Knicks · Kentucky bigs have not been good (page 1)

I have to wonder if some over reliance on their size able teammates might've been an actual dentriment? Trey lyles who I think some here liked even some of the Knicks decision makers who had some say has been brutal. Hasn't rebounded played poor d hasn't shot well can't hit fts. On the other hands guys who were the man so to speak have played well like Portis The best players from Kentucky have easily been the Harrison's

Lyles was never a good rebounder/defender. When he guarded 3's he was too slow, got pushed around by bigs and would nod off all the time.

Towns did not look like the sure thing #1 can't miss pick. Not by a long shot.

anrst wrote:Towns did not look like the sure thing #1 can't miss pick. Not by a long shot.

cant overreact to anything good or bad. Towns is still a kid just like porzingis. Both are probably gonna be the real deal they just may need some time

tj23 wrote:Lyles was never a good rebounder/defender. When he guarded 3's he was too slow, got pushed around by bigs and would nod off all the time.

2/10 from the field...0/3 from the 3...4/11 from the FT line...

Is he really this bad of a shooter??

WaltLongmire wrote:

tj23 wrote:Lyles was never a good rebounder/defender. When he guarded 3's he was too slow, got pushed around by bigs and would nod off all the time.

2/10 from the field...0/3 from the 3...4/11 from the FT line...

Is he really this bad of a shooter??

just one game. Im sure nerves are a factor. Plus its just summer league. Im not ready to claim anything on any of the top draft picks until we get into the season

StarksEwing1 wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

tj23 wrote:Lyles was never a good rebounder/defender. When he guarded 3's he was too slow, got pushed around by bigs and would nod off all the time.

2/10 from the field...0/3 from the 3...4/11 from the FT line...

Is he really this bad of a shooter??

just one game. Im sure nerves are a factor. Plus its just summer league. Im not ready to claim anything on any of the top draft picks until we get into the season

voice of reason

Swishfm3 wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

tj23 wrote:Lyles was never a good rebounder/defender. When he guarded 3's he was too slow, got pushed around by bigs and would nod off all the time.

2/10 from the field...0/3 from the 3...4/11 from the FT line...

Is he really this bad of a shooter??

just one game. Im sure nerves are a factor. Plus its just summer league. Im not ready to claim anything on any of the top draft picks until we get into the season

voice of reason

i try. i wasnt a fan of lyles anyway but the kid just started so any kind of judgment is premature.

Towns is the only player I see getting a constant double team from game to game

Actually it's been 2 games and you're right no reason to over react BUT it is compelling that none of these Kentucky bigs have jumped out yet while others have.

yellowboy90 wrote:Towns is the only player I see getting a constant double team from game to game

OK4 was being doubled and triple teamed at times..

BRIGGS wrote:Actually it's been 2 games and you're right no reason to over react BUT it is compelling that none of these Kentucky bigs have jumped out yet while others have.

id still take towns over anybody every day of the week...twice on sunday. That said im happy with KP and grant

Means nothing. A handful of summer league games don't mean much. How many times have players destroyed summer league only to disappear during the regular season? How many times have guys played horribly only to go on to become good pro's? The "Kentucky bigs" playing badly means literally nothing .

We should not judge by what we see in summer league. A lot of time I just think it's players trying to get theirs. Those who know they have a roster spot tend to cruise through the games. Those that are fighting for a spot tend to put up shots and try ridiculous things.

The things you can evaluate is NBA size, strength and whether or not you can adjust to the speed of the game...Game play I agree with, but the physical attributes carry over...

StarksEwing1 wrote:

Swishfm3 wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

tj23 wrote:Lyles was never a good rebounder/defender. When he guarded 3's he was too slow, got pushed around by bigs and would nod off all the time.

2/10 from the field...0/3 from the 3...4/11 from the FT line...

Is he really this bad of a shooter??

just one game. Im sure nerves are a factor. Plus its just summer league. Im not ready to claim anything on any of the top draft picks until we get into the season

voice of reason

i try. i wasnt a fan of lyles anyway but the kid just started so any kind of judgment is premature.

No premature judgement...completely understand, but Lyles seemed to have had a cult following as the draft moved along.
The FT shooting is most problematic, but in 2 games he is 5/19 from the field and 8/17 from the FT line.

My rule of thumb for watching rookies, especially as early as SL, is to make special note of the good things they do, especially if they're done the right way, and try to take a more balanced look at the their weaknesses, and determine whether they are due to nerves, being out of shape, lack of ease in a new system, etc., and not because of some significant mechanical or BB IQ issue. You also look at their past history- If a guy who is known for a great jumper is not hitting shots in SL, or a guy known for his passing is not using the judgement he showed in college, I don't get worried.

I would be more worried about players with known flaws prior to the draft who continue to show them in SL, or a guy like Lyles, who was under the radar in many ways, getting all the hype he got before the draft, without actually having proved himself as a bit time player.

Briggs' thread is about his belief that the Kentucky bigs were part of an amazing system that covered up many of their flaws and highlighted their strengths, and that maybe they are not as good as players who were the main focus of opposing defenses whenever they played a college game.

But premature judgement can go both ways...StarksEwing1...it took you one single SL game to declare: Winslow was definetly a steal falling to 10. Maybe he will be, but he has also shown some significant flaws as a player, especially as a shooter, and then you see this in the SL box score for yesterday-DND - GENERAL SORENESS, and you realize that in the past 3 games he's played about 7 minutes of ball, and in the entire SL he's maybe hit about 1 jumper. For me, he has not exceeded expectations, and is actually showing some significant flaws in his game that will be exploited if he doesn't make adjustments.

Kaminsky, Turner, and Johnson might be seen as the "steals" of the draft, at least if you look at the results so far, and maybe Portis will be in that category, but who knows.

Yea I like towns potential but being on a team like Kentucky, nba teams and fans seem to over value them... I viewed towns as a lottery pick but it's pretty risky drafting on potential he's not bust material but could be disappointing in terms of stardom ..I view him as a good player with 2 or three years experience.

he's nba size, athletic,nice touch, can rebound when he wants. But to pick him first when he only averaged 11 a game and looked disinterested and lackadaisical at times ..

Derrick Coleman had all the ability just not the desire to be the star he could have been . I worry that towns might become the new age DC

Of course you can gather information from sl. Right now I see Towns has a little less defensive skill and foot speed with kind of an irregular looking offensive game. Lyles seems to be lost between 3-4 especially when Utah lined him up at 5.wcs game should be the most defined so I would expect him to find his role faster

WaltLongmire wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

Swishfm3 wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

tj23 wrote:Lyles was never a good rebounder/defender. When he guarded 3's he was too slow, got pushed around by bigs and would nod off all the time.

2/10 from the field...0/3 from the 3...4/11 from the FT line...

Is he really this bad of a shooter??

just one game. Im sure nerves are a factor. Plus its just summer league. Im not ready to claim anything on any of the top draft picks until we get into the season

voice of reason

i try. i wasnt a fan of lyles anyway but the kid just started so any kind of judgment is premature.

No premature judgement...completely understand, but Lyles seemed to have had a cult following as the draft moved along.
The FT shooting is most problematic, but in 2 games he is 5/19 from the field and 8/17 from the FT line.

My rule of thumb for watching rookies, especially as early as SL, is to make special note of the good things they do, especially if they're done the right way, and try to take a more balanced look at the their weaknesses, and determine whether they are due to nerves, being out of shape, lack of ease in a new system, etc., and not because of some significant mechanical or BB IQ issue. You also look at their past history- If a guy who is known for a great jumper is not hitting shots in SL, or a guy known for his passing is not using the judgement he showed in college, I don't get worried.

I would be more worried about players with known flaws prior to the draft who continue to show them in SL, or a guy like Lyles, who was under the radar in many ways, getting all the hype he got before the draft, without actually having proved himself as a bit time player.

Briggs' thread is about his belief that the Kentucky bigs were part of an amazing system that covered up many of their flaws and highlighted their strengths, and that maybe they are not as good as players who were the main focus of opposing defenses whenever they played a college game.

But premature judgement can go both ways...StarksEwing1...it took you one single SL game to declare: Winslow was definetly a steal falling to 10. Maybe he will be, but he has also shown some significant flaws as a player, especially as a shooter, and then you see this in the SL box score for yesterday-DND - GENERAL SORENESS, and you realize that in the past 3 games he's played about 7 minutes of ball, and in the entire SL he's maybe hit about 1 jumper. For me, he has not exceeded expectations, and is actually showing some significant flaws in his game that will be exploited if he doesn't make adjustments.

Kaminsky, Turner, and Johnson might be seen as the "steals" of the draft, at least if you look at the results so far, and maybe Portis will be in that category, but who knows.

i have said winslow was a steal since draft....and im nota the only one. Many nba scouts, players, and people with more knowledge than me said winslow dropping to 10 was a gift since he was projected in top 6

i havent looked at his stat lines yet but Towns has been disappointing. EVERY single time down the court he whines to the refs. immortals like tarik black are pushing him out the lane. so far i have seen a SOFT big man who doesnt like to get physical. as a lil "punk" in him

BRIGGS wrote:I have to wonder if some over reliance on their size able teammates might've been an actual dentriment? Trey lyles who I think some here liked even some of the Knicks decision makers who had some say has been brutal. Hasn't rebounded played poor d hasn't shot well can't hit fts. On the other hands guys who were the man so to speak have played well like Portis The best players from Kentucky have easily been the Harrison's

You guys do realize that this is the summer league and these kids are just starting their careers right?? I mean some of you are already predicting how these KIDS will be in the summer league.....the summer league,,,,,it's the summer league and if you haven't heard yet.......it's the summer league. lol