Knicks · Broussard, Knicks told Melo he can have the max tonight. Have been telling him that all along (page 2)

MX25 wrote:I wouldn't trust Broussard if he told me water was wet.

CrushAlot wrote:

anrst wrote:looks to me like we were playing this cool, but then Dolan got all uncomfortable seeing his boyfriend flirt with other clubs.

Dolan made phil offer the max asap.

hey, this is how things have worked in the past. isn't this exactly true to pattern?

why are we just offering him the max like this? it's such a desperation move. what are we desperate about here?

Broussard said the Max has been there all along. Jax has just been encouraging Melo to take less.

This is what having bad media people does. Phil never said he would not offer the max. He said he hoped Melo would stick to his word that he would take less. Phil even told they media they got him wrong during the trade scrum and the media ignored it.

See I told you so. Melo is coming back and bringing with him Gasol.

Clean wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

anrst wrote:looks to me like we were playing this cool, but then Dolan got all uncomfortable seeing his boyfriend flirt with other clubs.

Dolan made phil offer the max asap.

hey, this is how things have worked in the past. isn't this exactly true to pattern?

why are we just offering him the max like this? it's such a desperation move. what are we desperate about here?

Broussard said the Max has been there all along. Jax has just been encouraging Melo to take less.

This is what having bad media people does. Phil never said he would not offer the max. He said he hoped Melo would stick to his word that he would take less. Phil even told they media they got him wrong during the trade scrum and the media ignored it.

Papabear wrote:

Andrew wrote:Sure Melo, take the max as we sign and trade you for some nice assets to chicago

Papabear Says

That won't happen. He stays in New York.

Can't believe the Bulls offered him $60mil over 4 years, and thought he'd go for it over 5 years at $130mil!

Not a fan of this offer at all, it's a disaster- never thought we'd offer him that much under Phil.

VDesai wrote:Phil is definitely working the Pau Gasol angle. If we pry away Gasol for the mini-MLE than Phil really is a zen master.

nothing zen like about asking melo to take a pay cut and then offering him the max.

once you sign him, there is zero incentive to really go after anyone this season and i think that's what phil will do. if melo signs, expect more fringe nba talent to round out the roster as he asks melo to wait another year.

gasol is not going to come to ny - just like kerr passed as well. they have better opportunities elsewhere.

may have to start calling phil "plan b" from now on :)

but it will be easier to rebuild a playoff team with melo on the roster than without.

But, Pau can do a one year deal or an opt out and knicks can bring him back, with Marc Gasol next year.

Thats an incentive.

imho, i think pau is on his last legs unless he moves to center. the league is now stretch 4 heavy and he can not play that way - he's one of the slowest bigs in the league. he will have to play center and get more physical.

i think marc re-signs in memphis. zach's deal goes down to $10 mil after this season which allows them to ante-up for marc.

Wonder if we can do a front loaded, Sign and trade for Pau Gasol, with Pau willing to sign with another team if not forcing a trade to NYK
With a JR Smith, type of treatment, as in take "under table handshake" with the 3rd year being a team option

23 - this coming year
20 - 2015-16 (Kevin Love and multiple UFA's possible with Lebron, Kevin Love, Jeff Green/Thad Young/Dragic, DeAndre Jordan/Marc Gasol/Asik, Rhondo/ Parker/Lin/Ginobili
23 (player option) (As of now, Durant/Noah, possibly Lebron, Monta Ellis, Wilson Chandler,
26.5
30

maybe the best case scenario, leaving us "wiggle room" and depending on Lebron's NEXT contract, likely a player option in either 2015 and/or 2016

Meanwhile a sign and trade for Gasol with multiple players, would have been nice had we NOT used our assets for AB, with those 3 draft picks
In the final year in addition to our 2 2nd round picks obtained, those are 5 picks
Going further back, 4 picks for 2 scrubs in Felton/Camby

ANYONE is movable at this point, even STAT had we not traded for AB
IF STAT has a similar season to last year but with more minutes in the 25-28 minutes range
What would his "value" be at?
I don't think anyone would give him more than 2-3m, possibly have trouble with the vet min, prior to watching him play last season
However, if Grant Hill was able to get a contract from Sun's despite his multiple surgeries and was actually a VERY GOOD ROLE player after 7 years of NOT playing
I guess anything is possible for STAT to resurrect his career
Kaman just got a 2 year 10m deal, though 2nd year is partial guaranteed (which usually ends up being a trading chip, a Daryl Morey type of contract)

At this point, we still have LOTS of players that can add up, with draft rights to 2 players, and a trade exemption
Though we cannot combine the trade exemption, we have many players outside of AB that could add up to over 10-12m in trades, though it would be quite a lot of roster spots, we need to cut some spots up while there are many talents that are undrafted to develop, and some vet min players for CONTINUED development

and

the 3.2m MLE to work with
3.6m trade exemption

ANYONE is movable at this point, even STAT had we not traded for AB

While Pacer's signed a vet min Euro easily 5x better than Novak

Nalod wrote:since Lakes renounced Gasol they can't do sign and trade.

But, Pau can do a one year deal or an opt out and knicks can bring him back, with Marc Gasol next year.

Thats an incentive.

Lakers can still S&T Gasol because they're so far under the cap. We won't know if we can S&T for Gasol until the July 10 when the new salary cap numbers are released. Right now, including Melo's cap hold of about $24M, our cap number is $84M. That includes the unguaranteed deals of Dalembert and Odom. If we waived both of them we could shave of something like $3M - $4M. That doesn't include Cleanthony or Thanasis. The latest reports are that the luxury tax will jump to $81M which means the apron will be $85M.

Let's say we resign Melo at $20M/year. Including our unguranteed contracts and the two rookies, at about $1.5M combined, that brings our cap number to $81.5M. If the reports are true and the luxury tax apron is going to be $85M this season then we could S&T for Gasol as long as his starting salary isn't more than $3M more than the salaries we trade for him.

VCoug wrote:

Nalod wrote:since Lakes renounced Gasol they can't do sign and trade.

But, Pau can do a one year deal or an opt out and knicks can bring him back, with Marc Gasol next year.

Thats an incentive.

Lakers can still S&T Gasol because they're so far under the cap. We won't know if we can S&T for Gasol until the July 10 when the new salary cap numbers are released. Right now, including Melo's cap hold of about $24M, our cap number is $84M. That includes the unguaranteed deals of Dalembert and Odom. If we waived both of them we could shave of something like $3M - $4M. That doesn't include Cleanthony or Thanasis. The latest reports are that the luxury tax will jump to $81M which means the apron will be $85M.

Let's say we resign Melo at $20M/year. Including our unguranteed contracts and the two rookies, at about $1.5M combined, that brings our cap number to $81.5M. If the reports are true and the luxury tax apron is going to be $85M this season then we could S&T for Gasol as long as his starting salary isn't more than $3M more than the salaries we trade for him.

smackeddog wrote:

Papabear wrote:

Andrew wrote:Sure Melo, take the max as we sign and trade you for some nice assets to chicago

Papabear Says

That won't happen. He stays in New York.

Can't believe the Bulls offered him $60mil over 4 years, and thought he'd go for it over 5 years at $130mil!

Not a fan of this offer at all, it's a disaster- never thought we'd offer him that much under Phil.

Bulls offered him what his real value is to a Contending roster. Any team like the Knicks that are offering more will never contend for anything.

meloshouldgo wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

Papabear wrote:

Andrew wrote:Sure Melo, take the max as we sign and trade you for some nice assets to chicago

Papabear Says

That won't happen. He stays in New York.

Can't believe the Bulls offered him $60mil over 4 years, and thought he'd go for it over 5 years at $130mil!

Not a fan of this offer at all, it's a disaster- never thought we'd offer him that much under Phil.

Bulls offered him what his real value is to a Contending roster. Any team like the Knicks that are offering more will never contend for anything.

anrst wrote:i dunno man... if it "was there all along" ... why was it "offered" just now tonight? ... seriously? wtf is brousard talking about. the offer was there all along, but it was offered tonight?

how does that make any sense.

The Max was there all along. Melo just wants to jump through hoops so he can feel loved and empowered. I'm totally against giving a max deal to any player including LeBron these are guaranteed contracts one would think they learned from Houston and Amare, Rose and all those that never lived up to their max deals.

Cartman718 wrote:tkf and dk7th have got to be depressed right now if this rumor is true. i like andrew's chain of thought though.... chicago's assets are enviable and if melo really does want to go there, the 129 mill is sure going to come at a high price.

Any Knick fan should be depressed, Yes the Knicks will be better next year but this deal officially closes the door on this team winning a title for the foreseeable future. You cant pay Melo this type of money with this roster. If you had young talent that could offset his deal you could but the Knicks dont

CrushAlot wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

Papabear wrote:

Andrew wrote:Sure Melo, take the max as we sign and trade you for some nice assets to chicago

Papabear Says

That won't happen. He stays in New York.

Can't believe the Bulls offered him $60mil over 4 years, and thought he'd go for it over 5 years at $130mil!

Not a fan of this offer at all, it's a disaster- never thought we'd offer him that much under Phil.

Bulls offered him what his real value is to a Contending roster. Any team like the Knicks that are offering more will never contend for anything.

Bulls offered him the max they could. Berman just tweeted that the Bulls are bringing Mirotic over. Berman seems to think this is to use him in a sign and trade for Melo. I am not sure if you can trade a player that you just signed. Others in the media are speculating that Mirotic is being brought over because the Bulls know Melo will not sign there.

and as usual... all bases covered lol. the media "insider" news sucks. they're about as much of an insider as the public.

Cartman718 wrote:tkf and dk7th have got to be depressed right now if this rumor is true. i like andrew's chain of thought though.... chicago's assets are enviable and if melo really does want to go there, the 129 mill is sure going to come at a high price.

he was going to get overpaid no matter what. as bonn1997 said in another thread, the 12-14 million was how much he is actually worth to the knicks for the best chance at a winning cause, because melo is a tagalong closer to a chris bosh and not a true max franchise player-- even if he ends up getting paid like one. on principle the guy should sacrifice a bunch if he truly trusts the process and understands his actual limitations as a player. apparently he doesn't and that is a crying shame for new york city.

i don't get this move, if this is what ends up happening. i have zero expectation that melo is capable of learning the triangle offense and i have little hope that the knicks will attract quality, seasoned players. i don't root against it, i just don't see it.

depressed? not exactly. more like somewhere between despondent and indifferent.

CrushAlot wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

Papabear wrote:

Andrew wrote:Sure Melo, take the max as we sign and trade you for some nice assets to chicago

Papabear Says

That won't happen. He stays in New York.

Can't believe the Bulls offered him $60mil over 4 years, and thought he'd go for it over 5 years at $130mil!

Not a fan of this offer at all, it's a disaster- never thought we'd offer him that much under Phil.

Bulls offered him what his real value is to a Contending roster. Any team like the Knicks that are offering more will never contend for anything.

Bulls offered him the max they could. Berman just tweeted that the Bulls are bringing Mirotic over. Berman seems to think this is to use him in a sign and trade for Melo. I am not sure if you can trade a player that you just signed. Others in the media are speculating that Mirotic is being brought over because the Bulls know Melo will not sign there.

That is the point isn't it? When you have a balanced roster that can contend you can't afford to pay a one dimensional ball hog 23 million a year. Bulls would need to keep their core to make up for Melo's lack of effort on defense if they want to contend.

If they do an S&T and give up Gibson and the euro as well as their draft picks I will be happy but they won't be contenders. They may be good in the East but that's not saying much.

Vmart wrote:

anrst wrote:i dunno man... if it "was there all along" ... why was it "offered" just now tonight? ... seriously? wtf is brousard talking about. the offer was there all along, but it was offered tonight?

how does that make any sense.

The Max was there all along. Melo just wants to jump through hoops so he can feel loved and empowered. I'm totally against giving a max deal to any player including LeBron these are guaranteed contracts one would think they learned from Houston and Amare, Rose and all those that never lived up to their max deals.

I always got the feeling that Jackson was drawing a line when he talked about Anthony taking less than Max, and that he would not make a Max offer.

As some have speculated, this gives Anthony the opportunity to be magnanimous and take less to help the team, but if he really has been offered a Max contract and takes it, he comes across as selfish, Phil comes across as weak, and the Knicks are severely hamstrung in terms of optimizing their roster.

I do find it ironic that we did a sign and trade with Denver so Anthony could get more $ and an extra year (am I wrong about this?), and then he opts out his final year. If the only financial difference between a S&T and picking him up as a FA was the extra year he got, then in essence, we gave up players and picks for a guy we could have gotten as a FA for the same terms.

If we sign him to a max we should have a team option for the final year (of course Anthony won't do this) and cut him loose if our mediocrity continues.