Knicks · ok this is what i wanted to hear: stressing fundamentals and discipline (page 1)

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/05/sports...

Fisher so far has come in with the right game plan towards building this thing from the ground up. Can't wait to see how he does with in game adjustments. As I think he will have the locker aspect on lock.

Great stuff!

I like the comment from Shump and Fish "it's like he's done this before"

And Cole saying Fish used to grab the white board in practice and drew up plays in okc

I like that the players are taken the fundamentals seriously and understand that there is a reason behind everything they are learning. Order & discipline baby

I agree- it's very good to hear. Can anyone remember what the heck they did last year in training camp? I have no memories of it at all- just the horror show that came after it (from preseason on)

smackeddog wrote:I agree- it's very good to hear. Can anyone remember what the heck they did last year in training camp? I have no memories of it at all- just the horror show that came after it (from preseason on)

i think to be fair, this kinda stuff gets said and done every year in training camp, it's just this year theres a new coach and a different feeling towards the organization, which is fine, but it has to be taken with a grain of salt. players were very happy going through the first training camp post d'antoni and said alot of great things about woodson too.

smackeddog wrote:I agree- it's very good to hear. Can anyone remember what the heck they did last year in training camp? I have no memories of it at all- just the horror show that came after it (from preseason on)

They kept Chris Smith despite desperately needing another big man because Dolan/Mills were limiting Amare and Kmart to 10 minutes every other game. It was pretty tense because there was a lot of speculation about Chris. His contract became fully guaranteed if he made the team. Tyler and Ike Diogu seemed like logical choices. Grunwald had just been fired and Woodson was speaking about the importance of family bonds on the team. Sucked a big one.

CrushAlot wrote:

smackeddog wrote:I agree- it's very good to hear. Can anyone remember what the heck they did last year in training camp? I have no memories of it at all- just the horror show that came after it (from preseason on)

They kept Chris Smith despite desperately needing another big man because Dolan/Mills were limiting Amare and Kmart to 10 minutes every other game. It was pretty tense because there was a lot of speculation about Chris. His contract became fully guaranteed if he made the team. Tyler and Ike Diogu seemed like logical choices. Grunwald had just been fired and Woodson was speaking about the importance of family bonds on the team. Sucked a big one.

Ah, now I remember- it seemed like the whole focus of training camp and preseason was which of Chris Smith, Tyler and Ike Diogu we would keep. Hard times!

smackeddog wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

smackeddog wrote:I agree- it's very good to hear. Can anyone remember what the heck they did last year in training camp? I have no memories of it at all- just the horror show that came after it (from preseason on)

They kept Chris Smith despite desperately needing another big man because Dolan/Mills were limiting Amare and Kmart to 10 minutes every other game. It was pretty tense because there was a lot of speculation about Chris. His contract became fully guaranteed if he made the team. Tyler and Ike Diogu seemed like logical choices. Grunwald had just been fired and Woodson was speaking about the importance of family bonds on the team. Sucked a big one.

Ah, now I remember- it seemed like the whole focus of training camp and preseason was which of Chris Smith, Tyler and Ike Diogu we would keep. Hard times!

Seems a bit simplistic?

We are not there and simply get fed thru the media. Knicks came off a 54 win season. Last year was lack of focus? Talent?
Was JR working on his comedy bits before his 5 game suspension? Off surgery? Bargnani's pneumonia summer? Amare basically out of the loop for a while?

Its all "Good" now cuz it has not started yet.

I think Cole said "HE Grabbed a white boy and drew on him"?

Got Phish and the old band back together with lots of expiring contracts so it should be a good camp.

Nalod wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

smackeddog wrote:I agree- it's very good to hear. Can anyone remember what the heck they did last year in training camp? I have no memories of it at all- just the horror show that came after it (from preseason on)

They kept Chris Smith despite desperately needing another big man because Dolan/Mills were limiting Amare and Kmart to 10 minutes every other game. It was pretty tense because there was a lot of speculation about Chris. His contract became fully guaranteed if he made the team. Tyler and Ike Diogu seemed like logical choices. Grunwald had just been fired and Woodson was speaking about the importance of family bonds on the team. Sucked a big one.

Ah, now I remember- it seemed like the whole focus of training camp and preseason was which of Chris Smith, Tyler and Ike Diogu we would keep. Hard times!

Seems a bit simplistic?

We are not there and simply get fed thru the media. Knicks came off a 54 win season. Last year was lack of focus? Talent?
Was JR working on his comedy bits before his 5 game suspension? Off surgery? Bargnani's pneumonia summer? Amare basically out of the loop for a while?

Its all "Good" now cuz it has not started yet.

I think Cole said "HE Grabbed a white boy and drew on him"?

Got Phish and the old band back together with lots of expiring contracts so it should be a good camp.

I don't think I would describe it as simplistic. Dysfunctional is a better fit in my opinion. Firing your gm on the eve of training camp, bringing in a guy from the worst era in your team's history to run things, and ownership/management telling the coach who is going to make the team and who is going to start pretty much sealed Woodson's fate as a lame duck coach in October.

It was a total disaster. Still I doubt they focused on fundamentals like this. We can dig for the tape but I don't recall this level of discipline or detail on the fine points. Plus we have a complete change on defense and offense. It's Not the same ole same old. I wish people would stop saying this stuff happens every TC! I mean we have Phil Jackson, Derek Fisher, Rambis and Cleamons running things ever camp? People seriously don't see a difference in that group teaching our players how to think and play the game?

Some keep mentioning that Phil didn't always win despite the Triangle and all the fundamentals etc but isn't that a Cynical Self Hating Knicks Fan way of looking at the career of PJax? So we should basically ignore all the years of success but presume this will be one of the times things didn't quite work? This is how you know we have some Jaded ass fans posting here. Only they could look at all the positive things coming out of TC so far and have a negative take on it. SMDH!!!

Yeah I was reading some Post news

Late last night and it was good to read

Fundamentals going back to the basics

No more holding the rock

And like Heat Wave said

Ain't No Jab Steppin

Calderon made comments in The Post

The triangle offense isn't easy to grasp

But will be effective once they do

May Fisher play all high IQ players

May be slim pickens here

The rotation will be surprising to some. It will force folks to root for the front and not the back of the jersey as much.

knickscity wrote:The rotation will be surprising to some. It will force folks to root for the front and not the back of the jersey as much.

Yeah if Fish is grounded

No more playing favorites or contract based players

Feelings may get hurt, but brains and execution

Over everything else

I do look forward to having a coach that doesn't play favorites (I'm looking at you Woodson and your relationship with JR) but the whole front/back of the jersey thing is nonsense.

nixluva wrote:It was a total disaster. Still I doubt they focused on fundamentals like this. We can dig for the tape but I don't recall this level of discipline or detail on the fine points. Plus we have a complete change on defense and offense. It's Not the same ole same old. I wish people would stop saying this stuff happens every TC! I mean we have Phil Jackson, Derek Fisher, Rambis and Cleamons running things ever camp? People seriously don't see a difference in that group teaching our players how to think and play the game?

Some keep mentioning that Phil didn't always win despite the Triangle and all the fundamentals etc but isn't that a Cynical Self Hating Knicks Fan way of looking at the career of PJax? So we should basically ignore all the years of success but presume this will be one of the times things didn't quite work? This is how you know we have some Jaded ass fans posting here. Only they could look at all the positive things coming out of TC so far and have a negative take on it. SMDH!!!

Do you honestly believe the previous training camp didnt feature defensive principles?

I'll take a page from your book...here's from videos....

here's a post lockout interview....

here's one for the 2012-13 season, pay close attention to the commentary...

and finally, last year.....

Now dont get me wrong, this year is different, but not so much to the point these guys havent had training camp focus on priciples before...

knickscity wrote:

nixluva wrote:It was a total disaster. Still I doubt they focused on fundamentals like this. We can dig for the tape but I don't recall this level of discipline or detail on the fine points. Plus we have a complete change on defense and offense. It's Not the same ole same old. I wish people would stop saying this stuff happens every TC! I mean we have Phil Jackson, Derek Fisher, Rambis and Cleamons running things ever camp? People seriously don't see a difference in that group teaching our players how to think and play the game?

Some keep mentioning that Phil didn't always win despite the Triangle and all the fundamentals etc but isn't that a Cynical Self Hating Knicks Fan way of looking at the career of PJax? So we should basically ignore all the years of success but presume this will be one of the times things didn't quite work? This is how you know we have some Jaded ass fans posting here. Only they could look at all the positive things coming out of TC so far and have a negative take on it. SMDH!!!

Do you honestly believe the previous training camp didnt feature defensive principles?

I'll take a page from your book...here's from videos....

here's a post lockout interview....

here's one for the 2012-13 season, pay close attention to the commentary...

and finally, last year.....

Now dont get me wrong, this year is different, but not so much to the point these guys havent had training camp focus on priciples before...

It's Freakin Basketball!!! Of course every team works on BASKETBALL in TC! Your videos don't really prove anything in terms of how this team is being prepared this year. I think this TC is different because of a bunch of things. #1 being this staff is full of Multiple Title winners and the focus from the Prez on down is unified.

They didn't support MDA and the fact that they brought in Woody underscored that lack of confidence. Then Woody's staff last year wasn't impressing anyone either. Just no comparison IMO. Then add the system being installed is a proven one and Fish is fully supported and being given what he needs. Imagine if MDA had a PG as good as Calderon? They never really supported MDA with the one key position he needed to succeed at the very least. Fish has that support.

nixluva wrote:

knickscity wrote:

nixluva wrote:It was a total disaster. Still I doubt they focused on fundamentals like this. We can dig for the tape but I don't recall this level of discipline or detail on the fine points. Plus we have a complete change on defense and offense. It's Not the same ole same old. I wish people would stop saying this stuff happens every TC! I mean we have Phil Jackson, Derek Fisher, Rambis and Cleamons running things ever camp? People seriously don't see a difference in that group teaching our players how to think and play the game?

Some keep mentioning that Phil didn't always win despite the Triangle and all the fundamentals etc but isn't that a Cynical Self Hating Knicks Fan way of looking at the career of PJax? So we should basically ignore all the years of success but presume this will be one of the times things didn't quite work? This is how you know we have some Jaded ass fans posting here. Only they could look at all the positive things coming out of TC so far and have a negative take on it. SMDH!!!

Do you honestly believe the previous training camp didnt feature defensive principles?

I'll take a page from your book...here's from videos....

here's a post lockout interview....

here's one for the 2012-13 season, pay close attention to the commentary...

and finally, last year.....

Now dont get me wrong, this year is different, but not so much to the point these guys havent had training camp focus on priciples before...

It's Freakin Basketball!!! Of course every team works on BASKETBALL in TC! Your videos don't really prove anything in terms of how this team is being prepared this year. I think this TC is different because of a bunch of things. #1 being this staff is full of Multiple Title winners and the focus from the Prez on down is unified.

They didn't support MDA and the fact that they brought in Woody underscored that lack of confidence. Then Woody's staff last year wasn't impressing anyone either. Just no comparison IMO. Then add the system being installed is a proven one and Fish is fully supported and being given what he needs. Imagine if MDA had a PG as good as Calderon? They never really supported MDA with the one key position he needed to succeed at the very least. Fish has that support.

See, this is my point. You claim you're being truthful, but the videos dont lie and neither does the commentary. You doubted they worked on fundamental stuff...they did, they do it every year. You can clearly hear the mic'ed up segments and Clyde hahn and some other guy commenting on it.

In your mind you really think these guys didnt buy in to the training camps...they've always talked about how great they were. Even last season the guys came into the season energized to play. but the spirits fell down with the second game of the season brutal loss to the Bulls, then fell to the Bobcats and their weak nature showed by having a players only meeeting ONE WEEK into the season. Then once Tyson went down, game over...they knew losing was on the way.

The players are the ones who gave up....way too son, and there was no vets to pick them up like when Kurt Thomas did on the WC trip the season prior.

I've already agreed the unisom of the management with coach is a good thing.

Now as far as MDA goes, he's had a pg as good as calderon (who really isnt good at all) in Marbury and he decided not to play him in the very first year when the player was told to get into shape...to which they did. he then goes and starts Duhon of all people

D'antoni not worthy of being called a coach, he's a gimmick of steve nash....arguably the worst coach the nba has ever had.

knickscity wrote:

nixluva wrote:

knickscity wrote:

nixluva wrote:It was a total disaster. Still I doubt they focused on fundamentals like this. We can dig for the tape but I don't recall this level of discipline or detail on the fine points. Plus we have a complete change on defense and offense. It's Not the same ole same old. I wish people would stop saying this stuff happens every TC! I mean we have Phil Jackson, Derek Fisher, Rambis and Cleamons running things ever camp? People seriously don't see a difference in that group teaching our players how to think and play the game?

Some keep mentioning that Phil didn't always win despite the Triangle and all the fundamentals etc but isn't that a Cynical Self Hating Knicks Fan way of looking at the career of PJax? So we should basically ignore all the years of success but presume this will be one of the times things didn't quite work? This is how you know we have some Jaded ass fans posting here. Only they could look at all the positive things coming out of TC so far and have a negative take on it. SMDH!!!

Do you honestly believe the previous training camp didnt feature defensive principles?

I'll take a page from your book...here's from videos....

here's a post lockout interview....

here's one for the 2012-13 season, pay close attention to the commentary...

and finally, last year.....

Now dont get me wrong, this year is different, but not so much to the point these guys havent had training camp focus on priciples before...

It's Freakin Basketball!!! Of course every team works on BASKETBALL in TC! Your videos don't really prove anything in terms of how this team is being prepared this year. I think this TC is different because of a bunch of things. #1 being this staff is full of Multiple Title winners and the focus from the Prez on down is unified.

They didn't support MDA and the fact that they brought in Woody underscored that lack of confidence. Then Woody's staff last year wasn't impressing anyone either. Just no comparison IMO. Then add the system being installed is a proven one and Fish is fully supported and being given what he needs. Imagine if MDA had a PG as good as Calderon? They never really supported MDA with the one key position he needed to succeed at the very least. Fish has that support.

See, this is my point. You claim you're being truthful, but the videos dont lie and neither does the commentary. You doubted they worked on fundamental stuff...they did, they do it every year. You can clearly hear the mic'ed up segments and Clyde hahn and some other guy commenting on it.

In your mind you really think these guys didnt buy in to the training camps...they've always talked about how great they were. Even last season the guys came into the season energized to play. but the spirits fell down with the second game of the season brutal loss to the Bulls, then fell to the Bobcats and their weak nature showed by having a players only meeeting ONE WEEK into the season. Then once Tyson went down, game over...they knew losing was on the way.

The players are the ones who gave up....way too son, and there was no vets to pick them up like when Kurt Thomas did on the WC trip the season prior.

I've already agreed the unisom of the management with coach is a good thing.

Now as far as MDA goes, he's had a pg as good as calderon (who really isnt good at all) in Marbury and he decided not to play him in the very first year when the player was told to get into shape...to which they did. he then goes and starts Duhon of all people

D'antoni not worthy of being called a coach, he's a gimmick of steve nash....arguably the worst coach the nba has ever had.

I'll give you the MDA and Marbury feud, that was worse than the larry brown and marbury feud only because marbury came into camp fully committed to buying in.

As far as last season, I don't care what the players said, they looked unprepared from game 1, where we barely beat a bucks team that loss 55+ games. Training camp last yr was a complete joke, people say preseason games are meaningless, but we were down to Boston by 45 points in our 2nd or 3rd preseason game, not to mention we played against boston's 3rd string players..yikes, it was a clear indication of things to come,

Hold up, out goes these players who had a significant impact

kurt
Kidd
rasheed
Novak
Copeland

In comes these players who had zero impact

beno
MWP
bargi

So the knicks got rid of 5 key players, and replace them with NOTHING, absolutely Nothing..oh wait (rolling my eyes) THJ..

The teams spirit,including the coaching staff was shattered 4 days before camp, when the person who was responsible for their employment was FIRED for no damn reason..

Let really keep it real..And why are you the only person on the planet that saying Calderon isn't good, you lose credibility saying stuff like that.

knickscity wrote:

nixluva wrote:

knickscity wrote:

nixluva wrote:It was a total disaster. Still I doubt they focused on fundamentals like this. We can dig for the tape but I don't recall this level of discipline or detail on the fine points. Plus we have a complete change on defense and offense. It's Not the same ole same old. I wish people would stop saying this stuff happens every TC! I mean we have Phil Jackson, Derek Fisher, Rambis and Cleamons running things ever camp? People seriously don't see a difference in that group teaching our players how to think and play the game?

Some keep mentioning that Phil didn't always win despite the Triangle and all the fundamentals etc but isn't that a Cynical Self Hating Knicks Fan way of looking at the career of PJax? So we should basically ignore all the years of success but presume this will be one of the times things didn't quite work? This is how you know we have some Jaded ass fans posting here. Only they could look at all the positive things coming out of TC so far and have a negative take on it. SMDH!!!

Do you honestly believe the previous training camp didnt feature defensive principles?

I'll take a page from your book...here's from videos....

here's a post lockout interview....

here's one for the 2012-13 season, pay close attention to the commentary...

and finally, last year.....

Now dont get me wrong, this year is different, but not so much to the point these guys havent had training camp focus on priciples before...

It's Freakin Basketball!!! Of course every team works on BASKETBALL in TC! Your videos don't really prove anything in terms of how this team is being prepared this year. I think this TC is different because of a bunch of things. #1 being this staff is full of Multiple Title winners and the focus from the Prez on down is unified.

They didn't support MDA and the fact that they brought in Woody underscored that lack of confidence. Then Woody's staff last year wasn't impressing anyone either. Just no comparison IMO. Then add the system being installed is a proven one and Fish is fully supported and being given what he needs. Imagine if MDA had a PG as good as Calderon? They never really supported MDA with the one key position he needed to succeed at the very least. Fish has that support.

See, this is my point. You claim you're being truthful, but the videos dont lie and neither does the commentary. You doubted they worked on fundamental stuff...they did, they do it every year. You can clearly hear the mic'ed up segments and Clyde hahn and some other guy commenting on it.

In your mind you really think these guys didnt buy in to the training camps...they've always talked about how great they were. Even last season the guys came into the season energized to play. but the spirits fell down with the second game of the season brutal loss to the Bulls, then fell to the Bobcats and their weak nature showed by having a players only meeeting ONE WEEK into the season. Then once Tyson went down, game over...they knew losing was on the way.

The players are the ones who gave up....way too son, and there was no vets to pick them up like when Kurt Thomas did on the WC trip the season prior.

I've already agreed the unisom of the management with coach is a good thing.

Now as far as MDA goes, he's had a pg as good as calderon (who really isnt good at all) in Marbury and he decided not to play him in the very first year when the player was told to get into shape...to which they did. he then goes and starts Duhon of all people

D'antoni not worthy of being called a coach, he's a gimmick of steve nash....arguably the worst coach the nba has ever had.

You post videos they have no value

Nix post videos they have value

Those are the rules, make sure you understand and follow them

OK you guys are right there's nothing really different about this TC compared to the last few years. There's no reason to expect anything better out of this team this year cuz well... What's the diff between the previous regimes and this current one? I mean what do they even bring to the table that is any different. A drill is a drill and pretty much all BB concepts are the same. Doesn't matter who it is teaching you cuz all coaches are exactly equal in their ability to teach and get their point across to the players.

It also means nothing if all the players are saying it's different and those viewing practice are erasing a difference cuz you know Drills... I don't even know why San Antonio is wasting all that money on Pop when they could get anyone in there to coach that team and get the same results. It's all about the players after all. What diff does the coach make anyway. They all teach the exact same way and the exact same stuff.