Knicks · Would This LAC-NOP-NYK Deal Be Feasible? (page 1)
That being said, why don't we couple the veterans that the Clippers include in a Melo deal, with our veterans and send them to the Pelicans for their unprotected first round pick in this years draft? The Pelicans are in reach of the playoffs and with Dell Demps on the hot seat (and provided he still has any autonomy with the team), I could see them making a foolhardy deal that foregoes future promise to serve immediate needs. It'd involve a lot of moving parts due to how funky the salaries are but given the respective needs of the teams involved, I could see something like this working....
NYK Trades: Carmelo Anthony, Kyle O'Quinn, Courtney Lee, Lance Thomas and Brandon Jennings
NYK Recieves: Austin Rivers, Tyreke Evans, Omer Asik, Alexis Ajinca, Wesley Johnson, NOPs 2017 unprotected first round pick and LACs 2021 first round pick
LAC Trades: Austin Rivers, Jamal Crawford, Wesley Johnson and a 2021 first round pick
LAC Recieves: Carmelo Anthony and Langston Galloway
NOP Trades: Tyreke Evans, Omer Asik, Alexis Ajinca and Langston Galloway
NOP Recieves: Courtney Lee, Kyle O'Quinn, Jamal Crawford, Lance Thomas and Brandon Jennings
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tra...
The Clippers would get their man, the Pelicans would vastly improve their talent base (while dumping a dubious contract like Asik) and the Knicks would get a degree of financial flexibility with Tyreke's expirer and two first round picks. I don't like how large the deal would be the spirit of it would make sense.
As for our end of the deal, I really think that Pelicans pick will be valuable because they'd likely miss the playoffs anyway given the number of new faces they'd have to integrate. And we'd be so bad in the deals aftermath that I could easily see us having a top-4 selection with our own pick. That'd give us the opportunity to either trade up even further if one of the other teams values quantity over quality or to remain at our respective positions and see if we can yield a running mate for Porzingis with one of the picks. If this draft is every bit as deep as they say it is, the sacrifice of punting on this season would be worth it. It'd be incredible if we could walk away with BOTH a Josh Jackson and Dennis Smith Jr.
NardDogNation wrote:The Clippers want Melo without giving up a core piece. The Pelicans- since drafting Anthony Davis- want veterans capable of helping them make a playoff push. The Knicks should want an additional draft pick and to rebuild.That being said, why don't we couple the veterans that the Clippers include in a Melo deal, with our veterans and send them to the Pelicans for their unprotected first round pick in this years draft? The Pelicans are in reach of the playoffs and with Dell Demps on the hot seat (and provided he still has any autonomy with the team), I could see them making a foolhardy deal that foregoes future promise to serve immediate needs. It'd involve a lot of moving parts due to how funky the salaries are but given the respective needs of the teams involved, I could see something like this working....
NYK Trades: Carmelo Anthony, Kyle O'Quinn, Courtney Lee, Lance Thomas and Brandon Jennings
NYK Recieves: Austin Rivers, Tyreke Evans, Omer Asik, Alexis Ajinca, Wesley Johnson, NOPs 2017 unprotected first round pick and LACs 2021 first round pickLAC Trades: Austin Rivers, Jamal Crawford, Wesley Johnson and a 2021 first round pick
LAC Recieves: Carmelo Anthony and Langston GallowayNOP Trades: Tyreke Evans, Omer Asik, Alexis Ajinca and Langston Galloway
NOP Recieves: Courtney Lee, Kyle O'Quinn, Jamal Crawford, Lance Thomas and Brandon Jenningshttp://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tra...
The Clippers would get their man, the Pelicans would vastly improve their talent base (while dumping a dubious contract like Asik) and the Knicks would get a degree of financial flexibility with Tyreke's expirer and two first round picks. I don't like how large the deal would be the spirit of it would make sense.
As for our end of the deal, I really think that Pelicans pick will be valuable because they'd likely miss the playoffs anyway given the number of new faces they'd have to integrate. And we'd be so bad in the deals aftermath that I could easily see us having a top-4 selection with our own pick. That'd give us the opportunity to either trade up even further if one of the other teams values quantity over quality or to remain at our respective positions and see if we can yield a running mate for Porzingis with one of the picks. If this draft is every bit as deep as they say it is, the sacrifice of punting on this season would be worth it. It'd be incredible if we could walk away with BOTH a Josh Jackson and Dennis Smith Jr.
Asik's contract is horrible- 3 or 4 more years at over $10mil per. Wes Johnson is another $6mil for the next two seasons after this- that's over $16mil tied up in trash
NardDogNation wrote:
NYK Trades: Carmelo Anthony, Kyle O'Quinn, Courtney Lee, Lance Thomas and Brandon Jennings
NYK Recieves: Austin Rivers, Tyreke Evans, Omer Asik, Alexis Ajinca, Wesley Johnson, NOPs 2017 unprotected first round pick and LACs 2021 first round pickLAC Trades: Austin Rivers, Jamal Crawford, Wesley Johnson and a 2021 first round pick
LAC Recieves: Carmelo Anthony and Langston GallowayNOP Trades: Tyreke Evans, Omer Asik, Alexis Ajinca and Langston Galloway
NOP Recieves: Courtney Lee, Kyle O'Quinn, Jamal Crawford, Lance Thomas and Brandon Jennings
I'll say this much, I've seen a decent number of you trade proposals over a few years, and I'd wager most of yours are 10,000 times more pragmatic and multi-faceted than just about every other trade proposal posts I've seen here. I appreciate that you are taking into account what all teams are needing, what they are willing to do and looking for a practical "Win/Win" where all sides can justify the deal to their fanbases and ownership.
I'm not sure NOP makes this deal, it's unclear if Demps is already cycled out of the power structure already, and I think any pick the Knicks get will be protected ( i.e. lottery protected and likely to covert to two 2nd rounders after X years of not vesting as a first) but I can see a core of this working on some level.
While NOP would like to dump Asik, I'm not sure they'd take on both Crawford and Lee together ( I don't vibe on Lee like some others here do) I also am not sure they move Ajinca.
I do appreciate that you are factoring in, with a trade kicker, that the Knicks will likely have to absorb at least one bad contract to get Melo off the roster.
I appreciate your trade proposals. They open up true critical thought on the process. I wish others would engage in the same way. Thanks.
NardDogNation wrote:The Clippers want Melo without giving up a core piece. The Pelicans- since drafting Anthony Davis- want veterans capable of helping them make a playoff push. The Knicks should want an additional draft pick and to rebuild.That being said, why don't we couple the veterans that the Clippers include in a Melo deal, with our veterans and send them to the Pelicans for their unprotected first round pick in this years draft? The Pelicans are in reach of the playoffs and with Dell Demps on the hot seat (and provided he still has any autonomy with the team), I could see them making a foolhardy deal that foregoes future promise to serve immediate needs. It'd involve a lot of moving parts due to how funky the salaries are but given the respective needs of the teams involved, I could see something like this working....
NYK Trades: Carmelo Anthony, Kyle O'Quinn, Courtney Lee, Lance Thomas and Brandon Jennings
NYK Recieves: Austin Rivers, Tyreke Evans, Omer Asik, Alexis Ajinca, Wesley Johnson, NOPs 2017 unprotected first round pick and LACs 2021 first round pickLAC Trades: Austin Rivers, Jamal Crawford, Wesley Johnson and a 2021 first round pick
LAC Recieves: Carmelo Anthony and Langston GallowayNOP Trades: Tyreke Evans, Omer Asik, Alexis Ajinca and Langston Galloway
NOP Recieves: Courtney Lee, Kyle O'Quinn, Jamal Crawford, Lance Thomas and Brandon Jenningshttp://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tra...
The Clippers would get their man, the Pelicans would vastly improve their talent base (while dumping a dubious contract like Asik) and the Knicks would get a degree of financial flexibility with Tyreke's expirer and two first round picks. I don't like how large the deal would be the spirit of it would make sense.
As for our end of the deal, I really think that Pelicans pick will be valuable because they'd likely miss the playoffs anyway given the number of new faces they'd have to integrate. And we'd be so bad in the deals aftermath that I could easily see us having a top-4 selection with our own pick. That'd give us the opportunity to either trade up even further if one of the other teams values quantity over quality or to remain at our respective positions and see if we can yield a running mate for Porzingis with one of the picks. If this draft is every bit as deep as they say it is, the sacrifice of punting on this season would be worth it. It'd be incredible if we could walk away with BOTH a Josh Jackson and Dennis Smith Jr.
Ewwwwwwwww, no thank you.
smackeddog wrote:NardDogNation wrote:The Clippers want Melo without giving up a core piece. The Pelicans- since drafting Anthony Davis- want veterans capable of helping them make a playoff push. The Knicks should want an additional draft pick and to rebuild.That being said, why don't we couple the veterans that the Clippers include in a Melo deal, with our veterans and send them to the Pelicans for their unprotected first round pick in this years draft? The Pelicans are in reach of the playoffs and with Dell Demps on the hot seat (and provided he still has any autonomy with the team), I could see them making a foolhardy deal that foregoes future promise to serve immediate needs. It'd involve a lot of moving parts due to how funky the salaries are but given the respective needs of the teams involved, I could see something like this working....
NYK Trades: Carmelo Anthony, Kyle O'Quinn, Courtney Lee, Lance Thomas and Brandon Jennings
NYK Recieves: Austin Rivers, Tyreke Evans, Omer Asik, Alexis Ajinca, Wesley Johnson, NOPs 2017 unprotected first round pick and LACs 2021 first round pickLAC Trades: Austin Rivers, Jamal Crawford, Wesley Johnson and a 2021 first round pick
LAC Recieves: Carmelo Anthony and Langston GallowayNOP Trades: Tyreke Evans, Omer Asik, Alexis Ajinca and Langston Galloway
NOP Recieves: Courtney Lee, Kyle O'Quinn, Jamal Crawford, Lance Thomas and Brandon Jenningshttp://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tra...
The Clippers would get their man, the Pelicans would vastly improve their talent base (while dumping a dubious contract like Asik) and the Knicks would get a degree of financial flexibility with Tyreke's expirer and two first round picks. I don't like how large the deal would be the spirit of it would make sense.
As for our end of the deal, I really think that Pelicans pick will be valuable because they'd likely miss the playoffs anyway given the number of new faces they'd have to integrate. And we'd be so bad in the deals aftermath that I could easily see us having a top-4 selection with our own pick. That'd give us the opportunity to either trade up even further if one of the other teams values quantity over quality or to remain at our respective positions and see if we can yield a running mate for Porzingis with one of the picks. If this draft is every bit as deep as they say it is, the sacrifice of punting on this season would be worth it. It'd be incredible if we could walk away with BOTH a Josh Jackson and Dennis Smith Jr.
Asik's contract is horrible- 3 or 4 more years at over $10mil per. Wes Johnson is another $6mil for the next two seasons after this- that's over $16mil tied up in trash
That's exactly why I'd demand the Pelican's (probable) lottery pick in THIS years draft. You got to give to take in this league and that pick is a mighty big "take" considering what people are saying about the top-tier players that are projected to be in the draft. Besides, if we are rebuilding, what do we really need with max cap space anyway? What big ticket free agents are we signing especially with the change in the CBA that has increased incentives for players to stay with their original teams?
Delving into the contracts themselves though, Wesley Johnson is a year shorter and about $1 million cheaper than Lance Thomas, which is why I'd structure the deal this way. Because of that, I only feel that Asik is the only "bad" contract and even so, it is only about $9 million of a $110 million cap. We could survive with it on our roster....or stretch it if things become an issue.
EnySpree wrote:Trade is very ambitious but it's interesting. I can't see the Pelicans giving up their pick for basically nothing. Otherwise deal is not bad. I like the idea of a Rivers/Evans back court.
The Pelicans were ready to give up CP3 for the ghost of Lamar Odom and fossils of Luis Scola and Kevin Martin. With the same GM- Dell Demps- at the helm, I wouldn't be surprised if the pick comes into play if it involved veterans that could augment their "core" for a playoff push this season. And with Demps on the hotseat, I think it makes that type of scenario all the more feasible.
And I disagree with the characterization of our outgoing package as being "nothing". 3-and-D guys are in high demand in this league and we'd be giving them two (Courtney Lee and Lance Thomas) that are still in their prime at BOTH wing positions. The cherry on top is that both have been relatively healthy throughout their careers AND are locked into long-term cap friendly deals that will allow the Pelicans to build the rest of their team. Also, Kyle O'Quinn is no slouch at the 5 spot and allows them to seeminglessly move Anthony Davis between the 4 and 5 spots depending on the matchups. That type of ability is rare to find in big men and especially important in helping to preserve an injury-prone Anthony Davis. Are they getting any stars in the deal that can carry the team? No. But there is a ton of value there as a supporting cast for a core.
I've never been a big fan of Tyreke Evans but I could see he and Rivers being something of a homeless man's Eric Bledsoe-Goran Dragic: Evans' ability to rebound and push as well as iso- is reminiscent of Eric and Rivers' ability to space the floor and move without the ball reminds me a bit of Dragic in the Suns' system. With Hornancek now our coach, I could see him getting a lot more out of those guys than most would expect.
newyorker4ever wrote:NardDogNation wrote:The Clippers want Melo without giving up a core piece. The Pelicans- since drafting Anthony Davis- want veterans capable of helping them make a playoff push. The Knicks should want an additional draft pick and to rebuild.That being said, why don't we couple the veterans that the Clippers include in a Melo deal, with our veterans and send them to the Pelicans for their unprotected first round pick in this years draft? The Pelicans are in reach of the playoffs and with Dell Demps on the hot seat (and provided he still has any autonomy with the team), I could see them making a foolhardy deal that foregoes future promise to serve immediate needs. It'd involve a lot of moving parts due to how funky the salaries are but given the respective needs of the teams involved, I could see something like this working....
NYK Trades: Carmelo Anthony, Kyle O'Quinn, Courtney Lee, Lance Thomas and Brandon Jennings
NYK Recieves: Austin Rivers, Tyreke Evans, Omer Asik, Alexis Ajinca, Wesley Johnson, NOPs 2017 unprotected first round pick and LACs 2021 first round pickLAC Trades: Austin Rivers, Jamal Crawford, Wesley Johnson and a 2021 first round pick
LAC Recieves: Carmelo Anthony and Langston GallowayNOP Trades: Tyreke Evans, Omer Asik, Alexis Ajinca and Langston Galloway
NOP Recieves: Courtney Lee, Kyle O'Quinn, Jamal Crawford, Lance Thomas and Brandon Jenningshttp://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tra...
The Clippers would get their man, the Pelicans would vastly improve their talent base (while dumping a dubious contract like Asik) and the Knicks would get a degree of financial flexibility with Tyreke's expirer and two first round picks. I don't like how large the deal would be the spirit of it would make sense.
As for our end of the deal, I really think that Pelicans pick will be valuable because they'd likely miss the playoffs anyway given the number of new faces they'd have to integrate. And we'd be so bad in the deals aftermath that I could easily see us having a top-4 selection with our own pick. That'd give us the opportunity to either trade up even further if one of the other teams values quantity over quality or to remain at our respective positions and see if we can yield a running mate for Porzingis with one of the picks. If this draft is every bit as deep as they say it is, the sacrifice of punting on this season would be worth it. It'd be incredible if we could walk away with BOTH a Josh Jackson and Dennis Smith Jr.
Ewwwwwwwww, no thank you.
You're averse to a second (probable) lottery pick?
dacash wrote:very ambitious ,very nicely done. trying to satisfy everyone wont be easy this atleast tries. but are the players we get back that useful or easy to flip?to shed melos big salary and add more that wont be off the books or players that arent as useful as him may hurt us
Evans is an expirer but we'd be stuck with Asik and Wesley Johnson who are basically deadweight. Even so, Asik and Johnson together account for just $15 million of $110 million cap over the next 3 years. Besides, we don't necessarily need to play Asik considering the promise we've seen from Willy Hernangomez, Mindy Kuzminskas and Marshall Plumlee. And when you'd factor in that the Pelicans would be getting us a second first round pick in a deep draft class, no bad contract should be a deterrent. It's not like we'd need max cap space anyway since we'd be rebuilding and focusing on developing our young guys.
TripleThreat wrote:NardDogNation wrote:
NYK Trades: Carmelo Anthony, Kyle O'Quinn, Courtney Lee, Lance Thomas and Brandon Jennings
NYK Recieves: Austin Rivers, Tyreke Evans, Omer Asik, Alexis Ajinca, Wesley Johnson, NOPs 2017 unprotected first round pick and LACs 2021 first round pickLAC Trades: Austin Rivers, Jamal Crawford, Wesley Johnson and a 2021 first round pick
LAC Recieves: Carmelo Anthony and Langston GallowayNOP Trades: Tyreke Evans, Omer Asik, Alexis Ajinca and Langston Galloway
NOP Recieves: Courtney Lee, Kyle O'Quinn, Jamal Crawford, Lance Thomas and Brandon Jennings
I'll say this much, I've seen a decent number of you trade proposals over a few years, and I'd wager most of yours are 10,000 times more pragmatic and multi-faceted than just about every other trade proposal posts I've seen here. I appreciate that you are taking into account what all teams are needing, what they are willing to do and looking for a practical "Win/Win" where all sides can justify the deal to their fanbases and ownership.I'm not sure NOP makes this deal, it's unclear if Demps is already cycled out of the power structure already, and I think any pick the Knicks get will be protected ( i.e. lottery protected and likely to covert to two 2nd rounders after X years of not vesting as a first) but I can see a core of this working on some level.
While NOP would like to dump Asik, I'm not sure they'd take on both Crawford and Lee together ( I don't vibe on Lee like some others here do) I also am not sure they move Ajinca.
I do appreciate that you are factoring in, with a trade kicker, that the Knicks will likely have to absorb at least one bad contract to get Melo off the roster.
I appreciate your trade proposals. They open up true critical thought on the process. I wish others would engage in the same way. Thanks.
That remains the big question and only something that could be answered by people in those circles. But if Demps still has the autonomy to make decisions, I remain confident that he'd be willing to do something stupid for the sake of it. This is the same man that thought it was a great idea to trade one of the best PGs of all-time for Kevin Martin, Luis Scola and Lamar Odom before David Stern intervened. This is also the same man that thought it was a good idea to trade a first round pick for the right to later overpay Omer Asik, a player that had no market and who- because he refused to play since he was no longer starting- had no opportunity to build a market. Demps simply can't see the forest from between the trees and so I think he'd be the type of guy that would jump at the opportunity to add two 3-and-D players (Courtney Lee and Lance Thomas) as well as the best big that Anthony Davis would have played with to date in Kyle O'Quinn. If they retain Jrue Holiday, I think those three are a reasonable upgrsde over the current crew they have around their core of Davis and Holiday.
As for the particulars of the deal, I know Jamal Crawford's time may have come and gone but he is still a maestro with the ball in his hands and a good shooter. He'd only be a stopgap until they figure out what they are doing with Buddy Hield off the bench. And while his play might not translate to actual wins, his theatrics are electrifying and can at least interest a waning fan base that has not been showing up to games or purchasing team paraphernalia. As a side, I think O'Quinn is a notable upgrade over Ajinca.
I also appreciate the kind words. I didn't want that to get lost in my response, so I saved it until the end.