Knicks · We signed Tony Wroten to 3 year contract... (page 8)

mreinman wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

mreinman wrote:

franco12 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

GoNyGoNyGo wrote:

I like it. He plays like a left handed Jeremy Lin and Alexey Shved.

It angers me that people can see this highlight and still say this guy isn't worth it. If he did half the stuff in this highlight he still would be the best guard we've had since Feltons first stint with the Knicks

highlights are so 80's. Have not learned from things like this how not to gauge players?

I looked for a comparable video of Calderon highlights from this year. I couldn't find it.

that argument will help you ace the LSATs.

Just curious. How would you judge a players capability other than highlights? You can watch game film but that is not available to us fans. So other than these highlight films and statistics what else is there?

I would start with stats, injury history, team history, win history, how is he playing now? how did he do for his last team? Who was his last team and why did they let him go? Are they doing better or worse without him? Did he elevate the players around him? etc ...

the last thing I would check is a youtube clip.

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CrushAlot wrote:

mreinman wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

mreinman wrote:

franco12 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

GoNyGoNyGo wrote:

I like it. He plays like a left handed Jeremy Lin and Alexey Shved.

It angers me that people can see this highlight and still say this guy isn't worth it. If he did half the stuff in this highlight he still would be the best guard we've had since Feltons first stint with the Knicks

highlights are so 80's. Have not learned from things like this how not to gauge players?

I looked for a comparable video of Calderon highlights from this year. I couldn't find it.

that argument will help you ace the LSATs.

Just curious. How would you judge a players capability other than highlights? You can watch game film but that is not available to us fans. So other than these highlight films and statistics what else is there?

I would start with stats, injury history, team history, win history, how is he playing now? how did he do for his last team? Who was his last team and why did they let him go? Are they doing better or worse without him? Did he elevate the players around him? etc ...

the last thing I would check is a youtube clip.

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Maybe watching game film helps sometimes.

With regard to Wroten I see a guy that would be the most physically talented guard on the roster even with a repaired ACL. By the way none of the media has seen the guy or know what his current health status is. The Knicks medical staff have a much clearer picture of his status. I'm sure that Phil must be at least somewhat confident in his health to have given him a contract. For all we know he could be much stronger than he was back in December when he was cut.

I hope he's been getting Rehab and getting ready since i'm sure his agent no doubt has been keeping him abreast of the Knicks interest and his need to prepare himself to play either now or this summer. He was actually able to play this season even if he wasn't at full strength. Perhaps the months since have allowed him to get his conditioning work in.

nixluva wrote:

fishmike wrote:this guy might end up being really good. He might end up being nothing at all. Nobody can pretend to predict now, its just throwing poop at the wall and seeing what sticks. he brings size, hops and one really sick handle to the table. He's got some huge holes in his game as mentioned above. If he didnt have huge holes he would not be available for the Knicks to sign.

Except Briggs who will use this as an example of Phil's hatred of small guards, this signing means nothing. He's just a guy the Knicks want to look at. Maybe he works out. Maybe he's gone by next year.

My prediction is 12 pages.

Hey what else is there to talk about.

IMO this is a good thing for this team. We lack athleticism and speed at guard and he's also big and aggressive as well. Dude was starting for the Sixers last year and doing well, before the injury. We can't be so blind as to not see this kid and think we have NO ONE even close to his talent at guard. IMO if he's healthy and coached up I think he can help this team. He had a bunch of games that none of our guards have had.

NO RISK. HIGH REWARD!

His athleticism and how quickly he can drive to the basket will be good for our offense. Obviously he was sitting without a job for a reason which could just be because he was still healing from his knee injury and nobody wanted to sign him without knowing if he was 100% or teams were just turned off by his bad shooting but no matter what it is why don't we just sit back and see what the kid can do for us instead of making judgment against him without even knowing how he'll be in our offense. He can play both guard spots but think he's more of a SG but not sure. Watching some of his highlight tapes he does makes some nice passes. I'm excited to see what he does even though 18/19 isn't really enough games for him to really get this offense down. There's no risk in this signing so everyone just chill and hope for the best.

JrZyHuStLa wrote:Welcome back, Tony Douglas.

Well that's a completely wrong comparison.

nixluva wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:Wroten has had a good deal of time to perfect his jumper since he shot 16% from the college distance 3.

Not sure his stroke and release will ever allow him to be a versatile shooter, and so far the stats back this up. From another site:

Frank
March 7, 2016 at 1:23 pm

His shot distribution from last year is really amazing. He had 434 FGA, 245 of which were in the restricted area. Then he shot 126 3 pointers, leaving just 40 paint/non-RA shots and SEVEN mid-range jumpers. 7 out of 434 shots were midrange shots. that’s astounding, and so not triangular.

Some other not so good stats:

Mike Kurylo
March 7, 2016 at 1:24 pm

Career TS%: .488
Usage%: 28.3
3p%: .231
3p/36: 4.2

Not so good finishing with his off hand, either- lots of awkward finishes when he drives right.

I'm just thinking that guys have to calm down a bit over this guy...but I don't expects folks around here will.

The Knicks are dead last in the league in drives to the basket - 15 drives per game. Every other team is over 20 drives per game. Why is it a bad thing again to get a guy who is really good at that? And his last full season he shot 26% from 3pt range - which is at least an improvement.

He also was forced to play heavy minutes on an absolutely terrible team at age 20 and 21. My guess is that that would give you some bad habits and lead to turnovers and bad shots.

I think looking at stats in a vacuum doesn't always tell you the full story. Turnovers can be limited and helped by playing with better teammates. And shooting can always be improved with practice and age and mechanical adjustments.

Also on this team we have a lot of other aspects already in place, but simply lack the talent at guard to create more easy buckets in transition or to take advantage of the openings this offense creates in terms of driving lanes. There are always openings but you can't hesitate to attack when it's there. Our current guards aren't nearly aggressive enough to take advantage of those openings.

It's not all about jump shooting in this offense. If you look at the plays Shved took advantage of just watch how hard he attacks off Dribble Hand Offs, Screens and Cuts.

newyorker4ever wrote:

nixluva wrote:

fishmike wrote:this guy might end up being really good. He might end up being nothing at all. Nobody can pretend to predict now, its just throwing poop at the wall and seeing what sticks. he brings size, hops and one really sick handle to the table. He's got some huge holes in his game as mentioned above. If he didnt have huge holes he would not be available for the Knicks to sign.

Except Briggs who will use this as an example of Phil's hatred of small guards, this signing means nothing. He's just a guy the Knicks want to look at. Maybe he works out. Maybe he's gone by next year.

My prediction is 12 pages.

Hey what else is there to talk about.

IMO this is a good thing for this team. We lack athleticism and speed at guard and he's also big and aggressive as well. Dude was starting for the Sixers last year and doing well, before the injury. We can't be so blind as to not see this kid and think we have NO ONE even close to his talent at guard. IMO if he's healthy and coached up I think he can help this team. He had a bunch of games that none of our guards have had.

NO RISK. HIGH REWARD!

His athleticism and how quickly he can drive to the basket will be good for our offense. Obviously he was sitting without a job for a reason which could just be because he was still healing from his knee injury and nobody wanted to sign him without knowing if he was 100% or teams were just turned off by his bad shooting but no matter what it is why don't we just sit back and see what the kid can do for us instead of making judgment against him without even knowing how he'll be in our offense. He can play both guard spots but think he's more of a SG but not sure. Watching some of his highlight tapes he does makes some nice passes. I'm excited to see what he does even though 18/19 isn't really enough games for him to really get this offense down. There's no risk in this signing so everyone just chill and hope for the best.

I'm really pulling for him to find success here cuz I think he can help this team to get out of only playing halfcourt ball. There's literally no reason why this team can't get more fast breaks and early offense. Also just plain attacking the rim on a more regular basis. It's the main thrust of the offense with all the cuts and dribble hand offs etc. So if you're guards aren't attacking you're leaving points on the floor.

We don't have a lot of options for adding talent and this is the kind of low risk move that might help. I don't know why the Sixers gave up on him so early but I don't care either. I'm just hoping he can get his career on track here and help this team win games in the future.

SocraticBallin22 wrote:Just heard from a source knowing Wroten's family who said that this deal with the Knicks has been in the works for a while. Knicks were monitoring his rehab and essentially guaranteed him a roster spot at some point in the season. He knew he was coming to the Knicks and wanted to play here all along. Also, he wasn't happy in Philly.

SocraticBallin22 wrote:Just heard from a source knowing Wroten's family who said that this deal with the Knicks has been in the works for a while. Knicks were monitoring his rehab and essentially guaranteed him a roster spot at some point in the season. He knew he was coming to the Knicks and wanted to play here all along. Also, he wasn't happy in Philly.

OK that sounds like a fair statement as to why he was sitting around for a long time.

CrushAlot wrote:

SocraticBallin22 wrote:Just heard from a source knowing Wroten's family who said that this deal with the Knicks has been in the works for a while. Knicks were monitoring his rehab and essentially guaranteed him a roster spot at some point in the season. He knew he was coming to the Knicks and wanted to play here all along. Also, he wasn't happy in Philly.

Wow. Makes sense. He definitely indicated that he wanted to be a knick on twitter on several occasions. Also, if you go by what he posts he seems to be very motivated to prove to the Sixers and teams that passed on him that they made a mistake.

This whole thing with Wroten seemed odd for a very long time. It was crazy with him tweeting and then deleting suggestive tweets that made it seem like he was coming to the Knicks soon. It also seemed odd how Phil kept this spot open as if he had someone in mind all this time. So it all makes sense now and i'm glad it got done and hope this works out well for the Knicks. IMO getting Wroten, who was a 1st rd pick, is just like adding another draft pick IMO. Dude is still so young that it's effectively the same as drafting him. I mean we have Jerian who is actually a bit older than Wroten. So IMO he's basically another young prospect to be developed.

FYI: John Wall right now is the most overrated guard in the league.

CrushAlot wrote:

mreinman wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

mreinman wrote:

franco12 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

GoNyGoNyGo wrote:

I like it. He plays like a left handed Jeremy Lin and Alexey Shved.

It angers me that people can see this highlight and still say this guy isn't worth it. If he did half the stuff in this highlight he still would be the best guard we've had since Feltons first stint with the Knicks

highlights are so 80's. Have not learned from things like this how not to gauge players?

I looked for a comparable video of Calderon highlights from this year. I couldn't find it.

that argument will help you ace the LSATs.

Just curious. How would you judge a players capability other than highlights? You can watch game film but that is not available to us fans. So other than these highlight films and statistics what else is there?

I would start with stats, injury history, team history, win history, how is he playing now? how did he do for his last team? Who was his last team and why did they let him go? Are they doing better or worse without him? Did he elevate the players around him? etc ...

the last thing I would check is a youtube clip.

Javascript is not enabled or there was problem with the URL: https://twitter.com/H_Grove/status/706970534714671104

Click here to view the Tweet

Maybe watching game film helps sometimes.

so your argument against adv stats are defensive stats? We talkin bout defense? No one claims that adv stats for defense or good.

And, as far as game film, of course that can help but not silly youtube clips.

SocraticBallin22 wrote:Just heard from a source knowing Wroten's family who said that this deal with the Knicks has been in the works for a while. Knicks were monitoring his rehab and essentially guaranteed him a roster spot at some point in the season. He knew he was coming to the Knicks and wanted to play here all along. Also, he wasn't happy in Philly.

That's good info, thanks. I'm kinda oddly excited about Wroten. I just feel like he's a real good fit here. I think he will be on the team at the end of next season and in the plans for the future.

callmened wrote:My only concern is the stability of the right knee acl which has been operated twice. That's def something to monitor for a guy who relies on his physical gifts so much

It's a worthy risk given the low cost and no guarantee long term. It's the prototypical low risk but high reward scenario! Aside from the injury issue, I like his talent and fit. Hopefully he works out cuz we can really use his speed and driving ability.

SocraticBallin22 wrote:Just heard from a source knowing Wroten's family who said that this deal with the Knicks has been in the works for a while. Knicks were monitoring his rehab and essentially guaranteed him a roster spot at some point in the season. He knew he was coming to the Knicks and wanted to play here all along. Also, he wasn't happy in Philly.

Thank you for posting. Please stick around.

dk7th wrote:it's going to be rough for him if he can't defend the position. i have seen zero evidence he can.

You can't say there is zero evidence when the dude is blocking shots and stealing the ball in these highlights. It's just a garbage statement when you can blatantly see him make amazing defensive plays. The potential is there and there is plenty of evidence

nixluva wrote:

callmened wrote:My only concern is the stability of the right knee acl which has been operated twice. That's def something to monitor for a guy who relies on his physical gifts so much

It's a worthy risk given the low cost and no guarantee long term. It's the prototypical low risk but high reward scenario! Aside from the injury issue, I like his talent and fit. Hopefully he works out cuz we can really use his speed and driving ability.

The injury is a definite concern. But like Nix pointed out, we're not paying him 20 mil a year. We're paying him basically minimum salary. Can't lose. Only win with this signin .