Knicks · Ntilinkina vs Smith vs Monk (page 3)
meloshouldgo wrote:Zero interest in Smith. Weak tentative passer, no ability to create for teammates and in most cases doesn't even know where his teammates are. Doesn't defend "except when motivated" and too small to defend bigger guards. Another Derrick Rose with less skills. How people think this guy is a HR boggles my mind.Monk is too small to be a SG and too little skills to be anything else.
I'll take Ntilikina over both these iso players.
+1
All of Smith's assists in his strengths video were him driving hard and winging the ball back to the three point line. Looked JUST like Rose. Definitely a skilled player and top tier athlete, but not what we're looking for or need.
Monk will be a good player in the league I'm sure, but I'm not crazy about a streaky shooting 1 way player with our lottery pick in this draft.
Frank has the most upside and two way skillset. Also he's been playing pro ball for a few years now. Don't be fooled by the videos. Just because the opponents were smaller than him doesn't mean they are scrubs. The U18 euro tournament is all professional basketball players, not HS kids.
BigDaddyG wrote:nixluva wrote:More recent game video of Nitty.Kid has good IQ and looks like he has more command on the pick and roll. The defense is impressive too. This kid is the best system fit of the three.
After watching this video I'm 100% sold on Frank. Great feel for the game, doesn't force anything, gorgeous shooting form from range, clean crisp passing with no waisted motion, tenacious willing defender, great size and lateral movement, solid ups, guarded bigs decently when switched, offensive rebounded like a beast for a 1-2. He's got it all! At this point I just hope he's still around at 8.
Welpee wrote:meloshouldgo wrote:I admit I haven't seen Ntilikina play nor have I paid much attention to Smith since NC State sucked this year. Pretty much going on what I read. But full disclosure I wanted Mudiay (over Okafor and Russell) and booed the KP pick two years ago so I admit I have no credibility when it comes to the draft. lolSwishfm3 wrote:meloshouldgo wrote:Zero interest in Smith. Weak tentative passer, no ability to create for teammates and in most cases doesn't even know where his teammates are. Doesn't defend "except when motivated" and too small to defend bigger guards. Another Derrick Rose with less skills. How people think this guy is a HR boggles my mind.Monk is too small to be a SG and too little skills to be anything else.
I'll take Ntilikina over both these iso players.
You need to watch them play instead of watching "highlight" videos to understand why some people are high on these players.
I'm not a big fan of either of them (Monk or Smith) but when those two are "on", especially Smith Jr., you can see why fans would get excited but you in order to see that you have had to watch them play in a real game.
Anyone picking Ntilikina, especially after all these horrid highlight videos, loses all credibility.
So I need to watch Smith play in a real game, but people picking Ntilikina lose credibility based on the highlight reel. Got it, glad we clears this one up.
Where in my post did I indicate, I never saw them play in a game? I watched Smith play Duke twice, yeah he can score, he is shoot first forget about setting up the offense type PG.
No worries as long as it's a discussion is all good. I don't have anymore credibility than you do. But I am just generally opposed to players with a score first mindset.
EnySpree wrote:Fuck it.... Diallo it is.... the Knicks need to hit the lotto. Why wait? Let everyone get who they want... why do we have to settle for Frenchy? If we habe to choose between Frenchy and Diallo? We should take Diallo...
No.
Hope it's not true about Frank. Probably the only guy in top 10 who is not NBA ready. He was not even French league ready. Would be a big mistake to waste an entire losing season just to pick a real long shot.
Would like to see Smith or John Collins picked at 8. Even though Smith is not your prototypical Triangle guy, as he is ball dominant.
Knicks need to adapt to my Football Giants philosophy. Pick best player available regardless of positional need. Then fill needs through FA bargains.
HofstraBBall wrote:Do not think Monk is there at 8. If not for being part of a strong team in college, he would have probably had huge offensive numbers. Think his game is NBA ready. Hope it's not true about Frank. Probably the only guy in top 10 who is not NBA ready. He was not even French league ready. Would be a big mistake to waste an entire losing season just to pick a real long shot.Would like to see Smith or John Collins picked at 8. Even though Smith is not your prototypical Triangle guy, as he is ball dominant.
Hope the Knicks adapt to my Football Giants philosophy. Pick best player available regardless of positional need. Then fill need through FA bargains.
It is my understanding he was injrued in the beginning of the year and has since taken over the league and is hands down the best player since getting healthy.
Intangibles win in this league. The top 4 teams left in the playoffs are the teams with the most intangibles. The players with th most potential are the players with high intangibles who you can develop as scores aka Leonard on the Spurs. We need to add as many intangible players as possible. I believe Frenchy is in this mold. Finding scorers are a lot easier to find.
HofstraBBall wrote:Do not think Monk is there at 8. If not for being part of a strong team in college, he would have probably had huge offensive numbers. Think his game is NBA ready.Hope it's not true about Frank. Probably the only guy in top 10 who is not NBA ready. He was not even French league ready. Would be a big mistake to waste an entire losing season just to pick a real long shot.
Would like to see Smith or John Collins picked at 8. Even though Smith is not your prototypical Triangle guy, as he is ball dominant.
Knicks need to adapt to my Football Giants philosophy. Pick best player available regardless of positional need. Then fill needs through FA bargains.
This is one way of doing things but the Knicks want to take a different approach. They have already been targeting players that fit their criteria and I see no reason that they should stop now! BPA isn't always clear! Often it's in the eye of the beholder. There isn't a KD or Lebron in this draft.
The Knicks have a clear set of needs at PG, SG and SF. That's where the talent is at the top of this draft. A kid like Nitty has a good combination of talent and skills. He's 18 so of course he's gonna need development but he's playing against men and doing well for his age. Who knows what his upside is?
meloshouldgo wrote:Swishfm3 wrote:meloshouldgo wrote:Zero interest in Smith. Weak tentative passer, no ability to create for teammates and in most cases doesn't even know where his teammates are. Doesn't defend "except when motivated" and too small to defend bigger guards. Another Derrick Rose with less skills. How people think this guy is a HR boggles my mind.Monk is too small to be a SG and too little skills to be anything else.
I'll take Ntilikina over both these iso players.
You need to watch them play instead of watching "highlight" videos to understand why some people are high on these players.
I'm not a big fan of either of them (Monk or Smith) but when those two are "on", especially Smith Jr., you can see why fans would get excited but you in order to see that you have had to watch them play in a real game.
Anyone picking Ntilikina, especially after all these horrid highlight videos, loses all credibility.
So I need to watch Smith play in a real game, but people picking Ntilikina lose credibility based on the highlight reel. Got it, glad we clears this one up.
Where in my post did I indicate, I never saw them play in a game? I watched Smith play Duke twice, yeah he can score, he is shoot first forget about setting up the offense type PG.
My bad...I assumed that you, like the majority here, don't watch CBB. I watched one of the games NC STATE had against Duke and the kid looked great. Shoot first PG, I agree, but that NC STATE team sucked.
And if people are picking Ntilikina based only on YouTube highlight videos, then yes, do lose all credibility.
I bet if we collect all your old VHS basketball videos from High School and send them to Pavvy, he'll turn that into an amazing 1 minute highlight reel. Probably have the fools from this site begging the Knicks to draft you.
Swishfm3 wrote:meloshouldgo wrote:Swishfm3 wrote:meloshouldgo wrote:Zero interest in Smith. Weak tentative passer, no ability to create for teammates and in most cases doesn't even know where his teammates are. Doesn't defend "except when motivated" and too small to defend bigger guards. Another Derrick Rose with less skills. How people think this guy is a HR boggles my mind.Monk is too small to be a SG and too little skills to be anything else.
I'll take Ntilikina over both these iso players.
You need to watch them play instead of watching "highlight" videos to understand why some people are high on these players.
I'm not a big fan of either of them (Monk or Smith) but when those two are "on", especially Smith Jr., you can see why fans would get excited but you in order to see that you have had to watch them play in a real game.
Anyone picking Ntilikina, especially after all these horrid highlight videos, loses all credibility.
So I need to watch Smith play in a real game, but people picking Ntilikina lose credibility based on the highlight reel. Got it, glad we clears this one up.
Where in my post did I indicate, I never saw them play in a game? I watched Smith play Duke twice, yeah he can score, he is shoot first forget about setting up the offense type PG.
My bad...I assumed that you, like the majority here, don't watch CBB. I watched one of the games NC STATE had against Duke and the kid looked great. Shoot first PG, I agree, but that NC STATE team sucked.
And if people are picking Ntilikina based only on YouTube highlight videos, then yes, do lose all credibility.
I bet if we collect all your old VHS basketball videos from High School and send them to Pavvy, he'll turn that into an amazing 1 minute highlight reel. Probably have the fools from this site begging the Knicks to draft you.
Well - KP6 was evaluated here based on videos as well. We are fans on a message board with no access to full game videos of euros. But the people doing the drafting and scouting do watch games then they provide their reports. People are excited about certain euros based on those reports, it's unfair to assume it's based on highlight videos only.
Zebo13 wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:nixluva wrote:More recent game video of Nitty.Kid has good IQ and looks like he has more command on the pick and roll. The defense is impressive too. This kid is the best system fit of the three.
After watching this video I'm 100% sold on Frank. Great feel for the game, doesn't force anything, gorgeous shooting form from range, clean crisp passing with no waisted motion, tenacious willing defender, great size and lateral movement, solid ups, guarded bigs decently when switched, offensive rebounded like a beast for a 1-2. He's got it all! At this point I just hope he's still around at 8.
High motor defensively even away from the ball, never taking plays off or relaxing, always looking for how he can cover ground and contribute. Seem a little awkward though as a ball handler/facilitator, but give his size I guess thats kind of natural.
He worked at improving his J, He worked at improving his turnovers and both have paid dividends over the past month or 2. So the work ethic seems to be there as well. I think drafting him and you know your getting a kid who is strictly about basketball.
newyorknewyork wrote:Zebo13 wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:nixluva wrote:More recent game video of Nitty.Kid has good IQ and looks like he has more command on the pick and roll. The defense is impressive too. This kid is the best system fit of the three.
After watching this video I'm 100% sold on Frank. Great feel for the game, doesn't force anything, gorgeous shooting form from range, clean crisp passing with no waisted motion, tenacious willing defender, great size and lateral movement, solid ups, guarded bigs decently when switched, offensive rebounded like a beast for a 1-2. He's got it all! At this point I just hope he's still around at 8.
High motor defensively even away from the ball, never taking plays off or relaxing, always looking for how he can cover ground and contribute. Seem a little awkward though as a ball handler/facilitator, but give his size I guess thats kind of natural.
He worked at improving his J, He worked at improving his turnovers and both have paid dividends over the past month or 2. So the work ethic seems to be there as well. I think drafting him and you know your getting a kid who is strictly about basketball.
Here's a longer video where you can get a sense of Nitty playing off the ball more. Have to remember he's 18! Very active. When he gets stronger and learns more he can be a very tough defender.
fwk00 wrote:Monk is publicly throwing shade on being a Knick. Will workout with Knicks "if he has to".
Sorry. Update.
I read a few snippets the other night that were surgically edited to make it sound like Monk did not want to work out with the Knicks.
Not true. He's hoping to be picked sooner, nothing more.
Panos wrote:Sorry, but the Ntilikina highlights are not very impressive. The games look like they're against high schoolers in slow motion.
He scares the crap out of me the more I watch, I will say this when I watched Porzingis Euro games I didnt come away impressed either
Jmpasq wrote:Why would we want athletes capable of having triple doubles lets draft a slow footed guard that will average 8 and 4
I actually think Phil wants to draft Monk! Monk is MUCH more ready to play a major role than Nitty! Monk is closer to the kind of dynamic 2 Way star player he's looking for. Nitty has very intriguing length and defensive potential but Monk is a much more accustomed to taking over a game when needed.
Monk at PG minus Fox
Sure, there’s always a chance another big name drops to the Knicks for some reason, and there’s also the terrifying possibility that Phil Jackson will have some sort of triangle-related breakdown and reach for the likes of Luke Kennard or Justin Jackson, but in all probability the pick will come down to the lanky gunner from Kentucky, the mercurial point guard from NC State, and the long-limbed Frenchman.
Who should New York pick? I don’t know about y’all, but I’m stumped. Even Smith, who didn’t really float my boat at first, would make sense. I gathered the P&T team and asked them to choose their preferred guard.
Dillon Dente
I like Malik Monk because the jumper is wetter than water itself. He's a better defender than he's given credit for and neither Ntilikina nor DSJ have a particular skill we KNOW will be NBA-ready. Monk is the best bucket-getter in the draft, hands down. Also, I love the idea of renaming the Garden "The Monastery."
Matt Miranda
I like Monk 'cuz his strengths seem the most compatible and most immediate with Kristaps' strengths going forward. Imagine the horror they'd unleash on pick-and-rolls, and in transition. Imagine the Knicks in a halfcourt set with multiple dudes who can shoot. Of these three prospects, only one's shown 50/40/80. Give. Also, I've always wanted to name a son "Malik" and the wife isn't having that, so this is vicarious for me.
Alex Wolfe
Look, I'm not going to lose sleep if the Knicks pick any of Ntilikina, Monk or Smith—I see the appeal in all of them. But Dennis Smith Jr. is my guy. His numbers are strikingly similar to Markelle Fultz, who the Sixers are on the verge of giving up the farm for (a small farm, but I digress). The character concerns are valid, but wasn't Phil Jackson brought here to establish "a culture" or whatever? Picking Smith is the ultimate put up or shut up as far as that narrative goes. Take the guy with the most talent and figure out the rest later.
Matt RW
My head says Malik Monk, but my heart says Frank Ntilikina. At 18, Ntilikina certainly has room to grow, but the Knicks can afford to give him that room: Kristaps Porzingis is still somehow only 21! Playing in France, Frank has shown flashes of defensive potential and 3-point range. Working with an NBA coaching staff should give Ntilikina a great shot at turning said potential into reality. And who could ignore that ridiculous wingspan, assuming the rumors are true? Frank Ntilikina is a pick much more aimed at the future than the present, but that's where the Knicks should be looking regardless.
Jonathan Schulman
Picture a guy whose shooting ability is quite possibly the best individual talent of any player available in the draft. His athleticism is also NBA-ready. While he isn't the most aggressive seeking, absorbing and overtaking contact, that shouldn't be enough to take away from his offensive elephantiasis. Obviously his shot is the key to the rest of his arsenal, but he is a sly and springy cutter that can hurt your defense without being anywhere near the ball. Triangles love that stuff. Switching ends, that same bouncy activity should help him find his way into passing lanes as he picks up the NBA game. He should certainly be able to move laterally quick enough to cut off or direct opposing drivers. If you desire this player, you might miss out on some hungry dire wolf defense but you'll love all those sopping wet buckets. I'm also not convinced that he can't make a decent living screeching around pick and rolls and either finding himself open or finding a 7'3" mobile warhead. Melo-haters be warned, he smiles through adversity. I love me some Malik Monk.
Zach DiLuzio
After quite a bit of deliberation, I have to go with Frank Ntilikina here. I'm staying far away from Dennis Smith cuz character concerns may as well be the Knicks motto at this point, and I'm sick of it. Of course, neither Monk nor Frank will be the primary ball handler the Knicks need so badly. So, with that in mind, I'd like to bolster the other area in which we've been lacking for twenty years -- defense. Ntilikina projects to be a top level defender at the point of attack, and has the length to be very switchable relative to other point guards. He's only 18, he can shoot, and he's got more length than one of those flailing arm things you see at a used car lot (cliche analogy idgaf). He also provides lineup flexibility, as he can play off ball and defend multiple positions. Plug in a primary ball handler at any position, and Ntilikina can stay on the floor. In lieu of getting a primary ball handler, this is the next best thing.
Joe
OK, no more stalling...I choose Frank Ntilikina. The Knicks straight-up do not care about defense—we learned as much when they traded away Robin Lopez and promoted Kurt Rambis to defensive assistant. They’re never going to have a coherent defensive scheme, and will continue to pretend the three-point line isn’t a concern on either side of the ball. The only hope for New York’s D over the next two years is the Hustle & Length Plan: deploy all the longest arms and let them do their thing. Frank’s not the cagiest defender yet, but his passion might actually inspire some of his teammates. At the very least it’ll make me smile.