Knicks · Rumor JVG coming back (page 4)

As year progresses, regardless of their record, if front office pushes to do what it can to resign Melo (i wish they would not), might as well keep Woodson as coach. Woodson gets the joke - Melo sets the rules, and, as MDA found out, pushing back on that one does at their peril. I wouldn't envy a new coach who comes in here to bring discipline and structure, all against the backdrop of front office 'recruting' Melo again...

franco12 wrote:And I agree- if we get blown out Thursday, Woodson is history. He'll be escorted from the bench straight out via the sky bridge!

More like hanged from the bridge by legs...

Just gotta say is not all on the coach. The knicks need bigs and they need a point guard regardless.

Woodson had to go regardless as well. Nuff has been said about it already

Bring back JVG - give him defensive players like Chandler, SHump and Peace. Add a scorer in Melo with Bargs and Jr and this team has enough to do something. D comes first, hold teams to 85 and they can win with a JVG offense.

I would look to trade Smith, Felton, Stat to anyone who would dare to take them. Get balls, a pizza, a Civic, I don't care, just move those guys.

EnySpree wrote:I'm on the back end of this conversion....

Just gotta say is not all on the coach. The knicks need bigs and they need a point guard regardless.

Woodson had to go regardless as well. Nuff has been said about it already

What? did this happen already???

GoNyGoNyGo wrote:If JVG comes back, he could bring SVG with him. That would be interesting. Perhaps LJ or Starks could become assistants too. The team needs to inject some PRIDE back onto the court.

Bring back JVG - give him defensive players like Chandler, SHump and Peace. Add a scorer in Melo with Bargs and Jr and this team has enough to do something. D comes first, hold teams to 85 and they can win with a JVG offense.

I would look to trade Smith, Felton, Stat to anyone who would dare to take them. Get balls, a pizza, a Civic, I don't care, just move those guys.

That would be an interesting bench, that's for sure, but I don't believe SVG would be willing to play second fiddle to his brother. He's probably waiting for his own gig.

gunsnewing wrote:Trust

I trust him. I don't trust the lack of picks, or the management that constructs the roster.

Autonomy to have input? Give it to JVG when he snatched it away from Donnie? Would not give it to riles, Nellie, Larry MDA or Phil Jax?

Your fantasy is nice. Your asking to rebuild the franchise with grit, determination and patience. With all due respect, you think that is what the plan is?

Really, your talking about salvage of this season, hold on to Melo and give him what he wants, mortgage the future further.

Why do we suck now? We are paying the mortgage from the past.

We are like the guy that keeps rolling over debt into a new leased car. when the rules change we found out we could not leverage it as we used to. Now we are driving a camry paying lexus prices but put some nice (Melo) aftermarket wheels on it to make it looks snazzy.

I appreciate the effort most posters put in to try to "Fix" the team while Somberites like me must seem lazy and don't try. Really, nobody has any imput here so lets not take it personal.

If JVG wants to coach here I think its a great idea, but the notion he can rebuild on the fly is fictional. Tell me he signs on for 5 years, has "Player personal" title and some hint that we'll rebuild then I can buy into that. But the song and dance of "Players wanting to come here" without the beneift of a teams own pick if it goes lottery is delusional. Melo and Amare came here to get paid.

GoNyGoNyGo wrote:If JVG comes back, he could bring SVG with him. That would be interesting. Perhaps LJ or Starks could become assistants too. The team needs to inject some PRIDE back onto the court.

Bring back JVG - give him defensive players like Chandler, SHump and Peace. Add a scorer in Melo with Bargs and Jr and this team has enough to do something. D comes first, hold teams to 85 and they can win with a JVG offense.

I would look to trade Smith, Felton, Stat to anyone who would dare to take them. Get balls, a pizza, a Civic, I don't care, just move those guys.

Your lips to gods ears. We would need to trade Felton because there is no hope for him. Even with JVG. He is slower than every starting PG in the league. Woodson's crap switching defense will be gone but Felton can't stay with his man even playing man defense

Make the focus of the team and help defense to stop the opposing teams best player like it used to be not to cover for Felton and melo's diffiencies

Nalod wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Trust

I trust him. I don't trust the lack of picks, or the management that constructs the roster.

Autonomy to have input? Give it to JVG when he snatched it away from Donnie? Would not give it to riles, Nellie, Larry MDA or Phil Jax?

Your fantasy is nice. Your asking to rebuild the franchise with grit, determination and patience. With all due respect, you think that is what the plan is?

Really, your talking about salvage of this season, hold on to Melo and give him what he wants, mortgage the future further.

Why do we suck now? We are paying the mortgage from the past.

We are like the guy that keeps rolling over debt into a new leased car. when the rules change we found out we could not leverage it as we used to. Now we are driving a camry paying lexus prices but put some nice (Melo) aftermarket wheels on it to make it looks snazzy.

I appreciate the effort most posters put in to try to "Fix" the team while Somberites like me must seem lazy and don't try. Really, nobody has any imput here so lets not take it personal.

If JVG wants to coach here I think its a great idea, but the notion he can rebuild on the fly is fictional. Tell me he signs on for 5 years, has "Player personal" title and some hint that we'll rebuild then I can buy into that. But the song and dance of "Players wanting to come here" without the beneift of a teams own pick if it goes lottery is delusional. Melo and Amare came here to get paid.

If we weren't trying to "fix" the team there wouldn't be much else to talk about except who is in what camp.

GoNyGoNyGo wrote:If JVG comes back, he could bring SVG with him. That would be interesting. Perhaps LJ or Starks could become assistants too. The team needs to inject some PRIDE back onto the court.

Bring back JVG - give him defensive players like Chandler, SHump and Peace. Add a scorer in Melo with Bargs and Jr and this team has enough to do something. D comes first, hold teams to 85 and they can win with a JVG offense.

I would look to trade Smith, Felton, Stat to anyone who would dare to take them. Get balls, a pizza, a Civic, I don't care, just move those guys.

really? stan is likely a better coach!

Bring back former players to inject "pride"? Seriously? Paid professionals with low self esteem need not apply and have no place at this level. Knicks need to stop stripping the cupboard to get stars (Marbury,Eddy,Melo) and then trying to fill the roster with reject physically talented mental midgets thinking it can succeed. IN fact, Starks and JR have a lot in common. Physically talented low IQ players!

LJ was a no. 1 pick with HOF talent in line with Barkley. How he become a knick? An $84,000,000 contract and a bad back. He played for love or for contract? I don't know, he was a great because he really gave everything he had. You can't teach what he had. sorry.

GustavBahler wrote:

Nalod wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Trust

I trust him. I don't trust the lack of picks, or the management that constructs the roster.

Autonomy to have input? Give it to JVG when he snatched it away from Donnie? Would not give it to riles, Nellie, Larry MDA or Phil Jax?

Your fantasy is nice. Your asking to rebuild the franchise with grit, determination and patience. With all due respect, you think that is what the plan is?

Really, your talking about salvage of this season, hold on to Melo and give him what he wants, mortgage the future further.

Why do we suck now? We are paying the mortgage from the past.

We are like the guy that keeps rolling over debt into a new leased car. when the rules change we found out we could not leverage it as we used to. Now we are driving a camry paying lexus prices but put some nice (Melo) aftermarket wheels on it to make it looks snazzy.

I appreciate the effort most posters put in to try to "Fix" the team while Somberites like me must seem lazy and don't try. Really, nobody has any imput here so lets not take it personal.

If JVG wants to coach here I think its a great idea, but the notion he can rebuild on the fly is fictional. Tell me he signs on for 5 years, has "Player personal" title and some hint that we'll rebuild then I can buy into that. But the song and dance of "Players wanting to come here" without the beneift of a teams own pick if it goes lottery is delusional. Melo and Amare came here to get paid.

If we weren't trying to "fix" the team there wouldn't be much else to talk about except who is in what camp.

Your right. I suppose I should chime in and offer something, but we have an impatient ignorant owner.

Nalod wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

Nalod wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Trust

I trust him. I don't trust the lack of picks, or the management that constructs the roster.

Autonomy to have input? Give it to JVG when he snatched it away from Donnie? Would not give it to riles, Nellie, Larry MDA or Phil Jax?

Your fantasy is nice. Your asking to rebuild the franchise with grit, determination and patience. With all due respect, you think that is what the plan is?

Really, your talking about salvage of this season, hold on to Melo and give him what he wants, mortgage the future further.

Why do we suck now? We are paying the mortgage from the past.

We are like the guy that keeps rolling over debt into a new leased car. when the rules change we found out we could not leverage it as we used to. Now we are driving a camry paying lexus prices but put some nice (Melo) aftermarket wheels on it to make it looks snazzy.

I appreciate the effort most posters put in to try to "Fix" the team while Somberites like me must seem lazy and don't try. Really, nobody has any imput here so lets not take it personal.

If JVG wants to coach here I think its a great idea, but the notion he can rebuild on the fly is fictional. Tell me he signs on for 5 years, has "Player personal" title and some hint that we'll rebuild then I can buy into that. But the song and dance of "Players wanting to come here" without the beneift of a teams own pick if it goes lottery is delusional. Melo and Amare came here to get paid.

If we weren't trying to "fix" the team there wouldn't be much else to talk about except who is in what camp.

Your right. I suppose I should chime in and offer something, but we have an impatient ignorant owner.

We could apply that to conspiracy theories as well I suppose.

gunsnewing wrote:How is SVG Lebron a better coach player than JVG Melo? SVG Lebron made the finals with Howard when the East was weak.

fixed.

GustavBahler wrote:Mixed feelings. At least we would probably start winning again, playing D, but JVG's playoff track record hasn't been great since leaving NY. If he were given control over the roster and it stuck, it could give us the buffer from mgmt and ownership the team desperately needs. Jeff would be smart to ask for it. Might finally put an end to JR having the run of the place. I get the feeling that JVG wouldn't mind if Melo left so he could get a star that plays better D. Again, having veto power over trades or signings could give him the flexibility to build the roster the way he wants.

CrushAlot wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:Mixed feelings. At least we would probably start winning again, playing D, but JVG's playoff track record hasn't been great since leaving NY. If he were given control over the roster and it stuck, it could give us the buffer from mgmt and ownership the team desperately needs. Jeff would be smart to ask for it. Might finally put an end to JR having the run of the place. I get the feeling that JVG wouldn't mind if Melo left so he could get a star that plays better D. Again, having veto power over trades or signings could give him the flexibility to build the roster the way he wants.

Agree but JVG is stubborn and committed to vets as much or more then most coaches. He didn't want Camby for Oak and he loves his vets etc. Having a good working relationship with a gm would be a good thing but letting him be gm or have veto power might not work out. However, I would be really excited to Jeff back. I also think that means Shump stays.

True, but I don't believe he would treat JR the way he is being treated now, with kid gloves. One of the things I really admired about Woodson early on was how he would light into JR when he was making bad decisions, like a father figure, and it worked for the most part during the regular season. At some point he started acting like an absentee parent. I believe Woodson can go back to being a successful coach but he has to be with an owner who won't be literally looking over his shoulder every second. If I'm JVG, I don't even think about the job without getting some autonomy in writing.

I agree with those who say he needs more help on offense. Like I said, mixed feelings.

GustavBahler wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:Mixed feelings. At least we would probably start winning again, playing D, but JVG's playoff track record hasn't been great since leaving NY. If he were given control over the roster and it stuck, it could give us the buffer from mgmt and ownership the team desperately needs. Jeff would be smart to ask for it. Might finally put an end to JR having the run of the place. I get the feeling that JVG wouldn't mind if Melo left so he could get a star that plays better D. Again, having veto power over trades or signings could give him the flexibility to build the roster the way he wants.

Agree but JVG is stubborn and committed to vets as much or more then most coaches. He didn't want Camby for Oak and he loves his vets etc. Having a good working relationship with a gm would be a good thing but letting him be gm or have veto power might not work out. However, I would be really excited to Jeff back. I also think that means Shump stays.

True, but I don't believe he would treat JR the way he is being treated now, with kid gloves. One of the things I really admired about Woodson early on was how he would light into JR when he was making bad decisions, like a father figure, and it worked for the most part during the regular season. At some point he started acting like an absentee parent. I believe Woodson can go back to being a successful coach but he has to be with an owner who won't be literally looking over his shoulder every second. If I'm JVG, I don't even think about the job without getting some autonomy in writing.

I agree with those who say he needs more help on offense. Like I said, mixed feelings.

That is a good point about Woodson becoming a bit of a lame duck as Dolan has become more hands on. I don't think there is much chance of Jeff coming back and I don't see Dolan giving anyone that much power in the organization. I think Glenn had woodson's back and that helped a lot. Begley wrote today that the knick organization is saying Woodson is using shump wrong in an attempt to increase his value.

CrushAlot wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:Mixed feelings. At least we would probably start winning again, playing D, but JVG's playoff track record hasn't been great since leaving NY. If he were given control over the roster and it stuck, it could give us the buffer from mgmt and ownership the team desperately needs. Jeff would be smart to ask for it. Might finally put an end to JR having the run of the place. I get the feeling that JVG wouldn't mind if Melo left so he could get a star that plays better D. Again, having veto power over trades or signings could give him the flexibility to build the roster the way he wants.

Agree but JVG is stubborn and committed to vets as much or more then most coaches. He didn't want Camby for Oak and he loves his vets etc. Having a good working relationship with a gm would be a good thing but letting him be gm or have veto power might not work out. However, I would be really excited to Jeff back. I also think that means Shump stays.

True, but I don't believe he would treat JR the way he is being treated now, with kid gloves. One of the things I really admired about Woodson early on was how he would light into JR when he was making bad decisions, like a father figure, and it worked for the most part during the regular season. At some point he started acting like an absentee parent. I believe Woodson can go back to being a successful coach but he has to be with an owner who won't be literally looking over his shoulder every second. If I'm JVG, I don't even think about the job without getting some autonomy in writing.

I agree with those who say he needs more help on offense. Like I said, mixed feelings.

That is a good point about Woodson becoming a bit of a lame duck as Dolan has become more hands on. I don't think there is much chance of Jeff coming back and I don't see Dolan giving anyone that much power in the organization. I think Glenn had woodson's back and that helped a lot. Begley wrote today that the knick organization is saying Woodson is using shump wrong in an attempt to increase his value.

Yeah, I doubt Mills will have anyone's back but Dolans' and his own. Of all the GMs that had to walk though the door......

JVG and Dolan can converse about their equal hate for/displeasure with the NBA office and Stern... It's a match made in heaven.

Nalod wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Trust

I trust him. I don't trust the lack of picks, or the management that constructs the roster.

Autonomy to have input? Give it to JVG when he snatched it away from Donnie? Would not give it to riles, Nellie, Larry MDA or Phil Jax?

Your fantasy is nice. Your asking to rebuild the franchise with grit, determination and patience. With all due respect, you think that is what the plan is?

Really, your talking about salvage of this season, hold on to Melo and give him what he wants, mortgage the future further.

Why do we suck now? We are paying the mortgage from the past.

We are like the guy that keeps rolling over debt into a new leased car. when the rules change we found out we could not leverage it as we used to. Now we are driving a camry paying lexus prices but put some nice (Melo) aftermarket wheels on it to make it looks snazzy.

I appreciate the effort most posters put in to try to "Fix" the team while Somberites like me must seem lazy and don't try. Really, nobody has any imput here so lets not take it personal.

If JVG wants to coach here I think its a great idea, but the notion he can rebuild on the fly is fictional. Tell me he signs on for 5 years, has "Player personal" title and some hint that we'll rebuild then I can buy into that. But the song and dance of "Players wanting to come here" without the beneift of a teams own pick if it goes lottery is delusional. Melo and Amare came here to get paid.

Well said but I think Melo is much more than a guy looking to get paid. We just don't have competent management to surround him with the players he'd need to win.

gunsnewing wrote:How is SVG a better coach than JVG? SVG made the finals with Howard when the East was weak. I like SVG but he is not his brother who already proved he can do it in New York even coaching against Michael Jordan

Stan displayed much greater offensive ingenuity, while wielding one of the best defensive schemes at that time. For years, the Magic happened to defend the 3 better than anyone in the league, while being a leader in 3 pointers made and 3 point efficiency. Considering what the bread and butter was for the Knicks last year (league leading 3 pointers made, one of the league leaders in 3 point effiency, a league leader in pick and roll efficiency and one of the beat defensive teams during our winning streaks), SVG could get much more out of this team than JVG could. In an ideal world, SVG would be our lieutenant (coach) and JVG my sergeant (lead assistant). Incidentally, I think the players we'd need to get the most of their coaching happen to be current and former Magic I.e. Aaron Afflalo, Jameer Nelson, Glen Davis, Brandon Bass, etc.