Knicks · Is the triangle outdated? (page 1)
nixluva wrote:Jeff's version of the Triangle is a good mix of modern style O that can flow into Triangle concepts! There's really no point in worrying about using the Triangle since we won't be running an old form of the Triangle.
Says who? I thought coach said they were going run the triangle exclusively next year, which sounds like a revert back to last year.
TPercy wrote:nixluva wrote:Jeff's version of the Triangle is a good mix of modern style O that can flow into Triangle concepts! There's really no point in worrying about using the Triangle since we won't be running an old form of the Triangle.Says who? I thought coach said they were going run the triangle exclusively next year, which sounds like a revert back to last year.
Jesus! WTF MAN? Jeff was talking about making sure the Triangle fundamentals are put in as a base but he WAS NOT saying his Blend of his schemes with the Triangle was going to be abandoned!
Remember Jeff agreed to Modernize the Triangle and Phil AGREED with this. Jeff's Offense is not walk it up and go right into the Side Triangle. He has added Early Offense with Spread PnR, Drag Screens and 3pt spacing!
Phil was pleased with Jeff's Offense and felt it was coming together by the end of the season!
“I let Jeff do what he wanted to do — an agreement to try to blend what we call whatever that flow, fastbreak, early shooting offense into something formatted,’’ Jackson said. “We kind of let it roll until things didn’t roll well before we [said it] looks like we need some more fundamentals, more function towards the end of a game. They showed at the end of season they started being able to do some of that.’’http://nypost.com/2017/04/15/phil-jackso...
“I like the backbone of what we have,’’ Jackson added later in the session. “You can see what we’ve got. Guys like Ron [Baker] and Chasson [Randle] and Willy Hernangomez, and the kids we’re bringing into this organization have a certain sense of how to play in the structure, the way we want to play.“I think we’re moving in that direction. It’s not fast enough, obviously to carry the day, but I think we’re going to get there.’’
What fans should expect to see out of the Knicks next season: “Playing hard like we played the last five, six games. Guys getting up into people, playing hard, pick up full court at times. You know, ball movement, activity instead of standing. Those type of things. That’s what they’re going to see more of.’’
nixluva wrote:TPercy wrote:nixluva wrote:Jeff's version of the Triangle is a good mix of modern style O that can flow into Triangle concepts! There's really no point in worrying about using the Triangle since we won't be running an old form of the Triangle.Says who? I thought coach said they were going run the triangle exclusively next year, which sounds like a revert back to last year.
Jesus! WTF MAN? Jeff was talking about making sure the Triangle fundamentals are put in as a base but he WAS NOT saying his Blend of his schemes with the Triangle was going to be abandoned!
Remember Jeff agreed to Modernize the Triangle and Phil AGREED with this. Jeff's Offense is not walk it up and go right into the Side Triangle. He has added Early Offense with Spread PnR, Drag Screens and 3pt spacing!
Phil was pleased with Jeff's Offense and felt it was coming together by the end of the season!
“I let Jeff do what he wanted to do — an agreement to try to blend what we call whatever that flow, fastbreak, early shooting offense into something formatted,’’ Jackson said. “We kind of let it roll until things didn’t roll well before we [said it] looks like we need some more fundamentals, more function towards the end of a game. They showed at the end of season they started being able to do some of that.’’http://nypost.com/2017/04/15/phil-jackso...“I like the backbone of what we have,’’ Jackson added later in the session. “You can see what we’ve got. Guys like Ron [Baker] and Chasson [Randle] and Willy Hernangomez, and the kids we’re bringing into this organization have a certain sense of how to play in the structure, the way we want to play.“I think we’re moving in that direction. It’s not fast enough, obviously to carry the day, but I think we’re going to get there.’’
What fans should expect to see out of the Knicks next season: “Playing hard like we played the last five, six games. Guys getting up into people, playing hard, pick up full court at times. You know, ball movement, activity instead of standing. Those type of things. That’s what they’re going to see more of.’’
No need to get up in arms man. I was simply inquiring based off of what I had read. WHile I don't reject the possibility of your premise to be true, none of the articles you cited gives an explicit statement of how we run the triangle next season. It displayed Phil promoting the concepts of fundamental basketball where nobody is standing still, a concept that we all can agree on, but how we go about accomplishing that concept is still unclear to me unless stated otherwise.
TPercy wrote:nixluva wrote:TPercy wrote:nixluva wrote:Jeff's version of the Triangle is a good mix of modern style O that can flow into Triangle concepts! There's really no point in worrying about using the Triangle since we won't be running an old form of the Triangle.Says who? I thought coach said they were going run the triangle exclusively next year, which sounds like a revert back to last year.
Jesus! WTF MAN? Jeff was talking about making sure the Triangle fundamentals are put in as a base but he WAS NOT saying his Blend of his schemes with the Triangle was going to be abandoned!
Remember Jeff agreed to Modernize the Triangle and Phil AGREED with this. Jeff's Offense is not walk it up and go right into the Side Triangle. He has added Early Offense with Spread PnR, Drag Screens and 3pt spacing!
Phil was pleased with Jeff's Offense and felt it was coming together by the end of the season!
“I let Jeff do what he wanted to do — an agreement to try to blend what we call whatever that flow, fastbreak, early shooting offense into something formatted,’’ Jackson said. “We kind of let it roll until things didn’t roll well before we [said it] looks like we need some more fundamentals, more function towards the end of a game. They showed at the end of season they started being able to do some of that.’’http://nypost.com/2017/04/15/phil-jackso...“I like the backbone of what we have,’’ Jackson added later in the session. “You can see what we’ve got. Guys like Ron [Baker] and Chasson [Randle] and Willy Hernangomez, and the kids we’re bringing into this organization have a certain sense of how to play in the structure, the way we want to play.“I think we’re moving in that direction. It’s not fast enough, obviously to carry the day, but I think we’re going to get there.’’
What fans should expect to see out of the Knicks next season: “Playing hard like we played the last five, six games. Guys getting up into people, playing hard, pick up full court at times. You know, ball movement, activity instead of standing. Those type of things. That’s what they’re going to see more of.’’
No need to get up in arms man. I was simply inquiring based off of what I had read. WHile I don't reject the possibility of your premise to be true, none of the articles you cited gives an explicit statement of how we run the triangle next season. It displayed Phil promoting the concepts of fundamental basketball where nobody is standing still, a concept that we all can agree on, but how we go about accomplishing that concept is still unclear to me unless stated otherwise.
The things I posted were CRYSTAL CLEAR! The way the Knicks played especially by the end of the season is pretty much what Jeff and Phil envisioned the Blend of Triangle and Jeff's concepts would look like. They wanted a modernized version of the Triangle and that's what Jeff did. There's no mystery here about what the Knicks offense is. Phil just described what he and Jeff agreed to and that the kids started to execute that!!!
“I let Jeff do what he wanted to do — an agreement to try to blend what we call whatever that flow, fastbreak, early shooting offense into something formatted,’’ Jackson said. “We kind of let it roll until things didn’t roll well before we [said it] looks like we need some more fundamentals, more function towards the end of a game. They showed at the end of season they started being able to do some of that
@Nix, where does it say here that the Knicks will be playing a blended/adapted version of the triangle next year? It said that Phil let Jeff play whatever ball he wanted to play untill things started falling apart.
“I like the backbone of what we have,’’ Jackson added later in the session. “You can see what we’ve got. Guys like Ron [Baker] and Chasson [Randle] and Willy Hernangomez, and the kids we’re bringing into this organization have a certain sense of how to play in the structure, the way we want to play.
“I think we’re moving in that direction. It’s not fast enough, obviously to carry the day, but I think we’re going to get there.’’
What fans should expect to see out of the Knicks next season: “Playing hard like we played the last five, six games. Guys getting up into people, playing hard, pick up full court at times. You know, ball movement, activity instead of standing. Those type of things. That’s what they’re going to see more of.’’
In what way does this explicitely state the detailed extent to which we run the triangle?
It will be based on writes every player gets from the coach.
They will read the writes and execute the pentangle.
Vmart wrote:The thing with the triangle is that it is based on series of reads. The process can also be sped up. The triangle can never be out dated it works based on execution of the reads.
Aka... basketball
TPercy wrote:Sigh.“I let Jeff do what he wanted to do — an agreement to try to blend what we call whatever that flow, fastbreak, early shooting offense into something formatted,’’ Jackson said. “We kind of let it roll until things didn’t roll well before we [said it] looks like we need some more fundamentals, more function towards the end of a game. They showed at the end of season they started being able to do some of that@Nix, where does it say here that the Knicks will be playing a blended/adapted version of the triangle next year? It said that Phil let Jeff play whatever ball he wanted to play untill things started falling apart.
“I like the backbone of what we have,’’ Jackson added later in the session. “You can see what we’ve got. Guys like Ron [Baker] and Chasson [Randle] and Willy Hernangomez, and the kids we’re bringing into this organization have a certain sense of how to play in the structure, the way we want to play.
“I think we’re moving in that direction. It’s not fast enough, obviously to carry the day, but I think we’re going to get there.’’
What fans should expect to see out of the Knicks next season: “Playing hard like we played the last five, six games. Guys getting up into people, playing hard, pick up full court at times. You know, ball movement, activity instead of standing. Those type of things. That’s what they’re going to see more of.’’In what way does this explicitely state the detailed extent to which we run the triangle?
You're kidding me! You clearly didn't comprehend what you read if you didn't see EXACTLY what the offense is. Phil and Jeff AGREED to blend Jeff's EARLY OFFENSE with Triangle! Phil only had the team go over Triangle Fundamentals but he DID NOT break the agreement with Jeff to run a Blended Triangle!
THE PROOF is in every single game played the rest of the season! The team continued to run Jeff's version of the Triangle and NEVER went to a Pure Triangle! The offense Phil was pleased with at the end of the season was Jeff's Blended Triangle!!!
Easy to see both Early O, Spread PnR AND Triangle!
Vmart wrote:The thing with the triangle is that it is based on series of reads. The process can also be sped up. The triangle can never be out dated it works based on execution of the reads.
It's a great system, if you got the right talent and coaching staff, running it without that, your a joke
knicks1248 wrote:Vmart wrote:The thing with the triangle is that it is based on series of reads. The process can also be sped up. The triangle can never be out dated it works based on execution of the reads.It's a great system, if you got the right talent and coaching staff, running it without that, your a joke
Doesnt that apply to every organized team sport that ever existed?
knicks1248 wrote:Vmart wrote:The thing with the triangle is that it is based on series of reads. The process can also be sped up. The triangle can never be out dated it works based on execution of the reads.It's a great system, if you got the right talent and coaching staff, running it without that, your a joke
The system has been around nearly 80 yrs! It has been run by all kinds of rosters and different coaches. So you're mistaken in your assessment of the Triangle.
nixluva wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Vmart wrote:The thing with the triangle is that it is based on series of reads. The process can also be sped up. The triangle can never be out dated it works based on execution of the reads.It's a great system, if you got the right talent and coaching staff, running it without that, your a joke
The system has been around nearly 80 yrs! It has been run by all kinds of rosters and different coaches. So you're mistaken in your assessment of the Triangle.
when you talk about any of the other 29 team do you mention or hear anything about the triangle.
Did you hear toronto say anything about Lowry not being able to commit to the triangle, or the the thunder wanting westbrook back to play in their triangle sets, or Aldridge is a perfect fit for the spurs triangle, or Curry runs the triangle for GSW like no other.
Only when it comes to knicks. One thing is for certain, you will not master the fundamentals of the system if your not 100% vested in it across the boards. That means a excellent teacher who knows the ins and outs(when to get in and when to get out), and how to communicate it to the players. Do we have that?
knicks1248 wrote:nixluva wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Vmart wrote:The thing with the triangle is that it is based on series of reads. The process can also be sped up. The triangle can never be out dated it works based on execution of the reads.It's a great system, if you got the right talent and coaching staff, running it without that, your a joke
The system has been around nearly 80 yrs! It has been run by all kinds of rosters and different coaches. So you're mistaken in your assessment of the Triangle.
when you talk about any of the other 29 team do you mention or hear anything about the triangle.
Did you hear toronto say anything about Lowry not being able to commit to the triangle, or the the thunder wanting westbrook back to play in their triangle sets, or Aldridge is a perfect fit for the spurs triangle, or Curry runs the triangle for GSW like no other.
Only when it comes to knicks. One thing is for certain, you will not master the fundamentals of the system if your not 100% vested in it across the boards. That means a excellent teacher who knows the ins and outs(when to get in and when to get out), and how to communicate it to the players. Do we have that?
The Triangle has been taught and coached by many different coaches from High School to College to the NBA! We have enough coaching to get the job done! Phil said the kids were starting to get the hang of Jeff's version of the Triangle which is a blend of his Early Offense schemes and some Triangle!
If you watched all of the games then you would know that the team was getting the hang of Jeff's Triangle Offense. There was resistance to learning the Triangle portion of the offense but by the end of the season that wasn't a problem anymore.
nixluva wrote:knicks1248 wrote:nixluva wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Vmart wrote:The thing with the triangle is that it is based on series of reads. The process can also be sped up. The triangle can never be out dated it works based on execution of the reads.It's a great system, if you got the right talent and coaching staff, running it without that, your a joke
The system has been around nearly 80 yrs! It has been run by all kinds of rosters and different coaches. So you're mistaken in your assessment of the Triangle.
when you talk about any of the other 29 team do you mention or hear anything about the triangle.
Did you hear toronto say anything about Lowry not being able to commit to the triangle, or the the thunder wanting westbrook back to play in their triangle sets, or Aldridge is a perfect fit for the spurs triangle, or Curry runs the triangle for GSW like no other.
Only when it comes to knicks. One thing is for certain, you will not master the fundamentals of the system if your not 100% vested in it across the boards. That means a excellent teacher who knows the ins and outs(when to get in and when to get out), and how to communicate it to the players. Do we have that?
The Triangle has been taught and coached by many different coaches from High School to College to the NBA! We have enough coaching to get the job done! Phil said the kids were starting to get the hang of Jeff's version of the Triangle which is a blend of his Early Offense schemes and some Triangle!
If you watched all of the games then you would know that the team was getting the hang of Jeff's Triangle Offense. There was resistance to learning the Triangle portion of the offense but by the end of the season that wasn't a problem anymore.
Nix you can keep telling him until your blue in the face. The man isn't gonna change his opinion. Honestly it's not gonna work. He has made up his mind about everything Phil Jackson.
Vmart wrote:nixluva wrote:knicks1248 wrote:nixluva wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Vmart wrote:The thing with the triangle is that it is based on series of reads. The process can also be sped up. The triangle can never be out dated it works based on execution of the reads.It's a great system, if you got the right talent and coaching staff, running it without that, your a joke
The system has been around nearly 80 yrs! It has been run by all kinds of rosters and different coaches. So you're mistaken in your assessment of the Triangle.
when you talk about any of the other 29 team do you mention or hear anything about the triangle.
Did you hear toronto say anything about Lowry not being able to commit to the triangle, or the the thunder wanting westbrook back to play in their triangle sets, or Aldridge is a perfect fit for the spurs triangle, or Curry runs the triangle for GSW like no other.
Only when it comes to knicks. One thing is for certain, you will not master the fundamentals of the system if your not 100% vested in it across the boards. That means a excellent teacher who knows the ins and outs(when to get in and when to get out), and how to communicate it to the players. Do we have that?
The Triangle has been taught and coached by many different coaches from High School to College to the NBA! We have enough coaching to get the job done! Phil said the kids were starting to get the hang of Jeff's version of the Triangle which is a blend of his Early Offense schemes and some Triangle!
If you watched all of the games then you would know that the team was getting the hang of Jeff's Triangle Offense. There was resistance to learning the Triangle portion of the offense but by the end of the season that wasn't a problem anymore.
Nix you can keep telling him until your blue in the face. The man isn't gonna change his opinion. Honestly it's not gonna work. He has made up his mind about everything Phil Jackson.
That's not true, and when your saying end of the bench guys were getting it around the last 6 games and still losing, then you know you have to upgrade the talent, which is what he said he was going to do. Rose, melo, kp, lance, noah barely played at all, and that was suppose to be the core of the roster, if holiday walks, and lance gets traded, it's going to be a learning curve for who you bring in AGAIN.
Upgrading the roster means a new set of players, if phil could get better talent than baker, randle and Kuz, what does it mean for that group that was getting it..BYE Bye or a major reduce role, and now you have new set of players that's going to need a ton of time to get it.
The only way that system works is if you keep the same 7 to 8 core guys and keep working at it every dam minute of the day.
NIX, jeffs version of the TRIANGLE was the first 2 months of the season(when where winning)and i loved it, when that wasn't working consistently they went back to phils full version of the basic triangle fundamentals.