d up? I mean pay them what you have to pay them--we can do that--to build a team that will perform at a championship level for 10 years? We had one in Pat Riley--since its been a team made up of crp management. Why not pay huge money for the executives in charge who have long term proven track records of winning championships? WHY dont we get the bets management????? Dolan is involved with some of this personnel decision making and clearly that is scary--people pay incredible money to see the Knicks--don't they deserve the best? Give them the money and freedom to build a big time winner we can enjoy for years.
not sure if pop is at this stage in his career to want to do that.. but I would like younger, similar versions of both guys and Dolan would have to promise to let them run the franchise... complete autonomy..
Briggs, your right.
first we have to define "winning"!
Revenue and the appearence of being a competitive team seems to be enough keep a fan base interested.
Hire Pops to make bball decisions? Unlikely. Have Dolan not interfere with those decisions? Inconceivable
Honest question would you like it if butterlies shat twinkies and all your farts turned into rainbows that smelled of warm Christmas cookies? Wouldn't NYC be wonderful if it was smaller and cozier and had less people and crime and no homeless vagrants and all the guns fired nerf pellets and it was warm nearly all year round and was near the Gulf of Mexico which didn't have any sea snakes in it?
Some fans would be fans if we lost every game for 20 years. For some, it's enough to see a team wear the uniform and play ball. Despite the owner. Despite the Scott Layden's and IT's of the world.
For some it's about outcomes they can feel comfortable associating their precious identity with.
jrodmc wrote:Honest question would you like it if butterlies shat twinkies and all your farts turned into rainbows that smelled of warm Christmas cookies? Wouldn't NYC be wonderful if it was smaller and cozier and had less people and crime and no homeless vagrants and all the guns fired nerf pellets and it was warm nearly all year round and was near the Gulf of Mexico which didn't have any sea snakes in it?Some fans would be fans if we lost every game for 20 years. For some, it's enough to see a team wear the uniform and play ball. Despite the owner. Despite the Scott Layden's and IT's of the world.
For some it's about outcomes they can feel comfortable associating their precious identity with.
I've never understood how in your mind "being a fan" = "never criticizing the team or Dolan".
those guys are good but is their record as impressive if they fall to #2 and pick Keith Van Horn instead of Tim Duncan? Would NY have the patience? This is NY, not SA... the environment is quite different
fishmike wrote:those guys are good but is their record as impressive if they fall to #2 and pick Keith Van Horn instead of Tim Duncan? Would NY have the patience? This is NY, not SA... the environment is quite different
It definitely takes a lot of luck. SA could easily have Van Horn, you are right. OKC could have won the lottery and drafted Oden. I'm sure they are glad they didn't win so Durant could fall on them because they would not have passed on Oden. Not knocking their management abilities, because these guys are amoungst the best in the business, but one lucky ping pong ball changes the outcome for everyone like them.
fishmike wrote:those guys are good but is their record as impressive if they fall to #2 and pick Keith Van Horn instead of Tim Duncan? Would NY have the patience? This is NY, not SA... the environment is quite different
they continue to find studs undrafted and late in the first round/second round.
Sure, having Tim Duncan makes Danny Green look like an all star - but Pop is the guy that makes all of it move.
If Dolan had an ounce of intelligence, he would make those guys part owners and get them in here yesterday.
Its not. He is an imbecile with a shit down of money.
of course i'd be happy but dolan has shown no signs of letting anyone have complete control over the basketball other than himself.
VCoug wrote:jrodmc wrote:Honest question would you like it if butterlies shat twinkies and all your farts turned into rainbows that smelled of warm Christmas cookies? Wouldn't NYC be wonderful if it was smaller and cozier and had less people and crime and no homeless vagrants and all the guns fired nerf pellets and it was warm nearly all year round and was near the Gulf of Mexico which didn't have any sea snakes in it?Some fans would be fans if we lost every game for 20 years. For some, it's enough to see a team wear the uniform and play ball. Despite the owner. Despite the Scott Layden's and IT's of the world.
For some it's about outcomes they can feel comfortable associating their precious identity with.
I've never understood how in your mind "being a fan" = "never criticizing the team or Dolan".
I've never understood how people read the thread title, read my response to the thread title, and then post about something that has nothing to do with either. I've consistently called Dolan a turd, I've criticized everyone from Walsh to ToneyD to JR Smith to Woody to Grunfeld. I'm still into "being a fan".
My post is about the absurdity of wishing for square circles and hot pregnant virgins not named Mary.
I've never really understood the "the Knicks have to earn my fandom" mindset. And they should do A, B and C or else.
fishmike wrote:those guys are good but is their record as impressive if they fall to #2 and pick Keith Van Horn instead of Tim Duncan? Would NY have the patience? This is NY, not SA... the environment is quite different
that is so true.. but here is what seperates the great organizations like the spurs from others... they have multiple rings because they were able to get gems like parker and ginobili with late picks..where other teams would have and did pass them up... They tend to maximize every asset they have....
jrodmc wrote:Honest question would you like it if butterlies shat twinkies and all your farts turned into rainbows that smelled of warm Christmas cookies? Wouldn't NYC be wonderful if it was smaller and cozier and had less people and crime and no homeless vagrants and all the guns fired nerf pellets and it was warm nearly all year round and was near the Gulf of Mexico which didn't have any sea snakes in it?Some fans would be fans if we lost every game for 20 years. For some, it's enough to see a team wear the uniform and play ball. Despite the owner. Despite the Scott Layden's and IT's of the world.
For some it's about outcomes they can feel comfortable associating their precious identity with.
Im old enough to remember the going to MSG and seeing it quite empty. History can repeat itself. Guys like Pat Riley Popovich Bellichik--they just seem to win every year. Id pay more for one of those guys than any player.
fishmike wrote:those guys are good but is their record as impressive if they fall to #2 and pick Keith Van Horn instead of Tim Duncan? Would NY have the patience? This is NY, not SA... the environment is quite different
+1
Bingo!
BRIGGS wrote:jrodmc wrote:Honest question would you like it if butterlies shat twinkies and all your farts turned into rainbows that smelled of warm Christmas cookies? Wouldn't NYC be wonderful if it was smaller and cozier and had less people and crime and no homeless vagrants and all the guns fired nerf pellets and it was warm nearly all year round and was near the Gulf of Mexico which didn't have any sea snakes in it?Some fans would be fans if we lost every game for 20 years. For some, it's enough to see a team wear the uniform and play ball. Despite the owner. Despite the Scott Layden's and IT's of the world.
For some it's about outcomes they can feel comfortable associating their precious identity with.
Im old enough to remember the going to MSG and seeing it quite empty. History can repeat itself. Guys like Pat Riley Popovich Bellichik--they just seem to win every year. Id pay more for one of those guys than any player.
Call Phil Jackson make him the President/GM/coach. If Pat Riley can Recruit talent by dropping bling on the table wouldn't Phil be able to do that.
didnt we hire a guy who won a title, and took two teams to the finals? Remember Larry Brown? He coached Iverson to an MVP and a finals appearance. He coached Billups and Big Ben to what should have been a sweep of Shaq and Kobe?
The Knicks are run by CAA. There is zero chance of success here. You can bring in any great mind basketball mind and MSG will turn them into retards. Isiah had a decent impact as a coach and talent evaluator. MSG turned him into Rich Kottite. Don Chaney coached a front court of Kurt, Othella and Shandon Anderson to 38 wins, he was escourted out by security. Lenny won more NBA games than any coach. MSG taught him being uemployed is better than making $5mm a year working for Dolan... we could really do this all day.
We have an environment at MSG that ruins good BB minds, sells off talent and doesnt develop our own. Luckily we have MElo to blame for every loss.
The problem is Dolan lately seems determined to take even more of a hands on approach, so he's not interested in hiring smart experts in their field- he wants people he can control.
Money Can't Buy You Love... Or a championship.smackeddog wrote:The problem is Dolan lately seems determined to take even more of a hands on approach, so he's not interested in hiring smart experts in their field- he wants people he can control.
Bingo
Phil Jackson understands the culture and said "no thank you"
The Dolan fingerprints smudged Donnie Walsh's work in progress. Donnie had enough and went back to a more sane workplace.
The only plausible thing to do is loudly protect ChrisnSmith every time he enters a game.
We have no power other than the power of protest.
Championships require strategy, good karma and patience
misterearl wrote:
Championships require strategy, good karma and patience
you nailed it good sir... something we lack. We saw a cultural transformation while Donnie was here. Maybe the Marbury thing was handled poorly, but the message was clear. No more catering to players before team.
The more I think of the Chris Smith thing the more the whole thing stinks. How can you run a team in good faith? If the guy's brother was a bigtime player we needed to wooo then OK, I get it. JR is volume shooting dummy whos won nothing and inspires less. These are the guys this org caters too? Its a CAA playground. Sucks
Did you say ...
Slowly I turned... Step by step....
Guys like the SA front office would never work for Dolan. Never ever ever.
