Knicks · OT: Hawks Selling Team Because of "Offensive" Emails... (page 5)
Uptown wrote:arkrud wrote:F500ONE wrote:The position of power with the Atlanta Hawks' organization held by Michael Gearon had been neutralized by Bruce Levenson and Danny Ferry.But Gearon was on a conference call with Ferry in June in which free agents were discussed.
The call proceeded with Ferry hustling through free agent names, a list that included Carmelo Anthony: "He can shoot the [expletive] out of it, but he screws you up in other ways," Ferry said, according to a transcript obtained by Yahoo Sports.
Ferry would go on to say of Anthony: "So is he really worth the 20 million dollars? … I would argue if he plays the right way, absolutely."
The Hawks never had an opportunity to pursue Anthony, but they did have a chance to sign Luol Deng.
Several sources told Yahoo that within the basketball operations, Ferry was Atlanta's biggest proponent to sign Deng.
Ferry started about how Deng "has got some African in him" and proceeded to make a comparison to Africans with phony facades selling counterfeit goods.
As soon as those words left Ferry's mouth on the call, Gearon responded in a dramatic way in the background of the tape recording, according to a partial transcript of the call obtained by Yahoo Sports.
"Oh my God, that comment sounds like Sterling on TMZ," Gearon said.
Gearon allowed Ferry to keep talking.
On Deng, Ferry said: "… For example, he can come out and be an unnamed source for a story and two days later come out and say, 'That absolutely was not me. I can't believe someone said that.'
"But talking to reporters, you know they can [believe it]."
Ferry kept going on Deng: "… Good guy in Chicago. They will tell you he was good for their culture, but not a culture setter. He played hard and all those things, but he was very worried about his bobble-head being the last one given away that year, or there was not enough stuff of him in the [team] store … kind of a complex guy."
According to the report, Ferry appears to be making his own interjections on the call and not reciting words belonging to someone else.
Ferry knows if he's cannedIt's never getting cracked open again
This dude is cooked, he's doneyanLike a rotten onion
It is pretty clear that in today America no white person should make any public comment mentioning African american or just African people in any form except of praising their excellent qualities. And this is good to praise people of any kind.
However if someone has burning desire to hate on somebody publicly he can safely say anything about white or Asian people.
They are used to this and don't give a damn anyways.
WOW! This post reeks of ignorance. As Nard pointed out, I guess you missed the whole "Chink in the Armor" article concerning Jeremy Lin? Dior Designer, John Galliano (worked with Madanna, Nicole Kidman, etc) made and anti-semtic remark and was fired a few years ago. The whole Redskin debacle concerning native americans has been all over the news of late. Seems as if you have an agenda....
My agenda is simple.
Nobody should judge people based on how they look, their race, gender, orientation, national descend, religion, weight, height, disability, etc.
People are what they do and what they say not how they look.
People who bring race up to single out somebody to praise or to hate are racists.
Plain and simple.
If somebody has a bad experience with specific kind of people he should just stay away and mind his own business.
No need to hang stereotypes on everybody.
Nalod wrote:Ferry Made the comment or read the comment from a scouting report?
Ferry should not have repeated it but is that the same as who wrote it?
All this because Levenson came public for his somewhat misworded demographic discription to the state of their Attndance.Ferry has been backed by his black friends as not being racist.
Does me defending Ferry make me a racist? If I ignore a racist comment does that make me a racist?
Do you actually believe Ferry though? You're telling me he didn't read that report in advance- he just went into the conference call without having done any prep? And if a scout really wrote it, why hasn't the scout been fired?
I never think that having black friends vouch for him means anything (he's hardly likely to reveal his racism to them- like would he really of said the african thing if his audience had been black?). Besides which it's a red herring- the issue isn't whether he is a racist in his free time, it's that he was racist at work and it will likely impact his recruiting abilities further down the line.
smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:Ferry Made the comment or read the comment from a scouting report?
Ferry should not have repeated it but is that the same as who wrote it?
All this because Levenson came public for his somewhat misworded demographic discription to the state of their Attndance.Ferry has been backed by his black friends as not being racist.
Does me defending Ferry make me a racist? If I ignore a racist comment does that make me a racist?
Do you actually believe Ferry though? You're telling me he didn't read that report in advance- he just went into the conference call without having done any prep? And if a scout really wrote it, why hasn't the scout been fired?
I never think that having black friends vouch for him means anything (he's hardly likely to reveal his racism to them- like would he really of said the african thing if his audience had been black?). Besides which it's a red herring- the issue isn't whether he is a racist in his free time, it's that he was racist at work and it will likely impact his recruiting abilities further down the line.
What if the Scout that wrote it was black?? Does that change anything?
Nalod wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:Ferry Made the comment or read the comment from a scouting report?
Ferry should not have repeated it but is that the same as who wrote it?
All this because Levenson came public for his somewhat misworded demographic discription to the state of their Attndance.Ferry has been backed by his black friends as not being racist.
Does me defending Ferry make me a racist? If I ignore a racist comment does that make me a racist?
Do you actually believe Ferry though? You're telling me he didn't read that report in advance- he just went into the conference call without having done any prep? And if a scout really wrote it, why hasn't the scout been fired?
I never think that having black friends vouch for him means anything (he's hardly likely to reveal his racism to them- like would he really of said the african thing if his audience had been black?). Besides which it's a red herring- the issue isn't whether he is a racist in his free time, it's that he was racist at work and it will likely impact his recruiting abilities further down the line.
What if the Scout that wrote it was black?? Does that change anything?
Nope- you cannot use racial stereotypes as a possible reason for not hiring someone, it's basic employment law.
arkrud wrote:NardDogNation wrote:arkrud wrote:F500ONE wrote:The position of power with the Atlanta Hawks' organization held by Michael Gearon had been neutralized by Bruce Levenson and Danny Ferry.But Gearon was on a conference call with Ferry in June in which free agents were discussed.
The call proceeded with Ferry hustling through free agent names, a list that included Carmelo Anthony: "He can shoot the [expletive] out of it, but he screws you up in other ways," Ferry said, according to a transcript obtained by Yahoo Sports.
Ferry would go on to say of Anthony: "So is he really worth the 20 million dollars? … I would argue if he plays the right way, absolutely."
The Hawks never had an opportunity to pursue Anthony, but they did have a chance to sign Luol Deng.
Several sources told Yahoo that within the basketball operations, Ferry was Atlanta's biggest proponent to sign Deng.
Ferry started about how Deng "has got some African in him" and proceeded to make a comparison to Africans with phony facades selling counterfeit goods.
As soon as those words left Ferry's mouth on the call, Gearon responded in a dramatic way in the background of the tape recording, according to a partial transcript of the call obtained by Yahoo Sports.
"Oh my God, that comment sounds like Sterling on TMZ," Gearon said.
Gearon allowed Ferry to keep talking.
On Deng, Ferry said: "… For example, he can come out and be an unnamed source for a story and two days later come out and say, 'That absolutely was not me. I can't believe someone said that.'
"But talking to reporters, you know they can [believe it]."
Ferry kept going on Deng: "… Good guy in Chicago. They will tell you he was good for their culture, but not a culture setter. He played hard and all those things, but he was very worried about his bobble-head being the last one given away that year, or there was not enough stuff of him in the [team] store … kind of a complex guy."
According to the report, Ferry appears to be making his own interjections on the call and not reciting words belonging to someone else.
Ferry knows if he's cannedIt's never getting cracked open again
This dude is cooked, he's doneyanLike a rotten onion
It is pretty clear that in today America no white person should make any public comment mentioning African american or just African people in any form except of praising their excellent qualities. And this is good to praise people of any kind.
However if someone has burning desire to hate on somebody publicly he can safely say anything about white or Asian people.
They are used to this and don't give a damn anyways.
You mean like when Max Bretos of ESPN was suspended for 30 days and an editor was outright fired for using the headline "chink in the armor?" in a story about Jeremy Lin? Or like when Sherrly Sherrod, an African American of the USDA, was fired for making comments that were misconstrued as being discriminatory against white people?
Dude, we get it, you are racist and don't like Black people. But don't try to rationalize it with nonsense to fit your narrative. In the meantime, how about you educate yourself about the going-ons of the world so I don't have to take time out of my day to constantly correct you?
Signed,
A Black guyI remember the Lin thing... never heard about Sherrod.
Not sure why my comment is racist... it was not directed at any specific group of peopleSigned,
Humanoid
You consistently have the same overarching narrative about Black people either being inferior and/or exclusive beneficiaries of double standards. From the post about that Australian teen who was murdered by three individuals who were presumed to be Black, lending to your central argument that the only racism is reverse racism; to posts intimating that Jews are morally and culturally superior to Black people in response to my comments that Blacks should look to develop economic infrastructure like Jews to make political in-roads, following the Donald Sterling fallout; to several different posts about economic policies; to this shit that you just posted. Your intent isn't to have constructive dialogue about these situations as much as it is to disparage. That's why I think you're a racist. It's also why I find it particularly amusing that you conveniently consider yourself a "humaniod" now, after being called out. Since we're evidently operating in the realm of fantasy, I'll close with the folllowing....
Signed,
The reincarnation of Benjamin Franklin
smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:Ferry Made the comment or read the comment from a scouting report?
Ferry should not have repeated it but is that the same as who wrote it?
All this because Levenson came public for his somewhat misworded demographic discription to the state of their Attndance.Ferry has been backed by his black friends as not being racist.
Does me defending Ferry make me a racist? If I ignore a racist comment does that make me a racist?
Do you actually believe Ferry though? You're telling me he didn't read that report in advance- he just went into the conference call without having done any prep? And if a scout really wrote it, why hasn't the scout been fired?
I never think that having black friends vouch for him means anything (he's hardly likely to reveal his racism to them- like would he really of said the african thing if his audience had been black?). Besides which it's a red herring- the issue isn't whether he is a racist in his free time, it's that he was racist at work and it will likely impact his recruiting abilities further down the line.
What if the Scout that wrote it was black?? Does that change anything?
Nope- you cannot use racial stereotypes as a possible reason for not hiring someone, it's basic employment law.
Can employee/candidate use racial stereotypes to claim that he was fired or not hired? I guess this is no low for this.
And folks who are using this to prosecute the employer (and this happened a lot) are making a big disservice to potential employes from his/her demographic group.
By putting so much attention to race and diversity we as society created a monster which brewing racism.
Ideally the personal information should not only be confidential but also removed from any government and employment procedures and stats.
Everyone should be just American citizen or legal alien. No other info should be of any legal significance.
And then if somebody is using race as a positive/negative factor this should be considered as crime/corruption.
The fact that even arguing this aspect of live became a tabu is also disturbing.
As soon as someone wants to discuss it he automatically labeled as racist as apparently it is nothing to argue about and all is hunky dory in Danish Kingdom.
arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:Ferry Made the comment or read the comment from a scouting report?
Ferry should not have repeated it but is that the same as who wrote it?
All this because Levenson came public for his somewhat misworded demographic discription to the state of their Attndance.Ferry has been backed by his black friends as not being racist.
Does me defending Ferry make me a racist? If I ignore a racist comment does that make me a racist?
Do you actually believe Ferry though? You're telling me he didn't read that report in advance- he just went into the conference call without having done any prep? And if a scout really wrote it, why hasn't the scout been fired?
I never think that having black friends vouch for him means anything (he's hardly likely to reveal his racism to them- like would he really of said the african thing if his audience had been black?). Besides which it's a red herring- the issue isn't whether he is a racist in his free time, it's that he was racist at work and it will likely impact his recruiting abilities further down the line.
What if the Scout that wrote it was black?? Does that change anything?
Nope- you cannot use racial stereotypes as a possible reason for not hiring someone, it's basic employment law.
Can employee/candidate use racial stereotypes to claim that he was fired or not hired? I guess this is no low for this.
And folks who are using this to prosecute the employer (and this happened a lot) are making a big disservice to potential employes from his/her demographic group.
By putting so much attention to race and diversity we as society created a monster which brewing racism.
Ideally the personal information should not only be confidential but also removed from any government and employment procedures and stats.
Everyone should be just American citizen or legal alien. No other info should be of any legal significance.
And then if somebody is using race as a positive/negative factor this should be considered as crime/corruption.
The fact that even arguing this aspect of live became a tabu is also disturbing.
As soon as someone wants to discuss it he automatically labeled as racist as apparently it is nothing to argue about and all is hunky dory in Danish Kingdom.
I always find this kind of reasoning bizarre- that the main damage regarding racism is caused by people complaining about it, and that if they didn't complain about it, it wouldn't happen and there wouldn't be any problem. This is just daft. It's like saying if people didn't complain about rape and murder as much, it wouldn't really be an issue.
smackeddog wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:Ferry Made the comment or read the comment from a scouting report?
Ferry should not have repeated it but is that the same as who wrote it?
All this because Levenson came public for his somewhat misworded demographic discription to the state of their Attndance.Ferry has been backed by his black friends as not being racist.
Does me defending Ferry make me a racist? If I ignore a racist comment does that make me a racist?
Do you actually believe Ferry though? You're telling me he didn't read that report in advance- he just went into the conference call without having done any prep? And if a scout really wrote it, why hasn't the scout been fired?
I never think that having black friends vouch for him means anything (he's hardly likely to reveal his racism to them- like would he really of said the african thing if his audience had been black?). Besides which it's a red herring- the issue isn't whether he is a racist in his free time, it's that he was racist at work and it will likely impact his recruiting abilities further down the line.
What if the Scout that wrote it was black?? Does that change anything?
Nope- you cannot use racial stereotypes as a possible reason for not hiring someone, it's basic employment law.
Can employee/candidate use racial stereotypes to claim that he was fired or not hired? I guess this is no low for this.
And folks who are using this to prosecute the employer (and this happened a lot) are making a big disservice to potential employes from his/her demographic group.
By putting so much attention to race and diversity we as society created a monster which brewing racism.
Ideally the personal information should not only be confidential but also removed from any government and employment procedures and stats.
Everyone should be just American citizen or legal alien. No other info should be of any legal significance.
And then if somebody is using race as a positive/negative factor this should be considered as crime/corruption.
The fact that even arguing this aspect of live became a tabu is also disturbing.
As soon as someone wants to discuss it he automatically labeled as racist as apparently it is nothing to argue about and all is hunky dory in Danish Kingdom.
I always find this kind of reasoning bizarre- that the main damage regarding racism is caused by people complaining about it, and that if they didn't complain about it, it wouldn't happen and there wouldn't be any problem. This is just daft. It's like saying if people didn't complain about rape and murder as much, it wouldn't really be an issue.
Main damage done by people who are using the victims of racism to build their political image and by media which is using each such case to increase the advertisement revenue.
If you actually read my post you will see that I said that people are not allowed to talk about it; not should not talk about it.
And any opinion should be permitted for discussion except of clear hate an calls for violence.
arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:Ferry Made the comment or read the comment from a scouting report?
Ferry should not have repeated it but is that the same as who wrote it?
All this because Levenson came public for his somewhat misworded demographic discription to the state of their Attndance.Ferry has been backed by his black friends as not being racist.
Does me defending Ferry make me a racist? If I ignore a racist comment does that make me a racist?
Do you actually believe Ferry though? You're telling me he didn't read that report in advance- he just went into the conference call without having done any prep? And if a scout really wrote it, why hasn't the scout been fired?
I never think that having black friends vouch for him means anything (he's hardly likely to reveal his racism to them- like would he really of said the african thing if his audience had been black?). Besides which it's a red herring- the issue isn't whether he is a racist in his free time, it's that he was racist at work and it will likely impact his recruiting abilities further down the line.
What if the Scout that wrote it was black?? Does that change anything?
Nope- you cannot use racial stereotypes as a possible reason for not hiring someone, it's basic employment law.
Can employee/candidate use racial stereotypes to claim that he was fired or not hired? I guess this is no low for this.
And folks who are using this to prosecute the employer (and this happened a lot) are making a big disservice to potential employes from his/her demographic group.
By putting so much attention to race and diversity we as society created a monster which brewing racism.
Ideally the personal information should not only be confidential but also removed from any government and employment procedures and stats.
Everyone should be just American citizen or legal alien. No other info should be of any legal significance.
And then if somebody is using race as a positive/negative factor this should be considered as crime/corruption.
The fact that even arguing this aspect of live became a tabu is also disturbing.
As soon as someone wants to discuss it he automatically labeled as racist as apparently it is nothing to argue about and all is hunky dory in Danish Kingdom.
I always find this kind of reasoning bizarre- that the main damage regarding racism is caused by people complaining about it, and that if they didn't complain about it, it wouldn't happen and there wouldn't be any problem. This is just daft. It's like saying if people didn't complain about rape and murder as much, it wouldn't really be an issue.
Main damage done by people who are using the victims of racism to build their political image and by media which is using each such case to increase the advertisement revenue.
If you actually read my post you will see that I said that people are not allowed to talk about it; not should not talk about it.
And any opinion should be permitted for discussion except of clear hate an calls for violence.
Logic follows that the main damage done to the "victims of racism" comes from the perpetrators of racism that injured them.
I'll grant you that race hustlers and media exploiters exist for the sake of argument, but metaphorically they would just be ambulance chasers arriving at the scene of a crime. The racist is the hit-and-run driver who has caused the main damage, obviously.
arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:Ferry Made the comment or read the comment from a scouting report?
Ferry should not have repeated it but is that the same as who wrote it?
All this because Levenson came public for his somewhat misworded demographic discription to the state of their Attndance.Ferry has been backed by his black friends as not being racist.
Does me defending Ferry make me a racist? If I ignore a racist comment does that make me a racist?
Do you actually believe Ferry though? You're telling me he didn't read that report in advance- he just went into the conference call without having done any prep? And if a scout really wrote it, why hasn't the scout been fired?
I never think that having black friends vouch for him means anything (he's hardly likely to reveal his racism to them- like would he really of said the african thing if his audience had been black?). Besides which it's a red herring- the issue isn't whether he is a racist in his free time, it's that he was racist at work and it will likely impact his recruiting abilities further down the line.
What if the Scout that wrote it was black?? Does that change anything?
Nope- you cannot use racial stereotypes as a possible reason for not hiring someone, it's basic employment law.
Can employee/candidate use racial stereotypes to claim that he was fired or not hired? I guess this is no low for this.
And folks who are using this to prosecute the employer (and this happened a lot) are making a big disservice to potential employes from his/her demographic group.
By putting so much attention to race and diversity we as society created a monster which brewing racism.
Ideally the personal information should not only be confidential but also removed from any government and employment procedures and stats.
Everyone should be just American citizen or legal alien. No other info should be of any legal significance.
And then if somebody is using race as a positive/negative factor this should be considered as crime/corruption.
The fact that even arguing this aspect of live became a tabu is also disturbing.
As soon as someone wants to discuss it he automatically labeled as racist as apparently it is nothing to argue about and all is hunky dory in Danish Kingdom.
I always find this kind of reasoning bizarre- that the main damage regarding racism is caused by people complaining about it, and that if they didn't complain about it, it wouldn't happen and there wouldn't be any problem. This is just daft. It's like saying if people didn't complain about rape and murder as much, it wouldn't really be an issue.
Main damage done by people who are using the victims of racism to build their political image and by media which is using each such case to increase the advertisement revenue.
If you actually read my post you will see that I said that people are not allowed to talk about it; not should not talk about it.
And any opinion should be permitted for discussion except of clear hate an calls for violence.
So do you consider it the same for anti-semitism- that the main damage is done by people who complain about it and report it, and that they're exaggerating it's existence? Do you wish we lived in a world where people could feel more comfortable being openly anti-semitic without fear of people speaking out about it?
Our laws have been slow to employ our constitution that grants "all people are created equal".
While far from perfect the document is the greatest on the planet and a beacon of light to follow. We are getting there and making progress. We as a society move forward but its not without its scars.
Racism exists even though we know its wrong. Keep moving forward.
smackeddog wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:Ferry Made the comment or read the comment from a scouting report?
Ferry should not have repeated it but is that the same as who wrote it?
All this because Levenson came public for his somewhat misworded demographic discription to the state of their Attndance.Ferry has been backed by his black friends as not being racist.
Does me defending Ferry make me a racist? If I ignore a racist comment does that make me a racist?
Do you actually believe Ferry though? You're telling me he didn't read that report in advance- he just went into the conference call without having done any prep? And if a scout really wrote it, why hasn't the scout been fired?
I never think that having black friends vouch for him means anything (he's hardly likely to reveal his racism to them- like would he really of said the african thing if his audience had been black?). Besides which it's a red herring- the issue isn't whether he is a racist in his free time, it's that he was racist at work and it will likely impact his recruiting abilities further down the line.
What if the Scout that wrote it was black?? Does that change anything?
Nope- you cannot use racial stereotypes as a possible reason for not hiring someone, it's basic employment law.
Can employee/candidate use racial stereotypes to claim that he was fired or not hired? I guess this is no low for this.
And folks who are using this to prosecute the employer (and this happened a lot) are making a big disservice to potential employes from his/her demographic group.
By putting so much attention to race and diversity we as society created a monster which brewing racism.
Ideally the personal information should not only be confidential but also removed from any government and employment procedures and stats.
Everyone should be just American citizen or legal alien. No other info should be of any legal significance.
And then if somebody is using race as a positive/negative factor this should be considered as crime/corruption.
The fact that even arguing this aspect of live became a tabu is also disturbing.
As soon as someone wants to discuss it he automatically labeled as racist as apparently it is nothing to argue about and all is hunky dory in Danish Kingdom.
I always find this kind of reasoning bizarre- that the main damage regarding racism is caused by people complaining about it, and that if they didn't complain about it, it wouldn't happen and there wouldn't be any problem. This is just daft. It's like saying if people didn't complain about rape and murder as much, it wouldn't really be an issue.
Main damage done by people who are using the victims of racism to build their political image and by media which is using each such case to increase the advertisement revenue.
If you actually read my post you will see that I said that people are not allowed to talk about it; not should not talk about it.
And any opinion should be permitted for discussion except of clear hate an calls for violence.So do you consider it the same for anti-semitism- that the main damage is done by people who complain about it and report it, and that they're exaggerating it's existence? Do you wish we lived in a world where people could feel more comfortable being openly anti-semitic without fear of people speaking out about it?
Yes - people who are ultra-Zionist and use the facts of antisemitism as their political agenda are brewing hate against Jews.
As a Jew the prosecution and oppression of my people and experienced by me personally inspired me to work harder to be successful despite all world biting down on me. This is how we are. It is and always be a shame for me to take any benefits and privileges because of the fact that my people were murdered, tortured, abused, and segregated.
We are leaving in the world where people ARE very comfortable being antisemitic. And there is no issues to talk about it. This is not a social taboo as race issues discussion are in US. If some public figure is antisemitic and is honest about it I have no issues with is.
Everyone has a right to announce to the world that he is bigot an idiot. And other people have rights to react or not react to it showing their own color.
Nalod wrote:Racism will always exist when ever you have people of different culture living under the same roof.Our laws have been slow to employ our constitution that grants "all people are created equal".
While far from perfect the document is the greatest on the planet and a beacon of light to follow. We are getting there and making progress. We as a society move forward but its not without its scars.
Racism exists even though we know its wrong. Keep moving forward.
Things didn't improve on their own- it was thanks to people speaking out, educating and protesting. A lot of people died in the struggle. Racists didn't wake up one day and think "Hey, I think we've been a bit unreasonable here with all the lynchings and slavery- I think we might be misapplying the constitution!"- they were pushed into making changes by protesters and educators.
arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:Ferry Made the comment or read the comment from a scouting report?
Ferry should not have repeated it but is that the same as who wrote it?
All this because Levenson came public for his somewhat misworded demographic discription to the state of their Attndance.Ferry has been backed by his black friends as not being racist.
Does me defending Ferry make me a racist? If I ignore a racist comment does that make me a racist?
Do you actually believe Ferry though? You're telling me he didn't read that report in advance- he just went into the conference call without having done any prep? And if a scout really wrote it, why hasn't the scout been fired?
I never think that having black friends vouch for him means anything (he's hardly likely to reveal his racism to them- like would he really of said the african thing if his audience had been black?). Besides which it's a red herring- the issue isn't whether he is a racist in his free time, it's that he was racist at work and it will likely impact his recruiting abilities further down the line.
What if the Scout that wrote it was black?? Does that change anything?
Nope- you cannot use racial stereotypes as a possible reason for not hiring someone, it's basic employment law.
Can employee/candidate use racial stereotypes to claim that he was fired or not hired? I guess this is no low for this.
And folks who are using this to prosecute the employer (and this happened a lot) are making a big disservice to potential employes from his/her demographic group.
By putting so much attention to race and diversity we as society created a monster which brewing racism.
Ideally the personal information should not only be confidential but also removed from any government and employment procedures and stats.
Everyone should be just American citizen or legal alien. No other info should be of any legal significance.
And then if somebody is using race as a positive/negative factor this should be considered as crime/corruption.
The fact that even arguing this aspect of live became a tabu is also disturbing.
As soon as someone wants to discuss it he automatically labeled as racist as apparently it is nothing to argue about and all is hunky dory in Danish Kingdom.
I always find this kind of reasoning bizarre- that the main damage regarding racism is caused by people complaining about it, and that if they didn't complain about it, it wouldn't happen and there wouldn't be any problem. This is just daft. It's like saying if people didn't complain about rape and murder as much, it wouldn't really be an issue.
Main damage done by people who are using the victims of racism to build their political image and by media which is using each such case to increase the advertisement revenue.
If you actually read my post you will see that I said that people are not allowed to talk about it; not should not talk about it.
And any opinion should be permitted for discussion except of clear hate an calls for violence.So do you consider it the same for anti-semitism- that the main damage is done by people who complain about it and report it, and that they're exaggerating it's existence? Do you wish we lived in a world where people could feel more comfortable being openly anti-semitic without fear of people speaking out about it?
Yes - people who are ultra-Zionist and use the facts of antisemitism as their political agenda are brewing hate against Jews.
As a Jew the prosecution and oppression of my people and experienced by me personally inspired me to work harder to be successful despite all world biting down on me. This is how we are. It is and always be a shame for me to take any benefits and privileges because of the fact that my people were murdered, tortured, abused, and segregated.
We are leaving in the world where people ARE very comfortable being antisemitic. And there is no issues to talk about it. This is not a social taboo as race issues discussion are in US. If some public figure is antisemitic and is honest about it I have no issues with is.
Everyone has a right to announce to the world that he is bigot an idiot. And other people have rights to react or not react to it showing their own color.
I respect your point of view regarding how you personally respond to prejudice and hate: rise above it. You should know that there are many, many Black Americans who do the same thing as you. If you have Black friends, I'm sure they do this (I doubt they would be your friends otherwise). But maybe you don't have any. So that's my main quibble with you. Your posts don't seem to reflect knowledge of this common everyday approach to discrimination, and seems to echo some tired tropes about "race hustlers" and the "race card" while pretending that there is carte blanche everywhere in the US to spout anti-Jewish rhetoric from the rooftops.
I also agree that someone who declares their prejudices openly is easier to deal with than someone who smiles to your face and talks evil when you aren't there. So let's bring it back to the Hawks discussion, because that is what is the issue here: an organization that is tripping over itself justifying odd comments about Africans selling counterfeit goods that were intended for an inside audience.
smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:Racism will always exist when ever you have people of different culture living under the same roof.Our laws have been slow to employ our constitution that grants "all people are created equal".
While far from perfect the document is the greatest on the planet and a beacon of light to follow. We are getting there and making progress. We as a society move forward but its not without its scars.
Racism exists even though we know its wrong. Keep moving forward.
Things didn't improve on their own- it was thanks to people speaking out, educating and protesting. A lot of people died in the struggle. Racists didn't wake up one day and think "Hey, I think we've been a bit unreasonable here with all the lynchings and slavery- I think we might be misapplying the constitution!"- they were pushed into making changes by protesters and educators.
Of course......I didn't omit this for any reason.
http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-bask...
Sounds like Ferry is describing himself!
arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:Ferry Made the comment or read the comment from a scouting report?
Ferry should not have repeated it but is that the same as who wrote it?
All this because Levenson came public for his somewhat misworded demographic discription to the state of their Attndance.Ferry has been backed by his black friends as not being racist.
Does me defending Ferry make me a racist? If I ignore a racist comment does that make me a racist?
Do you actually believe Ferry though? You're telling me he didn't read that report in advance- he just went into the conference call without having done any prep? And if a scout really wrote it, why hasn't the scout been fired?
I never think that having black friends vouch for him means anything (he's hardly likely to reveal his racism to them- like would he really of said the african thing if his audience had been black?). Besides which it's a red herring- the issue isn't whether he is a racist in his free time, it's that he was racist at work and it will likely impact his recruiting abilities further down the line.
What if the Scout that wrote it was black?? Does that change anything?
Nope- you cannot use racial stereotypes as a possible reason for not hiring someone, it's basic employment law.
Can employee/candidate use racial stereotypes to claim that he was fired or not hired? I guess this is no low for this.
And folks who are using this to prosecute the employer (and this happened a lot) are making a big disservice to potential employes from his/her demographic group.
By putting so much attention to race and diversity we as society created a monster which brewing racism.
Ideally the personal information should not only be confidential but also removed from any government and employment procedures and stats.
Everyone should be just American citizen or legal alien. No other info should be of any legal significance.
And then if somebody is using race as a positive/negative factor this should be considered as crime/corruption.
The fact that even arguing this aspect of live became a tabu is also disturbing.
As soon as someone wants to discuss it he automatically labeled as racist as apparently it is nothing to argue about and all is hunky dory in Danish Kingdom.
I always find this kind of reasoning bizarre- that the main damage regarding racism is caused by people complaining about it, and that if they didn't complain about it, it wouldn't happen and there wouldn't be any problem. This is just daft. It's like saying if people didn't complain about rape and murder as much, it wouldn't really be an issue.
Main damage done by people who are using the victims of racism to build their political image and by media which is using each such case to increase the advertisement revenue.
If you actually read my post you will see that I said that people are not allowed to talk about it; not should not talk about it.
And any opinion should be permitted for discussion except of clear hate an calls for violence.So do you consider it the same for anti-semitism- that the main damage is done by people who complain about it and report it, and that they're exaggerating it's existence? Do you wish we lived in a world where people could feel more comfortable being openly anti-semitic without fear of people speaking out about it?
Yes - people who are ultra-Zionist and use the facts of antisemitism as their political agenda are brewing hate against Jews.
As a Jew the prosecution and oppression of my people and experienced by me personally inspired me to work harder to be successful despite all world biting down on me. This is how we are. It is and always be a shame for me to take any benefits and privileges because of the fact that my people were murdered, tortured, abused, and segregated.
We are leaving in the world where people ARE very comfortable being antisemitic. And there is no issues to talk about it. This is not a social taboo as race issues discussion are in US. If some public figure is antisemitic and is honest about it I have no issues with is.
Everyone has a right to announce to the world that he is bigot an idiot. And other people have rights to react or not react to it showing their own color.
We literally just had Ted Cruz, a United States Senator with eyes on a Presidential run, speak at the In Defense of Christians (IDC) conference and state "those who do not stand with Israel, do not stand with America and those who do not stand with the Jews are not Christians" in a country that is 70% Christian. That sentiment is echoed by any and every politician that hopes to be elected to office on a state or national level; from Barack Obama, to Mitt Romney, to John Kerry, to Chris Christie, to Diane Feinstein, to Marco Rubio, to Debbie Wasserman, to Hilary Clinton....the list goes on and on irrespective of how different their political ideologies are. On top of that, our country gives more financial assistance to Israel than any other country in the world (including the ones we recently demolished) at a time when our own country is in economic decline, major American cities like Detroit are dying and Israel's GDP has tripled in just a decade. And no public outcry can be heard from the American people who are known to be especially xenophobic and tribal. Meanwhile, an entire political party (Republicans) keeps 20%-50% of its base by portraying Blacks and other minorities as leeches on the country and cause for its demise, yet you feel "race issues are taboo" while antisemitism is fine and dandy? What fucking world do you live in?
NardDogNation wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:Ferry Made the comment or read the comment from a scouting report?
Ferry should not have repeated it but is that the same as who wrote it?
All this because Levenson came public for his somewhat misworded demographic discription to the state of their Attndance.Ferry has been backed by his black friends as not being racist.
Does me defending Ferry make me a racist? If I ignore a racist comment does that make me a racist?
Do you actually believe Ferry though? You're telling me he didn't read that report in advance- he just went into the conference call without having done any prep? And if a scout really wrote it, why hasn't the scout been fired?
I never think that having black friends vouch for him means anything (he's hardly likely to reveal his racism to them- like would he really of said the african thing if his audience had been black?). Besides which it's a red herring- the issue isn't whether he is a racist in his free time, it's that he was racist at work and it will likely impact his recruiting abilities further down the line.
What if the Scout that wrote it was black?? Does that change anything?
Nope- you cannot use racial stereotypes as a possible reason for not hiring someone, it's basic employment law.
Can employee/candidate use racial stereotypes to claim that he was fired or not hired? I guess this is no low for this.
And folks who are using this to prosecute the employer (and this happened a lot) are making a big disservice to potential employes from his/her demographic group.
By putting so much attention to race and diversity we as society created a monster which brewing racism.
Ideally the personal information should not only be confidential but also removed from any government and employment procedures and stats.
Everyone should be just American citizen or legal alien. No other info should be of any legal significance.
And then if somebody is using race as a positive/negative factor this should be considered as crime/corruption.
The fact that even arguing this aspect of live became a tabu is also disturbing.
As soon as someone wants to discuss it he automatically labeled as racist as apparently it is nothing to argue about and all is hunky dory in Danish Kingdom.
I always find this kind of reasoning bizarre- that the main damage regarding racism is caused by people complaining about it, and that if they didn't complain about it, it wouldn't happen and there wouldn't be any problem. This is just daft. It's like saying if people didn't complain about rape and murder as much, it wouldn't really be an issue.
Main damage done by people who are using the victims of racism to build their political image and by media which is using each such case to increase the advertisement revenue.
If you actually read my post you will see that I said that people are not allowed to talk about it; not should not talk about it.
And any opinion should be permitted for discussion except of clear hate an calls for violence.So do you consider it the same for anti-semitism- that the main damage is done by people who complain about it and report it, and that they're exaggerating it's existence? Do you wish we lived in a world where people could feel more comfortable being openly anti-semitic without fear of people speaking out about it?
Yes - people who are ultra-Zionist and use the facts of antisemitism as their political agenda are brewing hate against Jews.
As a Jew the prosecution and oppression of my people and experienced by me personally inspired me to work harder to be successful despite all world biting down on me. This is how we are. It is and always be a shame for me to take any benefits and privileges because of the fact that my people were murdered, tortured, abused, and segregated.
We are leaving in the world where people ARE very comfortable being antisemitic. And there is no issues to talk about it. This is not a social taboo as race issues discussion are in US. If some public figure is antisemitic and is honest about it I have no issues with is.
Everyone has a right to announce to the world that he is bigot an idiot. And other people have rights to react or not react to it showing their own color.We literally just had Ted Cruz, a United States Senator with eyes on a Presidential run, speak at the In Defense of Christians (IDC) conference and state "those who do not stand with Israel, do not stand with America and those who do not stand with the Jews are not Christians" in a country that is 70% Christian. That sentiment is echoed by any and every politician that hopes to be elected to office on a state or national level; from Barack Obama, to Mitt Romney, to John Kerry, to Chris Christie, to Diane Feinstein, to Marco Rubio, to Debbie Wasserman, to Hilary Clinton....the list goes on and on irrespective of how different their political ideologies are. On top of that, our country gives more financial assistance to Israel than any other country in the world (including the ones we recently demolished) at a time when our own country is in economic decline, major American cities like Detroit are dying and Israel's GDP has tripled in just a decade. And no public outcry can be heard from the American people who are known to be especially xenophobic and tribal. Meanwhile, an entire political party (Republicans) keeps 20%-50% of its base by portraying Blacks and other minorities as leeches on the country and cause for its demise, yet you feel "race issues are taboo" while antisemitism is fine and dandy? What fucking world do you live in?
This is absolutely true that US is supporting Israel on many levels. There is no government sponsored antisemitism in US like it was in Soviet Union or Spain, or Arab countries, etc. I am talking about the antisemitism among public figures, celebs, etc.
This people make antisemitic comments and other people ridicule them for this and rightfully so.
But we can discuss this subject without anybody asking us to shut up.
We know when antisemitism goes into the shadows it is time to pack the bags before it is too late and somebody will wont to do some kind of Final solution.
Some dude made racist comments.... OK... Lets talk about it. Lets state our opinion but not ask for his head. He may be was in the heat of the moment. Lets see what he is done in his life to really hurt people and if he did then apply the low or power of public opinion.
But first and foremost let people take this out. Help them to look in the mirror.
arkrud wrote:NardDogNation wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:arkrud wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:smackeddog wrote:Nalod wrote:Ferry Made the comment or read the comment from a scouting report?
Ferry should not have repeated it but is that the same as who wrote it?
All this because Levenson came public for his somewhat misworded demographic discription to the state of their Attndance.Ferry has been backed by his black friends as not being racist.
Does me defending Ferry make me a racist? If I ignore a racist comment does that make me a racist?
Do you actually believe Ferry though? You're telling me he didn't read that report in advance- he just went into the conference call without having done any prep? And if a scout really wrote it, why hasn't the scout been fired?
I never think that having black friends vouch for him means anything (he's hardly likely to reveal his racism to them- like would he really of said the african thing if his audience had been black?). Besides which it's a red herring- the issue isn't whether he is a racist in his free time, it's that he was racist at work and it will likely impact his recruiting abilities further down the line.
What if the Scout that wrote it was black?? Does that change anything?
Nope- you cannot use racial stereotypes as a possible reason for not hiring someone, it's basic employment law.
Can employee/candidate use racial stereotypes to claim that he was fired or not hired? I guess this is no low for this.
And folks who are using this to prosecute the employer (and this happened a lot) are making a big disservice to potential employes from his/her demographic group.
By putting so much attention to race and diversity we as society created a monster which brewing racism.
Ideally the personal information should not only be confidential but also removed from any government and employment procedures and stats.
Everyone should be just American citizen or legal alien. No other info should be of any legal significance.
And then if somebody is using race as a positive/negative factor this should be considered as crime/corruption.
The fact that even arguing this aspect of live became a tabu is also disturbing.
As soon as someone wants to discuss it he automatically labeled as racist as apparently it is nothing to argue about and all is hunky dory in Danish Kingdom.
I always find this kind of reasoning bizarre- that the main damage regarding racism is caused by people complaining about it, and that if they didn't complain about it, it wouldn't happen and there wouldn't be any problem. This is just daft. It's like saying if people didn't complain about rape and murder as much, it wouldn't really be an issue.
Main damage done by people who are using the victims of racism to build their political image and by media which is using each such case to increase the advertisement revenue.
If you actually read my post you will see that I said that people are not allowed to talk about it; not should not talk about it.
And any opinion should be permitted for discussion except of clear hate an calls for violence.So do you consider it the same for anti-semitism- that the main damage is done by people who complain about it and report it, and that they're exaggerating it's existence? Do you wish we lived in a world where people could feel more comfortable being openly anti-semitic without fear of people speaking out about it?
Yes - people who are ultra-Zionist and use the facts of antisemitism as their political agenda are brewing hate against Jews.
As a Jew the prosecution and oppression of my people and experienced by me personally inspired me to work harder to be successful despite all world biting down on me. This is how we are. It is and always be a shame for me to take any benefits and privileges because of the fact that my people were murdered, tortured, abused, and segregated.
We are leaving in the world where people ARE very comfortable being antisemitic. And there is no issues to talk about it. This is not a social taboo as race issues discussion are in US. If some public figure is antisemitic and is honest about it I have no issues with is.
Everyone has a right to announce to the world that he is bigot an idiot. And other people have rights to react or not react to it showing their own color.We literally just had Ted Cruz, a United States Senator with eyes on a Presidential run, speak at the In Defense of Christians (IDC) conference and state "those who do not stand with Israel, do not stand with America and those who do not stand with the Jews are not Christians" in a country that is 70% Christian. That sentiment is echoed by any and every politician that hopes to be elected to office on a state or national level; from Barack Obama, to Mitt Romney, to John Kerry, to Chris Christie, to Diane Feinstein, to Marco Rubio, to Debbie Wasserman, to Hilary Clinton....the list goes on and on irrespective of how different their political ideologies are. On top of that, our country gives more financial assistance to Israel than any other country in the world (including the ones we recently demolished) at a time when our own country is in economic decline, major American cities like Detroit are dying and Israel's GDP has tripled in just a decade. And no public outcry can be heard from the American people who are known to be especially xenophobic and tribal. Meanwhile, an entire political party (Republicans) keeps 20%-50% of its base by portraying Blacks and other minorities as leeches on the country and cause for its demise, yet you feel "race issues are taboo" while antisemitism is fine and dandy? What fucking world do you live in?
This is absolutely true that US is supporting Israel on many levels. There is no government sponsored antisemitism in US like it was in Soviet Union or Spain, or Arab countries, etc. I am talking about the antisemitism among public figures, celebs, etc.
This people make antisemitic comments and other people ridicule them for this and rightfully so.
But we can discuss this subject without anybody asking us to shut up.
We know when antisemitism goes into the shadows it is time to pack the bags before it is too late and somebody will wont to do some kind of Final solution.
Some dude made racist comments.... OK... Lets talk about it. Lets state our opinion but not ask for his head. He may be was in the heat of the moment. Lets see what he is done in his life to really hurt people and if he did then apply the low or power of public opinion.
But first and foremost let people take this out. Help them to look in the mirror.
Name me a celebrity, public figure, etc. that has said anything remotely antisemitic and has gone unscathed. In the meantime, I could offer you a book filled with people that actually matter who have made a career in being anti-racial minority.
The OP was about Levenson. His comments are pretty innocuous compared to Ferry in my opinion. Here is Kareem Abdul-Jabbar's take on it from a few days ago:
http://time.com/3296175/bruce-levenson-a...
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: Bruce Levenson Isn’t a Racist; He’s a Businessman
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar @kaj33 Sept. 8, 2014Sure, there are assumptions he makes that are cringeworthy—but the questions about how to attract more white fans were entirely reasonable.
Well, the pitchforks are already sharpened and the torches lit anyway, so rather than let them go to waste, why not drag another so-called racist before the court of public opinion and see how much ratings-grabbing, head-shaking and race-shaming we can squeeze out of it? After all, the media got so much gleeful, hand-wringing mileage out of Don Sterling and Michael Brown.
The only problem is that Atlanta Hawks controlling owner Bruce Levenson is no Donald Sterling. Nor is his email racist. In fact, his worst crime is misguided white guilt.
I read Levenson’s email. Here’s what I concluded: Levenson is a businessman asking reasonable questions about how to put customers in seats. In the email, addressed to Hawks president Danny Ferry, Levenson wonders whether (according to his observations) the emphasis on hip-hop and gospel music and the fact that the cheerleaders are black, the bars are filled with 90% blacks, kiss cams focus on black fans and time-out contestants are always black has an effect on keeping away white fans.
Seems reasonable to ask those questions. If his arena was filled mostly with whites and he wanted to attract blacks, wouldn’t he be asking how they could de-emphasize white culture and bias toward white contestants and cheerleaders? Don’t you think every corporation in America that is trying to attract a more diverse customer base is discussing how to feature more blacks or Asians or Latinos in their TV ads?
Back when the original Law & Order first launched, there was a cast shake-up that added more women, reportedly in an effort to attract more female viewers. MTV shows like Finding Carter and Teen Wolf can’t get through an emotional scene without a pop song coming in to sing to the viewer what they should be feeling, because that’s what their demographic wants. Car companies hire specialized advertising agencies to create ads to appeal specifically to women, blacks and Latinos. That’s business.
Sure, there are a few assumptions he makes that make me cringe a little. For example: “My theory is that the black crowd scared away the whites and there are simply not enough affluent black fans to build a significant season ticket base.” On the other hand, I have no evidence that he’s wrong on either count. Even if he is, the question still needed to be raised, because racism is a realistic possibility as to why whites in Atlanta may not be coming.
To Levenson’s credit, in that same paragraph, he dismisses fans who complained about the arena’s site as code for racist fear that “there are too many blacks at the games.” He further decries the white perception that even though the percentage of blacks in attendance had lessened, they still feel it’s higher and therefore somehow threatening. His outrage seems authentic.
Businesspeople should have the right to wonder how to appeal to diverse groups in order to increase business. They should even be able to make minor insensitive gaffes if there is no obvious animosity or racist intent. This is a business email that is pretty harmless in terms of insulting anyone — and pretty fascinating in terms of seeing how the business of running a team really works.
The thing that makes me mad is that Levenson was too quick to rend his clothing and shout mea culpa. In his apology, he wrote, “By focusing on race, I also sent the unintentional and hurtful message that our white fans are more valuable than our black fans.” But that’s not the message in the email at all. If the seats had been filled, even if by all blacks, the email wouldn’t have been written. He wasn’t valuing white fans over blacks; he was trying to figure out a way to change what he thought was the white perception in Atlanta so he could sell more tickets. That’s his job.
Abdul-Jabbar is a six-time NBA champion and league Most Valuable Player. Follow him on Twitter (@KAJ33) and Facebook (facebook.com/KAJ). He also writes a weekly column for the L.A. Register.