I know there has been a lot of back and forth with this.
We have to keep Melo--its imperative to the organization to keep him. The more I look at this year the more I realize we made a MAJOR MAJOR mistake bringing in Bargs and we used our roster poorly from Chris Smith to not playing some guys over playing others at times and we just wilted.
We need an infusion at PG--there is no doubt about that. The team with the better records have better PG's for the most part--we need better consistent play from that position. I think with Phil Jackson here there will be renewed interest in the 7 footer. Remember that Chicago kept and played 3-4 7 footers in their rotation and also got a lot out of the 4 spot.
Melo said he was willing to take less and hopefully we can enhance and improve the roster as is. This has been a VERY difficult season as a fan--we went through a decade of bad basketball to get to win 54 games and then fall right back. Maybe we are getting Phil Jackson 1 year to late-it wouldve been better to let him coach this year and take the President GM position following. It was a big deal getting Bargs and I think it set the tone for a VERY bad year. I dont see Phil as a 68 year old guy who is going to rebuild this team--hes going to go with what we have --look to make it better with enhancements but he needs Melo to do that.
mreinman wrote:http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basket...Bondy has a different take. I think I may have to agree with him.
Sounds like wishful thinking, because nothing in PJ past suggest he is a blow up it for yoots kind of front office guy.
There is also nothing to suggest that if we keep Melo, we would have the resources to build around him. With that said, I don't think we can build without him either because our resources will still be limited. We should have traded Melo at the deadline.
There's no such thing as an unreplaceable player on a .380 team
If Jackson has a vision for this team that doesn't involve Melo then I'm fine with that, if there is a plan. If Dolan tells Phil "do whatever it takes to sign Melo", then I'd rather Melo left. It will mean that Jackson will have a player as his centerpiece he doesn't want and that will probably mean that things won't change much. All depends on who is calling the shots. I guess we will find out when the ink is dry on Jackson's contract.
What we don't know is has Dolan mandated that our future plans include Melo if at all possible? What we don't know is how much Melo is really in the know as opposed to what he is actually saying in the press?
He could have been in on it for weeks and given that respect. It could also be he has made up is mind either way, or PHil has presented to Dolan that No way he resigns Melo and that its dolans choice to continue to negotiate ( this would have happened already of course)further or Phil walks away.
These are things we don't know as transparency is not available for fans.
He Took Jordan who was in the leauge 5 years and turned him from a ball hog to a trusting teammate. Melo might not be an emotional sociopath to win but he is a multi tool player who can shoot.
My take would be its Jackson, and the coach to figure out how to make life easier for Melo to get his shots and improve his %. If not, let him walk.
Phil has nothing to prove to anyone, including Melo, regarding his ability to coach a team, inclduing with superstars vastly better than Melo. For all his noble words about the 'team', Melo has rejected other approaches to offense (See: MDA, Amare, Lin, etc) that don't include the ball starting, and ending, wiht him.
Delighted Phil is here, but, hoping he lets Melo go, as doubt he'll actually conform to whatever system or coach is instilled after two years of 'give it to Melo and clear out" under Woodson
ha ha i see where this is going. this is great. can't wait to see the drama unfold.
Great article. Points out the differences between Melo vs Jordan and Kobe and how Melo unlike those 2 is a low-intensity player on the defensive end. Melo may fit the triangle on offense but he is not nearly the defensive players those guys were.
Also I think Phil will make sure he gets a lot out of Shumpert as a two-way player
I will co-sign to keeping Melo but this topic has been beaten to death.
Love the end. The decision whether Melo stays or go is no longer in his hands. As it would've been had Dolan been in charge
Melo takes less than max or Phil will trade him now
Dolan would've give him the $30mil
Knicks22 wrote:
Phil has nothing to prove to anyone, including Melo, regarding his ability to coach a team, inclduing with superstars vastly better than Melo. For all his noble words about the 'team', Melo has rejected other approaches to offense (See: MDA, Amare, Lin, etc) that don't include the ball starting, and ending, wiht him. Delighted Phil is here, but, hoping he lets Melo go, as doubt he'll actually conform to whatever system or coach is instilled after two years of 'give it to Melo and clear out" under Woodson
well the key is that the knicks with jackson on board lowballs the shyte out of melo as a first step. i am talking 12-13 million. if melo balks then he understands nothing about winning requiring sacrifice and it's byebye.
jackson has way more gravitas than anyone melo has had dealings with.
it's like mount rushmore versus a statue in some obscure square covered in pigeon shyte.
tick tock tick tock
mreinman wrote:http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basket...Bondy has a different take. I think I may have to agree with him.
I didn't jibe with Bondy's perspective. I have issues with the concept of whether any player makes his teammates better. It's a nice notion, but Jordan's teammates weren't "better" until they got better players. Pippen, Grant, and the like were great players and they and the coaches took advantage of the opposition's focus on trying to contain MJ. Similar with the Lakers, Shaq couldn't do it himself and arguably never made anyone better directly, but the emergence of Kobe as a bonafide player. Like the Bulls, they had or acquired the perfect complimentary players. These teams were also pretty consistent as far as line ups went and had gelled...that hasn't happened in NY for over a decade.
Neither Denver nor the Knicks have done this for Melo. He's been playing with the aged and injured most of his career. Nene was pretty much his best and most consistent teammate. As it has been with his career to date, he's still getting his shots even when well covered and his teammates and coaches are highly inconsistent in their ability take advantage of doubles or pick up any slack when he's having a bad night.
This is not being blinded by any perceived love for Melo, it's just an objective observation. Now if you bring a second fiddle and that solid mix of cagey vets and enthusiastic youth and they can all maintain their health while keeping Melo the primary offensive focus and they still can't do significantly better than they have during his tenure...well, then there'd be a valid argument about how he is as a teammate.
This is similar to what happened with Ewing in NY. They took too long to put a killer team around him. By the time they did the Bulls had fully formed into their monstrous selves...then there was the playoff fight with the Heat in what looked like their year, Ewing's wrist explodes, Spree comes to town and lights a fire, but disrupts things a ton and they've been mired in mediocrity ever since.
I don't care who the "star" is. This is team sport and no one guy makes it happen. LeBron couldn't do it in Cleveland and we all agree that he's better than Melo. We might even agree that his team in Cleveland was better than the Knicks since before Melo came to NY...hell, we'd have to since they went to the finals! So if Melo goes, as long as they replace him and build a great around whoever that player may be, I'll be happy if they find a way to win and be really competitive.
mreinman wrote:http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basket...Bondy has a different take. I think I may have to agree with him.
pretty much what guys like myself and Dk have been saying, but we are labeled haters... he pretty much hits the nail on the head.. No need to even try to build around this dude, he is one dimensional, doesn't make anyone around him better, is getting older, paid way too much.. time to move on... If bringing Phil in gets rid of carmelo, then for me, it is the best move we made in the last 15 years or more..
this pretty much sums up carmelo for me..as the writer put it..
By the end, he had launched 25 shots and made 11 of them. He’d handed out just two assists, not far below his average. Those are not numbers that lead to championships, just to victories over teams such as the Celtics.Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/bondy-jackson-anthony-melo-article-1.1720052#ixzz2vqv2SLAp
bingo... knicks have won 5 straight beating the leagues worst teams...fools gold... no need to take this and run with it.. what we should be focusing on is the new direction Phil can take this team.. time to take this season and throw it in the dumpster with the rest of the carmelo era in NY...
Bonn1997 wrote:There's no such thing as an unreplaceable player on a .380 team
Exactly bonn... I don't get it... how can anyone on this team be labeled that.. really..
Nalod wrote:What we don't know is has Dolan mandated that our future plans include Melo if at all possible? What we don't know is how much Melo is really in the know as opposed to what he is actually saying in the press? He could have been in on it for weeks and given that respect. It could also be he has made up is mind either way, or PHil has presented to Dolan that No way he resigns Melo and that its dolans choice to continue to negotiate ( this would have happened already of course)further or Phil walks away.
These are things we don't know as transparency is not available for fans.
He Took Jordan who was in the leauge 5 years and turned him from a ball hog to a trusting teammate. Melo might not be an emotional sociopath to win but he is a multi tool player who can shoot.
My take would be its Jackson, and the coach to figure out how to make life easier for Melo to get his shots and improve his %. If not, let him walk.
difference is nalod.. Jordan was a fiery, relentless competitor, who played both ends of the floor...he just needed some mental adjusting and after 5 years, he got it... how long has carmelo been in the league? Jordan wanted to win and would probably sell off his first born to do so.. that was his only goal.. winning.. nothing else..
Melo might not be an emotional sociopath to win but he is a multi tool player who can shoot.
what other tools does he have nalod?
dk7th wrote:ha ha i see where this is going. this is great. can't wait to see the drama unfold.
I have my barcalounger, beer and popcorn ready... haha
gunsnewing wrote:Love the end. The decision whether Melo stays or go is no longer in his hands. As it would've been had Dolan been in chargeMelo takes less than max or Phil will trade him now
Dolan would've give him the $30mil
I think phil trades him anyway..
grillco wrote:mreinman wrote:http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basket...Bondy has a different take. I think I may have to agree with him.
I didn't jibe with Bondy's perspective. I have issues with the concept of whether any player makes his teammates better. It's a nice notion, but Jordan's teammates weren't "better" until they got better players. Pippen, Grant, and the like were great players and they and the coaches took advantage of the opposition's focus on trying to contain MJ. Similar with the Lakers, Shaq couldn't do it himself and arguably never made anyone better directly, but the emergence of Kobe as a bonafide player. Like the Bulls, they had or acquired the perfect complimentary players. These teams were also pretty consistent as far as line ups went and had gelled...that hasn't happened in NY for over a decade.
Neither Denver nor the Knicks have done this for Melo. He's been playing with the aged and injured most of his career. Nene was pretty much his best and most consistent teammate. As it has been with his career to date, he's still getting his shots even when well covered and his teammates and coaches are highly inconsistent in their ability take advantage of doubles or pick up any slack when he's having a bad night.
This is not being blinded by any perceived love for Melo, it's just an objective observation. Now if you bring a second fiddle and that solid mix of cagey vets and enthusiastic youth and they can all maintain their health while keeping Melo the primary offensive focus and they still can't do significantly better than they have during his tenure...well, then there'd be a valid argument about how he is as a teammate. This is similar to what happened with Ewing in NY. They took too long to put a killer team around him. By the time they did the Bulls had fully formed into their monstrous selves...then there was the playoff fight with the Heat in what looked like their year, Ewing's wrist explodes, Spree comes to town and lights a fire, but disrupts things a ton and they've been mired in mediocrity ever since.
I don't care who the "star" is. This is team sport and no one guy makes it happen. LeBron couldn't do it in Cleveland and we all agree that he's better than Melo. We might even agree that his team in Cleveland was better than the Knicks since before Melo came to NY...hell, we'd have to since they went to the finals! So if Melo goes, as long as they replace him and build a great around whoever that player may be, I'll be happy if they find a way to win and be really competitive.
camby, kenyon, iverson, billups, were not aged and injured.. one was DPOY, the other two guards are HOF guards.. Iverson was still in his prime years when he played with carmelo.. In NY carmelo had JR a 6th man of the year and DPOY on the same team.. lets stop acting like he had no one to play with.. take a look at carmelo's playoff numbers.. the 41% shooting, the lack of assists and defense.. and you will see he is as big a culprit to his lack of success as anyone else...
As far as Ewing goes.. Please, Ewing was a Beast.. and the knicks tried to put teams around Ewing, but in the end, Ewing had teams like the pacers, detroit, miami as well as the bulls... the east was stacked with good teams, teams that were equally as good as the knicks, and throw in teams like the cavs and charlotte and you had a tough road.. ewing was in two finals, one in which he was hurt(spurs) He had chances, his best chance vs the rockets, but he went up against Hakeem.. sometimes great players fall short, or lose to other great players.... but the key is, Ewing played very well, just got beat...
