F500ONE wrote:Knicksfan wrote:One thing about this: Phil Jackson offered this deal.
you have to believe that he still knows what he is doing with this deal. You have to believe that the "discount" given will indeed give Phil enough room to sign a second star next year
Example of how his contract could look meeting salary rules under CBA
Year 1: $22,500,000 (starting salary)
Year 2: $22,668,750 (0.75% increase)
Year 3: $24,368,906 (7.5% increase)
Year 4: $26,196,574 (7.5% increase)
Year 5: $28,161,317 (7.5% increase)
Total: $123,895,548
Is there really such a thing as a discount when you still get a raise?
Come on, now. We all know he would be getting a 7.5% raise but instead is having a "discounted raise" to help Phil have money to sign someone in 2015.
For everybody thinking we are going back to the Layden years, read this. It may give you a better outlook for the future, although some of you are just more comfortable under the darkness of negativity just for the sake of it.
http://www.postingandtoasting.com/2014/7...
VDesai wrote:It could be 24.5 mm in year 2. Even if its a 1.4 mm savings it helps us sign either LLE veteran or covers the salary slot alotted to a first round pick while still preserving max contract space and a little leftover.Look its not a huge savings or anything, but it helps a bit. We might've gotten a bigger discount if we were coming off the 54 win season instead of the 37 win season, but c'est la vie.
True
His 7.5% raise is factored from his first yr salary $22,500,000
Comes to $1,687,500 raise each yr and can only decrease by the same amount each yr if a paycut is taken. In order to get to the $124mil total you have to crunch numbers accordingly and figure how much of the $1,687,500 raise did he give back.
What he could have done, adjust his first yr starting salary lower like either 20 or 21 mil or even less.
He could have taken the full % of raises each yr. This would have provided lower second yr salary and other successive yrs.
Knicksfan wrote:F500ONE wrote:Knicksfan wrote:One thing about this: Phil Jackson offered this deal.
you have to believe that he still knows what he is doing with this deal. You have to believe that the "discount" given will indeed give Phil enough room to sign a second star next year
Example of how his contract could look meeting salary rules under CBA
Year 1: $22,500,000 (starting salary)
Year 2: $22,668,750 (0.75% increase)
Year 3: $24,368,906 (7.5% increase)
Year 4: $26,196,574 (7.5% increase)
Year 5: $28,161,317 (7.5% increase)
Total: $123,895,548
Is there really such a thing as a discount when you still get a raise?
Come on, now. We all know he would be getting a 7.5% raise but instead is having a "discounted raise" to help Phil have money to sign someone in 2015.
Correct looking at it from a technical giveback standpoint, but he had an option to have his salary decrease by 7.5% too.
He chose to forego it
Had he not given back $1.5mil it wasn't going to stunt us from signing a major target
F500ONE wrote:Knicksfan wrote:F500ONE wrote:Knicksfan wrote:One thing about this: Phil Jackson offered this deal.
you have to believe that he still knows what he is doing with this deal. You have to believe that the "discount" given will indeed give Phil enough room to sign a second star next year
Example of how his contract could look meeting salary rules under CBA
Year 1: $22,500,000 (starting salary)
Year 2: $22,668,750 (0.75% increase)
Year 3: $24,368,906 (7.5% increase)
Year 4: $26,196,574 (7.5% increase)
Year 5: $28,161,317 (7.5% increase)
Total: $123,895,548
Is there really such a thing as a discount when you still get a raise?
Come on, now. We all know he would be getting a 7.5% raise but instead is having a "discounted raise" to help Phil have money to sign someone in 2015.
Correct looking at it from a technical giveback standpoint, but he had an option to have his salary decrease by 7.5% too.
He chose to forego it
Had he not given back $1.5mil it wasn't going to stunt us from signing a major target
We have to wonder if it was an option for him given by Phil. May have been. Maybe not.
As a fan, I am somewhat disappointed in his contract, but it does still allows Phil to sign Gasol next year. We do have a near-max or max slot available. If that was the plan from the start and this Melo deal allows it, then the Melo hate is really unwarranted. Phil still can get his other man with the space he has next year.
i feel sad for knicks fans.
dk7th wrote:i feel sad for knicks fans.
maybe your pity is better suited to another forum? most of us are seeing that phil jackson already removed some trash and brought talent in.
Cartman718 wrote:dk7th wrote:i feel sad for knicks fans.
maybe your pity is better suited to another forum? most of us are seeing that phil jackson already removed some trash and brought talent in.
if i actually felt pity i would use the word "pity."
Listen who in their right mind is actually going to take a pay cut. Your GM is getting 12MM a year and has zero experience. The Knicks one of the worst franchises in the entire league that hasn't won a championship in 40 years is the most valuable team in all of basketball. So why would Melo take less.
Is the contract a joke? sure. but, jodie meeks got 9MM a year, so is Melo worth the max in this league without question. Had we not signed him we were getting who. Love will be resigned, Rondo traded and signed and Aldrige re-upped. We were screwed for a long time so we needed to lock it down.
dk7th wrote:Cartman718 wrote:dk7th wrote:i feel sad for knicks fans.
maybe your pity is better suited to another forum? most of us are seeing that phil jackson already removed some trash and brought talent in.
if i actually felt pity i would use the word "pity."
sadness, pity, menopause... take your pick :) KL, KD... i have faith that Phil will get one of these two people this year or next.
Read this:
One thing I mentioned at the very beginning of this piece is that a larger pay cut might not have changed much for the Knicks. To illustrate that point, we can also take a look at how some commonly suggested pay cuts would have affected the cap sheet. First, the widely requested 5-year, $115 million contract where Melo takes a 7.5% pay decrease in year 2.Decrease in Year 2
Year_____Amount__________________Raise
2015_____$22,458,401.70__________5.0%
2016_____$20,774,021.57_________-7.5%
2017_____$22,458,401.70__________7.5%
2018_____$24,142,781.83__________7.5%
2019_____$25,827,161.96__________7.5%
Total____$115,660,768.76
Just as with the contract Melo actually took, the foregoing of a maximum increase in 2015-16 leads to less money in each subsequent year. This is what the cap sheet would've looked like:
Renouncing every cap hold for 2015-16 would give the Knicks more than $20 million in space; waiving Pablo would push that number close to $22 million. If New York were to use $19.95 million of that space on Marc Gasol, they would have about $2 million left over. The BAE is projected to be $2.14 million in 2015-16, which means the Knicks would effectively be working with a bit less than the BAE after signing Gasol. The Room Exception is projected at $2.81 million for 2015-16, so the extra $2 million means almost nothing. This contract would also only give the Knicks $3.5 million extra in cap space for 2016-17; that's basically the mini-MLE.
http://www.postingandtoasting.com/2014/7...
If Melo will change his game and will start working in a system in team concept making other players of the team better nobody cares about this numbers, but if not and he will be same iso-ball volume shooter he was all his NBA stint then we will have a big unresolvable problem. Same true if he will break down early as Huston and Stat...
This is gamble... but hey somebody wins the lottery... may be we are due?
Cartman718 wrote:dk7th wrote:Cartman718 wrote:dk7th wrote:i feel sad for knicks fans.
maybe your pity is better suited to another forum? most of us are seeing that phil jackson already removed some trash and brought talent in.
if i actually felt pity i would use the word "pity."
sadness, pity, menopause... take your pick :) KL, KD... i have faith that Phil will get one of these two people this year or next.
they are going to have to want to come here voluntarily, so it don't matter how bad jackson wants them here. there is zero evidence that players of that caliber will want to play with anthony.
therefore this coming season melo has a huge onus to prove he's worth coming to new york to play with. make no mistake... 14-15 is not a throwaway season by any stretch.
odd that you associate sadness and pity with menopause-- i assumed you were a male. sorry.
dk7th wrote:Cartman718 wrote:dk7th wrote:Cartman718 wrote:dk7th wrote:i feel sad for knicks fans.
maybe your pity is better suited to another forum? most of us are seeing that phil jackson already removed some trash and brought talent in.
if i actually felt pity i would use the word "pity."
sadness, pity, menopause... take your pick :) KL, KD... i have faith that Phil will get one of these two people this year or next.
they are going to have to want to come here voluntarily, so it don't matter how bad jackson wants them here. there is zero evidence that players of that caliber will want to play with anthony.
therefore this coming season melo has a huge onus to prove he's worth coming to new york to play with. make no mistake... 14-15 is not a throwaway season by any stretch.
odd that you associate sadness and pity with menopause-- i assumed you were a male. sorry.
I agree. No superstar has wanted to come and play with Anthony for 3.6 million. However, we know LeBron and wade wanted to play with him. Lets what happens when the Knicks can offer worthy compensation in addition to the chance to play with Melo.
wade just took an $11 mil paycut over 2 years. melo is not looking good compared to other big name players.
djsunyc wrote:wade just took an $11 mil paycut over 2 years. melo is not looking good compared to other big name players.
Wade played 2800 minutes the first year LBJ was in Miami. He hasn't been able to play more than 54 games two of the last three years. Wade has chronic degenerative knee issues. LBJ left in part because his teammates couldn't get it done vwade did the right thing based on his physical ailments. Your post applies to amare who reupped to be either the highest or second highest player in the nba. Too bad Amare didnt put team first prior to re-upping.
djsunyc wrote:wade just took an $11 mil paycut over 2 years. melo is not looking good compared to other big name players.
I'm not sure Wade's was all that voluntary... Guy opted out for a Lebron max. How he was still able to sign for 16M/year at that point playing half a season is beyond me.
Dirk took less. Nice gesture from a franchise guy approaching the end of his career. Meanwhile Bron took his max in Cleveland (structuring for another raise in 2 years), and Bosh snatched 118M.
It is what it is. Not a fan of the contract, but was expected. Phil can continue with Plan A.
Knicksfan wrote:Read this:
One thing I mentioned at the very beginning of this piece is that a larger pay cut might not have changed much for the Knicks. To illustrate that point, we can also take a look at how some commonly suggested pay cuts would have affected the cap sheet. First, the widely requested 5-year, $115 million contract where Melo takes a 7.5% pay decrease in year 2.Decrease in Year 2
Year_____Amount__________________Raise
2015_____$22,458,401.70__________5.0%
2016_____$20,774,021.57_________-7.5%
2017_____$22,458,401.70__________7.5%
2018_____$24,142,781.83__________7.5%
2019_____$25,827,161.96__________7.5%
Total____$115,660,768.76
Just as with the contract Melo actually took, the foregoing of a maximum increase in 2015-16 leads to less money in each subsequent year. This is what the cap sheet would've looked like:
Renouncing every cap hold for 2015-16 would give the Knicks more than $20 million in space; waiving Pablo would push that number close to $22 million. If New York were to use $19.95 million of that space on Marc Gasol, they would have about $2 million left over. The BAE is projected to be $2.14 million in 2015-16, which means the Knicks would effectively be working with a bit less than the BAE after signing Gasol. The Room Exception is projected at $2.81 million for 2015-16, so the extra $2 million means almost nothing. This contract would also only give the Knicks $3.5 million extra in cap space for 2016-17; that's basically the mini-MLE.
http://www.postingandtoasting.com/2014/7...
So basically Melo would have needed to take a 5yr/$85-95M contract to make a impact to get one max and one $10M+ player. A $30-40M paycut is not that bad though as a 30 yr old.
Keep our draft picks, develop young players.
yellowboy90 wrote:Knicksfan wrote:Read this:
One thing I mentioned at the very beginning of this piece is that a larger pay cut might not have changed much for the Knicks. To illustrate that point, we can also take a look at how some commonly suggested pay cuts would have affected the cap sheet. First, the widely requested 5-year, $115 million contract where Melo takes a 7.5% pay decrease in year 2.Decrease in Year 2
Year_____Amount__________________Raise
2015_____$22,458,401.70__________5.0%
2016_____$20,774,021.57_________-7.5%
2017_____$22,458,401.70__________7.5%
2018_____$24,142,781.83__________7.5%
2019_____$25,827,161.96__________7.5%
Total____$115,660,768.76
Just as with the contract Melo actually took, the foregoing of a maximum increase in 2015-16 leads to less money in each subsequent year. This is what the cap sheet would've looked like:
Renouncing every cap hold for 2015-16 would give the Knicks more than $20 million in space; waiving Pablo would push that number close to $22 million. If New York were to use $19.95 million of that space on Marc Gasol, they would have about $2 million left over. The BAE is projected to be $2.14 million in 2015-16, which means the Knicks would effectively be working with a bit less than the BAE after signing Gasol. The Room Exception is projected at $2.81 million for 2015-16, so the extra $2 million means almost nothing. This contract would also only give the Knicks $3.5 million extra in cap space for 2016-17; that's basically the mini-MLE.
http://www.postingandtoasting.com/2014/7...
So basically Melo would have needed to take a 5yr/$85-95M contract to make a impact to get one max and one $10M+ player. A $30-40M paycut is not that bad though as a 30 yr old.
Suggesting he shouldve given NYK such a discount? Really?
arkrud wrote:If Melo will change his game and will start working in a system in team concept making other players of the team better nobody cares about this numbers, but if not and he will be same iso-ball volume shooter he was all his NBA stint then we will have a big unresolvable problem. Same true if he will break down early as Huston and Stat...
This is gamble... but hey somebody wins the lottery... may be we are due?
Yes those are pretty much thoughts too. Eberly I don't believe in winning the lottery by taking a gamble on high risk low rated moves is a good strategy. Just look at Houston, Curry, Amare...
All it does is set is further and further back.
