Knicks · Who would you keep around on the Knicks for the next season? (page 1)

The players I would keep, are either very hard workers on the team even if they are making peanuts or people with a good knowledge of the triangle that they can carry out to the next season.
I would keep:
Larkin- Works hard for rebounds/steals. potential consistent 3.(might not stay though since we did not pick up his option)
THJR- potential all star in NBA. We've seen he can be unselfish.can drive to the hoop needs to be more consistent with jumper and of course work on his horrible D.
Acy- He is a beast.
Alrich- he has shown he can be a 10+ and 10+ player when given 30+ minutes. defence isnt bad and is competant on offensive end.
Wear- works hard on defence, even though Butler punished him you could see he was making him work. His jumper is somewhat consistent and good things always happen when he is on the floor.
Amare(debatable)- so many ups and downs i don't know where to begin.
Melo on limited minutes(debatable) a top 5 scorer in the NBA who I see doing well on controlled minutes;however, could we get some decent players and picks if we traded him to benefit our team going forward? He hasn't greatly influenced our team when he is playing so would it matter if he was traded?
Early-(debatable) havent seen too much of him so can't say much

TPercy wrote:The players I would keep, are either very hard workers on the team even if they are making peanuts or people with a good knowledge of the triangle that they can carry out to the next season.
I would keep:
Larkin- Works hard for rebounds/steals. potential consistent 3.(might not stay though since we did not pick up his option)
THJR- potential all star in NBA. We've seen he can be unselfish.can drive to the hoop needs to be more consistent with jumper and of course work on his horrible D.
Acy- He is a beast.
Alrich- he has shown he can be a 10+ and 10+ player when given 30+ minutes. defence isnt bad and is competant on offensive end.
Wear- works hard on defence, even though Butler punished him you could see he was making him work. His jumper is somewhat consistent and good things always happen when he is on the floor.
Amare(debatable)- so many ups and downs i don't know where to begin.
Melo on limited minutes(debatable) a top 5 scorer in the NBA who I see doing well on controlled minutes;however, could we get some decent players and picks if we traded him to benefit our team going forward? He hasn't greatly influenced our team when he is playing so would it matter if he was traded?
Early-(debatable) havent seen too much of him so can't say much

I think they think they can draft someone to replace Larkin or groom a d league guy. The other you named will be back because you have to fill the roster salary wise they are bottom dwellers.

I still have no clue why folks are still high on THjr. The shooting mechanics are lovely but he has massively long stretches where he does nothing. Sub par at EVERY facet of the game. Right now he's a bench player on an uptempo team. Nice in transition. He can get hot and score in bunches, follows up every tantalizing game (like last night) with a 2-10, 3-9 and 1-7 three game shooting effort.

I would love to be wrong on him but thats what I see at this point.

So it's ok to keep THJ a "potential a all star" despite the fact that almost every person he guards has a season high or career high, but people are quick to kick Amare to the curb..

THJ is by far the worst defender at his position, his effort is there once in a blue. I have been focusing on each players defense when I watch the game, in fact thats all i have been paying attention to when i tune. I just watch each player for about 6 possessions on defense.

when you have bad guards defending, it's a domino effect, because as soon as that guard gets in the paint or close to it, here comes our bigs on the help forcing them to leave their man for a easy hoop. Everyone of our players converge into the paint once the ball gets there, and thats why we are dead last in 3 point defense. The philosophy is ok sometimes, but to stick to it and not adjust when you have very good shooters..thats a coaching problem.

fishmike wrote:

TPercy wrote:The players I would keep, are either very hard workers on the team even if they are making peanuts or people with a good knowledge of the triangle that they can carry out to the next season.
I would keep:
Larkin- Works hard for rebounds/steals. potential consistent 3.(might not stay though since we did not pick up his option)
THJR- potential all star in NBA. We've seen he can be unselfish.can drive to the hoop needs to be more consistent with jumper and of course work on his horrible D.
Acy- He is a beast.
Alrich- he has shown he can be a 10+ and 10+ player when given 30+ minutes. defence isnt bad and is competant on offensive end.
Wear- works hard on defence, even though Butler punished him you could see he was making him work. His jumper is somewhat consistent and good things always happen when he is on the floor.
Amare(debatable)- so many ups and downs i don't know where to begin.
Melo on limited minutes(debatable) a top 5 scorer in the NBA who I see doing well on controlled minutes;however, could we get some decent players and picks if we traded him to benefit our team going forward? He hasn't greatly influenced our team when he is playing so would it matter if he was traded?
Early-(debatable) havent seen too much of him so can't say much

I think they think they can draft someone to replace Larkin or groom a d league guy. The other you named will be back because you have to fill the roster salary wise they are bottom dwellers.

I still have no clue why folks are still high on THjr. The shooting mechanics are lovely but he has massively long stretches where he does nothing. Sub par at EVERY facet of the game. Right now he's a bench player on an uptempo team. Nice in transition. He can get hot and score in bunches, follows up every tantalizing game (like last night) with a 2-10, 3-9 and 1-7 three game shooting effort.

I would love to be wrong on him but thats what I see at this point.

I'm with you on Tim Jr- I just can't click with his game. He's a streaky chucker who does little (if anything) else and he is selfish. Other players get mercilessly blasted for it while he gets praise.

Fortunately he's getting the Knick fan demi-sophomore pass right now (It only lasts halfway in to young Knicks sophomore seasons), but by the end of this season people will have turned on him, be saying how he hasn't developed or improved at all- that he's actually regressed, and that we've left it too late to trade him- we should have traded him while his value was at it's highest (this argument gets flipped if we actually trade him at the deadline, at which point exactly the same people will insist that we traded him too soon, and that his value is only going to increase).

Melo: He is the devil and Im afraid of him.
Larkin: Good backup.
T-Wizzle (wear):The white glue guy to replecate Luke Walton.
Acy: the New Reggie Evans. He is trade fodder and serviceable. Great beard!!!! I can see Woodson when I stare into it.
THjr: Not ready to give up on him. Need him to spot shoot.
Jose: If we can't trade him, we need him to shoot, not create.
Cole: Shyt, we can't very well keep Sam!!!!
Early: Rookies for us to fawn over. if he can play, let him prove it!

Gone:
Shump: It was a good try. I hope he succeeds elsewhere and F500 can lament on how we should have kept him.
JR: Please go.
Amare: Time to go. If you can triangulate and want to be part of this for 3 million cuz you love Jewish Deli and the city, thats cool.

THJ is a keeper. He isn't that bad at defense over exaggeration by board members.

You all say that we should keep him but who would you rather have? Thjr defense is not that far off from the defense of the rest of the team the only difference is that he is young and has the potential to learn from that. Name one guard other than THJR he can consistently get to rim? He is the best we have got imho.

Vmart wrote:THJ is a keeper. He isn't that bad at defense over exaggeration by board members.

He is bad though... he's shown the ability and the drive to want to get better. He has his own will to compete and that alone is half the battle. I think he needs to continue developing with the Knicks. I believe his defense will get respectable as the years go by. When he learns how to work the game to his advantage, that's when he will evolve into that borderline all star type of player. I believe he's on that path.

I personally can't get behind any other player on the roster. I do like Wear and Acy, but they need to make things happen. They both seem content with just being out there. They have to play the game not play off of their "stars". You gotta want it. Neither had really proven that they want to be a nba player consistently enough.

TPercy wrote:You all say that we should keep him but who would you rather have? Thjr defense is not that far off from the defense of the rest of the team the only difference is that he is young and has the potential to learn from that. Name one guard other than THJR he can consistently get to rim? He is the best we have got imho.

Precisely, he is the best slasher on the team for a team that is stagnant THJ has great offense. His defense has steadily gotten better with time. His real plus minus has increased from the last I looked at -1.71 to -1.38. Shump is a -0.97. S. Smith has a second to last place real plus or minus of -5.87. Now I'm of the belief that the Knicks are tanking so these numbers are going to be worse than normal.

Vmart wrote:THJ is a keeper. He isn't that bad at defense over exaggeration by board members.

Why would you not keep a two year young promising guard around is baffling to me. Those same folks who want to castrate THJ are the same who want the Knicks to tank and acquire another young player that they will not have the patience to let develop

Knicks1969 wrote:

Vmart wrote:THJ is a keeper. He isn't that bad at defense over exaggeration by board members.

Why would you not keep a two year young promising guard around is baffling to me. Those same folks who want to castrate THJ are the same who want the Knicks to tank and acquire another young player that they will not have the patience to let develop

EXACTLY!

We may want to trade THjr. We've got a lot of marginal players who have overlapping holes in their game: Shump, THjr, JR. I mean, if you could combine them into one player, you'd have an all star. Instead we have a platoon with three guys that don't deserve the minutes they're getting because we have no one better to slot in. And 2 of them are now consistently injury prone.

I'd dump Bargnani. Buy him out and ask him to send me the name of the team he signs with in China.

I'd also try and trade Shump- and quite honestly, I might just release him outright to be free of the distraction.

Same with JR. Eat his salary and send him on his way. It might actually make a statement to the guys still here.

Vmart wrote:

TPercy wrote:You all say that we should keep him but who would you rather have? Thjr defense is not that far off from the defense of the rest of the team the only difference is that he is young and has the potential to learn from that. Name one guard other than THJR he can consistently get to rim? He is the best we have got imho.

Precisely, he is the best slasher on the team for a team that is stagnant THJ has great offense. His defense has steadily gotten better with time. His real plus minus has increased from the last I looked at -1.71 to -1.38. Shump is a -0.97. S. Smith has a second to last place real plus or minus of -5.87. Now I'm of the belief that the Knicks are tanking so these numbers are going to be worse than normal.

agreed. I am the first to admit hardaway has his flaws but he has practically played 1 season and still developing. True his defense is weak but to be fair other than shump and larkin nobody plays. Amare and melo are terrible defenders as we know

TPercy wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:

Vmart wrote:THJ is a keeper. He isn't that bad at defense over exaggeration by board members.

Why would you not keep a two year young promising guard around is baffling to me. Those same folks who want to castrate THJ are the same who want the Knicks to tank and acquire another young player that they will not have the patience to let develop

EXACTLY!

so embracing a losing season knowing it may yield franchise caliber talent is the same as calling out a low first round pick with a very average skill set as being... average? One has ZILCH to do the with the other, unless your pissed because you think THjr is a future star and just needs time. Thats a fine opinion to have. One I just dont share.

Evaluating a player who is nothing but inconsistent in very way as not being a future building piece does not equate to impatience. Who's castrating him? He was the 24th pick in the draft. He's playing like a guy who got picked about 24. Most guys that late dont make it past their rookie contracts.

fishmike wrote:

TPercy wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:

Vmart wrote:THJ is a keeper. He isn't that bad at defense over exaggeration by board members.

Why would you not keep a two year young promising guard around is baffling to me. Those same folks who want to castrate THJ are the same who want the Knicks to tank and acquire another young player that they will not have the patience to let develop

EXACTLY!

so embracing a losing season knowing it may yield franchise caliber talent is the same as calling out a low first round pick with a very average skill set as being... average? One has ZILCH to do the with the other, unless your pissed because you think THjr is a future star and just needs time. Thats a fine opinion to have. One I just dont share.

Evaluating a player who is nothing but inconsistent in very way as not being a future building piece does not equate to impatience. Who's castrating him? He was the 24th pick in the draft. He's playing like a guy who got picked about 24. Most guys that late dont make it past their rookie contracts.

to be honest fish other than melo you dont like anyone

StarksEwing1 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

TPercy wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:

Vmart wrote:THJ is a keeper. He isn't that bad at defense over exaggeration by board members.

Why would you not keep a two year young promising guard around is baffling to me. Those same folks who want to castrate THJ are the same who want the Knicks to tank and acquire another young player that they will not have the patience to let develop

EXACTLY!

so embracing a losing season knowing it may yield franchise caliber talent is the same as calling out a low first round pick with a very average skill set as being... average? One has ZILCH to do the with the other, unless your pissed because you think THjr is a future star and just needs time. Thats a fine opinion to have. One I just dont share.

Evaluating a player who is nothing but inconsistent in very way as not being a future building piece does not equate to impatience. Who's castrating him? He was the 24th pick in the draft. He's playing like a guy who got picked about 24. Most guys that late dont make it past their rookie contracts.

to be honest fish other than melo you dont like anyone

I liked Larkin. I like THjr for the cost but dont see him as a big part of any future rotation until proven otherwise. There hasnt been a player to really get excited about around here in years. Lee was probably my last. Gallo showed glimpses but is a bust and a joke and by the time he got traded it was like who cares. Probably Mosgov was the last Knick I really *liked* since we are "being honest"

But yea... if we are talking quality NBA talent there is really one guy on the roster, and even that one guy has a his own big set of flaws and aint no spring chicken.

the roster is total crap.

fishmike wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

TPercy wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:

Vmart wrote:THJ is a keeper. He isn't that bad at defense over exaggeration by board members.

Why would you not keep a two year young promising guard around is baffling to me. Those same folks who want to castrate THJ are the same who want the Knicks to tank and acquire another young player that they will not have the patience to let develop

EXACTLY!

so embracing a losing season knowing it may yield franchise caliber talent is the same as calling out a low first round pick with a very average skill set as being... average? One has ZILCH to do the with the other, unless your pissed because you think THjr is a future star and just needs time. Thats a fine opinion to have. One I just dont share.

Evaluating a player who is nothing but inconsistent in very way as not being a future building piece does not equate to impatience. Who's castrating him? He was the 24th pick in the draft. He's playing like a guy who got picked about 24. Most guys that late dont make it past their rookie contracts.

to be honest fish other than melo you dont like anyone

I liked Larkin. I like THjr for the cost but dont see him as a big part of any future rotation until proven otherwise. There hasnt been a player to really get excited about around here in years. Lee was probably my last. Gallo showed glimpses but is a bust and a joke and by the time he got traded it was like who cares. Probably Mosgov was the last Knick I really *liked* since we are "being honest"

But yea... if we are talking quality NBA talent there is really one guy on the roster, and even that one guy has a his own big set of flaws and aint no spring chicken.

He will only prve otherwise with CONSISTENT playing time. The first 20 games, he did not know where his minutes were coming from, but the injuries to Shump and JR, fisher has no choice but to use him. He is slumping with his shot, but WE have realized that he is also attacking the basket to get his numbers. He needs to cut down his many three point attempts, but the COACH needs to step in and coach the kid.

fishmike wrote:the roster is total crap.

what fish said...
I like what we have at roster spots 12-15 with THJR, Wear, Acy and Cole... havent seen anything tantalizing from Early yet incl. Preseason...
Everybody else ... but Melo who will not be going anywhere... bye bye...

Knicks1969 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

TPercy wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:

Vmart wrote:THJ is a keeper. He isn't that bad at defense over exaggeration by board members.

Why would you not keep a two year young promising guard around is baffling to me. Those same folks who want to castrate THJ are the same who want the Knicks to tank and acquire another young player that they will not have the patience to let develop

EXACTLY!

so embracing a losing season knowing it may yield franchise caliber talent is the same as calling out a low first round pick with a very average skill set as being... average? One has ZILCH to do the with the other, unless your pissed because you think THjr is a future star and just needs time. Thats a fine opinion to have. One I just dont share.

Evaluating a player who is nothing but inconsistent in very way as not being a future building piece does not equate to impatience. Who's castrating him? He was the 24th pick in the draft. He's playing like a guy who got picked about 24. Most guys that late dont make it past their rookie contracts.

to be honest fish other than melo you dont like anyone

I liked Larkin. I like THjr for the cost but dont see him as a big part of any future rotation until proven otherwise. There hasnt been a player to really get excited about around here in years. Lee was probably my last. Gallo showed glimpses but is a bust and a joke and by the time he got traded it was like who cares. Probably Mosgov was the last Knick I really *liked* since we are "being honest"

But yea... if we are talking quality NBA talent there is really one guy on the roster, and even that one guy has a his own big set of flaws and aint no spring chicken.

He will only prve otherwise with CONSISTENT playing time. The first 20 games, he did not know where his minutes were coming from, but the injuries to Shump and JR, fisher has no choice but to use him. He is slumping with his shot, but WE have realized that he is also attacking the basket to get his numbers. He needs to cut down his many three point attempts, but the COACH needs to step in and coach the kid.

what are you watching? The more minutes he's been handed the more inconsistent he's played. 24th pick. Stop making him into something he isnt. You act like he's never gottan a chance. His minutes get pulled because he's really really bad at times.

This coach is dying for any consistent guard play. Closest was 3 good weeks of shooting from Shump. Then he fell back to who he is. These guys arent good. Stop blaming coaches.

fishmike wrote:the roster is total crap.

Does this mean the Melo is God card really went into the shredder?