Knicks · Tyson chandler is the most over rated player in the nba he sucks (page 2)

fitzfarm wrote:Tyson must lead the league in turnovers when he puts the ball on the floor ... Whenever he has to dribble he turns the ball over and when contested around the rim not a good finisher ... Fumbles the ball a lot as well, bad hands. Doesn't go out and contest jumpers never puts his arms up...not as vocal on defense. A step or two slow,rebounds only when he wants...has trouble boxing out ... Has no consistancy rebounding. He's a back up at best now a days 10 to 15 min a game at most . He's such a liability on offense and now not really good on defense to make up for how poor he is on offense. One last thing he's on the wrong side of 30 for a 7 footer... He's only gonna get worse

^ This (for the most part)

Dagger wrote:Carmelo Anthony is a much, much, much better rebounder than Tyson Chandler, now that's really, really, really sad

^ This

BRIGGS wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Rudy Gay is the most overrated but health-wise it's been a very rough stretch for Tyson

Rudy Gay has been awesome in Sacremento--totally different player from Toronto.

and making 8m less

Chandler is the final piece you add to the puzzle and we just don't have enough talent and good defensive players to TEAM up with him
He played one of his best seasons here in NYK and looked his best with

Lin
Iman/JR
Fields/Walker
Jeffries/Novak
Chandler/Jeffries

under Dantoni

I thought we would be much more talented than we actually are but we are not and not having a Marion and more quality players of that type of player on both ends with a #1 like Dirk that understands how important FG% and playing the right way is, along with playing a style to earn double teams and good looks for his team mates is just as important as scoring 30 pts a night

If Tyson had anything resembling a post game, I don't believe we would this much trouble incorporating him into the offense. You have to spoon feed him perfect passes for Chandler to score in the paint. We don't have a PG who can do that consistently. Felton is the best at doing it but he can't do it consistently from different places on the floor like some other PGs can, its usually between the foul line and the rim. Either way we need a better PG, with or without Chandler.

Felton is too inconsistent unfortunately, not for lack of trying. He isn't the source of all our problems, he would make a great backup PG for a contender, and Tyson could be a starter on a better balanced squad.

Bonn1997 wrote:Rudy Gay is the most overrated but health-wise it's been a very rough stretch for Tyson

i think i heard someone (one of the commentators) say last night that since tyson has been in nyc, he's had more stretches of being "sick" than any other time. so basically december jan feb are all iffy months for him. what's the point of him being in nyc weather?

nycisgreat wrote:

fitzfarm wrote:Lol our defense has actually gotten worse since chandler has come back

Sure has. I still feel that woody deviated from what got us the 5 game winning streak. No Murry what so ever. I am not sure what Woody is doing.

are you not sure or you just dont want to admit it to yourself?

Cartman718 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Rudy Gay is the most overrated but health-wise it's been a very rough stretch for Tyson

i think i heard someone (one of the commentators) say last night that since tyson has been in nyc, he's had more stretches of being "sick" than any other time. so basically december jan feb are all iffy months for him. what's the point of him being in nyc weather?

I'm not disagreeing with you. Something very strange is going on with his health.

Erniecat wrote:

Dagger wrote:Carmelo Anthony is a much, much, much better rebounder than Tyson Chandler, now that's really, really, really sad

^ This

Look I realize this is a bash chandler thread but this is just false. Chandler is and has always been a better rebounder then Melo.
Chandler 26.8/7.5reb = a rebound every 3.57 min or 13.5 per 48 min
Melo 39.1/8.7 - A rebound every 4.47 min or 10.6 per 48 min

And this is with Melo having his best rebounding year ever and chandler in a down year. Chandlers career avg is 15 rebounds per 48 min.

Bonn1997 wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Rudy Gay is the most overrated but health-wise it's been a very rough stretch for Tyson

i think i heard someone (one of the commentators) say last night that since tyson has been in nyc, he's had more stretches of being "sick" than any other time. so basically december jan feb are all iffy months for him. what's the point of him being in nyc weather?

I'm not disagreeing with you. Something very strange is going on with his health.

It's not since he has been with Ny, it's his entire career. He has always been like this it seems but maybe in Ny it has been a little worse.

OldFan wrote:

Erniecat wrote:

Dagger wrote:Carmelo Anthony is a much, much, much better rebounder than Tyson Chandler, now that's really, really, really sad

^ This

Look I realize this is a bash chandler thread but this is just false. Chandler is and has always been a better rebounder then Melo.
Chandler 26.8/7.5reb = a rebound every 3.57 min or 13.5 per 48 min
Melo 39.1/8.7 - A rebound every 4.47 min or 10.6 per 48 min

And this is with Melo having his best rebounding year ever and chandler in a down year. Chandlers career avg is 15 rebounds per 48 min.

Regardless, Chandler is not the player that we need or thought we were getting. Trade him.

OldFan wrote:

Erniecat wrote:

Dagger wrote:Carmelo Anthony is a much, much, much better rebounder than Tyson Chandler, now that's really, really, really sad

^ This

Look I realize this is a bash chandler thread but this is just false. Chandler is and has always been a better rebounder then Melo.
Chandler 26.8/7.5reb = a rebound every 3.57 min or 13.5 per 48 min
Melo 39.1/8.7 - A rebound every 4.47 min or 10.6 per 48 min

And this is with Melo having his best rebounding year ever and chandler in a down year. Chandlers career avg is 15 rebounds per 48 min.

Yeah, people are saying lots of absurd stuff right now

Bonn1997 wrote:

OldFan wrote:

Erniecat wrote:

Dagger wrote:Carmelo Anthony is a much, much, much better rebounder than Tyson Chandler, now that's really, really, really sad

^ This

Look I realize this is a bash chandler thread but this is just false. Chandler is and has always been a better rebounder then Melo.
Chandler 26.8/7.5reb = a rebound every 3.57 min or 13.5 per 48 min
Melo 39.1/8.7 - A rebound every 4.47 min or 10.6 per 48 min

And this is with Melo having his best rebounding year ever and chandler in a down year. Chandlers career avg is 15 rebounds per 48 min.

Yeah, people are saying lots of absurd stuff right now

Obviously People are exaggerating unless they mean this year only but I guess they would be closer if you do "your" position adjustment. Chandler is not the problem but how he is used is. He is a bad match up for some players and this year it seems like everyone is getting the better of him. I still think he should've guarded West and Scola. I think Hibbert is slow enough for Bargs to handle in PnR situation and doesn't have the quick post moves to hurt Bargs.

Overall, Bargs and Chandler just can't play together. Maybe Bargs should not be playing at all. However his numbers were improving:

Games 1-10: 27.5 min, Ortg 97.9, DRtg 110.6, ORB% 6.9, DRB% 14.1, TRB% 10.1, TS 59.5
Games 11-20: 34 min, ORtg 99.1, DRtg 107.9, ORB% 5.2, DRB 13.9, TRB 9.4, TS 45.9
Games 21-30: 29.4 min, ORtg 105.3, DRtg 106, ORB 6.1, DRB 17.6, TRB 11.2, TS 47.6
Games 31-35: 30.5 min, ORtg 111.3, DRtg 97.4, ORB 8.0, DRB 17.6, TRB 12.6, TS 52.5

OldFan wrote:

Erniecat wrote:

Dagger wrote:Carmelo Anthony is a much, much, much better rebounder than Tyson Chandler, now that's really, really, really sad

^ This

Look I realize this is a bash chandler thread but this is just false. Chandler is and has always been a better rebounder then Melo.
Chandler 26.8/7.5reb = a rebound every 3.57 min or 13.5 per 48 min
Melo 39.1/8.7 - A rebound every 4.47 min or 10.6 per 48 min

And this is with Melo having his best rebounding year ever and chandler in a down year. Chandlers career avg is 15 rebounds per 48 min.

Per48 stats don't matter, no one plays that many minutes, certainly not Chandler. And I'm sure everyone already knew Chandler has a higher career rebounding average. Melo has better instincts rebounding the ball, Chandler is bigger and only stays under the basket so he gets more, happy?

Dagger wrote:

OldFan wrote:

Erniecat wrote:

Dagger wrote:Carmelo Anthony is a much, much, much better rebounder than Tyson Chandler, now that's really, really, really sad

^ This

Look I realize this is a bash chandler thread but this is just false. Chandler is and has always been a better rebounder then Melo.
Chandler 26.8/7.5reb = a rebound every 3.57 min or 13.5 per 48 min
Melo 39.1/8.7 - A rebound every 4.47 min or 10.6 per 48 min

And this is with Melo having his best rebounding year ever and chandler in a down year. Chandlers career avg is 15 rebounds per 48 min.

Per48 stats don't matter, no one plays that many minutes, certainly not Chandler. And I'm sure everyone already knew Chandler has a higher career rebounding average. Melo has better instincts rebounding the ball, Chandler is bigger and only stays under the basket so he gets more, happy?

No, he posted this year's #s. You could cut them in half or use any other fraction if you don't like per 48. Chandler still rebounds at a higher rate.

well this officially takes the cake for one of the worst threads in uk history. if people can't see chandler's use to a good team, you're nuts. the guy has won the DPOY and is a top defensive player in the league. nobody can play defense by yourself. yes he has his limitations offensively but he's excellent in the pick n roll game and is a very good offensive rebounder.

chandler isn't the problem, the problem is that chandler and bargs CAN NOT play together. how do you split them up though? bargs has shown that when he's playing the 5 he's very effective, both offensively and man to man defense. i think a big part of the team playing poorly since chandler came back is that the combo of bars/chandler upfront is absolutely killing the team offensively. bargs can't do shit at the 4.

The Nba Player tracking data is not that kind to Chandler either but he hasn't been healthy that much and that is just one type of measurement.

GP
15

MIN per game
26.6

REB per game
7.5

Percentage of rebounds per chance
64.0%

REB Chances per game
11.7

Total REB
112

Contested REB per game
2.5

Uncontested REB per game
5.0

Contested REB Percentage
33.0%

For comparison AB:

GP
39

MIN per game
30.2

REB per game
5.4

Percentage of rebounds per chance
64.0%

REB Chances per game
8.4

Total REB
210

Contested REB per game
2.0

Uncontested REB per game
3.4

Contested REB Percentage
37.6%

Now the real key is Reb chances a game which could be thrown off because Bargs does not get into position(usually out of position) to get a rebound.

However, looking at bigs(4/5) that play over 20 minutes Chandler ranks 16 or 17 in percentage of rebounds per chance.

Yeah, I find it odd that someone with "no offense" who makes it "4 on 5" can somehow get 13 points in 26 minutes. How does that happen?

yellowboy90 wrote:The Nba Player tracking data is not that kind to Chandler either but he hasn't been healthy that much and that is just one type of measurement.

GP
15

MIN per game
26.6

REB per game
7.5

Percentage of rebounds per chance
64.0%

REB Chances per game
11.7

Total REB
112

Contested REB per game
2.5

Uncontested REB per game
5.0

Contested REB Percentage
33.0%

For comparison AB:

GP
39

MIN per game
30.2

REB per game
5.4

Percentage of rebounds per chance
64.0%

REB Chances per game
8.4

Total REB
210

Contested REB per game
2.0

Uncontested REB per game
3.4

Contested REB Percentage
37.6%

Now the real key is Reb chances a game which could be thrown off because Bargs does not get into position(usually out of position) to get a rebound.

However, looking at bigs(4/5) that play over 20 minutes Chandler ranks 16 or 17 in percentage of rebounds per chance.

I'm not sure how useful the rebounds per chance figure is. Like you hinted at, it doesn't reward you for putting yourself in position to get the rebound.
Regardless, I think everyone would acknowledge that this has been a bad year for Tyson.

Melo rebounding stats via player tracking data:

GP
36

MIN per game
39.3

REB per game
8.7

Percentage of rebounds per chance
71.2%

REB Chances per game
12.3

Total REB
314

Contested REB per game
2.7

Uncontested REB per game
6.0

Contested REB Percentage
31.2%

Bonn1997 wrote:

Dagger wrote:

OldFan wrote:

Erniecat wrote:

Dagger wrote:Carmelo Anthony is a much, much, much better rebounder than Tyson Chandler, now that's really, really, really sad

^ This

Look I realize this is a bash chandler thread but this is just false. Chandler is and has always been a better rebounder then Melo.
Chandler 26.8/7.5reb = a rebound every 3.57 min or 13.5 per 48 min
Melo 39.1/8.7 - A rebound every 4.47 min or 10.6 per 48 min

And this is with Melo having his best rebounding year ever and chandler in a down year. Chandlers career avg is 15 rebounds per 48 min.

Per48 stats don't matter, no one plays that many minutes, certainly not Chandler. And I'm sure everyone already knew Chandler has a higher career rebounding average. Melo has better instincts rebounding the ball, Chandler is bigger and only stays under the basket so he gets more, happy?

No, he posted this year's #s. You could cut them in half or use any other fraction if you don't like per 48. Chandler still rebounds at a higher rate.

I know he does, my post was hyperbole. I know per 48 stats are just a multiple of a player's average stats, but per 48 is rubbish, because no one plays that much. When I said per 48 minutes stats don't matter I was referring to his last sentence in which he said Chandler's per 48 career avg in rebounds is 15, like I'm supposed to be impressed. Okay 15*(28 min/48 min), the amount he actually plays, is a lot less impressive. Per 36 stats have use because they tell you what a guy's output might be when compared to starters, who usually play a little less than 36 minutes a night. Per48 has no use really in my opinion.

Chandler rebounds at a higher rate, that's not arguable, that's fact. But what I'm saying is Melo has better rebounding instincts, reads the ball better, and actually secures rebounds better than Chandler, famous for his "tip outs" that May or may not go to a player on the other team. Chandler has a size and position advantage when rebounding so he's going to have more, but I think Melo is a much better rebounder for his position than Chandler is for his. I see Melo as a SF, however I know you seem him as a PF when analyzing his rebounding stats. Regardless, his stats this year are still impressive.