We did look more spread out didn't we? I'm still hating the fact thst melo and rose deviate so much from the system to run ISO ball.
nixluva wrote:SupremeCommander wrote:nixluva wrote:SupremeCommander wrote:wow! look at those pictures! !!! ! ! !!! !!!!! look at those exclamations!!! ! !! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If you have NOTHING to add STFU!!!
go!!! eff!!! yourself!!!
If you think you've enlightened anyone -- YOU'RE A MORON!!!
This coming from someone that didn't add a single thing to the thread! If you've got a point then go ahead and make it. Give us your detailed breakdown of why I'm wrong and what you've seen that contradicts what I've posted.
All you did was post pictures! And say that we are spaced out!! Melo played a stretch four!!! weeeeeee!!!!
Congratulations on your superior basketball mind. Is that what you wanted? you're welcome!!!!
SupremeCommander wrote:nixluva wrote:SupremeCommander wrote:nixluva wrote:SupremeCommander wrote:wow! look at those pictures! !!! ! ! !!! !!!!! look at those exclamations!!! ! !! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If you have NOTHING to add STFU!!!
go!!! eff!!! yourself!!!
If you think you've enlightened anyone -- YOU'RE A MORON!!!
This coming from someone that didn't add a single thing to the thread! If you've got a point then go ahead and make it. Give us your detailed breakdown of why I'm wrong and what you've seen that contradicts what I've posted.
All you did was post pictures! And say that we are spaced out!! Melo played a stretch four!!! weeeeeee!!!!
Congratulations on your superior basketball mind. Is that what you wanted? you're welcome!!!!
Martin make mom and dad stop fighting
rose add 1 assist, that so bad it's embarrassing
knicks1248 wrote:rose add 1 assist, that so bad it's embarrassing
Rose had 3 assist, which isn't a great number either..
holfresh wrote:knicks1248 wrote:rose add 1 assist, that so bad it's embarrassing
Rose had 3 assist, which isn't a great number either..
this guy has the ability to make this team so much better if he would pass the damn ball
knicks1248 wrote:holfresh wrote:knicks1248 wrote:rose add 1 assist, that so bad it's embarrassing
Rose had 3 assist, which isn't a great number either..
this guy has the ability to make this team so much better if he would pass the damn ball
Lance and CLee combined were 5-17 last night...The bigger problem with the Knicks is defense not offense..So the Knicks can get better if they played defense...I'm more worried about the 108 points per game we give up than the 4.4 assist per game by Rose..
SupremeCommander wrote:nixluva wrote:SupremeCommander wrote:nixluva wrote:SupremeCommander wrote:wow! look at those pictures! !!! ! ! !!! !!!!! look at those exclamations!!! ! !! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If you have NOTHING to add STFU!!!
go!!! eff!!! yourself!!!
If you think you've enlightened anyone -- YOU'RE A MORON!!!
This coming from someone that didn't add a single thing to the thread! If you've got a point then go ahead and make it. Give us your detailed breakdown of why I'm wrong and what you've seen that contradicts what I've posted.
All you did was post pictures! And say that we are spaced out!! Melo played a stretch four!!! weeeeeee!!!!
Congratulations on your superior basketball mind. Is that what you wanted? you're welcome!!!!
I don't know about you but I do appreciate this type of post from nix, I do know that nix has posted others like it that are a bit more detailed. These are not easy to do and are time consuming.
He's trying to make an effort, maybe it's not for you.
fitzfarm wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:nixluva wrote:I wanted to highlight the points I was making about the way Jeff had the team playing tonight so I took a few stills of the spacing to make it clearer just what he had them doing! If they continue to do this it could change things up for the better!
We all watched the game and we all saw the spacing cause it's not just you that sees it nix like you seem to think. The Bulls defense was really really bad and i don't acre if you think it was the spacing cause if they use that same spacing against a team that does play defense we won't get all the easy baskets we got last night. Now of course i do like a lot of what we did last night and hope to god it carries over into every game from here on out but that win did nothing for me and i don't trust the Knicks any more today then i did before the game last night. Their best player didn't even play last night and they had some guy names Zipster or whatever the heck his name was playing a bunch of minutes last night.
Love that we finally got a win and love that we didn't let them come back on us and love that it looked like we played a little harder on defense but that win didn't do anything for me. Beat some real teams and look good doing it and then maybe it will do something for me.
I agree about not getting to excited with this one win. But let's not forget we rested one of our best players as well so we did this to them short handed as well.
And they were without two of their best players in J.Butler and Miritoc
nixluva wrote:Welpee wrote:nixluva wrote:I wanted to highlight the points I was making about the way Jeff had the team playing tonight so I took a few stills of the spacing to make it clearer just what he had them doing! If they continue to do this it could change things up for the better!
I'm always leery when people present a few seconds of video or photos to prove a point. Not saying your point isn't valid, just that you can pretty much "prove" any point that way.
Man I can get MUCH more detailed than this!!! Trust me there is a reason I was talking so much about what Jeff had them doing. It wasn't a Ton of Triangle all game! He had them playing more Spread Offense with a high PnR and a WIDE OPEN PAINT! That's MDA BALL! Noah setting Picks for Rose, Melo etc. Jeff had them playing more 4 Out Ball and less Post Up or Triangle Spacing.
You saw a lot of KOQ 2 Man with Lee, Holiday or Kuz too. All of them got involved in Give n Go actions that lead to Dunks and Layups or open 3's. Notice in the stills below how the Knicks started in a Spread look and got penetration and dish to a cutter!
I don't really think you need to keep telling everyone what they did when you'd have to be a complete moron not to see it, it's really not that hard to see but just because they played more spread offense doesn't mean it would have worked as well against a good team that plays defense and actually has quality players playing which the Bulls had two quality players playing in DWade and Rolo.
nixluva wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:nixluva wrote:I wanted to highlight the points I was making about the way Jeff had the team playing tonight so I took a few stills of the spacing to make it clearer just what he had them doing! If they continue to do this it could change things up for the better!
We all watched the game and we all saw the spacing cause it's not just you that sees it nix like you seem to think. The Bulls defense was really really bad and i don't acre if you think it was the spacing cause if they use that same spacing against a team that does play defense we won't get all the easy baskets we got last night. Now of course i do like a lot of what we did last night and hope to god it carries over into every game from here on out but that win did nothing for me and i don't trust the Knicks any more today then i did before the game last night. Their best player didn't even play last night and they had some guy names Zipster or whatever the heck his name was playing a bunch of minutes last night.
Love that we finally got a win and love that we didn't let them come back on us and love that it looked like we played a little harder on defense but that win didn't do anything for me. Beat some real teams and look good doing it and then maybe it will do something for me.
What you seem to think is that we don't have offensive firepower when this team plays the right way!!! Perhaps you're just too jaded to recognize that we do have scorers and they need to be put in the right positions and the right style for their talents.
By playing more Spread PnR style offense that fits what these players do BEST! The Knicks were in attack mode rather than trying to read and react in the Triangle all night. They Stretched the Defense with that spacing which made it hard to give help!!!
Also the paint was wide open for a reason! That's not an accident and it wasn't just poor D! This is the same style MDA has used and if you have lethal scoring threats like Rose and Melo who can both work as PnR Ball Handlers, it's going to give a LOT of teams Problems. We won't be losing to bad teams if Jeff keeps them playing this style.
Where the F do you come up with this shyt? You seem to think you're the only one on here that understands the game which isn't even close to the truth and now you say that i seem to think we don't have offensive firepower and don't have guys that can score....hahahaha. Are you kidding right now? You don't have to disrespect other posters on here because they don't agree with everything you're saying. It's really not that hard of a game to understand so you're not the only one that does understand it and it's really not that hard. I used to agree with you a lot on here but not on this one for sure. Did we play better last night? Yep. We're the Bulls just plain bad on defense last night? Absolutely they were. Get a grip man
holfresh wrote:knicks1248 wrote:holfresh wrote:knicks1248 wrote:rose add 1 assist, that so bad it's embarrassing
Rose had 3 assist, which isn't a great number either..
this guy has the ability to make this team so much better if he would pass the damn ball
Lance and CLee combined were 5-17 last night...The bigger problem with the Knicks is defense not offense..So the Knicks can get better if they played defense...I'm more worried about the 108 points per game we give up than the 4.4 assist per game by Rose..
We don't have the players or coaching staff to be a good defensive team by any stretch, but I can't say the same about the offense, which I think we have the talent to put up 110 ppg, which would be more than the 108 we give up
knicks1248 wrote:holfresh wrote:knicks1248 wrote:holfresh wrote:knicks1248 wrote:rose add 1 assist, that so bad it's embarrassing
Rose had 3 assist, which isn't a great number either..
this guy has the ability to make this team so much better if he would pass the damn ball
Lance and CLee combined were 5-17 last night...The bigger problem with the Knicks is defense not offense..So the Knicks can get better if they played defense...I'm more worried about the 108 points per game we give up than the 4.4 assist per game by Rose..
We don't have the players or coaching staff to be a good defensive team by any stretch, but I can't say the same about the offense, which I think we have the talent to put up 110 ppg, which would be more than the 108 we give up
Sounds simple..There are 4 teams in the NBA that score at or more than 110 per game...GS, Cleveland, Raptors, and Houston...Knicks should be the 5th? while trying to run elements of the triangle and other offenses??..OK..
Teams take time to gel..Rose is still trying to figure his way around the team...It's not an instantaneous thing...
holfresh wrote:knicks1248 wrote:holfresh wrote:knicks1248 wrote:holfresh wrote:knicks1248 wrote:rose add 1 assist, that so bad it's embarrassing
Rose had 3 assist, which isn't a great number either..
this guy has the ability to make this team so much better if he would pass the damn ball
Lance and CLee combined were 5-17 last night...The bigger problem with the Knicks is defense not offense..So the Knicks can get better if they played defense...I'm more worried about the 108 points per game we give up than the 4.4 assist per game by Rose..
We don't have the players or coaching staff to be a good defensive team by any stretch, but I can't say the same about the offense, which I think we have the talent to put up 110 ppg, which would be more than the 108 we give up
Sounds simple..There are 4 teams in the NBA that score at or more than 110 per game...GS, Cleveland, Raptors, and Houston...Knicks should be the 5th? while trying to run elements of the triangle and other offenses??..OK..
Teams take time to gel..Rose is still trying to figure his way around the team...It's not an instantaneous thing...
It's not rocket science either, you drive, draw the defense , and kick out to the open man. Rose needs to turn down good shots for better ones, bottom line.
There are only 2 ways for you to increase your scoring, FT's and 3's something he doesn't do consistently at all..
knicks1248 wrote:holfresh wrote:knicks1248 wrote:holfresh wrote:knicks1248 wrote:holfresh wrote:knicks1248 wrote:rose add 1 assist, that so bad it's embarrassing
Rose had 3 assist, which isn't a great number either..
this guy has the ability to make this team so much better if he would pass the damn ball
Lance and CLee combined were 5-17 last night...The bigger problem with the Knicks is defense not offense..So the Knicks can get better if they played defense...I'm more worried about the 108 points per game we give up than the 4.4 assist per game by Rose..
We don't have the players or coaching staff to be a good defensive team by any stretch, but I can't say the same about the offense, which I think we have the talent to put up 110 ppg, which would be more than the 108 we give up
Sounds simple..There are 4 teams in the NBA that score at or more than 110 per game...GS, Cleveland, Raptors, and Houston...Knicks should be the 5th? while trying to run elements of the triangle and other offenses??..OK..
Teams take time to gel..Rose is still trying to figure his way around the team...It's not an instantaneous thing...
It's not rocket science either, you drive, draw the defense , and kick out to the open man. Rose needs to turn down good shots for better ones, bottom line.
There are only 2 ways for you to increase your scoring, FT's and 3's something he doesn't do consistently at all..
He has never been that type of player...Never...He was brought here for his offense by a guy who thought he was bringing players for the triangle...He wasn't brought here to set up the team in a pick and roll offense...
Now you could make some adjustments and build an offense around the talents of your players but thats on the coach...Everyone in the NBA is trying to run the same offense..Our fans want in....
To make more of a contrast to what the Knicks have been running a lot more of in terms of Triangle Spacing. You of course see the Triangle on One Side and the Pinch Post 2 Man on the other. There are other Variations including double screens. But in any event They ran MORE of this in the Philly game and most of the recent losses.
The problem I have with the Triangle spacing for this team is that fewer players are an actual threat to score!!! If you compare that to the Spread 4 Out looks almost everyone is a threat because the guys standing behind the 3pt line are a threat as well as the PnR tandem or Post player near the basket. When the PnR Ball Handler or Post Player attacks that forces help and opens up easy 3's or Drives against the Close Out Defender!!! We have guys like Kuz, Holiday and Lee that can attack the close out or hit the 3. This is a better offense for them.
newyorker4ever wrote:fitzfarm wrote:newyorker4ever wrote:nixluva wrote:I wanted to highlight the points I was making about the way Jeff had the team playing tonight so I took a few stills of the spacing to make it clearer just what he had them doing! If they continue to do this it could change things up for the better!
We all watched the game and we all saw the spacing cause it's not just you that sees it nix like you seem to think. The Bulls defense was really really bad and i don't acre if you think it was the spacing cause if they use that same spacing against a team that does play defense we won't get all the easy baskets we got last night. Now of course i do like a lot of what we did last night and hope to god it carries over into every game from here on out but that win did nothing for me and i don't trust the Knicks any more today then i did before the game last night. Their best player didn't even play last night and they had some guy names Zipster or whatever the heck his name was playing a bunch of minutes last night.
Love that we finally got a win and love that we didn't let them come back on us and love that it looked like we played a little harder on defense but that win didn't do anything for me. Beat some real teams and look good doing it and then maybe it will do something for me.
I agree about not getting to excited with this one win. But let's not forget we rested one of our best players as well so we did this to them short handed as well.
And they were without two of their best players in J.Butler and Miritoc
Butler is one of there best but miritoc is like us being without kuz def would not say he's one of their best players . He's a good player defensively atrocious.
Once again look at how the 4 Out Look helps the Knicks and makes it tough to defend:
Pic 1 you can see that Melo is faster than PF and C that would have to guard him in SPACE! Look at all the targets Melo has with Lee, Kuz in the Corners and Rose roaming.
Pic 2 Noah's man Lopez doesn't want to come out too far on this PnR with Rose cuz he knows he can't stay with Rose and plus Rose is not a Jump shooter, but Rose is too fast with that much space he can't be stopped. Defenders don't want to leave Melo or Lee and LT is right under the basket.
Pic 3 Melo is trailing and Gibson knows it so he's kind of stuck. Rose can attack his defender if the ball is passed with RoLo distracted by the PnR. LT is in a great spot in the Corner.
All of this is IMO better than when this team is in Triangle and we are pretty much looking for Post Ups by Melo or KP and the defense can focus on stopping Melo and the opposing Center can get set in the paint to defend the basket. Help defenders are closer to being able to help and the paint is clogged so our guards like Rose can't drive as easily.
I just watched the Game again and 28 of the Knicks 44 made baskets came out of 4 Out Style sets. Most were started with a High PnR and I saw no Pure Triangle sets. This was a major shift away from the Triangle and can't be accidental. It's literally what i've been screaming for Jeff to do and I hope he sticks with this. It's clearly more PnR from Melo than we've seen in recent times.
nixluva wrote:I just watched the Game again and 28 of the Knicks 44 made baskets came out of 4 Out Style sets. Most were started with a High PnR and I saw no Pure Triangle sets. This was a major shift away from the Triangle and can't be accidental. It's literally what i've been screaming for Jeff to do and I hope he sticks with this. It's clearly more PnR from Melo than we've seen in recent times.
When the rest of the board kept telling you we need more PNR last season, you couldn't react to it positively. I don't care about how many screenshots you post. Anyone who has watched even the first 10-15 games of the season will concede that the triangle is not a fit for these players. As far as Jeff running more PNR than anything else...it may be a recent occurrence because Phil may have finally conceded to Jeff that we can't play triangle with these guys that he himself brought in.
Cartman718 wrote:nixluva wrote:I just watched the Game again and 28 of the Knicks 44 made baskets came out of 4 Out Style sets. Most were started with a High PnR and I saw no Pure Triangle sets. This was a major shift away from the Triangle and can't be accidental. It's literally what i've been screaming for Jeff to do and I hope he sticks with this. It's clearly more PnR from Melo than we've seen in recent times.
When the rest of the board kept telling you we need more PNR last season, you couldn't react to it positively. I don't care about how many screenshots you post. Anyone who has watched even the first 10-15 games of the season will concede that the triangle is not a fit for these players. As far as Jeff running more PNR than anything else...it may be a recent occurrence because Phil may have finally conceded to Jeff that we can't play triangle with these guys that he himself brought in.
You misunderstood what I was saying! I actually pointed out that you can run PnR out of the Triangle in addition to 4 Out!!! I even posted images to PROVE how easy it is to do. Only change is to move one forward out of the Pinch Post and then you have a 4 Out look.
In fact Tex Winter had a 4 Out look in his playbook in his own hand writing. He made it easy to flow in and out of that look at any time. THAT is what I was saying! I'm not against PnR ball which you would know from my support of MDA's offense!
Just cuz guys didn't follow what I've been saying doesn't mean I've changed my views. Also I felt with Rose, Noah, Jennings added it made more sense to run MORE PnR than pure Triangle with this team and Jeff talked about doing that from the start.
