Knicks · The Case for Willie Trill Cauley Stein (page 22)

nba is a point guard league unless you think winslow is the next james harden or ginobili, cauley stein is next tyson chandler or ben wallace, porzingis is the next dirk

Bonn1997 wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:Stein is a combo of Tyson, k. Martin, and Camby. He embodies what those three players were able to do, but in a much much longer frame. None of those three guys could do all that Stein can do. If this dude is able to knock down open shots as he has shown on the video, watch out. The heck with the euro prizinski or Mudiay. None of the two has proven that they can dominate on a big stage. Stein has

That does not sound like a good description of a guy who never came close to averaging a double double in college or high school, and never even averaged a single double in college. Statistically, Dan Gadzuric is probably a more reasonable comparison. If you want to say he also does things that don't show up in the box score, then let's call him a Gadzuric - Jared Jeffries hybrid

If you're going by stats how do you project Karl Anthony Towns? Kentucky played a platoon system.

Knicks1969 wrote:Stein is a combo of Tyson, k. Martin, and Camby. He embodies what those three players were able to do, but in a much much longer frame. None of those three guys could do all that Stein can do. If this dude is able to knock down open shots as he has shown on the video, watch out. The heck with the euro prizinski or Mudiay. None of the two has proven that they can dominate on a big stage. Stein has

KrisP n Mudiay are mystery men. You don't know for sure what they'll be. There's potential but also bust potential. With WCS and Winslow they are much more of a sure thing and still have some upside.

With WCS I prefer his size and potential impact on the entire defense. He doesn't need the ball on offense to still have an impact.

crzymdups wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:Stein is a combo of Tyson, k. Martin, and Camby. He embodies what those three players were able to do, but in a much much longer frame. None of those three guys could do all that Stein can do. If this dude is able to knock down open shots as he has shown on the video, watch out. The heck with the euro prizinski or Mudiay. None of the two has proven that they can dominate on a big stage. Stein has

That does not sound like a good description of a guy who never came close to averaging a double double in college or high school, and never even averaged a single double in college. Statistically, Dan Gadzuric is probably a more reasonable comparison. If you want to say he also does things that don't show up in the box score, then let's call him a Gadzuric - Jared Jeffries hybrid

If you're going by stats how do you project Karl Anthony Towns? Kentucky played a platoon system.

His #s for a freshmen were excellent. So pretty high. If he stayed the exact same for 3 consecutive years in college (and had been a 3 rpg player in high school), then closer to Gadz/Jeffries but with a little more offense. Note that I did mention HS too for Stein - basically he's never been productive at any level.

Bonn1997 wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:Stein is a combo of Tyson, k. Martin, and Camby. He embodies what those three players were able to do, but in a much much longer frame. None of those three guys could do all that Stein can do. If this dude is able to knock down open shots as he has shown on the video, watch out. The heck with the euro prizinski or Mudiay. None of the two has proven that they can dominate on a big stage. Stein has

That does not sound like a good description of a guy who never came close to averaging a double double in college or high school, and never even averaged a single double in college. Statistically, Dan Gadzuric is probably a more reasonable comparison. If you want to say he also does things that don't show up in the box score, then let's call him a Gadzuric - Jared Jeffries hybrid

If you're going by stats how do you project Karl Anthony Towns? Kentucky played a platoon system.

His #s for a freshmen were excellent. So pretty high. If he stayed the exact same for 3 consecutive years in college (and had been a 3 rpg player in high school), then closer to Gadz/Jeffries but with a little more offense. Note that I did mention HS too for Stein - basically he's never been productive at any level.

Towns really stepped up for the most part in the Wisconsin game. Actually enjoyed watching him and Kaminsky bang in the paint-looked more like an old NBA game.

The DraftExpress video showing what Towns/Kaminsky/Stein did solidified Towns as the #1 pick,IMO. You add the outside shot that he was showing in the workout, but also in HS, and you have an all around player to look at and build around.

i rather shoot for the moon with mudiay, winslow and porzingis than the gutter with cauley stein

jbeachboy wrote:i rather shoot for the moon with mudiay, winslow and porzingis than the gutter with cauley stein

Stein is a one of a kind type 7 footer that does not come around as often. You can always find a marginal talent like a Mudiay in the draft, but not a stud like Stein. How much do you know about Mudiay?

Knicks1969 wrote:

jbeachboy wrote:i rather shoot for the moon with mudiay, winslow and porzingis than the gutter with cauley stein

Stein is a one of a kind type 7 footer that does not come around as often. You can always find a marginal talent like a Mudiay in the draft, but not a stud like Stein. How much do you know about Mudiay?

No one really knows what Mudiay will be. He certainly has talent but he's not so rare that you can't find a similarly talented guard. There are very few bigs like WCS period. This team needs to be built on D. WCS would make everyone better on D and at the same time is effective offensively without the ball. He would help make the team faster and more athletic and more efficient on both ends.

i think its easier to find a cauley stein than a mudiay like pg, you can get a biyombo or a omer asik , mudiay is an exceptional pg with passing , rebounding and quickness skills, just needs to work on his shooting

jbeachboy wrote:i think its easier to find a cauley stein than a mudiay like pg, you can get a biyombo or a omer asik , mudiay is an exceptional pg with passing , rebounding and quickness skills, just needs to work on his shooting

Ok let's be clear here Biyombo and Asik are NOTHING like WCS. It's not just about blocked shots. WCS is a freak of nature. How many 7' guys do you know who could play Wide Receiver in Footbsll? He's just not a normal 7' athlete. His agility is like a guard and his ability to help and recover is elite.

Kentucky would use him against top perimeter players. It's an insult to suggest he's like any of these journeyman bigs in the NBA. WCS has already shown some ability on offense and he runs the floor like a gazelle. People are stuck on his college averages but you have to also take into account the circumstances of the situation in Kentucky. No one really was able to fully expand their game.

jbeachboy wrote:i think its easier to find a cauley stein than a mudiay like pg, you can get a biyombo or a omer asik , mudiay is an exceptional pg with passing , rebounding and quickness skills, just needs to work on his shooting

I think its easier to find a Mudiay type because big guards are in.....defensive bigs with a touch like wcs is rare.....especially with a combination of rim protection and pg defense. Im back on the stein wagon after watching his latest video.

blkexec wrote:

jbeachboy wrote:i think its easier to find a cauley stein than a mudiay like pg, you can get a biyombo or a omer asik , mudiay is an exceptional pg with passing , rebounding and quickness skills, just needs to work on his shooting

I think its easier to find a Mudiay type because big guards are in.....defensive bigs with a touch like wcs is rare.....especially with a combination of rim protection and pg defense. Im back on the stein wagon after watching his latest video.

Thx for posting this. WCS has looked sharp in all his workouts. Despite the erroneous report BRIGGS came up with about his Denver workout. From what I've read he's looked good in every workout. WCS is honing his skills and looking better and better. He's not even going full speed in this workout. He still has upside IMO.

nixluva wrote:

blkexec wrote:

jbeachboy wrote:i think its easier to find a cauley stein than a mudiay like pg, you can get a biyombo or a omer asik , mudiay is an exceptional pg with passing , rebounding and quickness skills, just needs to work on his shooting

I think its easier to find a Mudiay type because big guards are in.....defensive bigs with a touch like wcs is rare.....especially with a combination of rim protection and pg defense. Im back on the stein wagon after watching his latest video.

Thx for posting this. WCS has looked sharp in all his workouts. Despite the erroneous report BRIGGS came up with about his Denver workout. From what I've read he's looked good in every workout. WCS is honing his skills and looking better and better. He's not even going full speed in this workout. He still has upside IMO.

They put him thru some good test....showing his touch around the basket.....mid range jumper......and great hands on those alley opps. Its going to be extremely hard for phil to pass on him.

nixluva wrote:

blkexec wrote:

jbeachboy wrote:i think its easier to find a cauley stein than a mudiay like pg, you can get a biyombo or a omer asik , mudiay is an exceptional pg with passing , rebounding and quickness skills, just needs to work on his shooting

I think its easier to find a Mudiay type because big guards are in.....defensive bigs with a touch like wcs is rare.....especially with a combination of rim protection and pg defense. Im back on the stein wagon after watching his latest video.

Thx for posting this. WCS has looked sharp in all his workouts. Despite the erroneous report BRIGGS came up with about his Denver workout. From what I've read he's looked good in every workout. WCS is honing his skills and looking better and better. He's not even going full speed in this workout. He still has upside IMO.

I'm Stein fan for this draft but I was much more impressed with his shooting workout. If we set up the way we can, we can have Stein for lobs and open 3s and have him as a defensive powerhouse on the defensive end. Stein will be the most impactful and resourceful player to us.

blkexec wrote:

nixluva wrote:

blkexec wrote:

jbeachboy wrote:i think its easier to find a cauley stein than a mudiay like pg, you can get a biyombo or a omer asik , mudiay is an exceptional pg with passing , rebounding and quickness skills, just needs to work on his shooting

I think its easier to find a Mudiay type because big guards are in.....defensive bigs with a touch like wcs is rare.....especially with a combination of rim protection and pg defense. Im back on the stein wagon after watching his latest video.

Thx for posting this. WCS has looked sharp in all his workouts. Despite the erroneous report BRIGGS came up with about his Denver workout. From what I've read he's looked good in every workout. WCS is honing his skills and looking better and better. He's not even going full speed in this workout. He still has upside IMO.

They put him thru some good test....showing his touch around the basket.....mid range jumper......and great hands on those alley opps. Its going to be extremely hard for phil to pass on him.

WCS is a much more confident player now. I think this process has helped him see that he can be more at the next level. Just listen to him talk and he's no longer timid about his offense.

where do you find guards like mudiay in free agency?

jbeachboy wrote:where do you find guards like mudiay in free agency?

Von Wafer averaged over 30 in China, and Marbs is their Jordan...I think we could pick them up for you.

jbeachboy wrote:where do you find guards like mudiay in free agency?

In the ideal world you draft both players.....in the real world you draft the healthy 2 way defensive center over an injured guard with limited production.

blkexec wrote:

jbeachboy wrote:where do you find guards like mudiay in free agency?

In the ideal world you draft both players.....in the real world you draft the healthy 2 way defensive center over an injured guard with limited production.

I'd go with WCS over Mudiay. In our system the PG is not going to be a problem in terms of finding players who can handle the role. The ball is out of the PG's hands so much that it's a waste of resources to put a lot into the PG spot. This offense works best with good passers at as many positions as you can get, since everyone has to handle the ball to some degree. Midi's real value is as a ball dominant PG, so you'd be wasting a lot of his strengths.

WCS doesn't need the ball in order to have a great impact. That's huge in this system. WCS gives the team an identity as a better defensive team. Once you have him it's much easier to build on that defensive base. Every additional defensive player you add makes the D that much stronger. WCS is quickly improving his comfort with the offensive side of the floor. People that don't like him at #4 can try to ignore this but it's clear from every workout video that he's not the offensive zero they thought he was. No he's not Olajuwon, but he doesn't have to be in order to be really good. I've been saying this for a while now, but WCS is the right player for this team. It's easy to fit him into the mix, easy to mesh with other players and he'll have an immediate impact.

blkexec wrote:

jbeachboy wrote:i think its easier to find a cauley stein than a mudiay like pg, you can get a biyombo or a omer asik , mudiay is an exceptional pg with passing , rebounding and quickness skills, just needs to work on his shooting

I think its easier to find a Mudiay type because big guards are in.....defensive bigs with a touch like wcs is rare.....especially with a combination of rim protection and pg defense. Im back on the stein wagon after watching his latest video.

Cameron Payne looks really good too- a shame he won't be working out with us

smackeddog wrote:

blkexec wrote:

jbeachboy wrote:i think its easier to find a cauley stein than a mudiay like pg, you can get a biyombo or a omer asik , mudiay is an exceptional pg with passing , rebounding and quickness skills, just needs to work on his shooting

I think its easier to find a Mudiay type because big guards are in.....defensive bigs with a touch like wcs is rare.....especially with a combination of rim protection and pg defense. Im back on the stein wagon after watching his latest video.

Cameron Payne looks really good too- a shame he won't be working out with us

You don't need to work him out. If a trade is made for another pick and hes available, you take him. Especially if our 4th pick is a big. Payne has the potential to be the best PG in the 1st round, once all the smoke clears.