Chuckbuck, not to get into the long "discussion" but after seeing what the Nets are doing and the taxes that they will pay its a very extreme example of what I have been talking about when a team makes serious financial commitment the owner must more than on board with it.
Getting AK47 in the manner in which they did really had to have had been on a personal level with Prokhorov. Maybe AK47 got some sort of off the table compensation "back home" to make this happen?
Nets ambition in this offseason is staggering! 90mil in Taxes alone! AK47 is the closest thing I have seen to Dennis Rodman and the kind of glue guy a successful team can use. Rodman and AK can take over games in a 90 second time frame and just be all over the court. Short bursts on both ends of court filling up a stat sheet. He was also tight with Deron. Im blown away by this move.
This is a prime example of an owner setting a directive and the GM following the plan laid out.
Blatch and AK be it thru bribes or opportunity want to play in BKN and this team can come out you in waves.
Read Mozgov was interested in playing and can't see how as Denver can match them but he'd be a big body to an already massive front line!
Does Pierce come off the bench? This team is insanely deep on paper!
Billy Kings roster additions using the russians money is making Isiah/Dolan's spending spree looks "frugal" in comparison!
On paper its very impressive but we all know its got to be proven on the court! Its going to be a very interesting year in NYC!
Naturally this team don't produce King/Prokhorov will look bad.
Isiah spent similar money but on the wrong players. It's not a money issue is this complete disregard of assets from ever Knicks GM even Walsh that keeps us down. So it is safe to assume that the owner is not doing a good job of laying out a plan and sticking to it as good owners do. Every Knicks GM feels the pressure to make an immediate splash knowing he will be fired if the team because a laughing stock in the papers and on radio. You have to figure Dolan is fuming over the Nyets "Takeover" I don't know how Grunwald and Woodson make it through this to see 2015
gunsnewing wrote:Isiah spent similar money but on the wrong players. It's not a money issue is this complete disregard of assets from ever Knicks GM even Walsh that keeps us down. So it is safe to assume that the owner is not doing a good job of laying out a plan and sticking to it as good owners do. Every Knicks GM feels the pressure to make an immediate splash knowing he will be fired if the team because a laughing stock in the papers and on radio. You have to figure Dolan is fuming over the Nyets "Takeover" I don't know how Grunwald and Woodson make it through this to see 2015
Knicks pay their guys well and coach's and GM's all know the gig before they sign up. They will all find jobs somewhere.
Fans look at coach's records and GM's record and think like players they can be replicated in the future. Layden "drafted" stockton and malone but drafting is a % game and the more picks you have the more diamonds you can find! Bring in a guy who is suppose to be a good draft man like Layden was and then basically strip the picks away does not play to ones strength. Left with one legacy pick in Sweetney his tenure looks awful. Isiah had some busts but he did pretty good because he also had a number of picks and we played some of them. Frye I thought was pretty solid but his injury was unfortunate and momemtum was lost.
I don't know what the Nets long term plan is to sustain a competitive team, or really the knicks for that matter. Im kind of just going with the short term flow as its the only way to really enjoy the knicks. I survived 40 years without a chip, I can go 40 more!
I guess when you put it that way I can go at least 40 more too
Prokhorov net worth $13.5 Billion
Dolan Family about $3 Billion
Of course Prokhorov don't care about luxury taxes! 
Isiah fails he gets extension.
Billy fails he might endup going for a helicopter ride with no landing privilege!
I see both the insanity in paying the tax but I also dig the passion to win and spend it!
BTW, I never faulted Dolan for being cheap and always credited him in the Isiah reign of terror to his willingness to spend. To bad it was with such ignorance and so little return!
Nyets doing the same? We'll find out!
gunsnewing wrote:Isiah spent similar money but on the wrong players. It's not a money issue is this complete disregard of assets from ever Knicks GM even Walsh that keeps us down. So it is safe to assume that the owner is not doing a good job of laying out a plan and sticking to it as good owners do. Every Knicks GM feels the pressure to make an immediate splash knowing he will be fired if the team because a laughing stock in the papers and on radio. You have to figure Dolan is fuming over the Nyets "Takeover" I don't know how Grunwald and Woodson make it through this to see 2015
but some owners are not BASKETBALL guys and wouldn't know what a good plan is (dolan). So they put their trust in these GM's to do what the owners lack the knowledge to do. That is why I don't have the hate for Dolan that most have because his biggest mistake was/is 2fold. Hiring the wrong GM's and then they loyalty he showed for them well past their expiration date.
DurzoBlint wrote:gunsnewing wrote:Isiah spent similar money but on the wrong players. It's not a money issue is this complete disregard of assets from ever Knicks GM even Walsh that keeps us down. So it is safe to assume that the owner is not doing a good job of laying out a plan and sticking to it as good owners do. Every Knicks GM feels the pressure to make an immediate splash knowing he will be fired if the team because a laughing stock in the papers and on radio. You have to figure Dolan is fuming over the Nyets "Takeover" I don't know how Grunwald and Woodson make it through this to see 2015
but some owners are not BASKETBALL guys and wouldn't know what a good plan is (dolan). So they put their trust in these GM's to do what the owners lack the knowledge to do. That is why I don't have the hate for Dolan that most have because his biggest mistake was/is 2fold. Hiring the wrong GM's and then they loyalty he showed for them well past their expiration date.
I like to think this myself. I thought Dolan does this from time to time as he has other fish to fry but then when (rumored) Layden says Marbury is not a good idea he fires him (im sure it was not the only reason) to the delight of bored fans and starphuchs with Isiah who banks on Marbury! Layden after the dice disaster had not paniced and was keeping assets and letting players expire. Isiah used that with leverage to make the mess he did.
Ok, Isiah is more of a basketball guy. Don't understand the thinking of bringing in Larry Brown. Never will.
OK, Isiah out and Walsh in.
Walsh is not a starphuch guy, his work in small market Indy has a history of drafting players (Davis boys, Smits, Reggie) and making some nice trades. Walsh was bought in to clean up the stench of Isiah and he hired MDA who does get a lot out of HIS TYPE OF PLAYERS. Walsh had to rid out the roster and looks like we are rebuilding with youthier players (growing assets that can be used on the court and in trades!) but also cleaned out space at great cost to make a run at Lebron. I get that, but instead We get AMARE, and I can't ever believe in the history of Walsh and how he constructed rosters he thinks ALONE thats a good idea. Sorry, I know he is the face of the franchise and quotes taking credit but its JUST NOT CONSTISTANT WITH HIS HISTORY.
But he real Dolan running things is when he shut down Walsh and in fear of Nyets getting Melo instead got involved.
Im not here to say Moz or the deal for Melo was good or not, just talking about Dolans involvement.
Owners get involved quite often. These are usually busy men and not involved in the day to day but most of the time GM's ahve budget constraints and if they spend money have to sell it to the owner. Did walsh sell Melo to Dolan?
Nalod wrote:DurzoBlint wrote:gunsnewing wrote:Isiah spent similar money but on the wrong players. It's not a money issue is this complete disregard of assets from ever Knicks GM even Walsh that keeps us down. So it is safe to assume that the owner is not doing a good job of laying out a plan and sticking to it as good owners do. Every Knicks GM feels the pressure to make an immediate splash knowing he will be fired if the team because a laughing stock in the papers and on radio. You have to figure Dolan is fuming over the Nyets "Takeover" I don't know how Grunwald and Woodson make it through this to see 2015
but some owners are not BASKETBALL guys and wouldn't know what a good plan is (dolan). So they put their trust in these GM's to do what the owners lack the knowledge to do. That is why I don't have the hate for Dolan that most have because his biggest mistake was/is 2fold. Hiring the wrong GM's and then they loyalty he showed for them well past their expiration date.
I like to think this myself. I thought Dolan does this from time to time as he has other fish to fry but then when (rumored) Layden says Marbury is not a good idea he fires him (im sure it was not the only reason) to the delight of bored fans and starphuchs with Isiah who banks on Marbury! Layden after the dice disaster had not paniced and was keeping assets and letting players expire. Isiah used that with leverage to make the mess he did.
Ok, Isiah is more of a basketball guy. Don't understand the thinking of bringing in Larry Brown. Never will.
OK, Isiah out and Walsh in.
Walsh is not a starphuch guy, his work in small market Indy has a history of drafting players (Davis boys, Smits, Reggie) and making some nice trades. Walsh was bought in to clean up the stench of Isiah and he hired MDA who does get a lot out of HIS TYPE OF PLAYERS. Walsh had to rid out the roster and looks like we are rebuilding with youthier players (growing assets that can be used on the court and in trades!) but also cleaned out space at great cost to make a run at Lebron. I get that, but instead We get AMARE, and I can't ever believe in the history of Walsh and how he constructed rosters he thinks ALONE thats a good idea. Sorry, I know he is the face of the franchise and quotes taking credit but its JUST NOT CONSTISTANT WITH HIS HISTORY.
But he real Dolan running things is when he shut down Walsh and in fear of Nyets getting Melo instead got involved.
Im not here to say Moz or the deal for Melo was good or not, just talking about Dolans involvement.
Owners get involved quite often. These are usually busy men and not involved in the day to day but most of the time GM's ahve budget constraints and if they spend money have to sell it to the owner. Did walsh sell Melo to Dolan?
well to be fair, Walsh WAS working on the Melo deal and everyone pretty much knew he was Walsh's targeted free agent. Dolan got involved once Walsh balked at the Nuggest asking price. He (walsh) didn't want to include all of what he did. Dolan got involved at that point. So, Walsh was the guy that got the Melo ball rolling and Dolan was the one that pushed it through.
Nalod wrote:DurzoBlint wrote:gunsnewing wrote:Isiah spent similar money but on the wrong players. It's not a money issue is this complete disregard of assets from ever Knicks GM even Walsh that keeps us down. So it is safe to assume that the owner is not doing a good job of laying out a plan and sticking to it as good owners do. Every Knicks GM feels the pressure to make an immediate splash knowing he will be fired if the team because a laughing stock in the papers and on radio. You have to figure Dolan is fuming over the Nyets "Takeover" I don't know how Grunwald and Woodson make it through this to see 2015
but some owners are not BASKETBALL guys and wouldn't know what a good plan is (dolan). So they put their trust in these GM's to do what the owners lack the knowledge to do. That is why I don't have the hate for Dolan that most have because his biggest mistake was/is 2fold. Hiring the wrong GM's and then they loyalty he showed for them well past their expiration date.
I like to think this myself. I thought Dolan does this from time to time as he has other fish to fry but then when (rumored) Layden says Marbury is not a good idea he fires him (im sure it was not the only reason) to the delight of bored fans and starphuchs with Isiah who banks on Marbury! Layden after the dice disaster had not paniced and was keeping assets and letting players expire. Isiah used that with leverage to make the mess he did.
Ok, Isiah is more of a basketball guy. Don't understand the thinking of bringing in Larry Brown. Never will.
OK, Isiah out and Walsh in.
Walsh is not a starphuch guy, his work in small market Indy has a history of drafting players (Davis boys, Smits, Reggie) and making some nice trades. Walsh was bought in to clean up the stench of Isiah and he hired MDA who does get a lot out of HIS TYPE OF PLAYERS. Walsh had to rid out the roster and looks like we are rebuilding with youthier players (growing assets that can be used on the court and in trades!) but also cleaned out space at great cost to make a run at Lebron. I get that, but instead We get AMARE, and I can't ever believe in the history of Walsh and how he constructed rosters he thinks ALONE thats a good idea. Sorry, I know he is the face of the franchise and quotes taking credit but its JUST NOT CONSTISTANT WITH HIS HISTORY.
But he real Dolan running things is when he shut down Walsh and in fear of Nyets getting Melo instead got involved.
Im not here to say Moz or the deal for Melo was good or not, just talking about Dolans involvement.
Owners get involved quite often. These are usually busy men and not involved in the day to day but most of the time GM's ahve budget constraints and if they spend money have to sell it to the owner. Did walsh sell Melo to Dolan?
For the record Walsh was down with the Melo trade, he just wasn't willing to part with Timofey... 
GOD DAM that Dolan for trading away TIMOFEY!!!! 
ChuckBuck wrote:Nalod wrote:DurzoBlint wrote:gunsnewing wrote:Isiah spent similar money but on the wrong players. It's not a money issue is this complete disregard of assets from ever Knicks GM even Walsh that keeps us down. So it is safe to assume that the owner is not doing a good job of laying out a plan and sticking to it as good owners do. Every Knicks GM feels the pressure to make an immediate splash knowing he will be fired if the team because a laughing stock in the papers and on radio. You have to figure Dolan is fuming over the Nyets "Takeover" I don't know how Grunwald and Woodson make it through this to see 2015
but some owners are not BASKETBALL guys and wouldn't know what a good plan is (dolan). So they put their trust in these GM's to do what the owners lack the knowledge to do. That is why I don't have the hate for Dolan that most have because his biggest mistake was/is 2fold. Hiring the wrong GM's and then they loyalty he showed for them well past their expiration date.
I like to think this myself. I thought Dolan does this from time to time as he has other fish to fry but then when (rumored) Layden says Marbury is not a good idea he fires him (im sure it was not the only reason) to the delight of bored fans and starphuchs with Isiah who banks on Marbury! Layden after the dice disaster had not paniced and was keeping assets and letting players expire. Isiah used that with leverage to make the mess he did.
Ok, Isiah is more of a basketball guy. Don't understand the thinking of bringing in Larry Brown. Never will.
OK, Isiah out and Walsh in.
Walsh is not a starphuch guy, his work in small market Indy has a history of drafting players (Davis boys, Smits, Reggie) and making some nice trades. Walsh was bought in to clean up the stench of Isiah and he hired MDA who does get a lot out of HIS TYPE OF PLAYERS. Walsh had to rid out the roster and looks like we are rebuilding with youthier players (growing assets that can be used on the court and in trades!) but also cleaned out space at great cost to make a run at Lebron. I get that, but instead We get AMARE, and I can't ever believe in the history of Walsh and how he constructed rosters he thinks ALONE thats a good idea. Sorry, I know he is the face of the franchise and quotes taking credit but its JUST NOT CONSTISTANT WITH HIS HISTORY.
But he real Dolan running things is when he shut down Walsh and in fear of Nyets getting Melo instead got involved.
Im not here to say Moz or the deal for Melo was good or not, just talking about Dolans involvement.
Owners get involved quite often. These are usually busy men and not involved in the day to day but most of the time GM's ahve budget constraints and if they spend money have to sell it to the owner. Did walsh sell Melo to Dolan?
For the record Walsh was down with the Melo trade, he just wasn't willing to part with Timofey...
GOD DAM that Dolan for trading away TIMOFEY!!!!
we are agreed. You got yours in while I was editing my response :) Not sure why the Nuggest even insisted since the let the guy rot on the bench.
It was the picks not the players that hurt us in the long run. Don't know if u blame Walsh or Dolan. You had to give up Gallo for Melo
Guys, we don't know whose idea it was. IM sure the knicks were in on it and it had great legs with the Nyets.
Walsh has been nothing but great in terms of taking the heat for not drafting Jennings, Melo trade, and even was nothing but complimentry of MSG/Dolan even after Dolan made an insulting offer to Donnie and basically left. Thats how most GM's are btw. They take it.
So I don't believe much of what donnie is quoted as saying as he was a team kind of guy. All class.
I blame this organization not individuals for its failures/starphuchedness in mediocrity over a long sample.
gunsnewing wrote:It was the picks not the players that hurt us in the long run. Don't know if u blame Walsh or Dolan. You had to give up Gallo for Melo
Walsh was pursuing him all year and had outlined his two star plan. I do think Dolan becomes enamored with the idea of having certain stars or at least can be easily convinced acquiring them Is the right move. I think the trade was a win for the Knicks and the best move Walsh made while he was in NY.
Walsh screwed us when he lost the Lebron sweepstakes and stuck is with that awful Amare contract.
The Melo trade wasnt the killer move the killer move was using the amnesty
And signing Amare to $100mil uninsured
Silverfuel wrote:Walsh screwed us when he lost the Lebron sweepstakes and stuck is with that awful Amare contract.
THAT is why I can't be down with Walsh. Amare's contract should have been filled with incentives requiring him to play a minimum amount of games. How do you not try to protect the franchise considering his injury history. I even remember reading a report right before the trade from out Phoenix where their doctors were saying Amare would need additional surgery within a year or 2.
Though, I should admit, I was LOVING Amare in his 1st season with us. Dude was even more Beastly than I though.
