Knicks · what is developing a player to you? (page 1)

It used to be you show it in practice and earn your spot. Be ready when your number is called and seize the moment.

Nowadays is more like play a bum 30 mins a game so they can get better.

what's going on here?

Maybe veterans don't go as hard in practice anymore. Unless you are Kobe

EnySpree wrote:It used to be you show it in practice and earn your spot. Be ready when your number is called and seize the moment.

Nowadays is more like play a bum 30 mins a game so they can get better.

what's going on here?

where's this coming from? the knicks? can you provide an example?

I think what the Knicks did with Galloway and now Sanchez. I think they are doing the right thing sending Early to Westchester. Using the d league the right way is a great place to start.

CrushAlot wrote:I think what the Knicks did with Galloway and now Sanchez. I think they are doing the right thing sending Early to Westchester. Using the d league the right way is a great place to start.

This is the right way to do it in this era I guess. Back in the day guys had to do their own grooming. A guy like Anthony mason played all over the world and got better until the Knicks Gabe him his shot in the nba. Starks has his story too. It wasn't in the hands if a team to get guys better. Guy had to do their own shit or find a regular job.

Clyde often talks about how he originally came off the bench and had to defend at a high level before he got moved up. I think in general that in the old days there was a very clear pecking order and the vets would set the tone. A guy like Willis would enforce things among the players and the coach would put players in a very specific mental approach to the game that led to the right mental development. It was the same with the Knicks under Riley. Before you could expect to be just throwing up shots you would earn your way in practice with effort on D and then even more in games. The offensive stuff came gradually.

Now there is finally a system where you can refine a players mental approach to the game and in the off season that player can work on his actual skills in terms of improving his shooting and dribbling technique etc. In the D League players can really stretch their wings minus the presence of vets who would be in front of them in the pros. I think it helps to build confidence and to get reps doing things a pro will be required to do more so than they might have had to do in college. Still if a player is up with the big team they have to show in practice that they understand what is required of them and the proper effort level. IMO if they're showing it in practice they will get minutes in games. If they slip and revert in practice or the games then they will see minutes drop and perhaps get sent down. I think this is a proper method to develop.

I think the Knicks are doing a good job of finding and developing undrafted talent. They targeted four undrafted guys, Wear, Galloway, Sanchez and a center who has since been cut from the W-Knicks. Two of the guys are in the nba and Sanchez looks really good in spurts. Sanchez needs to up the intensity level a bit to be a pro. When he gets fired up he is a menace on both sides of the floor. He needs to play with that level of intensity all the time. Wear probably needs some time in Westchester.

I think it means sending the player to another team so that he can develop.
I really hope it no longer goes like that though.

the d-league is a good alternative for kids who flunk out of college or can't get scholarships i guess.

in frazier's heyday there were no more than 10 teams and every player got a full 4 years of college before coming to the pros. big difference between a 19-year old and a 22-year old. he also said that in those days you only needed one coach, the head coach.

nowadays the nba is a bloated, diluted mess, and you have to search far and wide for polished players.... not only that but you have to have huge coaching staffs to turn almost all one-and-dones into nba-caliber players. and even then there is no guarantee that all that coaching will yield the results that meet expectations.

so the d-league is nice in that it fills a need.

EnySpree wrote:It used to be you show it in practice and earn your spot. Be ready when your number is called and seize the moment.

Nowadays is more like play a bum 30 mins a game so they can get better.

what's going on here?

There would be no D-League if what you said above was the proper process of development

Because of a dilution and similar like talent level

You don't have clear distinctions of who's better than the other player

You have contracts getting in the way of who should and shouldn't play

You also have more 1 and done or younger talents coming into the league

There needs to be proper development in place

I'll interject with this point too, why do fans say it takes point guards and big men

3-4yrs to DEVELOP before you know what you have, what the heck does that mean

If there's no such thing as development or proper way to develop a player

CrushAlot wrote:I think what the Knicks did with Galloway and now Sanchez. I think they are doing the right thing sending Early to Westchester. Using the d league the right way is a great place to start.

Are you mentioning Sanchez because he's down in the D-League

And going through the proper process, because there are other players down there doing likewise

I do not see any NBA talent level in Sanchez yet

At least nothing that I saw last night saying so

But we don't have to be exclusive to our farm team

The whole D-League is at our disposal outside of draft right players

So who cares what team is developing said player[no the Triangle is not the end all be all if a player can contribute or not]

If we're covering all areas of operation including scouting

We can find the developed talent in front of our face in the D-League

And do not forget overseas too

Players progress at different rates, if at all. Developing a player who isnt a high draft pick, maybe undrafted, is IMO to give them that extra time to possibly be good enough to make a rotation. Helping them work on weaknesses in their game.

F500ONE wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:I think what the Knicks did with Galloway and now Sanchez. I think they are doing the right thing sending Early to Westchester. Using the d league the right way is a great place to start.

Are you mentioning Sanchez because he's down in the D-League

And going through the proper process, because there are other players down there doing likewise

I do not see any NBA talent level in Sanchez yet

At least nothing that I saw last night saying so

But we don't have to be exclusive to our farm team

The whole D-League is at our disposal outside of draft right players

So who cares what team is developing said player[no the Triangle is not the end all be all if a player can contribute or not]

If we're covering all areas of operation including scouting

We can find the developed talent in front of our face in the D-League

And do not forget overseas too

I mentioned Sanchez because he was brought into camp so that the Knicks could protect him from the d league draft. I think you should watch Sanchez a bit more before you rule him out as a part of the future. The Knicks protected Galloway, Sanchez and Jordan Vandenberg from the d league draft. They had those guys in camp and Galloway and Vandenberg were on the summer league team. I am not saying be exclusive in looking at d league talent but Sanchez is a guy the Knicks liked enough to protect from the draft. He also is a guy that Houston is talking about and according to one of todays articles has another team interested in bringing him up. Sanchez is brought up next from Westchester if they bring up another d leaguer. It won't be Thanasis.

dk7th wrote:

EnySpree wrote:It used to be you show it in practice and earn your spot. Be ready when your number is called and seize the moment.

Nowadays is more like play a bum 30 mins a game so they can get better.

what's going on here?

where's this coming from? the knicks? can you provide an example?

THJR and Shump??

TPercy wrote:

dk7th wrote:

EnySpree wrote:It used to be you show it in practice and earn your spot. Be ready when your number is called and seize the moment.

Nowadays is more like play a bum 30 mins a game so they can get better.

what's going on here?

where's this coming from? the knicks? can you provide an example?

THJR and Shump??

thjr has been on a deeply-diseased knicks team that resembles an expansion team the last season and a half so i don't see a problem with auditioning him. nonetheless i agree he is closer to a bum than a legit nba player. bbiq, court vision, handle, footwork, shot selection, lateral quickness-- all are questionable. he does not seem mentally resilient... not expected in such a young guy but he just isn't that good.

shumpert is a strange and puzzling case. before his knee injury he had a chance to have a decent career on his defense alone. i think this truly shytti knicks organization did a lot of harm. he too was not mentally resilient and he may have had attitude problems to begin with.

if the knicks franchise were not so revoltingly awful and diseased the team would have been further along than it is and these two guys would have been able to develop in the d-league.

but the knicks have sucked for years (except for half a season) so these guys end up getting a shot.

dk7th wrote:

TPercy wrote:

dk7th wrote:

EnySpree wrote:It used to be you show it in practice and earn your spot. Be ready when your number is called and seize the moment.

Nowadays is more like play a bum 30 mins a game so they can get better.

what's going on here?

where's this coming from? the knicks? can you provide an example?

THJR and Shump??

thjr has been on a deeply-diseased knicks team that resembles an expansion team the last season and a half so i don't see a problem with auditioning him. nonetheless i agree he is closer to a bum than a legit nba player. bbiq, court vision, handle, footwork, shot selection, lateral quickness-- all are questionable. he does not seem mentally resilient... not expected in such a young guy but he just isn't that good.

shumpert is a strange and puzzling case. before his knee injury he had a chance to have a decent career on his defense alone. i think this truly shytti knicks organization did a lot of harm. he too was not mentally resilient and he may have had attitude problems to begin with.

if the knicks franchise were not so revoltingly awful and diseased the team would have been further along than it is and these two guys would have been able to develop in the d-league.

but the knicks have sucked for years (except for half a season) so these guys end up getting a shot.

Look at the negatives on Shump's pre-draft scouting report. They are all his negatives as an nba player.

Weaknesses: Lacks stability/discipline on the court ... Inconsistent … Not efficient at all ... Horrid shot-selection ... Liable to shoot at any time, even when being closely guarded ... Likes to shoot off the dribble on a good deal of his isolation possessions, despite only connecting on 20% of these attempts ... Shoots nearly 5 three pointers per game, despite only shooting 27.8% from behind the arc ... Will often go for the flashy play instead of the easy play, which can lead to unforced turnovers ... Very poor jump shooter, and hasn't shown any improvement in this area during his three-year career with Georgia Tech ... Needs the ball in his hands a lot to be effective on offense and he certainly won't have as many isolation opportunities at the next level ... Should look to take advantage of his size and strength more in the post, but has yet to add this dimension to his game ... Attitude has been questioned in the past, but to his credit he appears to have matured over the past year ...

http://www.nbadraft.net/players/iman-shu...

yeah can't argue with any of that. that's why i said he could have carved out a decent nba career on his defense alone, which i though had promise prior to the knee injury. keep working on a corner 3 and he could have been a poor man's bowen... maybe.

Oh goodness gracious who is personally responsible

For that scouting report on Shumpert

There should have been no reason to draft him

As he fulfilled every letter of it in the NBA thus far

F500ONE wrote:Oh goodness gracious who is personally responsible

For that scouting report on Shumpert

There should have been no reason to draft him

As he fulfilled every letter of it in the NBA thus far

D'Antoni loved his workout

I don't believe that teams develop players...I don't believe its their responsibility. Between, High School, AAU & College, these players should already be "developed." By the time they reach the professional level, all the coach should be responsible for is helping that player adjust to whatever schemes he runs.

I believe the individual player is responsible for their own development by working on their deficiencies in the off season. Until the NBA adjusts the developmental league to reflect to what MLB has, an NBA coach just doesn't have enough time to hold a player by the hand...ESPECIALLY DURING the season.

Swishfm3 wrote:I don't believe that teams develop players...I don't believe its their responsibility. Between, High School, AAU & College, these players should already be "developed." By the time they reach the professional level, all the coach should be responsible for is helping that player adjust to whatever schemes he runs.

I believe the individual player is responsible for their own development by working on their deficiencies in the off season. Until the NBA adjusts the developmental league to reflect to what MLB has, an NBA coach just doesn't have enough time to hold a player by the hand...ESPECIALLY DURING the season.

No they should, that's why you have

Position and-or skillset coaches

You don't think it would be a good idea

To hire someone like Mark Price, Hakeem, Patrick, Payton, Cassell, Oakley

To teach players how to play this game

It's up to the coach and-or organization to bring these guys in or teach it themselves

I recall of stories where McHale would work with Garnett

While in Minnesota when he was the GM and coach

Sam Cassell working with John Wall in Washington

You don't think Doc had some kind of positive effect on Rondo

SVG's affect on Brandon Jennings, Kidd's effect on Brandon Knight

Kerr's effect on Curry and Klay[who actually has shooting contests with both on a habitual basis]

Dallas footing the bill or maybe it was Dirk bringing his shooting coach from Germany

To help him add things to his game along with Chandler Parsons'

I thought I recalled a televised game that said Dallas flew him in on their bill

I could go on and on, yes the player is culpable but so is the team-caoch