SocraticBallin22 wrote:The only positive of this deal is the tremendous cap flexibility it brings us for 2017. Think about it: Rose's 20 million off the books. Rolo's 13 million off the books next year, which was a long contract. Calderon off the books. The real free agent class is in 2017. Phil has set us up in that regard. Give him credit for that. I still don't like giving up on Grant but I see the forward thinking in that.
That's the genius of the trade.... Rose is a rental. Grant was given evey chance to succeed and it took him till April as a 23 year old rookie. We all wanted Calderon outta here.... Rolo got us Derrick Rose so hats off to him.
Joakim Noah, or even possibly Dwight Howard or Gasol could fill in for Rolo.... this is some serious exciting shit
earthmansurfer wrote:Holy crap - Getting an injury waiting to happen for a pretty good center on a GREAT contract in Lopez and giving up our 1st round pick from last year?
We get nothing back but a 2nd? Wow, bend over Phil.We must be looking to sign someone big in FA or this is (another) disaster waiting to happen.
That is the only thing I can think of..and I'm also thinking about FAs next year, but...
Rose has 1 year left...what do you do with him next year if he has a decent but not great season. You know the guy will want a max contract. Maybe you get the #8 seed, lose to the Cavs in rnd 1, earn a midrange #1 draft pick, and then you have to debate over signing an injury prone player to a big contract.
Rose is not even a facilitator as a PG.
Hope I get proven wrong, but this does not seem like a wise trade at this point.
we can't have nice things
Don't mind giving up Grant, but I was a fan of Lopez. I suppose the thinking is that he has limited versatility and it's perhaps easier to find a decent rebounding big who can also shoot more from outside. I hope Hernangomez can pick up some slack because I'm not convinced about OQuinn or Seraphim.
Also don't mind that it's a one year trial basically, though it seems we gave up lots of value for a very appealing salary dump for the Bulls. I have no real confidence left in Rose's game or certainly his durability. They must have expectations for Wroten.
But point taken that Rose is still the best player in the trade with something to play for next year, that aspect combined with tons of money next offseason with those players coming out puts us in great position. Maybe they can make some noise this year and make the Knicks more attractive for top FAs next time around.
Overall: low risk trade, with great future set up for moves for the team, some possibility to make some noise this season with good health. Price paid by Knicks was a bit high.
I fully expect to sign a big now this offseason.
Long shot but now let's get Lin here so Hornacek can work some magic.
KP
Melo/Willy
Melo/Dwill
Lin
Rose
Bench Galloway, LT, KOQ & Serafin?
Question is who starts at PF & SF? Do we let Dwill walk and sign a big? Noah, Pau, Hill or someone cheap?
gunsnewing wrote:CrushAlot wrote:WaltLongmire wrote:Just heard it on the radio while I was doing work in the basement.Don't like this trade unless something else is coming over.
I don't understand it at all, if it is true, unless their are other things in the works.
Can anyone tell me why this trade makes sense?
No. I don't get it. Rolo was a really good value signing, and I think Grant was going to have a breakout year.
I don't think the Knicks are expecting Rose to be great. He's expiring and we needed an upgrade at guard. Rose is a huge upgrade over Grant and certainly a major upgrade over Calderon.
And Lopez being included proves Phil did not like how the front court panned out. Can't really fault him though since no one expected KP to be this good this quick. We were talking 2-5yrs for KP to have the kind of year he had as a rookie.
Long shot but now let's get Lin here!
Does KP move to center, now?
Maybe Lopez being expendable had something to do with how KP developed, and how Hornachek wants to run the offense.
GustavBahler wrote:SocraticBallin22 wrote:The only positive of this deal is the tremendous cap flexibility it brings us for 2017. Think about it: Rose's 20 million off the books. Rolo's 13 million off the books next year, which was a long contract. Calderon off the books. The real free agent class is in 2017. Phil has set us up in that regard. Give him credit for that. I still don't like giving up on Grant but I see the forward thinking in that.
All he has to do is put up mediocre numbers, not get hurt, and watch Rose get a long term deal.
Like that Phil is looking long term and not being short-sighted--something all our previous GM's have done. Our cap space and flexibility in 2017 will be tremendous.
Plus Rose has incentive to have monster season on the last year of his contract to try to get another max contract (although don't think Knicks should give it to him).
CrushAlot wrote:GustavBahler wrote:Rose has only played in 39 percent of games since 2012-13 season. Meet the new Isiah, same as the old Isiah.....
Watch him get a long term deal. We had the best frontcourt since Ewing/Oakley and he wants to break that up for Rose?
Or the re-empowered Mills.
Anyone who could have as dismal a career as Mills has had as a front office executive, and still be around to have a part in this doo-doo trade, is very empowered. Still, Phil just gifted one of the best young Centers in this league to his old team, a good prospect in Grant, for what? A big name whose best days are well behind him who can walk after a year. Sounds like Isiah is the one who is really empowered here.
mreinman wrote:nixluva wrote:y2zipper wrote:Moonangie wrote:Oh man. I really hope this is wrong. WTF Phil?!?!?!?!? Have you become a gambler in your old age?This has the signs of a major screw-up. Can anyone get on-board with this move? If so, please explain the upside.
We lose our starting center and PG-of-future for a broken down, former uber-athlete and a second rounder next year. Am I missing something?
There's 2 upsides to this deal:
1. The Knicks get the best player in the deal, which means historically they'll win the trade. If Rose comes back to form this will be a coup and if not, New York has even more cap flexibility.
2. Grant likely isn't very good, and moving him with Lopez and Calderon basically off-sets any money that you take on with Rose coming in. With this in mind, the Knicks can actually target one of the many bigs that are out there in free agency instead of having to make an iffy max offer to a guard.
VERY LOGICAL!!! Once you get past the emotional knee jerk reactions this could have a lot of potential upside in terms of structuring the team for the future. Very interesting.
whew! I feel better now 
say hello to stevie francis 2.0
Even if that's true, it's only for one year and all you lose is Lopez.
jamp wrote:I bet we sign Gasol
Interesting...is he unrestricted?
Does Rose know the Triangle?
SocraticBallin22 wrote:GustavBahler wrote:SocraticBallin22 wrote:The only positive of this deal is the tremendous cap flexibility it brings us for 2017. Think about it: Rose's 20 million off the books. Rolo's 13 million off the books next year, which was a long contract. Calderon off the books. The real free agent class is in 2017. Phil has set us up in that regard. Give him credit for that. I still don't like giving up on Grant but I see the forward thinking in that.
All he has to do is put up mediocre numbers, not get hurt, and watch Rose get a long term deal.
Like that Phil is looking long term and not being short-sighted--something all our previous GM's have done. Our cap space and flexibility in 2017 will be tremendous.
Plus Rose has incentive to have monster season on the last year of his contract to try to get another max contract (although don't think Knicks should give it to him).
Cap room is great, but lots of teams have it. I dont have a problem with Lopez being traded, by himself or part of a deal. Not for a has been PG with a bad attitude who might end up being here for a long time.
anrst wrote:Does Rose know the Triangle?
I don't think they will be playing a lot of the triangle.
They have to make another move for a Center(any big body will do) for this to make sense. Just don't get Dwight, unless it's a 1 year deal only.
We cannot afford to put KP at the 5...Yet. He's destined for the 5, but I don't want him breaking down early, he's not even 21 yet and still growing.
Absolutely positively NO DWIGHT HOWARD please!
Clean wrote:This opens up the possibility that we might actually target Howard now. I got to admit a healthy Rose, Melo, KP and a healthy Howard is a playoff team.
I was ho-hum on Rose. I am vomiting at the prospects of getting Howard. Please don't do it.
y2zipper wrote:mreinman wrote:nixluva wrote:y2zipper wrote:Moonangie wrote:Oh man. I really hope this is wrong. WTF Phil?!?!?!?!? Have you become a gambler in your old age?This has the signs of a major screw-up. Can anyone get on-board with this move? If so, please explain the upside.
We lose our starting center and PG-of-future for a broken down, former uber-athlete and a second rounder next year. Am I missing something?
There's 2 upsides to this deal:
1. The Knicks get the best player in the deal, which means historically they'll win the trade. If Rose comes back to form this will be a coup and if not, New York has even more cap flexibility.
2. Grant likely isn't very good, and moving him with Lopez and Calderon basically off-sets any money that you take on with Rose coming in. With this in mind, the Knicks can actually target one of the many bigs that are out there in free agency instead of having to make an iffy max offer to a guard.
VERY LOGICAL!!! Once you get past the emotional knee jerk reactions this could have a lot of potential upside in terms of structuring the team for the future. Very interesting.
whew! I feel better now
say hello to stevie francis 2.0
Even if that's true, it's only for one year and all you lose is Lopez.
What makes you so sure? I hope you're right.
