I am certainly not going to waste much energy trying to convince someone Shump had a good game. You seem to get stuck in rhetorical concepts like this inversion nonsense. If he is Jekyll and Hyding like you say, then I'll just ignore the defensive stops and strips plus the swishes and offensive play of the game all late in the game. Oh never mind
When we have Melo and shump play so well and still lose to Milwaukee it's bad. It's obvious we have 2 real different makers and that's it. Calderon will add a 3rd. THjr will be there someday too. So when healthy we have 3 real impact players and one future impact player and that's it. The good news is shumpert seems like he could be turning a corner and we have the cap space necessary to add a couple of difference makers. And I don't always buy that playing for a new contract thing. Not every player only plays well when motivated by a new contract. Shump doesn't seem like that type.
Splat wrote:I am certainly not going to waste much energy trying to convince someone Shump had a good game. You seem to get stuck in rhetorical concepts like this inversion nonsense. If he is Jekyll and Hyding like you say, then I'll just ignore the defensive stops and strips plus the swishes and offensive play of the game all late in the game. Oh never mind
He played good defense in the second half
Probably was the major reason we as a team played better D
The first half he wasn't good defensively
http://espn.go.com/nba/playbyplay?gameId...
http://espn.go.com/nba/playbyplay?gameId...
How many pts did Middleton, Mayo, Dudley have at the end of 1st half Splat
Guarded by a combination of Shump/Smith/THJR, in particular 1qrt numbers
What was the score at the end of the first half
Play-By-Play doesn't lie
So yeah I call Jekyll and Hyde on Shump
F500ONE wrote:Splat wrote:gunsnewing wrote:Splat wrote:That's what we get for being lazy dogs earlier
They obviously don't care so why should we?
I like that Timmy caught fire and all that jazz, but the only real positive takeaway from this game is Shump is clearly the only leader on this team who imposes his will on the game with any consistency.
I think Shump is teetering on being an empty stat player
He's essentially traded in his defense for offense
We don't really have a dog on our team
Shump tries to be off the chain but it's clear IMO
He's playing for a contract, his angle is no different
Than Phil's money grab
i looked at his defensive win shares and it is true they are down so far this season. but at the end of the day the issue is not whether he is an empty stat player but whether he is a positive-sum player. i think there's a difference. there's no way his stats in a vacuum are empty this season... but if he gives up as much as he contributes then you may have a point.
Knixkik wrote:When we have Melo and shump play so well and still lose to Milwaukee it's bad. It's obvious we have 2 real different makers and that's it. Calderon will add a 3rd. THjr will be there someday too. So when healthy we have 3 real impact players and one future impact player and that's it. The good news is shumpert seems like he could be turning a corner and we have the cap space necessary to add a couple of difference makers. And I don't always buy that playing for a new contract thing. Not every player only plays well when motivated by a new contract. Shump doesn't seem like that type.
If they were real difference makers
We wouldn't of been down 17pts at half
And
Parker/Illyasova
Mayo/Middleton/Dudley
Wouldn't have been so productive[efficient] as they were
Who were their counters this game, Melo and Shump
Played what you call zero sum ball tonight
Very similar to the other night Melo allowing
Hayward to have a career game essentially
Knixkik wrote:When we have Melo and shump play so well and still lose to Milwaukee it's bad. It's obvious we have 2 real different makers and that's it. Calderon will add a 3rd. THjr will be there someday too. So when healthy we have 3 real impact players and one future impact player and that's it. The good news is shumpert seems like he could be turning a corner and we have the cap space necessary to add a couple of difference makers. And I don't always buy that playing for a new contract thing. Not every player only plays well when motivated by a new contract. Shump doesn't seem like that type.
Well a lot of scoring came when both of them were out in the second qtr. Maybe Shump was on a minutes restriction because THjr played over him to close the half and of course the game exploded when melo went to the locker room.
Who was Shumpert guarding tonight? He was penciled in at SF. Was it the Greek? Because he did not kill us. Middleton and Knight did and thats on JR & Larkin
Postgame crew zeroing in and blaming Travis Wear
UNBELIEVABLE
gunsnewing wrote:Who was Shumpert guarding tonight? He was penciled in at SF. Was it the Greek? Because he did not kill us. Middleton and Knight did and thats on JR & Larkin
I posted links already guns
Greek only played 2min in the first half
Analyze those first half links I dropped and first half score
gunsnewing wrote:Postgame crew zeroing in and blaming Travis WearUNBELIEVABLE
lol he did get muscled a little by Illyasova
But he also was relatively effective the short time he was in
Illyasova smacked every player guarding him around, including Melo
dk7th wrote:F500ONE wrote:Splat wrote:gunsnewing wrote:Splat wrote:That's what we get for being lazy dogs earlier
They obviously don't care so why should we?
I like that Timmy caught fire and all that jazz, but the only real positive takeaway from this game is Shump is clearly the only leader on this team who imposes his will on the game with any consistency.
I think Shump is teetering on being an empty stat player
He's essentially traded in his defense for offense
We don't really have a dog on our team
Shump tries to be off the chain but it's clear IMO
He's playing for a contract, his angle is no different
Than Phil's money grab
i looked at his defensive win shares and it is true they are down so far this season. but at the end of the day the issue is not whether he is an empty stat player but whether he is a positive-sum player. i think there's a difference. there's no way his stats in a vacuum are empty this season... but if he gives up as much as he contributes then you may have a point.
Maybe something to give attention to
As the year drags on
Here we go with Melo's knee. Sore since the Game # 2. They're going to have to rest him at some point
Splat wrote:Here we go with Melo's knee. Sore since the Game # 2. They're going to have to rest him at some point
better fix it now before it turns into H20 v2.0
Melo already admitted to already having his knee checked out but is opting to play through it for now. Refused to say what it was.
$124mil investment....year 1 of 5
gunsnewing wrote:Splat wrote:Here we go with Melo's knee. Sore since the Game # 2. They're going to have to rest him at some point
better fix it now before it turns into H20 v2.0
Melo already admitted to already having his knee checked out but is opting to play through it for now. Refused to say what it was.
$124mil investment....year 1 of 5
I say shut him down for the year. Get that pick.
gunsnewing wrote:Splat wrote:Here we go with Melo's knee. Sore since the Game # 2. They're going to have to rest him at some point
better fix it now before it turns into H20 v2.0
Melo already admitted to already having his knee checked out but is opting to play through it for now. Refused to say what it was.
$124mil investment....year 1 of 5
Like I've said, Amare # 2. Better player by far, but same basic risk being gambled on again. Guy's too shopworn to pay him this much for that long and with no trade clause. Only blind optimists would think his body is going to hold up for five years.
Vmart wrote:gunsnewing wrote:Splat wrote:Here we go with Melo's knee. Sore since the Game # 2. They're going to have to rest him at some point
better fix it now before it turns into H20 v2.0
Melo already admitted to already having his knee checked out but is opting to play through it for now. Refused to say what it was.
$124mil investment....year 1 of 5
I say shut him down for the year. Get that pick.
Phil: Hi Melo, have some good news
Melo: What's that Phil?
Phil: We're shutting you down for the year.
Melo: How is that good news? I want to play.
Phil: Because we're still paying you $75,607.43 per quarter while you're at home binge watching Orange Is The New Black
Splat wrote:Vmart wrote:gunsnewing wrote:Splat wrote:Here we go with Melo's knee. Sore since the Game # 2. They're going to have to rest him at some point
better fix it now before it turns into H20 v2.0
Melo already admitted to already having his knee checked out but is opting to play through it for now. Refused to say what it was.
$124mil investment....year 1 of 5
I say shut him down for the year. Get that pick.
Phil: Hi Melo, have some good news
Melo: What's that Phil?
Phil: We're shutting you down for the year.
Melo: How is that good news? I want to play.
Phil: Because we're still paying you $75,607.43 per quarter while you're at home binge watching Orange Is The New Black
That is the same f'ing conversation Pops had with Robinson when Tim Duncan was coming out of college.
Vmart wrote:Splat wrote:Vmart wrote:gunsnewing wrote:Splat wrote:Here we go with Melo's knee. Sore since the Game # 2. They're going to have to rest him at some point
better fix it now before it turns into H20 v2.0
Melo already admitted to already having his knee checked out but is opting to play through it for now. Refused to say what it was.
$124mil investment....year 1 of 5
I say shut him down for the year. Get that pick.
Phil: Hi Melo, have some good news
Melo: What's that Phil?
Phil: We're shutting you down for the year.
Melo: How is that good news? I want to play.
Phil: Because we're still paying you $75,607.43 per quarter while you're at home binge watching Orange Is The New Black
That is the same f'ing conversation Pops had with Robinson when Tim Duncan was coming out of college.
Only difference being David got paid $150 per quarter while watching VHS box sets of The Golden Girls
Vmart wrote:gunsnewing wrote:Splat wrote:Here we go with Melo's knee. Sore since the Game # 2. They're going to have to rest him at some point
better fix it now before it turns into H20 v2.0
Melo already admitted to already having his knee checked out but is opting to play through it for now. Refused to say what it was.
$124mil investment....year 1 of 5
I say shut him down for the year. Get that pick.
I'm still not sure why Melo isn't on a minutes restriction. He needs to be capped at 28mpg moving forward.
Splat wrote:gunsnewing wrote:Splat wrote:Here we go with Melo's knee. Sore since the Game # 2. They're going to have to rest him at some point
better fix it now before it turns into H20 v2.0
Melo already admitted to already having his knee checked out but is opting to play through it for now. Refused to say what it was.
$124mil investment....year 1 of 5
Like I've said, Amare # 2. Better player by far, but same basic risk being gambled on again. Guy's too shopworn to pay him this much for that long and with no trade clause. Only blind optimists would think his body is going to hold up for five years.
Tried explaining this to Fishmike for 2yrs but he was adamant about re-signing Melo for the supermax while overlooking the wear and tear of Melo's 12yr career of heavy use
Then he proceeded to call me a Melo-hater
gunsnewing wrote:Splat wrote:gunsnewing wrote:Splat wrote:Here we go with Melo's knee. Sore since the Game # 2. They're going to have to rest him at some point
better fix it now before it turns into H20 v2.0
Melo already admitted to already having his knee checked out but is opting to play through it for now. Refused to say what it was.
$124mil investment....year 1 of 5
Like I've said, Amare # 2. Better player by far, but same basic risk being gambled on again. Guy's too shopworn to pay him this much for that long and with no trade clause. Only blind optimists would think his body is going to hold up for five years.
Tried explaining this to Fishmike for 2yrs but he was adamant about re-signing Melo for the supermax while overlooking the wear and tear of Melo's 12yr career of heavy use
Then he proceeded to call me a Melo-hater
yeah, he still loves Amare, what can you say to that? Seems so completely obvious to me these guys always sign with us when they've already been through the grinder. Only diff here is we ground down Melo here on his first contract, so its doubly stupid for management not to know Melo is a tired dude who worked hard for his paycheck, but his body has paid the price. He has been on our medical staff's tables for years now. If he breaks down early, there will be zero excuses. They signed on for this.
Any argument that we couldn't let Melo walk can be countered by, OK, then we should have signed and traded him for assets.
But the other counter-argument is will it be worth an untradeable $124M if he can only plays half of his contract or if he is soon past his prime? Will it be worth that? I say it is just gambling and anything but a sure bet the deal will return its full value to the Knicks.
