as Dirk is/was, but similar build and skillset.

ChuckBuck wrote:I don't think Dirk plays in the post all the time and he's roughly the same size(7' 250 lbs). Dirk plays alot of faceup game as well.

Dirk sometimes plays in the post if he has a mismatch. Most of the time to set up his patented step back jumper.

Not saying Bargs is on the same level as Dirk is/was, but similar build and skillset.

At 7' a player should accidentally grab 7-8 rebounds.

the one thing i do like is bargs running the pick n pop from the 5 position - he could be lethal with it. the problem is, you're going to give bargs 30mpg and how does that translate with chandler? chandler isn't going anywhere either. bargs most valuable position to us is the 5 for sure.

Tyson Chandler was one of the more mobile 7 + footers with good athleticism, mobility, length
However, last season he was NOT and I am not sure if it is due to his injuries or his age, but he also lacked heart

Without the mobility and physical abilities, he becomes a BIGGER liability on OFFENSE unable to make our opponents DEF pay for not defending him and fight for position for OFF boards
In addition to being a solid 1v1 defender and/or help defender that can recover to defend his own man for helping

For instance, trading for Greivez Vazqeuz 2,150,888 (upcoming season), 3,203,708 next season (RFA Qualifying offer)

2018 1st rounder
non guaranteed contract of Earl Barron
Ronnie Brewer's trade exemption
150% rule

If Chandler does not regain his physical abilities in mobility, athleticism, strength (do to loss weight from strep throat), and also continues to show signs of decline for his age, I do not think it would work, especially in a SPREAD/ISO offense

Bargs is what he is, we would need to throw him in to a team like the Pacer's with great size, rebounding (in all positions), great 1v1 and team DEFENDERS, all round skilled players with size/athleticism/skills, and in addition to shooters to spread the floor that play together unselfishly to make plays for one another for the OPEN SHOT
He is similar to what Amare was suppose to be at C on DEF/REB but on OFF as a shooter and does not shoot close to the 50% that Amare did prior to breaking down

This is one of the selling points we can give to retain JR Smith who has improved his penetration, handle, and driving/finishing/facilitating
Starting JR is a must as well and Barg's compliments each other with the team, unlike Chandler who was left my Hibbert to defend the paint and was not able to Hibbert/Pacer's pay as we were unable to get in the paint

Starting lineup

Vasqeuz/PG/IMAN
JR Smith/Hardaway
Iman/Melo/CJ Leslie
Melo/Copeland/Martin or Hagins
Bargs/Jermaine Oneil/Amare

Amare is going to be playing a 10thman role at 20mins a game without back to back games like a 38 + year old vet
5m MLE on one or 2 players
2m BAE
some young players like Muscula and future picks for Chandler

Kenyon Martin is more a center than Bargnani.

He will probably get spot minutes at Center though.

This also gets interesting on the defensive end with switches. Knicks got very big up front court now. Have Bargnani play PF on defense and let Melo play PF on offense. Things can get very interesting next season.

BRIGGS wrote:

djsunyc wrote:i thought bargs best offensive season was in 10/11 when he put on about 15-20 pounds and played alot in the post. then he lost the weight and became a more outside in guy.

whatever the case, he must be involved in the offense if you are going to utilize him right.

he can play in the post but after 1 or 2 tries there, he goes back to his comfort zone of the perimeter unless a play is called for him there.

here he is tearing up the heat - bosh had no chance. this one was from 10/11 where he was heavier and played in the post.

but this one was the next year when he was more perimeter oriented:

the thing is that he needs to get the ball and make his move. if you park him at the 3 and make him a catch and shoot player, it won't work.

He can play the post--if you look at his film--there is no doubt about that. Look at the mentality here--he cant do that-hes too soft. No he hasnt played in the post enough because the team hes on was not smart with his development. A guy who is 7 feet 260 is NOT a SF. We already have one of those his name is Melo and he shoots a lot. How exactly do you have 2 SF who shoot a lot and dont pass going to work? Not to mention that there would be two slow 7 footers in the starting line up? Nope for this to work Bargs would need to play a conventional 5 and we would need to acquire a 4 that can play a synergistic role with him. Its pretty easy to see--this is not FC Barcelona--this is the NBA when you are 7-0 260 with skills you play inm the post--you get higher % shots you rebound get to the line and make nice plays using the pass. If we want Bargs to float and shoot 27 footers this team will win 35 games. If he can play an effective post and avg 23 points 8 rebounds 3 assist 1 block and shoot 48% we would be close to 50 wins again.

BRIGGS wrote:

djsunyc wrote:i thought bargs best offensive season was in 10/11 when he put on about 15-20 pounds and played alot in the post. then he lost the weight and became a more outside in guy.

whatever the case, he must be involved in the offense if you are going to utilize him right.

he can play in the post but after 1 or 2 tries there, he goes back to his comfort zone of the perimeter unless a play is called for him there.

here he is tearing up the heat - bosh had no chance. this one was from 10/11 where he was heavier and played in the post.

but this one was the next year when he was more perimeter oriented:

the thing is that he needs to get the ball and make his move. if you park him at the 3 and make him a catch and shoot player, it won't work.

He can play the post--if you look at his film--there is no doubt about that. Look at the mentality here--he cant do that-hes too soft. No he hasnt played in the post enough because the team hes on was not smart with his development. A guy who is 7 feet 260 is NOT a SF. We already have one of those his name is Melo and he shoots a lot. How exactly do you have 2 SF who shoot a lot and dont pass going to work? Not to mention that there would be two slow 7 footers in the starting line up? Nope for this to work Bargs would need to play a conventional 5 and we would need to acquire a 4 that can play a synergistic role with him. Its pretty easy to see--this is not FC Barcelona--this is the NBA when you are 7-0 260 with skills you play inm the post--you get higher % shots you rebound get to the line and make nice plays using the pass. If we want Bargs to float and shoot 27 footers this team will win 35 games. If he can play an effective post and avg 23 points 8 rebounds 3 assist 1 block and shoot 48% we would be close to 50 wins again.

BRIGGS wrote:

djsunyc wrote:i thought bargs best offensive season was in 10/11 when he put on about 15-20 pounds and played alot in the post. then he lost the weight and became a more outside in guy.

whatever the case, he must be involved in the offense if you are going to utilize him right.

he can play in the post but after 1 or 2 tries there, he goes back to his comfort zone of the perimeter unless a play is called for him there.

here he is tearing up the heat - bosh had no chance. this one was from 10/11 where he was heavier and played in the post.

but this one was the next year when he was more perimeter oriented:

the thing is that he needs to get the ball and make his move. if you park him at the 3 and make him a catch and shoot player, it won't work.

He can play the post--if you look at his film--there is no doubt about that. Look at the mentality here--he cant do that-hes too soft. No he hasnt played in the post enough because the team hes on was not smart with his development. A guy who is 7 feet 260 is NOT a SF. We already have one of those his name is Melo and he shoots a lot. How exactly do you have 2 SF who shoot a lot and dont pass going to work? Not to mention that there would be two slow 7 footers in the starting line up? Nope for this to work Bargs would need to play a conventional 5 and we would need to acquire a 4 that can play a synergistic role with him. Its pretty easy to see--this is not FC Barcelona--this is the NBA when you are 7-0 260 with skills you play inm the post--you get higher % shots you rebound get to the line and make nice plays using the pass. If we want Bargs to float and shoot 27 footers this team will win 35 games. If he can play an effective post and avg 23 points 8 rebounds 3 assist 1 block and shoot 48% we would be close to 50 wins again.

If u can obtain a young pogo stick 4 that can block shots and rebound then it would work but I dont know where we are getting that for 3 mil

franco12 wrote:for this to work, he has to hit 40%+ of the 3pt shots he takes.

He is an improved version of Steve Novak! Not a poor man's Dirk!

He has to play the 4 and move Melo back to the 3. Functionally on offense, they play the opposite role traditionally expected- Bargs as the SF operating from the outside, and Melo on the 4 in the post.

Chandler needs to do 1 thing - play defense with a vengeance and grab rebounds as he will be the only one with size that has the capacity to board.

And Amar'e can cheer from the bench for 48 minutes a night!

This I disagree with. Novak can't put the ball on the floor at all, and doesn't have any post game. The videos he can do both, not sure how well and for how long but the fact remains he can do both.
I think like Bonn said it will work as long as he shoots well from outside, but Woody needs to force him to mix it up. They will have to design plays for him in the low post which is what really bothers me about this. I don't think Woody will actually do that with any regularity or consistency.

nixluva wrote:1st of all Bargs is not slow for a 7'er. Also Bargs makes plenty of sense playing alongside Tyson. If we're making a high % of our shots and not turning it over, then it doesn't matter how fast we are. Also Bargs is likely to play a fair amount at center anyway, so it's not a big deal really.

yeah, alonside Chandler keeps Melo at the 3 and less likely to be injured. Bargs has also shown an ability to block shots, not an intimidator but, better at it than Chandler. Melo for his health needs to stay away from playing the 4

Bargs for us will be what Memhet Okur was to the Jazz albeit as a bench player. I don't mind the player because of this likelihood; I just hate we gave away picks for a chronically injured guys.

Jmpasq wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

djsunyc wrote:i thought bargs best offensive season was in 10/11 when he put on about 15-20 pounds and played alot in the post. then he lost the weight and became a more outside in guy.

whatever the case, he must be involved in the offense if you are going to utilize him right.

he can play in the post but after 1 or 2 tries there, he goes back to his comfort zone of the perimeter unless a play is called for him there.

here he is tearing up the heat - bosh had no chance. this one was from 10/11 where he was heavier and played in the post.

but this one was the next year when he was more perimeter oriented:

the thing is that he needs to get the ball and make his move. if you park him at the 3 and make him a catch and shoot player, it won't work.

He can play the post--if you look at his film--there is no doubt about that. Look at the mentality here--he cant do that-hes too soft. No he hasnt played in the post enough because the team hes on was not smart with his development. A guy who is 7 feet 260 is NOT a SF. We already have one of those his name is Melo and he shoots a lot. How exactly do you have 2 SF who shoot a lot and dont pass going to work? Not to mention that there would be two slow 7 footers in the starting line up? Nope for this to work Bargs would need to play a conventional 5 and we would need to acquire a 4 that can play a synergistic role with him. Its pretty easy to see--this is not FC Barcelona--this is the NBA when you are 7-0 260 with skills you play inm the post--you get higher % shots you rebound get to the line and make nice plays using the pass. If we want Bargs to float and shoot 27 footers this team will win 35 games. If he can play an effective post and avg 23 points 8 rebounds 3 assist 1 block and shoot 48% we would be close to 50 wins again.

If u can obtain a young pogo stick 4 that can block shots and rebound then it would work but I dont know where we are getting that for 3 mil

I'm not sure how anyone can mistake this for a "post game"