What is the difference? He would give us that athletic defender at the 1 to start the game against PG's who are likely going to be top caliber--jose can come in 2nd against guys who are either tired or 2nd string. This really compliments our D to start game.
I'd love to see it, if for no other reason(s) that it would be fun, makes sense and would give us some balance out there - on D as you said.
I think the politics of Jose's contract will come out on top though.
That said, if Larkin gets minutes (Pablo is probably #2 to start the season) I have a feeling he will move up the totem pole. Again, due to his defense.
He is really going to add something to this team once he gets his Mojo back...
Too small and relatively inexperienced. He'd have to prove he belongs 1st
earthmansurfer wrote:I'd love to see it, if for no other reason(s) that it would be fun, makes sense and would give us some balance out there - on D as you said.
I think the politics of Jose's contract will come out on top though.That said, if Larkin gets minutes (Pablo is probably #2 to start the season) I have a feeling he will move up the totem pole. Again, due to his defense.
He is really going to add something to this team once he gets his Mojo back...
he avg 1.4 steals per 12 minutes played last year in 48 games and lead the entire SL with 3.1 steals per game and avg only 27 minutes. In some respects he plays a bit like Derek Fischer--hes a 2nd year player--if he can prove to be a defensive impact player with the ability to distribute the ball well and hit his jump shots--then starting out w Larkin and bring Jose off the bench might be in ur bets interests to start games--well he'll have to prove it but in theory it makes sense.
Shane goes prove starting on the court. Right now I want him giving 100% off the bench. I hope Fisher gives everyone a shot to play this year
The only time a player without history of NBA success is made a starter is if he was one of the top lottery picks in the most recent draft.
If Larkin has the best training camp out of the three pg rotationals, I see no reason why Fisher would deny him.
knickscity wrote:If Larkin has the best training camp out of the three pg rotationals, I see no reason why Fisher would deny him.
Yeah, even if the success in the nba is just in the preseason, that's at least a possible justification. I think he'd have to substantially outplay Priggs and Calderon though in the preseason.
I like Larkin a lot. I think he has real NBA talent even tho he's a bit small. I think he makes up for a bit with his speed and aggressiveness. I don't think he has to start tho. Most PG's with real talent are hard to stop. Only elite defenders at PG have a chance to stop the better PG's. We have Larkin likely playing significant minutes off the bench and that's good enough. The last time Tony Parker defended another PG he was in French Boarding School. That didn't stop the Spurs from winning. Not saying Parker is as bad as Jose but he's no defensive stud. I get the idea Jose could see fewer minutes this year so we can play Larkin and Priggs and get their D in the mix.
EnySpree wrote:Shane goes prove starting on the court. Right now I want him giving 100% off the bench. I hope Fisher gives everyone a shot to play this year
I hope he doesn't play everyone this yr, get a rotation of 9 guys and roll with them..that 10/11 man rotation is a chemistry killer. somebody gets injured, then you have guys that should be ready to step in and step up.
Players need to earn minutes IMO
EnySpree wrote:Shane goes prove starting on the court. Right now I want him giving 100% off the bench. I hope Fisher gives everyone a shot to play this year
fisher is 1st time coach and if he wants the respect of his team, he will not start larkin at PG. i can see him making a change midway through the season though.
Cartman718 wrote:EnySpree wrote:Shane goes prove starting on the court. Right now I want him giving 100% off the bench. I hope Fisher gives everyone a shot to play this year
fisher is 1st time coach and if he wants the respect of his team, he will not start larkin at PG. i can see him making a change midway through the season though.
I think let the players fight it out. If you look at unit 1 which mostlikely will have J R Smith Carmelo and Amare--having a quick PG who can guard might be the way to go. The 2nd unit is better equipped to hide Jose on D.
Start Calderon & Shumpert then
knicks1248 wrote:EnySpree wrote:Shane goes prove starting on the court. Right now I want him giving 100% off the bench. I hope Fisher gives everyone a shot to play this year
I hope he doesn't play everyone this yr, get a rotation of 9 guys and roll with them..that 10/11 man rotation is a chemistry killer. somebody gets injured, then you have guys that should be ready to step in and step up.
Players need to earn minutes IMO
It really all depends on how u do it. no one really has a 10-11 man rotation without using some guys in a very limited role. Its about saving vets for the playoffs. The Spurs play a lot of guys and it works fine cuz the 10th or 11th man is just playing low minutes and garbage in blowouts. It's a smart way of doing it. Your main guys get the bulk of the minutes but will play a few minutes less each game as those 10th or 11th guys take up some slack. If you do it right it shouldn't negatively effect the teams performance. The plus is that those guys stay ready and can be depended on to perform well if they need to play extended minutes of while a key player is out. I remember we got burned by not playing guys and sticking to a strict short rotation in the Riley years.
Knicks are playing system basketball. So they got to trust the system and keep guys minutes down.
We have alot of depth. Guys like quincy acy, Larkin, shump early and Cole are going to be hard to bench. But if we go with a 8-9 man rotation, those 5 are the odd men out, assuming Jason smith and Dalembert are in the rotation.
How do you keep these guys from playing?
Im a big Larkin fan in fact I think he could be the steal of the trade. However he is inexperienced mostly because of injuries so giving him the starting job is a bigt aggressive. Id rather him learn a bit and let him improve and gain more knowledge. Im not a huge calderon fan but at least he is a veteran who can still play at a good level.
nixluva wrote:knicks1248 wrote:EnySpree wrote:Shane goes prove starting on the court. Right now I want him giving 100% off the bench. I hope Fisher gives everyone a shot to play this year
I hope he doesn't play everyone this yr, get a rotation of 9 guys and roll with them..that 10/11 man rotation is a chemistry killer. somebody gets injured, then you have guys that should be ready to step in and step up.
Players need to earn minutes IMO
It really all depends on how u do it. no one really has a 10-11 man rotation without using some guys in a very limited role. Its about saving vets for the playoffs. The Spurs play a lot of guys and it works fine cuz the 10th or 11th man is just playing low minutes and garbage in blowouts. It's a smart way of doing it. Your main guys get the bulk of the minutes but will play a few minutes less each game as those 10th or 11th guys take up some slack. If you do it right it shouldn't negatively effect the teams performance. The plus is that those guys stay ready and can be depended on to perform well if they need to play extended minutes of while a key player is out. I remember we got burned by not playing guys and sticking to a strict short rotation in the Riley years.
I guess everyone here is too young to have watched Pitino's Knicks. Or too old to remember!
Nothing wrong with playing guys if they can contribute. I think our challenge is we have a lot of marginal talent where guys don't stand out as better.
franco12 wrote:nixluva wrote:knicks1248 wrote:EnySpree wrote:Shane goes prove starting on the court. Right now I want him giving 100% off the bench. I hope Fisher gives everyone a shot to play this year
I hope he doesn't play everyone this yr, get a rotation of 9 guys and roll with them..that 10/11 man rotation is a chemistry killer. somebody gets injured, then you have guys that should be ready to step in and step up.
Players need to earn minutes IMO
It really all depends on how u do it. no one really has a 10-11 man rotation without using some guys in a very limited role. Its about saving vets for the playoffs. The Spurs play a lot of guys and it works fine cuz the 10th or 11th man is just playing low minutes and garbage in blowouts. It's a smart way of doing it. Your main guys get the bulk of the minutes but will play a few minutes less each game as those 10th or 11th guys take up some slack. If you do it right it shouldn't negatively effect the teams performance. The plus is that those guys stay ready and can be depended on to perform well if they need to play extended minutes of while a key player is out. I remember we got burned by not playing guys and sticking to a strict short rotation in the Riley years.
I guess everyone here is too young to have watched Pitino's Knicks. Or too old to remember!
Nothing wrong with playing guys if they can contribute. I think our challenge is we have a lot of marginal talent where guys don't stand out as better.
Guys need to feel involved. You must call guys numbers and get them out there. People like to use the spurs now cuz they just won, but Pop Plays his bench all year. He gives his starters days off because the trust is there. Guys know coach believes in them, their confidence is high, and everyone completely trusts the offense and defense. Not looking for the right player to save them, but looking for the right read and making the right basketball play. That's what I'm hoping we are building here.
My phone betrays me with the auto correct. I never proof read before I post either.
I just want to clarify that Shane needs to prove he's worthy of starting. If the Knicks were running a traditional set where the point guard is the dominant ball handler, I might be more on the Larkin bandwagon. Kid is s good player
TripleThreat wrote:BRIGGS wrote:What is the difference? He would give us that athletic defender at the 1 to start the game against PG's who are likely going to be top caliber--jose can come in 2nd against guys who are either tired or 2nd string. This really compliments our D to start game.
Calderon's shooting ability spaces the floor. The Knicks don't have a traditional Stretch 4, which really isn't very common in today's NBA. A traditional Stretch 4 would help draw a big out of the paint and space the floor. To play team ball, you need to pass, you can't pass if your players are all compressed. Floor spacing is critical not just to the Triangle, but to any team "system"
Larkin is also a sub 6 foot point guard. Guards at that size rarely succeed as starters in the modern NBA, not unless there are some unique circumstances ( i.e. Allen Iverson, who was also paired with Eric Snow ) Starting Larkin will force the Knicks to pair him with a shooting guard to hide Larkin's deficiencies. It's not just about height, but length. Having length at your guard positions helps to close down passing lanes.
Larkin's ceiling IMHO is JJ Barea in his prime.
Zen Master is also clearly looking to dump whatever contracts he can. By playing Calderon, it's possible he will try to feature him for a future trade at the deadline. Calderon at two years left is a lot more digestable in trade than with three full years left. I'm not saying he'd be desirable, I'm saying the contract situation in trade down the road would be better than right now.
If Larkin was starter worthy, Dallas would have never included him in the deal.
I agree with most of what you said, but Amar'e is potentially a stretch 4 as he has historically been money with his mid range jumper.
if Shane can get the job done Im all for it. I like Calderon off the bench. Problem is not who starts but finish's. Go with the hot hand or let the PG know his role and confident build down the stretch?
