Knicks · The triangle Mutiny....... (page 3)
holfresh wrote:nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:I think Melo, KP, BJ and Lee wants Hornacek to coach his offense and run the team...Noah is loyal to Phil and Rose just doesn't care about anything but getting his next contract...I think Rose told Phil he doesn't have a problem running the triangle in his exit interviews...Phil said he was surprised that Rose said he wants to be back...Rose will ally with Noah in Phil's camp...Phil actually seems smittened by Rose at the press conference..Rose got what he wanted, Phil speaking nicely about him and that will drive his price up in free agency to other suitors...
The Rookies don't care and are just trying to make the team...
This is probably true but KP was the one that came out vociferously in favor of using more Triangle. No one made KP say that he LIKES the Triangle. We can understand that BJ didn't like the Triangle, never understood it and never ran it. I think CLee eventually came around and you could see his game expanding later in the year. CLee was more active coming off Curls and used his dribble penetration much more aggressively. He looked like he had finally got the hang of things.Melo mostly posts up in a Pinch Post situation so I don't know why he'd even complain about the Triangle. His game would actually fit in perfectly except that he stopped the ball. If Melo took more of what the offense gave him rather than forcing things he'd be a much better team player. Just keep the ball moving and use more of the motion to get more catch and shoot looks. Go quicker rather than always stopping the action.
I think you are looking at it all wrong...The point wasn't that KP endorsed the triangle, he is asking for consistency...Phil offered the job to Hornacek with the understanding that Hornacek will run his system and tenets of the triangle..Phil changed his mind and switch to triangle only in season...It caused confusion among the players..Let's face it, Hornacek is weak and will do whatever Phil says...The team started winning and Phil wanted his way...Which is running the triangle fully...Hornacek folded and the players who supported him wasn't happy...Melo at that time said Hornacek should have kept his system..Then the posse thing erupted around that time, Melo took a shot at Phil saying he didn't understand what Phil was saying..
The meeting of Nov 20th was to re emphasis Hornacek style of play which Phil said nothing and accepted or so it seemed..The players said Phil took it well...Then Phil targeted Melo as being the guy that wasn't buying in and holding the ball during the Knicks mini-hot streak...Then the CBS news story and the Rosen hit job followed by Phil's writer in LA..It was all BS...That's where Phil lost KP..Phil is dirty and plays dirty...Noah doesn't care because no one else would have given him that contract...Rose wants to get overpaid too and tells Phil he wants to return to the triangle...Phil is looking for players in his corner...
So in my opinion, KP wanted consistency not necessarily the triangle...He was saying if that was the system, Phil should have been open about his intentions from the start...Which he wasn't...OK just so we're clear the Knicks only worked on more Triangle Fundamentals but NEVER Trashed Jeff's Offense completely. In fact if you go watch the games after the move to reinstall some Triangle you will notice that it NEVER got to 100% Pure Triangle. This is just not True!
KP and the kids went on to really learn and grasp Jeff's version of the Triangle!!! It's actually pretty good stuff and Phil approves! I don't think the Media or some fans realize what the Knicks have been running on Offense.
Yeah..KP seems thrilled..
You REALLY think KP is upset about the team running Jeff's version of the Triangle??? You really bough the Woj BS Hook Line and Sinker!!! Woj was wrong and he provided no proof for his rumors.
Meanwhile the Video evidence shows KP and the younger players were getting the hang of things! Not to mention KP saying he likes the Triangle!
nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:I think Melo, KP, BJ and Lee wants Hornacek to coach his offense and run the team...Noah is loyal to Phil and Rose just doesn't care about anything but getting his next contract...I think Rose told Phil he doesn't have a problem running the triangle in his exit interviews...Phil said he was surprised that Rose said he wants to be back...Rose will ally with Noah in Phil's camp...Phil actually seems smittened by Rose at the press conference..Rose got what he wanted, Phil speaking nicely about him and that will drive his price up in free agency to other suitors...
The Rookies don't care and are just trying to make the team...
This is probably true but KP was the one that came out vociferously in favor of using more Triangle. No one made KP say that he LIKES the Triangle. We can understand that BJ didn't like the Triangle, never understood it and never ran it. I think CLee eventually came around and you could see his game expanding later in the year. CLee was more active coming off Curls and used his dribble penetration much more aggressively. He looked like he had finally got the hang of things.Melo mostly posts up in a Pinch Post situation so I don't know why he'd even complain about the Triangle. His game would actually fit in perfectly except that he stopped the ball. If Melo took more of what the offense gave him rather than forcing things he'd be a much better team player. Just keep the ball moving and use more of the motion to get more catch and shoot looks. Go quicker rather than always stopping the action.
I think you are looking at it all wrong...The point wasn't that KP endorsed the triangle, he is asking for consistency...Phil offered the job to Hornacek with the understanding that Hornacek will run his system and tenets of the triangle..Phil changed his mind and switch to triangle only in season...It caused confusion among the players..Let's face it, Hornacek is weak and will do whatever Phil says...The team started winning and Phil wanted his way...Which is running the triangle fully...Hornacek folded and the players who supported him wasn't happy...Melo at that time said Hornacek should have kept his system..Then the posse thing erupted around that time, Melo took a shot at Phil saying he didn't understand what Phil was saying..
The meeting of Nov 20th was to re emphasis Hornacek style of play which Phil said nothing and accepted or so it seemed..The players said Phil took it well...Then Phil targeted Melo as being the guy that wasn't buying in and holding the ball during the Knicks mini-hot streak...Then the CBS news story and the Rosen hit job followed by Phil's writer in LA..It was all BS...That's where Phil lost KP..Phil is dirty and plays dirty...Noah doesn't care because no one else would have given him that contract...Rose wants to get overpaid too and tells Phil he wants to return to the triangle...Phil is looking for players in his corner...
So in my opinion, KP wanted consistency not necessarily the triangle...He was saying if that was the system, Phil should have been open about his intentions from the start...Which he wasn't...OK just so we're clear the Knicks only worked on more Triangle Fundamentals but NEVER Trashed Jeff's Offense completely. In fact if you go watch the games after the move to reinstall some Triangle you will notice that it NEVER got to 100% Pure Triangle. This is just not True!
KP and the kids went on to really learn and grasp Jeff's version of the Triangle!!! It's actually pretty good stuff and Phil approves! I don't think the Media or some fans realize what the Knicks have been running on Offense.
Yeah..KP seems thrilled..You REALLY think KP is upset about the team running Jeff's version of the Triangle??? You really bough the Woj BS Hook Line and Sinker!!! Woj was wrong and he provided no proof for his rumors.
Meanwhile the Video evidence shows KP and the younger players were getting the hang of things! Not to mention KP saying he likes the Triangle!
Why do you insist on promoting propaganda?
holfresh wrote:nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:I think Melo, KP, BJ and Lee wants Hornacek to coach his offense and run the team...Noah is loyal to Phil and Rose just doesn't care about anything but getting his next contract...I think Rose told Phil he doesn't have a problem running the triangle in his exit interviews...Phil said he was surprised that Rose said he wants to be back...Rose will ally with Noah in Phil's camp...Phil actually seems smittened by Rose at the press conference..Rose got what he wanted, Phil speaking nicely about him and that will drive his price up in free agency to other suitors...
The Rookies don't care and are just trying to make the team...
This is probably true but KP was the one that came out vociferously in favor of using more Triangle. No one made KP say that he LIKES the Triangle. We can understand that BJ didn't like the Triangle, never understood it and never ran it. I think CLee eventually came around and you could see his game expanding later in the year. CLee was more active coming off Curls and used his dribble penetration much more aggressively. He looked like he had finally got the hang of things.Melo mostly posts up in a Pinch Post situation so I don't know why he'd even complain about the Triangle. His game would actually fit in perfectly except that he stopped the ball. If Melo took more of what the offense gave him rather than forcing things he'd be a much better team player. Just keep the ball moving and use more of the motion to get more catch and shoot looks. Go quicker rather than always stopping the action.
I think you are looking at it all wrong...The point wasn't that KP endorsed the triangle, he is asking for consistency...Phil offered the job to Hornacek with the understanding that Hornacek will run his system and tenets of the triangle..Phil changed his mind and switch to triangle only in season...It caused confusion among the players..Let's face it, Hornacek is weak and will do whatever Phil says...The team started winning and Phil wanted his way...Which is running the triangle fully...Hornacek folded and the players who supported him wasn't happy...Melo at that time said Hornacek should have kept his system..Then the posse thing erupted around that time, Melo took a shot at Phil saying he didn't understand what Phil was saying..
The meeting of Nov 20th was to re emphasis Hornacek style of play which Phil said nothing and accepted or so it seemed..The players said Phil took it well...Then Phil targeted Melo as being the guy that wasn't buying in and holding the ball during the Knicks mini-hot streak...Then the CBS news story and the Rosen hit job followed by Phil's writer in LA..It was all BS...That's where Phil lost KP..Phil is dirty and plays dirty...Noah doesn't care because no one else would have given him that contract...Rose wants to get overpaid too and tells Phil he wants to return to the triangle...Phil is looking for players in his corner...
So in my opinion, KP wanted consistency not necessarily the triangle...He was saying if that was the system, Phil should have been open about his intentions from the start...Which he wasn't...OK just so we're clear the Knicks only worked on more Triangle Fundamentals but NEVER Trashed Jeff's Offense completely. In fact if you go watch the games after the move to reinstall some Triangle you will notice that it NEVER got to 100% Pure Triangle. This is just not True!
KP and the kids went on to really learn and grasp Jeff's version of the Triangle!!! It's actually pretty good stuff and Phil approves! I don't think the Media or some fans realize what the Knicks have been running on Offense.
Yeah..KP seems thrilled..You REALLY think KP is upset about the team running Jeff's version of the Triangle??? You really bough the Woj BS Hook Line and Sinker!!! Woj was wrong and he provided no proof for his rumors.
Meanwhile the Video evidence shows KP and the younger players were getting the hang of things! Not to mention KP saying he likes the Triangle!Why do you insist on promoting propaganda?
Until KP makes a statement there is no proof he was upset about the Triangle coming back. Why don't you put up or shut up? Where's your proof about the KP being upset about the Knicks Offense? Haven't seen anything yet regarding this.
nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:I think Melo, KP, BJ and Lee wants Hornacek to coach his offense and run the team...Noah is loyal to Phil and Rose just doesn't care about anything but getting his next contract...I think Rose told Phil he doesn't have a problem running the triangle in his exit interviews...Phil said he was surprised that Rose said he wants to be back...Rose will ally with Noah in Phil's camp...Phil actually seems smittened by Rose at the press conference..Rose got what he wanted, Phil speaking nicely about him and that will drive his price up in free agency to other suitors...
The Rookies don't care and are just trying to make the team...
This is probably true but KP was the one that came out vociferously in favor of using more Triangle. No one made KP say that he LIKES the Triangle. We can understand that BJ didn't like the Triangle, never understood it and never ran it. I think CLee eventually came around and you could see his game expanding later in the year. CLee was more active coming off Curls and used his dribble penetration much more aggressively. He looked like he had finally got the hang of things.Melo mostly posts up in a Pinch Post situation so I don't know why he'd even complain about the Triangle. His game would actually fit in perfectly except that he stopped the ball. If Melo took more of what the offense gave him rather than forcing things he'd be a much better team player. Just keep the ball moving and use more of the motion to get more catch and shoot looks. Go quicker rather than always stopping the action.
I think you are looking at it all wrong...The point wasn't that KP endorsed the triangle, he is asking for consistency...Phil offered the job to Hornacek with the understanding that Hornacek will run his system and tenets of the triangle..Phil changed his mind and switch to triangle only in season...It caused confusion among the players..Let's face it, Hornacek is weak and will do whatever Phil says...The team started winning and Phil wanted his way...Which is running the triangle fully...Hornacek folded and the players who supported him wasn't happy...Melo at that time said Hornacek should have kept his system..Then the posse thing erupted around that time, Melo took a shot at Phil saying he didn't understand what Phil was saying..
The meeting of Nov 20th was to re emphasis Hornacek style of play which Phil said nothing and accepted or so it seemed..The players said Phil took it well...Then Phil targeted Melo as being the guy that wasn't buying in and holding the ball during the Knicks mini-hot streak...Then the CBS news story and the Rosen hit job followed by Phil's writer in LA..It was all BS...That's where Phil lost KP..Phil is dirty and plays dirty...Noah doesn't care because no one else would have given him that contract...Rose wants to get overpaid too and tells Phil he wants to return to the triangle...Phil is looking for players in his corner...
So in my opinion, KP wanted consistency not necessarily the triangle...He was saying if that was the system, Phil should have been open about his intentions from the start...Which he wasn't...OK just so we're clear the Knicks only worked on more Triangle Fundamentals but NEVER Trashed Jeff's Offense completely. In fact if you go watch the games after the move to reinstall some Triangle you will notice that it NEVER got to 100% Pure Triangle. This is just not True!
KP and the kids went on to really learn and grasp Jeff's version of the Triangle!!! It's actually pretty good stuff and Phil approves! I don't think the Media or some fans realize what the Knicks have been running on Offense.
Yeah..KP seems thrilled..You REALLY think KP is upset about the team running Jeff's version of the Triangle??? You really bough the Woj BS Hook Line and Sinker!!! Woj was wrong and he provided no proof for his rumors.
Meanwhile the Video evidence shows KP and the younger players were getting the hang of things! Not to mention KP saying he likes the Triangle!Why do you insist on promoting propaganda?
Until KP makes a statement there is no proof he was upset about the Triangle coming back. Why don't you put up or shut up? Where's your proof about the KP being upset about the Knicks Offense? Haven't seen anything yet regarding this.
Confusion top to bottom not proof?
holfresh wrote:nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:nixluva wrote:holfresh wrote:I think Melo, KP, BJ and Lee wants Hornacek to coach his offense and run the team...Noah is loyal to Phil and Rose just doesn't care about anything but getting his next contract...I think Rose told Phil he doesn't have a problem running the triangle in his exit interviews...Phil said he was surprised that Rose said he wants to be back...Rose will ally with Noah in Phil's camp...Phil actually seems smittened by Rose at the press conference..Rose got what he wanted, Phil speaking nicely about him and that will drive his price up in free agency to other suitors...
The Rookies don't care and are just trying to make the team...
This is probably true but KP was the one that came out vociferously in favor of using more Triangle. No one made KP say that he LIKES the Triangle. We can understand that BJ didn't like the Triangle, never understood it and never ran it. I think CLee eventually came around and you could see his game expanding later in the year. CLee was more active coming off Curls and used his dribble penetration much more aggressively. He looked like he had finally got the hang of things.Melo mostly posts up in a Pinch Post situation so I don't know why he'd even complain about the Triangle. His game would actually fit in perfectly except that he stopped the ball. If Melo took more of what the offense gave him rather than forcing things he'd be a much better team player. Just keep the ball moving and use more of the motion to get more catch and shoot looks. Go quicker rather than always stopping the action.
I think you are looking at it all wrong...The point wasn't that KP endorsed the triangle, he is asking for consistency...Phil offered the job to Hornacek with the understanding that Hornacek will run his system and tenets of the triangle..Phil changed his mind and switch to triangle only in season...It caused confusion among the players..Let's face it, Hornacek is weak and will do whatever Phil says...The team started winning and Phil wanted his way...Which is running the triangle fully...Hornacek folded and the players who supported him wasn't happy...Melo at that time said Hornacek should have kept his system..Then the posse thing erupted around that time, Melo took a shot at Phil saying he didn't understand what Phil was saying..
The meeting of Nov 20th was to re emphasis Hornacek style of play which Phil said nothing and accepted or so it seemed..The players said Phil took it well...Then Phil targeted Melo as being the guy that wasn't buying in and holding the ball during the Knicks mini-hot streak...Then the CBS news story and the Rosen hit job followed by Phil's writer in LA..It was all BS...That's where Phil lost KP..Phil is dirty and plays dirty...Noah doesn't care because no one else would have given him that contract...Rose wants to get overpaid too and tells Phil he wants to return to the triangle...Phil is looking for players in his corner...
So in my opinion, KP wanted consistency not necessarily the triangle...He was saying if that was the system, Phil should have been open about his intentions from the start...Which he wasn't...OK just so we're clear the Knicks only worked on more Triangle Fundamentals but NEVER Trashed Jeff's Offense completely. In fact if you go watch the games after the move to reinstall some Triangle you will notice that it NEVER got to 100% Pure Triangle. This is just not True!
KP and the kids went on to really learn and grasp Jeff's version of the Triangle!!! It's actually pretty good stuff and Phil approves! I don't think the Media or some fans realize what the Knicks have been running on Offense.
Yeah..KP seems thrilled..You REALLY think KP is upset about the team running Jeff's version of the Triangle??? You really bough the Woj BS Hook Line and Sinker!!! Woj was wrong and he provided no proof for his rumors.
Meanwhile the Video evidence shows KP and the younger players were getting the hang of things! Not to mention KP saying he likes the Triangle!Why do you insist on promoting propaganda?
Until KP makes a statement there is no proof he was upset about the Triangle coming back. Why don't you put up or shut up? Where's your proof about the KP being upset about the Knicks Offense? Haven't seen anything yet regarding this.
Confusion top to bottom not proof?
You keep referring to this statement by KP, so let's look at that.
The Knicks have re-emphasized the triangle offense during the last few weeks, with team president Phil Jackson teaching the guards some options within his beloved system Thursday. But Porzingis spoke candidly and said the Knicks “don’t know the triangle that well.”http://www.newsday.com/sports/basketball...Porzingis also said that with the Knicks changing what they’ve tried to build all season, they’re lost on the floor. It showed on both ends Sunday night. They fell behind by 22 and allowed a team-record 14 three-pointers in the first half.
“We’ve been switching things up because at any point of this season, we never played like we wanted to,” Porzingis said after fouling out with 19 points, 10 rebounds and five blocks. “It was like, ‘Maybe this will work. Maybe this will work.’ So we’re kind of looking for stuff.
“Coaches, they obviously try to do the best job they can and give us as much as they can so we have the information. But we never really got it all together and were able to execute the way we should have. It’s been a lot of confusion.”
Porzingis said the confusion is “from top to bottom. A lot of stuff that’s not clear. So it’s hard to play like that.”
“The situation is tough,” Porzingis said. “We’re not doing the right things. We’re just not working together right now. We need to find solutions. Whatever 16, 15 games we have left, we have to give everything we have so we can finish the season not regretting anything.”
If you read what KP actually says it's clear that he's actually talking about the PLAYERS more than he's saying there's confusion from Top to Bottom of the entire Franchise, ie. Phil on down. That's not what he seemed to be saying at that time. He was saying the saying the PLAYERS are not doing the right things and not working together. That they have to give everything they have to finish the season strong. That's not about Phil!!! Woj, the Media at large, you and all the fans that keep pushing this are taking his comments out of context.
Just to back up what I'm saying just read what KP had to say back when they 1st went back to adding Triangle Fundamentals.
ORLANDO, Fla. — Phil Jackson isn’t the only person who likes that the Knicks are playing more triangle. Kristaps Porzingis is a fan of the often-criticized offense and believes the Knicks should have been emphasizing it from the start of the season.http://www.newsday.com/sports/basketball...“We’re starting to learn it now the way we should [and] we should have been playing from the beginning of the season,” Porzingis said “So we’re a little behind. But every game we’re getting a little better. Hopefully, I don’t know when, we can start using it properly and making some impact playing it.”
Porzingis, who returned Wednesday night after missing the past two games with a sprained right ankle, is happy the Knicks have gone back to utilizing more triangle since returning from the All-Star break last week. His opinion matters since the Knicks will be building around Porzingis.
Coach Jeff Hornacek said a goal for the rest of this season is to “continue to grow the offense,” and that the Knicks would evaluate players on whether they can play in it.
“I like the triangle,” Porzingis said. “My first season, the whole first season we played nothing but the triangle so I know it pretty well. I like the offense. It can only work if everybody believes in it and everybody executes it the right way.”
During training camp, Hornacek said the players don’t like running the triangle. He ran what he called “triangle aspects” early in the season, but then the Knicks went away from it after a team meeting where the players voiced some concerns to Jackson and Hornacek.
Hornacek estimated that they’re running it less than 50 percent of the game now. But one reason Hornacek said it’s been re-emphasized is it helps balance their defense. He said Jackson mentioned that to him.
“We talk about it a lot,” Hornacek said. “Different things in the triangle you can do. Sometimes you call them out of timeout plays. That’s some of the things Phil has said; some plays that maybe he used. We’re talking all the time. That came up in one of the discussions, that it does give you better balance. We had guys that were getting stuck in the corner. That was part of it.”
At no time did the Knicks EVER play 100% Triangle. The way the team finished the season you could clearly see Jeff's Tweaks to the Triangle were prominent and Phil mentioned he approved of Jeff's Early Offense. The young Players really started to grasp things and execute better. So I don't know what Woj or you are able to point to in regards to KP being upset about the Triangle but I see NOTHING to support this.