Knicks · Knicks can WIN with Bargnani Starting at PF (page 13)

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Bargnani and Melo may improve each other's games a little. We can at least hope. I don't see how they'd ever form a championship-level one-two scoring combo though - not when other teams have Lebron-Wade, Durant-Westbrook, Harden-Howard, or Parker-Duncan one-two combos.

Bargs seems to be a great third option...We do have a lot of talent do and we are deep...We need another guy to step up his play...Bargs and JR as your third and fourth option can make a very good team...

Is Melo 1st and 2nd option?

Top 2 or 3 scorer in the game ??..I'll say first

He's referring to the fact that you've listed Bargs as the third option but haven't said who that means the 2nd option is.

Right, that's the thing, to compete, we need a second option...I don't think Bargs is it..

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Bargnani and Melo may improve each other's games a little. We can at least hope. I don't see how they'd ever form a championship-level one-two scoring combo though - not when other teams have Lebron-Wade, Durant-Westbrook, Harden-Howard, or Parker-Duncan one-two combos.

Bargs seems to be a great third option...We do have a lot of talent do and we are deep...We need another guy to step up his play...Bargs and JR as your third and fourth option can make a very good team...

Is Melo 1st and 2nd option?

Top 2 or 3 scorer in the game ??..I'll say first

He's referring to the fact that you've listed Bargs as the third option but haven't said who that means the 2nd option is.

Right, that's the thing, to compete, we need a second option...I don't think Bargs is it..

Well that's a serious problem then. We won't be able to get that kind of scorer until the salaries are cleared 3 years from now. And Melo will be entering his thirteenth season then and in all likelihood well into the downward part of his career.

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Bargnani and Melo may improve each other's games a little. We can at least hope. I don't see how they'd ever form a championship-level one-two scoring combo though - not when other teams have Lebron-Wade, Durant-Westbrook, Harden-Howard, or Parker-Duncan one-two combos.

Bargs seems to be a great third option...We do have a lot of talent do and we are deep...We need another guy to step up his play...Bargs and JR as your third and fourth option can make a very good team...

Is Melo 1st and 2nd option?

Top 2 or 3 scorer in the game ??..I'll say first

He's referring to the fact that you've listed Bargs as the third option but haven't said who that means the 2nd option is.

Right, that's the thing, to compete, we need a second option...I don't think Bargs is it..

True but we seems deep enough to make it interesting this year...Can we get it together like Indy did by the end of the year???...This is the best talent I have seen in the last decade..

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Bargnani and Melo may improve each other's games a little. We can at least hope. I don't see how they'd ever form a championship-level one-two scoring combo though - not when other teams have Lebron-Wade, Durant-Westbrook, Harden-Howard, or Parker-Duncan one-two combos.

Bargs seems to be a great third option...We do have a lot of talent do and we are deep...We need another guy to step up his play...Bargs and JR as your third and fourth option can make a very good team...

Is Melo 1st and 2nd option?

Top 2 or 3 scorer in the game ??..I'll say first

He's referring to the fact that you've listed Bargs as the third option but haven't said who that means the 2nd option is.

Right, that's the thing, to compete, we need a second option...I don't think Bargs is it..

True but we seems deep enough to make it interesting this year...Can we get it together like Indy did by the end of the year???...This is the best talent I have seen in the last decade..

Grunwald did a great job while positioning the Knicks for the future. Can't believe the guy was demoted. I do think Bargs can be the second scorer for this team.

CrushAlot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Bargnani and Melo may improve each other's games a little. We can at least hope. I don't see how they'd ever form a championship-level one-two scoring combo though - not when other teams have Lebron-Wade, Durant-Westbrook, Harden-Howard, or Parker-Duncan one-two combos.

Bargs seems to be a great third option...We do have a lot of talent do and we are deep...We need another guy to step up his play...Bargs and JR as your third and fourth option can make a very good team...

Is Melo 1st and 2nd option?

Top 2 or 3 scorer in the game ??..I'll say first

He's referring to the fact that you've listed Bargs as the third option but haven't said who that means the 2nd option is.

Right, that's the thing, to compete, we need a second option...I don't think Bargs is it..

True but we seems deep enough to make it interesting this year...Can we get it together like Indy did by the end of the year???...This is the best talent I have seen in the last decade..

Grunwald did a great job while positioning the Knicks for the future. Can't believe the guy was demoted. I do think Bargs can be the second scorer for this team.

I'm hearing it been H20 on the phones...If it's all Grunwald then it's a shame.. But I can't defend Novak's, Kidd's and Camby's contracts..

holfresh wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Bargnani and Melo may improve each other's games a little. We can at least hope. I don't see how they'd ever form a championship-level one-two scoring combo though - not when other teams have Lebron-Wade, Durant-Westbrook, Harden-Howard, or Parker-Duncan one-two combos.

Bargs seems to be a great third option...We do have a lot of talent do and we are deep...We need another guy to step up his play...Bargs and JR as your third and fourth option can make a very good team...

Is Melo 1st and 2nd option?

Top 2 or 3 scorer in the game ??..I'll say first

He's referring to the fact that you've listed Bargs as the third option but haven't said who that means the 2nd option is.

Right, that's the thing, to compete, we need a second option...I don't think Bargs is it..

True but we seems deep enough to make it interesting this year...Can we get it together like Indy did by the end of the year???...This is the best talent I have seen in the last decade..

Grunwald did a great job while positioning the Knicks for the future. Can't believe the guy was demoted. I do think Bargs can be the second scorer for this team.

I'm hearing it been H20 on the phones...If it's all Grunwald then it's a shame.. But I can't defend Novak's, Kidd's and Camby's contracts..

Haven't heard anything about Allan. I thought he was running the d league team. Grunwald was given credit for every move I am aware of. I think his last signing was Aldrich.

CrushAlot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Bargnani and Melo may improve each other's games a little. We can at least hope. I don't see how they'd ever form a championship-level one-two scoring combo though - not when other teams have Lebron-Wade, Durant-Westbrook, Harden-Howard, or Parker-Duncan one-two combos.

Bargs seems to be a great third option...We do have a lot of talent do and we are deep...We need another guy to step up his play...Bargs and JR as your third and fourth option can make a very good team...

Is Melo 1st and 2nd option?

Top 2 or 3 scorer in the game ??..I'll say first

He's referring to the fact that you've listed Bargs as the third option but haven't said who that means the 2nd option is.

Right, that's the thing, to compete, we need a second option...I don't think Bargs is it..

True but we seems deep enough to make it interesting this year...Can we get it together like Indy did by the end of the year???...This is the best talent I have seen in the last decade..

Grunwald did a great job while positioning the Knicks for the future. Can't believe the guy was demoted. I do think Bargs can be the second scorer for this team.

I'm hearing it been H20 on the phones...If it's all Grunwald then it's a shame.. But I can't defend Novak's, Kidd's and Camby's contracts..

Haven't heard anything about Allan. I thought he was running the d league team. Grunwald was given credit for every move I am aware of. I think his last signing was Aldrich.

SAS said Houston is the guy who works the phones most...

Bargnani has a scoring advantage almost every time he's got the ball. It's going to be very important for Woodson to make sure that Bargs gets plenty of touches in the flow of the offense. The plays have to be designed with AB involved as a top scoring option. As a coach you are the one responsible for making sure that your best players are put in the best position to score. Melo and Bargnani should figure heavily in the game plan. I believe Woody believes in that combo at the top of the scoring chain as he should. Aside from Melo and STAT, Bargnani is the only other player who has been a primary option scoring 20 ppg.

I'm hoping that Bargnani can get comfortable and gain his full confidence back. This team needs him to be clicking on all cylinders. They will need time to build chemistry over the course of the season. Melo has been talking to Bargnani about being aggressive and I think that's going to be very important.

holfresh wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Bargnani and Melo may improve each other's games a little. We can at least hope. I don't see how they'd ever form a championship-level one-two scoring combo though - not when other teams have Lebron-Wade, Durant-Westbrook, Harden-Howard, or Parker-Duncan one-two combos.

Bargs seems to be a great third option...We do have a lot of talent do and we are deep...We need another guy to step up his play...Bargs and JR as your third and fourth option can make a very good team...

Is Melo 1st and 2nd option?

Top 2 or 3 scorer in the game ??..I'll say first

He's referring to the fact that you've listed Bargs as the third option but haven't said who that means the 2nd option is.

Right, that's the thing, to compete, we need a second option...I don't think Bargs is it..

True but we seems deep enough to make it interesting this year...Can we get it together like Indy did by the end of the year???...This is the best talent I have seen in the last decade..

Grunwald did a great job while positioning the Knicks for the future. Can't believe the guy was demoted. I do think Bargs can be the second scorer for this team.

I'm hearing it been H20 on the phones...If it's all Grunwald then it's a shame.. But I can't defend Novak's, Kidd's and Camby's contracts..

Haven't heard anything about Allan. I thought he was running the d league team. Grunwald was given credit for every move I am aware of. I think his last signing was Aldrich.

SAS said Houston is the guy who works the phones most...

Wow. Is that since Grunwald left or while he was gm? Grunwald has gotten credit for being a very smart, opportunistic and innovative guy. Was it Allan?

CrushAlot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Bargnani and Melo may improve each other's games a little. We can at least hope. I don't see how they'd ever form a championship-level one-two scoring combo though - not when other teams have Lebron-Wade, Durant-Westbrook, Harden-Howard, or Parker-Duncan one-two combos.

Bargs seems to be a great third option...We do have a lot of talent do and we are deep...We need another guy to step up his play...Bargs and JR as your third and fourth option can make a very good team...

Is Melo 1st and 2nd option?

Top 2 or 3 scorer in the game ??..I'll say first

He's referring to the fact that you've listed Bargs as the third option but haven't said who that means the 2nd option is.

Right, that's the thing, to compete, we need a second option...I don't think Bargs is it..

True but we seems deep enough to make it interesting this year...Can we get it together like Indy did by the end of the year???...This is the best talent I have seen in the last decade..

Grunwald did a great job while positioning the Knicks for the future. Can't believe the guy was demoted. I do think Bargs can be the second scorer for this team.

I'm hearing it been H20 on the phones...If it's all Grunwald then it's a shame.. But I can't defend Novak's, Kidd's and Camby's contracts..

Haven't heard anything about Allan. I thought he was running the d league team. Grunwald was given credit for every move I am aware of. I think his last signing was Aldrich.

SAS said Houston is the guy who works the phones most...

Wow. Is that since Grunwald left or while he was gm? Grunwald has gotten credit for being a very smart, opportunistic and innovative guy. Was it Allan?

That was when Grunwald was there..Copeland had a very interesting quote after he heard the news about Grunwald firing...He said he was sorry to hear that because Grunwald was a nice guy but then he said he thinks this is great for Houston, he one of the great basketball minds he has spoken to and he would do well...

holfresh wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Bargnani and Melo may improve each other's games a little. We can at least hope. I don't see how they'd ever form a championship-level one-two scoring combo though - not when other teams have Lebron-Wade, Durant-Westbrook, Harden-Howard, or Parker-Duncan one-two combos.

Bargs seems to be a great third option...We do have a lot of talent do and we are deep...We need another guy to step up his play...Bargs and JR as your third and fourth option can make a very good team...

Is Melo 1st and 2nd option?

Top 2 or 3 scorer in the game ??..I'll say first

He's referring to the fact that you've listed Bargs as the third option but haven't said who that means the 2nd option is.

Right, that's the thing, to compete, we need a second option...I don't think Bargs is it..

True but we seems deep enough to make it interesting this year...Can we get it together like Indy did by the end of the year???...This is the best talent I have seen in the last decade..

Grunwald did a great job while positioning the Knicks for the future. Can't believe the guy was demoted. I do think Bargs can be the second scorer for this team.

I'm hearing it been H20 on the phones...If it's all Grunwald then it's a shame.. But I can't defend Novak's, Kidd's and Camby's contracts..

Haven't heard anything about Allan. I thought he was running the d league team. Grunwald was given credit for every move I am aware of. I think his last signing was Aldrich.

SAS said Houston is the guy who works the phones most...

Wow. Is that since Grunwald left or while he was gm? Grunwald has gotten credit for being a very smart, opportunistic and innovative guy. Was it Allan?

That was when Grunwald was there..Copeland had a very interesting quote after he heard the news about Grunwald firing...He said he was sorry to hear that because Grunwald was a nice guy but then he said he thinks this is great for Houston, he one of the great basketball minds he has spoken to and he would do well...

If that is the case I hope Houston steps into Mills role sooner rather then later.

yellowboy90 wrote:I like Novak but I wonder why many teams have let him go even though he continues to show that he is a good/great shooter.

As for Bargs creating more space I don't know how you can judge that. What I do think is that because of his versatility if Bargs is on defenders will be in a conundrum trying to defend him. With Novak you could lay off and defend him with a small guy that can close hard which would take away all the work an offense did to get the defense of balance. Because Bargs can actually put the ball on the ground to score he puts more pressure on the D and possibly keeps the D off balance. The key will be him making the simple passes as the D rotates when he drives.

Whatever you say doesn't matter. Anything he does is negated by his absolutely awful defensive and rebounding play. It's like Eddy Curry's 19 and 7 season. It was a complete stat-pad, empty stat of a season. Andrea Bargnani is our new Eddy Curry. He is the laziest, softest loser we have had here since Curry left the team. You and many others who try to rationalize every single Knicks trade in existence will soon come to realize the painful truth. The man is pathetic on the basketball court. Be prepared for him to feel the wrath of the fans early on in the season if he puts up the effort he has his entire career until now.

JamesKPolk wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:I like Novak but I wonder why many teams have let him go even though he continues to show that he is a good/great shooter.

As for Bargs creating more space I don't know how you can judge that. What I do think is that because of his versatility if Bargs is on defenders will be in a conundrum trying to defend him. With Novak you could lay off and defend him with a small guy that can close hard which would take away all the work an offense did to get the defense of balance. Because Bargs can actually put the ball on the ground to score he puts more pressure on the D and possibly keeps the D off balance. The key will be him making the simple passes as the D rotates when he drives.

Whatever you say doesn't matter. Anything he does is negated by his absolutely awful defensive and rebounding play. It's like Eddy Curry's 19 and 7 season. It was a complete stat-pad, empty stat of a season. Andrea Bargnani is our new Eddy Curry. He is the laziest, softest loser we have had here since Curry left the team. You and many others who try to rationalize every single Knicks trade in existence will soon come to realize the painful truth. The man is pathetic on the basketball court. Be prepared for him to feel the wrath of the fans early on in the season if he puts up the effort he has his entire career until now.

The difference for AB is that he's going to be part of a roster that has more talent around him. There are some similarities between Curry and Bargnani but I don't think he's as bad as you're making him out to be. The role that Bargnani is playing is far different than the role Curry played for this team. Bargnani doesn't have to hold down the middle on D or be a beast on the boards. We need him to mainly help Melo with the scoring. Bargnani isn't being asked to carry this team.

I think we need to give Bargs time to adjust to the culture of this team which is to work hard and give effort. When Bargs sees himself on film any lack of effort should be addressed by Woody and also in practice. We'll see how things work out here in NY. I don't really want to get too carried away with assuming Bargs is gonna be a problem before we even get him thru his 1st camp with this team. I'm not saying it's not a concern, but the jury is still out on this.

nixluva wrote:

JamesKPolk wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:I like Novak but I wonder why many teams have let him go even though he continues to show that he is a good/great shooter.

As for Bargs creating more space I don't know how you can judge that. What I do think is that because of his versatility if Bargs is on defenders will be in a conundrum trying to defend him. With Novak you could lay off and defend him with a small guy that can close hard which would take away all the work an offense did to get the defense of balance. Because Bargs can actually put the ball on the ground to score he puts more pressure on the D and possibly keeps the D off balance. The key will be him making the simple passes as the D rotates when he drives.

Whatever you say doesn't matter. Anything he does is negated by his absolutely awful defensive and rebounding play. It's like Eddy Curry's 19 and 7 season. It was a complete stat-pad, empty stat of a season. Andrea Bargnani is our new Eddy Curry. He is the laziest, softest loser we have had here since Curry left the team. You and many others who try to rationalize every single Knicks trade in existence will soon come to realize the painful truth. The man is pathetic on the basketball court. Be prepared for him to feel the wrath of the fans early on in the season if he puts up the effort he has his entire career until now.

The difference for AB is that he's going to be part of a roster that has more talent around him. There are some similarities between Curry and Bargnani but I don't think he's as bad as you're making him out to be. The role that Bargnani is playing is far different than the role Curry played for this team. Bargnani doesn't have to hold down the middle on D or be a beast on the boards. We need him to mainly help Melo with the scoring. Bargnani isn't being asked to carry this team.

I think we need to give Bargs time to adjust to the culture of this team which is to work hard and give effort. When Bargs sees himself on film any lack of effort should be addressed by Woody and also in practice. We'll see how things work out here in NY. I don't really want to get too carried away with assuming Bargs is gonna be a problem before we even get him thru his 1st camp with this team. I'm not saying it's not a concern, but the jury is still out on this.

The funny thing is that i have said pretty much the same thing that you said right now but i got accused of being too hard on him lol

Nixluva im holding you accountable for andreas play this year. Lol

Im back in the states now so I get to see him play

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

JamesKPolk wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:I like Novak but I wonder why many teams have let him go even though he continues to show that he is a good/great shooter.

As for Bargs creating more space I don't know how you can judge that. What I do think is that because of his versatility if Bargs is on defenders will be in a conundrum trying to defend him. With Novak you could lay off and defend him with a small guy that can close hard which would take away all the work an offense did to get the defense of balance. Because Bargs can actually put the ball on the ground to score he puts more pressure on the D and possibly keeps the D off balance. The key will be him making the simple passes as the D rotates when he drives.

Whatever you say doesn't matter. Anything he does is negated by his absolutely awful defensive and rebounding play. It's like Eddy Curry's 19 and 7 season. It was a complete stat-pad, empty stat of a season. Andrea Bargnani is our new Eddy Curry. He is the laziest, softest loser we have had here since Curry left the team. You and many others who try to rationalize every single Knicks trade in existence will soon come to realize the painful truth. The man is pathetic on the basketball court. Be prepared for him to feel the wrath of the fans early on in the season if he puts up the effort he has his entire career until now.

The difference for AB is that he's going to be part of a roster that has more talent around him. There are some similarities between Curry and Bargnani but I don't think he's as bad as you're making him out to be. The role that Bargnani is playing is far different than the role Curry played for this team. Bargnani doesn't have to hold down the middle on D or be a beast on the boards. We need him to mainly help Melo with the scoring. Bargnani isn't being asked to carry this team.

I think we need to give Bargs time to adjust to the culture of this team which is to work hard and give effort. When Bargs sees himself on film any lack of effort should be addressed by Woody and also in practice. We'll see how things work out here in NY. I don't really want to get too carried away with assuming Bargs is gonna be a problem before we even get him thru his 1st camp with this team. I'm not saying it's not a concern, but the jury is still out on this.

The funny thing is that i have said pretty much the same thing that you said right now but i got accused of being too hard on him lol

I think the difference between how I express things is that my take is that he's going to have a net positive impact despite not being a strong rebounder or defender. There seems to be this concern about his presence that is overstated IMO. He's been brought in for his SCORING ability and as a good sidekick for Melo in the SL. We've lacked that 2nd guy to worry about in the SL and AB provides that regardless of his issues on the other end. I'm more optimistic that he'll adjust to our level of effort from being around it all year. The other poster mentions Curry, but Curry was in a more central role than AB is. Melo is in the Curry role as the top player and AB is a sidekick. The Knicks can win despite AB but if he plays well that can enhance this teams prospects. Curry was in a spot that the team was dependent on him performing at a high level much more.

nixluva wrote:

JamesKPolk wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:I like Novak but I wonder why many teams have let him go even though he continues to show that he is a good/great shooter.

As for Bargs creating more space I don't know how you can judge that. What I do think is that because of his versatility if Bargs is on defenders will be in a conundrum trying to defend him. With Novak you could lay off and defend him with a small guy that can close hard which would take away all the work an offense did to get the defense of balance. Because Bargs can actually put the ball on the ground to score he puts more pressure on the D and possibly keeps the D off balance. The key will be him making the simple passes as the D rotates when he drives.

Whatever you say doesn't matter. Anything he does is negated by his absolutely awful defensive and rebounding play. It's like Eddy Curry's 19 and 7 season. It was a complete stat-pad, empty stat of a season. Andrea Bargnani is our new Eddy Curry. He is the laziest, softest loser we have had here since Curry left the team. You and many others who try to rationalize every single Knicks trade in existence will soon come to realize the painful truth. The man is pathetic on the basketball court. Be prepared for him to feel the wrath of the fans early on in the season if he puts up the effort he has his entire career until now.

The difference for AB is that he's going to be part of a roster that has more talent around him. There are some similarities between Curry and Bargnani but I don't think he's as bad as you're making him out to be. The role that Bargnani is playing is far different than the role Curry played for this team. Bargnani doesn't have to hold down the middle on D or be a beast on the boards. We need him to mainly help Melo with the scoring. Bargnani isn't being asked to carry this team.

I think we need to give Bargs time to adjust to the culture of this team which is to work hard and give effort. When Bargs sees himself on film any lack of effort should be addressed by Woody and also in practice. We'll see how things work out here in NY. I don't really want to get too carried away with assuming Bargs is gonna be a problem before we even get him thru his 1st camp with this team. I'm not saying it's not a concern, but the jury is still out on this.

I agree. While Curry and Bargnani have some similarities, they are in different situations. Curry was expected to be the main scorer and all-star player. Bargnani used to be in that position, but is now asked to be a complimentary scorer and role player. Big difference. If he can average 15-plus pts and 5-plus rebs and shoot decent percentages from the field and 3 while getting to the line a good amount, he will accomplish what we need of him.

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

JamesKPolk wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:I like Novak but I wonder why many teams have let him go even though he continues to show that he is a good/great shooter.

As for Bargs creating more space I don't know how you can judge that. What I do think is that because of his versatility if Bargs is on defenders will be in a conundrum trying to defend him. With Novak you could lay off and defend him with a small guy that can close hard which would take away all the work an offense did to get the defense of balance. Because Bargs can actually put the ball on the ground to score he puts more pressure on the D and possibly keeps the D off balance. The key will be him making the simple passes as the D rotates when he drives.

Whatever you say doesn't matter. Anything he does is negated by his absolutely awful defensive and rebounding play. It's like Eddy Curry's 19 and 7 season. It was a complete stat-pad, empty stat of a season. Andrea Bargnani is our new Eddy Curry. He is the laziest, softest loser we have had here since Curry left the team. You and many others who try to rationalize every single Knicks trade in existence will soon come to realize the painful truth. The man is pathetic on the basketball court. Be prepared for him to feel the wrath of the fans early on in the season if he puts up the effort he has his entire career until now.

The difference for AB is that he's going to be part of a roster that has more talent around him. There are some similarities between Curry and Bargnani but I don't think he's as bad as you're making him out to be. The role that Bargnani is playing is far different than the role Curry played for this team. Bargnani doesn't have to hold down the middle on D or be a beast on the boards. We need him to mainly help Melo with the scoring. Bargnani isn't being asked to carry this team.

I think we need to give Bargs time to adjust to the culture of this team which is to work hard and give effort. When Bargs sees himself on film any lack of effort should be addressed by Woody and also in practice. We'll see how things work out here in NY. I don't really want to get too carried away with assuming Bargs is gonna be a problem before we even get him thru his 1st camp with this team. I'm not saying it's not a concern, but the jury is still out on this.

The funny thing is that i have said pretty much the same thing that you said right now but i got accused of being too hard on him lol

I think the difference between how I express things is that my take is that he's going to have a net positive impact despite not being a strong rebounder or defender. There seems to be this concern about his presence that is overstated IMO. He's been brought in for his SCORING ability and as a good sidekick for Melo in the SL. We've lacked that 2nd guy to worry about in the SL and AB provides that regardless of his issues on the other end. I'm more optimistic that he'll adjust to our level of effort from being around it all year. The other poster mentions Curry, but Curry was in a more central role than AB is. Melo is in the Curry role as the top player and AB is a sidekick. The Knicks can win despite AB but if he plays well that can enhance this teams prospects. Curry was in a spot that the team was dependent on him performing at a high level much more.

Not really. I never said he would be a negative. I said exactly what you said about his defense/rebounding. I have always praise his offensive ability

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

JamesKPolk wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:I like Novak but I wonder why many teams have let him go even though he continues to show that he is a good/great shooter.

As for Bargs creating more space I don't know how you can judge that. What I do think is that because of his versatility if Bargs is on defenders will be in a conundrum trying to defend him. With Novak you could lay off and defend him with a small guy that can close hard which would take away all the work an offense did to get the defense of balance. Because Bargs can actually put the ball on the ground to score he puts more pressure on the D and possibly keeps the D off balance. The key will be him making the simple passes as the D rotates when he drives.

Whatever you say doesn't matter. Anything he does is negated by his absolutely awful defensive and rebounding play. It's like Eddy Curry's 19 and 7 season. It was a complete stat-pad, empty stat of a season. Andrea Bargnani is our new Eddy Curry. He is the laziest, softest loser we have had here since Curry left the team. You and many others who try to rationalize every single Knicks trade in existence will soon come to realize the painful truth. The man is pathetic on the basketball court. Be prepared for him to feel the wrath of the fans early on in the season if he puts up the effort he has his entire career until now.

The difference for AB is that he's going to be part of a roster that has more talent around him. There are some similarities between Curry and Bargnani but I don't think he's as bad as you're making him out to be. The role that Bargnani is playing is far different than the role Curry played for this team. Bargnani doesn't have to hold down the middle on D or be a beast on the boards. We need him to mainly help Melo with the scoring. Bargnani isn't being asked to carry this team.

I think we need to give Bargs time to adjust to the culture of this team which is to work hard and give effort. When Bargs sees himself on film any lack of effort should be addressed by Woody and also in practice. We'll see how things work out here in NY. I don't really want to get too carried away with assuming Bargs is gonna be a problem before we even get him thru his 1st camp with this team. I'm not saying it's not a concern, but the jury is still out on this.

The funny thing is that i have said pretty much the same thing that you said right now but i got accused of being too hard on him lol

I think the difference between how I express things is that my take is that he's going to have a net positive impact despite not being a strong rebounder or defender. There seems to be this concern about his presence that is overstated IMO. He's been brought in for his SCORING ability and as a good sidekick for Melo in the SL. We've lacked that 2nd guy to worry about in the SL and AB provides that regardless of his issues on the other end. I'm more optimistic that he'll adjust to our level of effort from being around it all year. The other poster mentions Curry, but Curry was in a more central role than AB is. Melo is in the Curry role as the top player and AB is a sidekick. The Knicks can win despite AB but if he plays well that can enhance this teams prospects. Curry was in a spot that the team was dependent on him performing at a high level much more.

Not really. I never said he would be a negative. I said exactly what you said about his defense/rebounding. I have always praise his offensive ability

Perhaps there's no real difference in the overall view, but a difference in style of expressing it. I don't choose to harp on the flaws at the end of every one of my statements about Bargnani. So for me there's less doubt that he'll be successful. Tho no one can say 100% that things will work out as expected. My point is that even if AB doesn't significantly increase his rebounds we'd be in good shape if AB gives us 17/5 which is pretty much what he's been for the last 5 yrs on avg. We're asking him to play at his avg at the least. To me that's not a high bar to reach.

nixluva wrote:

JamesKPolk wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:I like Novak but I wonder why many teams have let him go even though he continues to show that he is a good/great shooter.

As for Bargs creating more space I don't know how you can judge that. What I do think is that because of his versatility if Bargs is on defenders will be in a conundrum trying to defend him. With Novak you could lay off and defend him with a small guy that can close hard which would take away all the work an offense did to get the defense of balance. Because Bargs can actually put the ball on the ground to score he puts more pressure on the D and possibly keeps the D off balance. The key will be him making the simple passes as the D rotates when he drives.

Whatever you say doesn't matter. Anything he does is negated by his absolutely awful defensive and rebounding play. It's like Eddy Curry's 19 and 7 season. It was a complete stat-pad, empty stat of a season. Andrea Bargnani is our new Eddy Curry. He is the laziest, softest loser we have had here since Curry left the team. You and many others who try to rationalize every single Knicks trade in existence will soon come to realize the painful truth. The man is pathetic on the basketball court. Be prepared for him to feel the wrath of the fans early on in the season if he puts up the effort he has his entire career until now.

The difference for AB is that he's going to be part of a roster that has more talent around him. There are some similarities between Curry and Bargnani but I don't think he's as bad as you're making him out to be. The role that Bargnani is playing is far different than the role Curry played for this team. Bargnani doesn't have to hold down the middle on D or be a beast on the boards. We need him to mainly help Melo with the scoring. Bargnani isn't being asked to carry this team.

I think we need to give Bargs time to adjust to the culture of this team which is to work hard and give effort. When Bargs sees himself on film any lack of effort should be addressed by Woody and also in practice. We'll see how things work out here in NY. I don't really want to get too carried away with assuming Bargs is gonna be a problem before we even get him thru his 1st camp with this team. I'm not saying it's not a concern, but the jury is still out on this.

His problem areas (basically everything except scoring) can't be excused by being on poor teams though. Being on a bad team won't make you get fewer rebounds or blocks or steals. Assists and turnovers are his only bad areas that you could make that argument for.

Bonn1997 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

JamesKPolk wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:I like Novak but I wonder why many teams have let him go even though he continues to show that he is a good/great shooter.

As for Bargs creating more space I don't know how you can judge that. What I do think is that because of his versatility if Bargs is on defenders will be in a conundrum trying to defend him. With Novak you could lay off and defend him with a small guy that can close hard which would take away all the work an offense did to get the defense of balance. Because Bargs can actually put the ball on the ground to score he puts more pressure on the D and possibly keeps the D off balance. The key will be him making the simple passes as the D rotates when he drives.

Whatever you say doesn't matter. Anything he does is negated by his absolutely awful defensive and rebounding play. It's like Eddy Curry's 19 and 7 season. It was a complete stat-pad, empty stat of a season. Andrea Bargnani is our new Eddy Curry. He is the laziest, softest loser we have had here since Curry left the team. You and many others who try to rationalize every single Knicks trade in existence will soon come to realize the painful truth. The man is pathetic on the basketball court. Be prepared for him to feel the wrath of the fans early on in the season if he puts up the effort he has his entire career until now.

The difference for AB is that he's going to be part of a roster that has more talent around him. There are some similarities between Curry and Bargnani but I don't think he's as bad as you're making him out to be. The role that Bargnani is playing is far different than the role Curry played for this team. Bargnani doesn't have to hold down the middle on D or be a beast on the boards. We need him to mainly help Melo with the scoring. Bargnani isn't being asked to carry this team.

I think we need to give Bargs time to adjust to the culture of this team which is to work hard and give effort. When Bargs sees himself on film any lack of effort should be addressed by Woody and also in practice. We'll see how things work out here in NY. I don't really want to get too carried away with assuming Bargs is gonna be a problem before we even get him thru his 1st camp with this team. I'm not saying it's not a concern, but the jury is still out on this.

His problem areas (basically everything except scoring) can't be excused by being on poor teams though. Being on a bad team won't make you get fewer rebounds or blocks or steals. Assists and turnovers are his only bad areas that you could make that argument for.

The most important stat is the one you never bring up, wins...